On Death and Dying -- Spurgeon Style

[SovereignGrace]

Satan did.

As mentioned before, very little is mentioned about the devil in the OT. People would not have been able to deal with a powerful, invisible spiritual enemy. In the OT, God frequently takes the credit for both good and evil.

In the NT, Jesus Christ made known the Father. Likewise, he made known the nature of the devil, and the reality of the spiritual we are in the middle of.

This is so far out of touch with the bible, its sickening.

Now the Spirit of the Lord departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the Lord terrorized him.[1 Samuel 16:14]

So it came about whenever the evil spirit from God came to Saul, David would take the harp and play it with his hand; and Saul would be refreshed and be well, and the evil spirit would depart from him.[1 Samuel 16:23]

Now it came about on the next day that an evil spirit from God came mightily upon Saul, and he raved in the midst of the house, while David was playing the harp with his hand, as usual; and a spear was in Saul’s hand.[1 Samuel 18:10]

Now there was an evil spirit from the Lord on Saul as he was sitting in his house with his spear in his hand, and David was playing the harp with his hand.[1 Samuel 19:9]



Youse guise really need to quit apologizing for God. He knows what to do and how to do it.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Satan did.

Got a verse or passage of verses to support this claim of yours?

 

[shrume]

Got a verse or passage of verses to support this claim of yours?

Here's a few:

1 John 1:5) This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

James 1:17) Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

Rom 2:4) Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

Acts 10:38) How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

2 Pet 3:9) The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1 Tim 2:4) Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

 

[shrume]

This is so far out of touch with the bible, its sickening.

Now the Spirit of the Lord departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the Lord terrorized him.[1 Samuel 16:14]

So it came about whenever the evil spirit from God came to Saul, David would take the harp and play it with his hand; and Saul would be refreshed and be well, and the evil spirit would depart from him.[1 Samuel 16:23]

Now it came about on the next day that an evil spirit from God came mightily upon Saul, and he raved in the midst of the house, while David was playing the harp with his hand, as usual; and a spear was in Saul’s hand.[1 Samuel 18:10]

Now there was an evil spirit from the Lord on Saul as he was sitting in his house with his spear in his hand, and David was playing the harp with his hand.[1 Samuel 19:9]



Youse guise really need to quit apologizing for God. He knows what to do and how to do it.

God had anointed David to be king. It was God's will for David to be king.

You believe that God sent a devil spirit to possess Saul so Saul would try and kill David?

"A house divided against itself cannot stand".

As mentioned before, very little is mentioned about the devil in the OT. People would not have been able to deal with a powerful, invisible spiritual enemy. In the OT, God frequently takes the credit for both good and evil.

In the NT, Jesus Christ made known the Father. Likewise, he made known the nature of the devil, and the reality of the spiritual war we are in the middle of.

 

[SovereignGrace]

God had anointed David to be king. It was God's will for David to be king.

You believe that God sent a devil spirit to possess Saul so Saul would try and kill David?

"A house divided against itself cannot stand".

As mentioned before, very little is mentioned about the devil in the OT. People would not have been able to deal with a powerful, invisible spiritual enemy. In the OT, God frequently takes the credit for both good and evil.

In the NT, Jesus Christ made known the Father. Likewise, he made known the nature of the devil, and the reality of the spiritual we are in the middle of.

Where's the verse that says Satan sent that evil spirit upon King Saul?

 

[SovereignGrace]

Here's a few:

1 John 1:5) This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

James 1:17) Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

Rom 2:4) Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

Acts 10:38) How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

2 Pet 3:9) The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1 Tim 2:4) Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Texts w/o context are pretexts.

You can't just throw a bunch of singled-out verses and think you have an 'a-ha'!

 

[shrume]

Where's the verse that says Satan sent that evil spirit upon King Saul?

As mentioned before, very little is mentioned about the devil in the OT. People would not have been able to deal with a powerful, invisible spiritual enemy. In the OT, God frequently takes the credit for both good and evil.

In the NT, Jesus Christ made known the Father. Likewise, he made known the nature of the devil, and the reality of the spiritual we are in the middle of.

 

[shrume]

Texts w/o context are pretexts.

You can't just throw a bunch of singled-out verses and think you have an 'a-ha'!

Those verses show the character of God, as made known in the NT.

 

[SovereignGrace]

As mentioned before, very little is mentioned about the devil in the OT. People would not have been able to deal with a powerful, invisible spiritual enemy. In the OT, God frequently takes the credit for both good and evil.

In the NT, Jesus Christ made known the Father. Likewise, he made known the nature of the devil, and the reality of the spiritual we are in the middle of.

Again, where is the verse that says Satan sent that evil spirit upon King Saul?

I showed you a bunch of verses that explicitly stated that God sent that evil spirit upon King Saul.

Now, the onus is on you to post one verse, just one verse, that states Satan sent that evil spirit upon King Saul.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Those verses show the character of God, as made known in the NT.

And the bible also proves God uses wicked ppl to fulfill His plan.

The ultimate example of this is the cross of the Christ. God used wicked men, who freely chose to crucify the Christ.

 

[Didymous]

Again, where is the verse that says Satan sent that evil spirit upon King Saul?

I showed you a bunch of verses that explicitly stated that God sent that evil spirit upon King Saul.

Now, the onus is on you to post one verse, just one verse, that states Satan sent that evil spirit upon King Saul.

There's not one verse that says that and we all know this.
His argument only wins if you accept his interpretation of some scriptures that partially define God. Or you can just believe the Bible for what it actually days.

 

[shrume]

God takes credit for good and evil?

In the OT, yes.

Again, where is the verse that says Satan sent that evil spirit upon King Saul?

I showed you a bunch of verses that explicitly stated that God sent that evil spirit upon King Saul.

Yes, you did. But you do not grasp that in the OT, very little is revealed about the devil. People would not have been able to handle knowing they had a powerful, invisible, spiritual enemy.

Now, the onus is on you to post one verse, just one verse, that states Satan sent that evil spirit upon King Saul.

As mentioned before, very little is mentioned about the devil in the OT. People would not have been able to deal with a powerful, invisible spiritual enemy. In the OT, God frequently takes the credit for both good and evil.

In the NT, Jesus Christ made known the Father. Likewise, he made known the nature of the devil, and the reality of the spiritual we are in the middle of.

I have presented my case, and that is what I choose to believe. I am very well aware that the words in the scripture you gave say that the evil spirit was from the Lord, and I gave reasons why I do not believe it. If God did send it, then He cannot be trusted, and those verses I gave a few posts up are not true.

I understand that you believe God sends devil spirits to torment people and have them try and kill people who love God, people "after God's own heart". That's not too much different from you telling your wife you love her but then in the next breath you hire a hit man to take her out.

 

[shrume]

There's not one verse that says that and we all know this.
His argument only wins if you accept his interpretation of some scriptures that partially define God. Or you can just believe the Bible for what it actually days.

If you take the verses that SG gave as being literally true, that God sent a devil spirit to torment Saul and have him try and kill David, then what is written about God in the NT cannot be trusted. It should read more like this:

"Nothing can separate us from the love of God, unless God sends a demon to torment you and have you try and murder other Christians."

 

[SovereignGrace]

In the OT, yes.


Yes, you did. But you do not grasp that in the OT, very little is revealed about the devil. People would not have been able to handle knowing they had a powerful, invisible, spiritual enemy.



As mentioned before, very little is mentioned about the devil in the OT. People would not have been able to deal with a powerful, invisible spiritual enemy. In the OT, God frequently takes the credit for both good and evil.

In the NT, Jesus Christ made known the Father. Likewise, he made known the nature of the devil, and the reality of the spiritual we are in the middle of.

I have presented my case, and that is what I choose to believe. I am very well aware that the words in the scripture you gave say that the evil spirit was from the Lord, and I gave reasons why I do not believe it. If God did send it, then He cannot be trusted, and those verses I gave a few posts up are not true.

I understand that you believe God sends devil spirits to torment people and have them try and kill people who love God, people "after God's own heart". That's not too much different from you telling your wife you love her but then in the next breath you hire a hit man to take her out.

You and I are finito. Its obvious that you're not with it in regards to exegeting scriptures. God is the same God in the OT as He is in the NT. You are off the deep end.

Please do not respond, as you are going on ignore.

 

[Angela53510]

You and I are finito. Its obvious that you're not with it in regards to exegeting scriptures. God is the same God in the OT as He is in the NT. You are off the deep end.

Please do not respond, as you are going on ignore.

Yes, certain people just have to go on ignore.

The thing I find interesting, is all these hypergrace and/or Word Faith people really think the power of life and death is in their hands, and they can command miracles.

Yet, when you confront them with the sovereignty of God, they get mad and outraged, because their shallow idea of God has been cast down. Really, their concept of God, is more like a demi-god, or maybe some kind of idol.

They certainly have no knowledge of the vast and amazing depth of a holy, mighty, and powerful God, as the Bible describes. I guess it is bad preaching in part, and just a failure to read Scripture in context? I would hope it wouldn't be the ego of these persons, for whom "free will" and their own autonomy and independence is more important than God himself.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Yes, certain people just have to go on ignore.

The thing I find interesting, is all these hypergrace and/or Word Faith people really think the power of life and death is in their hands, and they can command miracles.

Yet, when you confront them with the sovereignty of God, they get mad and outraged, because their shallow idea of God has been cast down. Really, their concept of God, is more like a demi-god, or maybe some kind of idol.

They certainly have no knowledge of the vast and amazing depth of a holy, mighty, and powerful God, as the Bible describes. I guess it is bad preaching in part, and just a failure to read Scripture in context? I would hope it wouldn't be the ego of these persons, for whom "free will" and their own autonomy and independence is more important than God himself.

Sadly, this is the 'god' they want...

If He can't be shaped and molded into what they want, forget it. Plus, they can rip off the parts they don't want and toss them in the trash can.

 

[Desdichado]

Conversely, I don't know how certain heretics/apostates can convince themselves they're jedi wizards.

Yes, certain people just have to go on ignore.

The thing I find interesting, is all these hypergrace and/or Word Faith people really think the power of life and death is in their hands, and they can command miracles.

Yet, when you confront them with the sovereignty of God, they get mad and outraged, because their shallow idea of God has been cast down. Really, their concept of God, is more like a demi-god, or maybe some kind of idol.

They certainly have no knowledge of the vast and amazing depth of a holy, mighty, and powerful God, as the Bible describes. I guess it is bad preaching in part, and just a failure to read Scripture in context? I would hope it wouldn't be the ego of these persons, for whom "free will" and their own autonomy and independence is more important than God himself.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Let's take a look at a few examples of bad times, and God still being in control...

Joseph sold into slavery, gets to be Potiphar's right hand man. His wife wants Joseph, but he gets away and leaves some of his clothing behind. Wife lies and gets Joseph tossed into prison. ~ 3 years later, he interprets a dream for Pharaoh and at the end, is his right hand man. Saves his family from starving to death and knows that they meant it for evil, but God intended it for good.[Genesis 50:20]

Israel is taken into captivity for 70 years. It even says In the third year of the reign of Jehoiakim king of Judah, Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon came to Jerusalem and besieged it. The Lord gave Jehoiakim king of Judah into his hand, along with some of the vessels of the house of God; and he brought them to the land of Shinar, to the house of his god, and he brought the vessels into the treasury of his god.[Daniel 1:1-3] Over a period of time, Daniel is exalted until he becomes King Darius' right hand man. In time, God moves King Cyrus to allow His ppl to return to Jerusalem to rebuild the temple.

Jonah is told, by God, to go to Ninevah. Jonah rebels and goes to Tarshish and gets on a ship. He becomes whale food for three days and nights, and then get regurgitated. Makes haste and goes to Ninevah and tells them what God told him to say. He still gets puffed up when God does not destroy them.

Job is assaulted by Satan, but God told him what he could and could not do, and set the boundaries that he could not cross.

Then there's the cross. The cruelest event to ever take place. A sinless man is crucified to a cross. He is mocked, slapped, spit upon, had His beard torn from His face. His Apostles ran away and leave Him to Himself(yet He was never truly alone) to be throttled by these wicked men.

Apostle Paul is beaten, imprisoned, shipwrecked, ridiculed, and then finally beheaded for the cause of the Christ.



Yet, in all of these events, God was in control.

 

[Depleted]

The problem I am seeing is ppl are so stuck on God being a God of love, they do so to the detriment of all of His other attributes. Its like they divorce His love from all other attributes. God is not just love, but holy, just, righteous, wrath, vengeance, but all they focus on is love, love, love, LOVE!!!

The LGBTQ community believes that as well. Try saying God is love to them. I picture things going like this.

Jane goes to a local LGBTQ parade to witness to them. She sees a young lady by herself and she introduces herself to her.

"Hi, I am Jane. I noticed you were here at this parade, and I want to tell you God loves you."

"Hi. I am Judy. I know! Isn't He wonderful? He loves everybody. We are made in His likeness, and He loves us just the way we are."

"Sorry, but He does not love your lifestyle. He loves you, but not your sin."

"What do you mean? God is love, and He can not hate."

"Well, He does hate your sin. He loves you, but hates your sin."

"Look, God loves us the way we are. You are just being silly. That's just like you Christians. You always want to look down on those who are not just like you!"

"Sweetie, that is not what I am doing, but I am concerned for your soul. Those who don't repent of their sins, and die in that state, will go to an eternal hell."

"There you go with God loving me, but then casting me into hell! You are wrong. God is love, and He loves us just the way we are. I help my neighbors when they need help. I go to the homeless shelter twice a week and help to serve meals to the less fortunate. I have donated a bunch of clothes and money to them through the years. I have even driven some of them to hospitals when they need medical care. I help my neighbor, and that is what Jesus said we should do. He loves me just the way I am."

"Sorry dear, but that's not true."

"Look, I am through with you and this 'god' that will cast me into hell. That is not the God I know. I think its best you leave me alone, or I will call for the police."


Yes, God is love, yet because He is love, He also must hate. He hates those who commit iniquity. This 'God loves the sinner but hates the sin' looks good on bumpers, but its not sound teaching.

That's not just the LBGTQ community. That's what Peaceful and Shrume are trying to teach here. And, they don't much like the true gospel, which is why they're doing this on this thread.

 

[SovereignGrace]

That's not just the LBGTQ community. That's what Peaceful and Shrume are trying to teach here. And, they don't much like the true gospel, which is why they're doing this on this thread.

Oh, I wholeheartedly agree. I was just using that as an example. The reason why ppl don't fear God is because all they hear about Him is love, love, love, love, LOVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!