Healing through the Son

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PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
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Mark 2:5And when Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”6Now some of the scribes were sitting there, questioning in their hearts, 7“Why does this man speak like that? He is blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?” 8And immediately Jesus, perceiving in his spirit that they thus questioned within themselves, said to them, “Why do you question these things in your hearts?9Which is easier, to say to the paralytic, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Rise, take up your bed and walk’?10But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins”—he said to the paralytic— 11“I say to you, rise, pick up your bed, and go home.”

Just as Christ in the flesh revealed Himself through healing, He does so today. And to say that He isn't the same today, makes me sad. God cares about the whole thing: spirit, soul, and body. But gnostic thought has spread through the church thinking that if one focuses on the material, they must not care about the spiritual. And that's a lie. It all matters to God, we do ALL things unto Him.

In fact, in the OT God got upset when someone inquired of a doctor, before inquiring of Him. He is our all in all. Nothing against doctors, I love them, but I do believe God should be our first choice.
Perhaps the 1st post of yours that I disagree with.
Although Christ CAN reveal Himself through healing this was not how He revealed Himself to me, or virtually every other Christian I know.

His healing during His time on Earth was to fulfill the Scriptures to the Jews that He was in fact their Messiah.

Today, it is by the hearing of the Gospel, and the New birth through which He reveals Himself to us.

Gosh I would be very sad if yet another brother so full of wisdom, went down this prosperity gospel trail.
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
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Perhaps the 1st post of yours that I disagree with.
Although Christ CAN reveal Himself through healing this was not how He revealed Himself to me, or virtually every other Christian I know.

His healing during His time on Earth was to fulfill the Scriptures to the Jews that He was in fact their Messiah.

Today, it is by the hearing of the Gospel, and the New birth through which He reveals Himself to us.

Gosh I would be very sad if yet another brother so full of wisdom, went down this prosperity gospel trail.
How is that a "prosperity Gospel trail"? People do get healed, physically, miraculously, and are then preached to of the gospel of Jesus Christ. Street healing ministries exist, and go out and heal the sick. During this process it reveals the goodness of God, as we know, that leads to repentance. This doesn't happen to everyone in this manner but to some it does. There is nothing prosperity based about it, it is men and women of faith stepping out in the name of Jesus administering healing and glorifying God. Revealing the heart of the Father. Which leads to repentance as they come to an understanding of Christ, who reconciles us to God.
 

Cee

Senior Member
May 14, 2010
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Perhaps the 1st post of yours that I disagree with.
Although Christ CAN reveal Himself through healing this was not how He revealed Himself to me, or virtually every other Christian I know.

His healing during His time on Earth was to fulfill the Scriptures to the Jews that He was in fact their Messiah.

Today, it is by the hearing of the Gospel, and the New birth through which He reveals Himself to us.

Gosh I would be very sad if yet another brother so full of wisdom, went down this prosperity gospel trail.
I'm okay with us not agreeing, if we only listen and hang out with people we agree with there isn't much for us to learn. Part of iron sharpening iron. :)

But I'm not sure we are far off.

I have personally seen God reveal Himself to people through Healing. I didn't say and I don't believe it is the ONLY way. However in this specific Scripture that I am referring to Jesus did reveal Himself as Healer. But where I do not agree is the idea that God NO LONGER reveals Himself as Healer. And there is no where in Scripture that I know of that says this is the case.

I do appreciate that you feel that I am a man full of wisdom. I feel that you are also. But I believe we are wise to the degree that we are lead by the Spirit. So I pray that I and you are continually lead by Him.
 
Dec 16, 2012
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Great work Ben!

For the record, she is clarifying through the means of reiteration.

re·it·er·ate
rēˈidəˌrāt/
verb


  • say something again or a number of times, typically for emphasis or clarity.
    "she reiterated that the administration would remain steadfast in its support"
    [TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
    [TD]repeat, say again, restate, retell, recapitulate, go over (and over), rehearse"he reiterated his concerns"[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]



As you can clearly see, she is clarifying when she shares her previous posts in order to reiterate her points that so many veer off from through red-herrings. What is the thread about? Let me clarify by reiterating my points (hence quoting a previous post).

Meekness. Just a suggestion or something you may want to ask the Lord about. Your post, right here, shows no level of compassion or love, it is sharp and cuts and does not mend. Why must you attempt to humiliate and denigrate? Joanie is your sister in Christ, a fellow believer in Jesus Christ. Not your punching bag.
 

Cee

Senior Member
May 14, 2010
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"His healing during His time on Earth was to fulfill the Scriptures to the Jews that He was in fact their Messiah."

I can not agree with this statement.

Yes He did fulfill Scriptures and He did show He was their Messiah, but that's not all He did.

He also healed because He is Jehovah Rapha. He is the Lord who heals.

And He told some people who He healed to not share with anyone what happened.

They came to Him and asked Him to heal them.

And when He gave the Spirit, His disciples also went forward healing the sick.

And when asked about the works He did, He said those who believed in Him would do the same.

He is still Jehovah Rapha and healing is still a gift of the Spirit.
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
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I'm okay with us not agreeing, if we only listen and hang out with people we agree with there isn't much for us to learn. Part of iron sharpening iron. :)

But I'm not sure we are far off.

I have personally seen God reveal Himself to people through Healing. I didn't say and I don't believe it is the ONLY way. However in this specific Scripture that I am referring to Jesus did reveal Himself as Healer. But where I do not agree is the idea that God NO LONGER reveals Himself as Healer. And there is no where in Scripture that I know of that says this is the case.

I do appreciate that you feel that I am a man full of wisdom. I feel that you are also. But I believe we are wise to the degree that we are lead by the Spirit. So I pray that I and you are continually lead by Him.
Well maybe we're just on different wavelengths. I didn't say Jesus doesn't reveal Himself through healing. Of course He can.

The issue has always been the hideously hurtful doctrine, no matter how much window dressing is put on it, that people aren't healed because they lack faith.

And the cruel insult only gets worse when it is clarified in glowing terms that basically say, "well don't worry, the Holy Spirit will reveal that you too can be healed, just like He did for me and healed me".
Not saying YOU are doing that. But you seem to be dancing on that line a bit.

I also never meant that healings were the only way Jesus showed himself as Messiah to the Jews, nor that all of His healings were for that purpose.
 

Laish

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2016
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How is that a "prosperity Gospel trail"? People do get healed, physically, miraculously, and are then preached to of the gospel of Jesus Christ. Street healing ministries exist, and go out and heal the sick. During this process it reveals the goodness of God, as we know, that leads to repentance. This doesn't happen to everyone in this manner but to some it does. There is nothing prosperity based about it, it is men and women of faith stepping out in the name of Jesus administering healing and glorifying God. Revealing the heart of the Father. Which leads to repentance as they come to an understanding of Christ, who reconciles us to God.
Well how is it prosperity gospel?
You said it here
It is not that you're setting God on a high pedestal, but rather there is a false sense of humility in your posts when you always say that others are all about "me" instead of God. It isn't their fault God has made promises that pertain to this life, and they wish to obtain them (that part, is their fault haha).

Seeking healing, wealth, and well-being are not bad endeavors, but they should accompany seeking first the Kingdom. Seeking the Lord's will in your life and walking in the good works He has prepared. God makes promises in these areas, and because He does, we may have faith. Without these promises we have a dwindling hope, but with them we are encouraged to persevere.
It’s simple you said it . It’s not a bad endeavor.
Simple question why aren’t some healed ?
I lost my father more than a decade ago to cancer . We prayed until the last moment my father was with us . I lost my tia (aunt )last week . We all prayed for her hundreds in fact prayed for my tia ( aunt ) Lupe . What’s the reason ? according to y’all if we had strong enough faith it would have been done . Well why ?
Blessings
Bill
 

Cee

Senior Member
May 14, 2010
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Well maybe we're just on different wavelengths. I didn't say Jesus doesn't reveal Himself through healing. Of course He can.

The issue has always been the hideously hurtful doctrine, no matter how much window dressing is put on it, that people aren't healed because they lack faith.

And the cruel insult only gets worse when it is clarified in glowing terms that basically say, "well don't worry, the Holy Spirit will reveal that you too can be healed, just like He did for me and healed me".
Not saying YOU are doing that. But you seem to be dancing on that line a bit.

I also never meant that healings were the only way Jesus showed himself as Messiah to the Jews, nor that all of His healings were for that purpose.
I simply believe what Scripture says even if my experiences don't always line up to it. I will aways preach faith and focus on faith, not to condemn people as I have seen others do. But because Scripture teaches that faith alone pleases Him. And He desires us to be faithful when He returns.

And I agree, saying someone isn't healed because they don't have enough faith can be dangerous, but equally dangerous is teaching that God doesn't heal today. It is because of theology like this that many people don't have a personal relationship with God. They think He is only His Book. They read ABOUT Him, but they do not believe they can truly know Him. Yet it is Scripture that teaches us eternal life is to know Him.

We must be careful to not strain out gnats and swallow camels. I agree we must be careful to not destroy our brothers and sisters in their time of pain and sorrow, but we must balance this with an understanding of who God is. And not ignoring Scriptures because we haven't seen them.

Many people don't believe God is good because their "experiences" didn't show Him to be good. But what do we tell them? Don't let your feelings and your experiences disagree with what Scripture says. He is a mysterious God, but He is good even when we don't understand what's happening.

Do we take out the idea God is good, that God wants people to know Him, simply because some don't? I certainly hope not!

People struggle with drugs, they struggle with depression, anxiety, and fear, but when they look for freedom from these things because of this disastrous theology people point them to the world. Even though Scripture says that the Kingdom of God is not word, but also of power. Yes we need compassion, but equally we need the power of God.

I struggled with depression, I was told I would be on depression drugs for my entire life, I used to struggle with anxiety, I jumped out of 3 moving cars, spent time in a hospital for it, yet through all of this God showed up and God set me free. Would you have me stay silent about what God did in my life and to sit quietly by instead of inspiring hope in others for what He can do, simply because some people mysteriously don't experience it? I refuse. I refuse to let the testimonies of God be silenced out of fear of offending a few. And I refuse to neuter the power of God because some people think it's a prosperity gospel.

Please address what I am saying and not what I am not saying. I pray that we could equally have compassion and faith. That we could find a balance between the two instead of tripping over both ditches.
 

Cee

Senior Member
May 14, 2010
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Well how is it prosperity gospel?
You said it here

It’s simple you said it . It’s not a bad endeavor.
Simple question why aren’t some healed ?
I lost my father more than a decade ago to cancer . We prayed until the last moment my father was with us . I lost my tia (aunt )last week . We all prayed for her hundreds in fact prayed for my tia ( aunt ) Lupe . What’s the reason ? according to y’all if we had strong enough faith it would have been done . Well why ?
Blessings
Bill
I lost my mom to Cancer, I lost my step dad to a stroke and prayed over him all day and night. I have lost numerous family members to sickness, but I still believe God heals today. I still pray for the sick today. And I have seen people healed of numerous things. I don't understand it all, but that's okay. I do the best I can with what He has given me.
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
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Well how is it prosperity gospel?
You said it here

It’s simple you said it . It’s not a bad endeavor.
Simple question why aren’t some healed ?
I lost my father more than a decade ago to cancer . We prayed until the last moment my father was with us . I lost my tia (aunt )last week . We all prayed for her hundreds in fact prayed for my tia ( aunt ) Lupe . What’s the reason ? according to y’all if we had strong enough faith it would have been done . Well why ?
Blessings
Bill
Well, to begin Laish, I'm sorry for your losses. I hope your spirits are lifted soon and God fills you with joy.

Where you quoted me, context needs to be stated. I asked how what Cee said was prosperity gospel, not what I said. So there isn't really much more to be said in this regard, context is about Cee's post, not my own.

As for the passing of your relatives, and as gently as I can say it, such is life (we all will one day pass away). I do not know their ages, but suffice it to say, just maybe it was their time. Just because we have the faith for something it doesn't mean that God has called us to it. Not all are called to jump out of the boat, right? Even if they have the faith to do so, it is God who gives the command. God is sovereign.

It isn't so much a matter of how strong your faith is, but a simple matter of belief and stretching that belief to the acknowledgement that with God all things are possible. Faith is a matter of trust, and God is faithful ergo you can have faith in Him. As we become more familiar with God, acquainted, theoretically speaking, faith should become easier and easier as we continue to see Him hasten to do His word. To be faithful, since He is not a liar.

You ask why aren't some healed, but I, personally, find the question loaded and starts with a false premise. You see, healing is available through Christ just as salvation is, though both require faith. Am I stating some people aren't healed because they don't believe? Scripture itself gives testament to this. Think of Jesus in His hometown. Prayer itself requires expectation to be made, in order to receive ("believe that you have received"). Faith, expectation, and belief are concepts all wrapped up around our experience in this life.

I wouldn't be so arrogant and heartless to tell another that their relative died because they didn't have faith. I would console them, just as you, in the fact that they're with the Lord! How blessed are they! No longer are they dealing with the things of this life but are in the presence of God.

Yet for those living, those who can still be healed, I would encourage them to believe. To trust the Lord and His sovereignty, whatever that may be. We are not talking of the impossible here, because God has shown it can be done time and again. He is the Lord that heals us, in so many fashions.

Again, I am sorry for your loss and may God take your pain and fill it with joy. Remember the good times you had with your aunt and your father. Rejoice that they now, as believers (assuming) are in His presence. If you yourself need healing or know of others that do, go in the power of the Holy Spirit by the name of Jesus and administer healing. Have others pray over you. Not just prayers of request, but actually operating in the gift of healing.

God bless.
 

Cee

Senior Member
May 14, 2010
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Oh and yes I still struggle with an infirmity myself right now. Even though I believe God heals. Like I said it's all a mystery, but He is God and I am not. And I believe His word even when I don't always see the promise right away.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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"His healing during His time on Earth was to fulfill the Scriptures to the Jews that He was in fact their Messiah."

I can not agree with this statement.
And yet that is exactly what Scripture reveals. Healings were one aspect of the miracles of Christ. But ALL His miracles were signs and wonders, and they were given for a very specific purpose -- to authenticate who He was, who had sent Him, and why He was sent. So that all Israel would believe on Him and be saved. Indeed John calls His selected miracles in the Gospel of John "signs". The Jews always looked for signs, and these miracles were indeed signs and wonders.

And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book:But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name. (John 20:30,31)

Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know (Acts 2:22).

Strong's Concordance
sémeion: a sign
Original Word: σημεῖον, ου, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: sémeion
Phonetic Spelling: (say-mi'-on)
Short Definition: a sign, miracle, indication
Definition: a sign, miracle, indication, mark, token.

Thayer's Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 4592: σημεῖον

b. of miracles and wonders by which God authenticates the men sent by him, or by which men prove that the cause they are pleading is God's:Matthew 12:38; Matthew 16:1, 4; Mark 8:11; Mark 16:17, 20; Luke 11:16, 29; Luke 23:8; John 2:11, 18, 23; John 3:2; John 4:54; John 6:2, 14, 26, 30; John 7:31; John 9:16; John 10:41; John 11:47; John 12:18, 37; John 20:30; Acts 2:22, 43; Acts 8:6; 1 Corinthians 1:22;

 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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Oh and yes I still struggle with an infirmity myself right now. Even though I believe God heals. Like I said it's all a mystery, but He is God and I am not. And I believe His word even when I don't always see the promise right away.
Well which is it? Is healing GUARANTEED in the Atonement so that every believer should be in perfect health and free from every disability or is it not? And is it always because of lack of faith that Christians are not healed, or is there something else we should learn from that?
 

Cee

Senior Member
May 14, 2010
2,169
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And yet that is exactly what Scripture reveals. Healings were one aspect of the miracles of Christ. But ALL His miracles were signs and wonders, and they were given for a very specific purpose -- to authenticate who He was, who had sent Him, and why He was sent. So that all Israel would believe on Him and be saved. Indeed John calls His selected miracles in the Gospel of John "signs". The Jews always looked for signs, and these miracles were indeed signs and wonders.

And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book:But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name. (John 20:30,31)

Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know (Acts 2:22).

Strong's Concordance
sémeion: a sign
Original Word: σημεῖον, ου, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: sémeion
Phonetic Spelling: (say-mi'-on)
Short Definition: a sign, miracle, indication
Definition: a sign, miracle, indication, mark, token.

Thayer's Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 4592: σημεῖον

b. of miracles and wonders by which God authenticates the men sent by him, or by which men prove that the cause they are pleading is God's:Matthew 12:38; Matthew 16:1, 4; Mark 8:11; Mark 16:17, 20; Luke 11:16, 29; Luke 23:8; John 2:11, 18, 23; John 3:2; John 4:54; John 6:2, 14, 26, 30; John 7:31; John 9:16; John 10:41; John 11:47; John 12:18, 37; John 20:30; Acts 2:22, 43; Acts 8:6; 1 Corinthians 1:22;

Let's look at the facts.

We still see healings all through Church history (even today), we see the disciples healed the sick, we see Jesus make a promise that any who believe in Him would do the same, we see in James the command to pray for sick believers not the lost. We see gifts of the Spirit which are still available include healing and miracles.

Yes they are signs to point to Christ, and it is not I who live, but Christ who lives in me. He is still pointing to Himself and revealing Himself however He wants to. Even if some people don't like it.

And rather than celebrate what God is doing today, they point at it and say oh it's the Devil, exactly what they did when Jesus walked the Earth. The religious people couldn't see past their traditions. And they missed Christ. Even going so far as to attribute the Devil for His miracles.
 

Cee

Senior Member
May 14, 2010
2,169
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Well which is it? Is healing GUARANTEED in the Atonement so that every believer should be in perfect health and free from every disability or is it not? And is it always because of lack of faith that Christians are not healed, or is there something else we should learn from that?
Is Peace guaranteed in the atonement or not? Does God want all to be saved or not? So then why aren't all saved? Why don't all have peace when Scripture says those who are focused on Him will be in perfect peace.
 

vic1980

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
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If all were healed then there would be no need for compassion. The LORD has homeless & those that are weak in body to examine if one truly has been born again, to serve the LORD with all your heart soul and mind.

John 3:17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?

Shalom
 

Laish

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2016
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Well, to begin Laish, I'm sorry for your losses. I hope your spirits are lifted soon and God fills you with joy.

Where you quoted me, context needs to be stated. I asked how what Cee said was prosperity gospel, not what I said. So there isn't really much more to be said in this regard, context is about Cee's post, not my own.

As for the passing of your relatives, and as gently as I can say it, such is life (we all will one day pass away). I do not know their ages, but suffice it to say, just maybe it was their time. Just because we have the faith for something it doesn't mean that God has called us to it. Not all are called to jump out of the boat, right? Even if they have the faith to do so, it is God who gives the command. God is sovereign.

It isn't so much a matter of how strong your faith is, but a simple matter of belief and stretching that belief to the acknowledgement that with God all things are possible. Faith is a matter of trust, and God is faithful ergo you can have faith in Him. As we become more familiar with God, acquainted, theoretically speaking, faith should become easier and easier as we continue to see Him hasten to do His word. To be faithful, since He is not a liar.

You ask why aren't some healed, but I, personally, find the question loaded and starts with a false premise. You see, healing is available through Christ just as salvation is, though both require faith. Am I stating some people aren't healed because they don't believe? Scripture itself gives testament to this. Think of Jesus in His hometown. Prayer itself requires expectation to be made, in order to receive ("believe that you have received"). Faith, expectation, and belief are concepts all wrapped up around our experience in this life.

I wouldn't be so arrogant and heartless to tell another that their relative died because they didn't have faith. I would console them, just as you, in the fact that they're with the Lord! How blessed are they! No longer are they dealing with the things of this life but are in the presence of God.

Yet for those living, those who can still be healed, I would encourage them to believe. To trust the Lord and His sovereignty, whatever that may be. We are not talking of the impossible here, because God has shown it can be done time and again. He is the Lord that heals us, in so many fashions.

Again, I am sorry for your loss and may God take your pain and fill it with joy. Remember the good times you had with your aunt and your father. Rejoice that they now, as believers (assuming) are in His presence. If you yourself need healing or know of others that do, go in the power of the Holy Spirit by the name of Jesus and administer healing. Have others pray over you. Not just prayers of request, but actually operating in the gift of healing.

God bless.
First BenFTW thankyou for the kind response.
My point is concerning the op . The video says all are healed that comes to Jesus (The Son) in faith . He states like Eve we are deceived if we state not all are healed . Simple reasoning tells you then no healing no Son . Watch it . Listen to him .

As far as myself I am joyful that I am saved I know of no greater gift than knowing and having faith in our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
I am content with what He has given us. Healing or not I accept all with gratitude . To ask for more on my behalf is greed . To pray for others is what Jesus did an I follow suit. To make it clear I am not a cessationist . I pray for healing my experience is that it is not normative.
Blessings
Bill
 

joaniemarie

Senior Member
Jan 4, 2017
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I'm okay with us not agreeing, if we only listen and hang out with people we agree with there isn't much for us to learn. Part of iron sharpening iron. :)

But I'm not sure we are far off.

I have personally seen God reveal Himself to people through Healing. I didn't say and I don't believe it is the ONLY way. However in this specific Scripture that I am referring to Jesus did reveal Himself as Healer. But where I do not agree is the idea that God NO LONGER reveals Himself as Healer. And there is no where in Scripture that I know of that says this is the case.

I do appreciate that you feel that I am a man full of wisdom. I feel that you are also. But I believe we are wise to the degree that we are lead by the Spirit. So I pray that I and you are continually lead by Him.

Amazing concept..... Christians being able to agree to disagree with one another on a Christian chat site. :)
 

joaniemarie

Senior Member
Jan 4, 2017
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It needs to be said again and again because it keeps being ignored again and again. We have these great and precious promises and in order to see each one of them in our lives we get on the path set before us and walk it out.

All kinds of tribulations from this world., the flesh and the devil will come., Jesus promised that we need to be aware of this AND to mostly be aware that we are to be of good cheer He has overcome the world...the flesh and the devil.

How do we see anything Jesus has for us? By grace through faith. It begins at the time of our salvation. From there we learn about Jesus and what this so great a salvation is by the things we go through and how we keep learning to keep going to Him in and through the new creation we are in Christ and the Holy Spirit who leads, comforts, teaches., guides us into all truth. learning as we go about the love of God in Christ and what it means for us each day.


No one has said here that if you are sick you don't have enough faith.... If you have tribulation you don't have enough faith., if you can't pay the bills you don't have enough faith., if you are dealing with depression you don't have enough faith., if you are not sure how to proceed in life choices you don't have enough faith. I don't agree with those who do say this because these are things we all to some degree deal with each day.

I'm daily learning to walk in the truth and the promises Jesus paid for me to have and it takes me time to walk it out by faith each day. None of us have arrived 100% But I see there are things to learn to access by faith each day. And each day by faith the Bible says we are to prove what is that GOOD and ACCEPTABLE and PERFECT WILL OF GOD.

It takes time for us to grow in that each day. Each day we are supposed to be being transformed by the renewing of our minds so that we each INDIVIDUALLY in the power of the Holy Spirit prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God. Romans 12:2
[SUP]
2 [/SUP]Do not be conformed to this world (this age), [fashioned after and adapted to its external, superficial customs], but be transformed (changed) by the [entire] renewal of your mind [by its new ideals and its new attitude], so that you may prove [for yourselves] what is the good and acceptable and perfect will of God, even the thing which is good and acceptable and perfect [in His sight for you].



And may as well post a few more verses in this chapter in Romans 12


I appeal to you therefore, brethren, and beg of you in view of [all] the mercies of God, to make a decisive dedication of your bodies [presenting all your members and faculties] as a living sacrifice, holy (devoted, consecrated) and well pleasing to God, which is your reasonable (rational, intelligent) service and spiritual worship.
[SUP]
2 [/SUP]Do not be conformed to this world (this age), [fashioned after and adapted to its external, superficial customs], but be transformed (changed) by the [entire] renewal of your mind [by its new ideals and its new attitude], so that you may prove [for yourselves] what is the good and acceptable and perfect will of God, even the thing which is good and acceptable and perfect [in His sight for you].
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3 [/SUP]For by the grace (unmerited favor of God) given to me I warn everyone among you not to estimate and think of himself more highly than he ought [not to have an exaggerated opinion of his own importance], but to rate his ability with sober judgment, each according to the degree of faith apportioned by God to him.
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4 [/SUP]For as in one physical body we have many parts (organs, members) and all of these parts do not have the same function or use,
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5 [/SUP]So we, numerous as we are, are one body in Christ (the Messiah) and individually we are parts one of another [mutually dependent on one another].
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6 [/SUP]Having gifts (faculties, talents, qualities) that differ according to the grace given us, let us use them: [He whose gift is] prophecy, [let him prophesy] according to the proportion of his faith;
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7 [/SUP][He whose gift is] practical service, let him give himself to serving; he who teaches, to his teaching;
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8 [/SUP]He who exhorts (encourages), to his exhortation; he who contributes, let him do it in simplicity and liberality; he who gives aid and superintends, with zeal and singleness of mind; he who does acts of mercy, with genuine cheerfulness and joyful eagerness.
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9 [/SUP][Let your] love be sincere (a real thing); hate what is evil [loathe all ungodliness, turn in horror from wickedness], but hold fast to that which is good.
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10 [/SUP]Love one another with brotherly affection [as members of one family], giving precedence and showing honor to one another.
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11 [/SUP]Never lag in zeal and in earnest endeavor; be aglow and burning with the Spirit, serving the Lord.
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12 [/SUP]Rejoice and exult in hope; be steadfast and patient in suffering and tribulation; be constant in prayer.
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13 [/SUP]Contribute to the needs of God’s people [sharing in the necessities of the saints]; pursue the practice of hospitality.
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14 [/SUP]Bless those who persecute you [who are cruel in their attitude toward you]; bless and do not curse them.
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15 [/SUP]Rejoice with those who rejoice [sharing others’ joy], and weep with those who weep [sharing others’ grief].
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16 [/SUP]Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty (snobbish, high-minded, exclusive), but readily adjust yourself to [people, things] and give yourselves to humble tasks. Never overestimate yourself or be wise in your own conceits.
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17 [/SUP]Repay no one evil for evil, but take thought for what is honest and proper and noble [aiming to be above reproach] in the sight of everyone.
 
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