The Fall of Islam

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Dec 6, 2012
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#21
You say that 'all muslims' have the goal of world domination for their religion. This is only true when the religion is used in extroverted fashion, against which Muhammad has warned.

The word islam is referenced across several Arabic languages meaning something akin to 'surrender of oneself'.

This does not mean, as it has been twisted 'force others unto surrender of themselves'.

The Koran takes quotes from the Jewish Torah stating eye for eye teachings, but always goes on after their reference to advocate that the cultivation of forgiveness, mercy, and above all, love and joy. The Arabic word 'Meshallah' is roughly translated as 'joy'. Literally it means 'make as (or alike to) Allah'.

The word Jihad is a reference to this very inner struggle. To come out of the ways of eye for eye and transcend that Earthly way of thought.

The Koran does justify retaliation if someone should strike a muslim (and muslim, in the koran, is actually defined as simply a person who is made by God. ie. Everyone), or indeed, for instance, if a war has been brought to their own soil, it is thought fair that they strike back by the law. As it is in the Torah and Old Testament, if you were to take a literal viewpoint. That by the law you are justified in self defence. But no law can cover bad morals. hence why true followers do not eat 'the flesh of the swine'.

It also advocates that instead of striking back, one can do better to forgive and have mercy.

The literal translation of Jihad is not 'holy war', it is 'holy struggle'.

Extremists in Islam misquote the Koran. Or in fact leave important verses out entirely to suit the ideal that it can be used to hate and for domination.

And the same extremists for instance, might twist the bible to advocate and allow hatred towards Muslims. To condone wars and the like.

Nether teaching advocates these things.

It is like the verses in the bible where there is the passage speaking of a man raping a woman, and what he must do afterwards in order to make it up to her.

The passage states that if a man takes a virgin, or unbetrothed lady, and defiles her, that he must offer her shelter, food, warmth and care for all her days, and is never allowed to divorce her.

This passage is often twisted into this: 'If a woman is raped by a man, she MUST marry him and is never allowed to divorce him. He's defiled her and she's no longer any good', when this is leagues apart from the real meaning of the verse.

It's the same with the Koran.

arabic and hebrew, are very idiomatic languages and without the proper root understanding of what the words and phrases reference to, it is almost impossible to understand the true nature of what it is trying to say.

The Koran has an infinitesimal vocabulary. And each word has to be taken in it's proper context.
 
T

Therapon

Guest
#22
What about those behind buddhism, hinduism and confucianism? Surely by your reasoning they could fit that mode as well.
Not really. We can prove that Bible prophecy specifically targets Islam. Hinduism and confucianism are not trespassing on the Temple Mount of God most holy, but Islam does with the Dome of the Rock.
 
Dec 6, 2012
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#23
You really believe the temple mount of God is a piece of Land that can be defiled by a building honouring the same God of the Jewish Torah that we worship?

It's the spirit that talks. Not a piece of land.
 
Dec 6, 2012
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#24
There's a reason literal Israel holds the prime example of the stumbling block to the spiritual Israel.
 
Dec 1, 2012
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#25
Not really. We can prove that Bible prophecy specifically targets Islam. Hinduism and confucianism are not trespassing on the Temple Mount of God most holy, but Islam does with the Dome of the Rock.
Do you not understand that the kingdom of God is NOT of this world?

The dome in merely entertainment to play on our minds. God does not dwell in buildings made with human hands.
 
Dec 6, 2012
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#26
The temple is the mind and it is the wheat and tares of thought which inhabit it. Learn to capture these thoughts and HOLD THEM CAPTIVE TO CHRIST and one can understand what it means then to 'cut off ones hands'.

It is the Spirit of peace love and joy, regardless of it's name or title, that is of the Kingdom of God.
 

Cobb

Banned
Dec 27, 2012
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#27
........... So islam or rome is the beast? Confusion.
Babylon is the word Babel in the Hebrew and it means "confusion"- so every time you see the word Babylon in the bible it signifies confusion. There is only one biblical entity that exatchly matches the descriptions of the beasts of the Revelation, and that entity is divided Israel. You have the dominion/kingdom of the northern house of Israel with its 10 tribes/princes/horns and you have the sanctuary of the southern house of Judah with its 2 tribes/princes/horns. You have the seven mountains of the seven kingdoms which were conquered by Israel. You have the indwelling qualities of the former beasts (lion/bear/leopard) which had Israel in subjegation, and whose worship of strange gods influenced Israel into apostacy from the word of the Lord. You have a false passover token (mark on hand/forehead) along with a false prophet (antichrist, as Jesus was and is the prophet; Paul calls the false prophet "another Jesus")- this is apostate Israel and this signifies apostate Christianity. Jerusalem is the great whore as the imagery is the same as shown by Ezekiel (c16). These things all signify Israel, which is the church of Christ; but in a state of apostacy. This is the apostacy spoken of by Paul, which precede the day of Christ; this is said by Paul to occur with all power and signs, and the false prophet and the son of perdition are one and the same: the false Messiah "another Jesus"

All of this Islam, New World Order, USA "beasts" is just misdirection; Satan is using basic misdirection tactics to confuse the Christians so when the son of perdition is revealed with all power, then they'll accept him as Jesus Christ returned, which he'll appear to be, and which mostly they'll do.

This kingdom has been here all my life. It is one of division. It is left behind by those who came before us! Taurine of various religions (including christianity) and systems of government (buying and selling) in which we all are deceived by.

But sadly, no one will listen.
True but Great Babylon (Great Confusion) doesn't "overflow her cup" until the son of perdition has been revealed and the churches become apostate from the Lord. Only a small remnant of Christians will remain faithful to the Lord Jesus, the rest will be carried away captive into Great Confusion. But these things all signify Israel; the church, divided and in a state of apostacy.
 
T

Therapon

Guest
#28
Do you not understand that the kingdom of God is NOT of this world?
The Bible was written for real people living real physical lives in this material world. If it wasn't, then it is meaningless.
 
T

Therapon

Guest
#29
You really believe the temple mount of God is a piece of Land that can be defiled by a building honouring the same God of the Jewish Torah that we worship? It's the spirit that talks. Not a piece of land.
To quote Jesus, "You err not knowing the Scripture."

1Chronicles 28:2 “Then David the king stood up upon his feet, and said, Hear me, my brethren, and my people: As for me, I had in mine heart to build an house of rest for the ark of the covenant of the LORD, andfor the footstool of our God, and had made ready for the building.”


2 Chronicles 3:1
“Then Solomon began to build the house of the LORD at Jerusalem in mount Moriah, where the LORD appeared unto David his father, in the place that David had prepared in the threshingfloor of Ornan the Jebusite.”


2Chronicles 7:12 and 16 “And the LORD appeared to Solomon by night, and said unto him, I have heard thy prayer, and have chosen this place to myself for an house of sacrifice . . . For now have I chosen and sanctified this house, that my name may be there forever: and mine eyes and mine heart shall be there perpetually.”


So the church may have forgotten the Temple Mount, but our God hasn't.
 
Dec 1, 2012
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#30
Babylon is the word Babel in the Hebrew and it means "confusion"- so every time you see the word Babylon in the bible it signifies confusion. There is only one biblical entity that exatchly matches the descriptions of the beasts of the Revelation, and that entity is divided Israel. You have the dominion/kingdom of the northern house of Israel with its 10 tribes/princes/horns and you have the sanctuary of the southern house of Judah with its 2 tribes/princes/horns. You have the seven mountains of the seven kingdoms which were conquered by Israel. You have the indwelling qualities of the former beasts (lion/bear/leopard) which had Israel in subjegation, and whose worship of strange gods influenced Israel into apostacy from the word of the Lord. You have a false passover token (mark on hand/forehead) along with a false prophet (antichrist, as Jesus was and is the prophet; Paul calls the false prophet "another Jesus")- this is apostate Israel and this signifies apostate Christianity. Jerusalem is the great whore as the imagery is the same as shown by Ezekiel (c16). These things all signify Israel, which is the church of Christ; but in a state of apostacy. This is the apostacy spoken of by Paul, which precede the day of Christ; this is said by Paul to occur with all power and signs, and the false prophet and the son of perdition are one and the same: the false Messiah "another Jesus"

All of this Islam, New World Order, USA "beasts" is just misdirection; Satan is using basic misdirection tactics to confuse the Christians so when the son of perdition is revealed with all power, then they'll accept him as Jesus Christ returned, which he'll appear to be, and which mostly they'll do.



True but Great Babylon (Great Confusion) doesn't "overflow her cup" until the son of perdition has been revealed and the churches become apostate from the Lord. Only a small remnant of Christians will remain faithful to the Lord Jesus, the rest will be carried away captive into Great Confusion. But these things all signify Israel; the church, divided and in a state of apostacy.
Beloved. This is the great confusion... The man of sin is the earthly man. He is not revealed until the individual has died, whether in the crucifying of the flesh (those having the firstfruits of the Spirit) and those who have really died and has put off the body of sins.

We are ALL beasts until the drawing of God. It is the mind of the flesh that holds us captive. The carnal mind is satan.


It is the tongue that walks to and fro seeking to destroy, and all to profit. Money is indeed the root of all evil.
 

Cobb

Banned
Dec 27, 2012
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#31
Beloved. This is the great confusion... The man of sin is the earthly man. He is not revealed until the individual has died, whether in the crucifying of the flesh (those having the firstfruits of the Spirit) and those who have really died and has put off the body of sins.

We are ALL beasts until the drawing of God. It is the mind of the flesh that holds us captive. The carnal mind is satan.


It is the tongue that walks to and fro seeking to destroy, and all to profit. Money is indeed the root of all evil.
I don't disagree that there's an individual persepctive as you're alluding; however, these things contain more than the individual perspective; there's the individual, the house, the family, the tribe, the nation and ultimately the world.

The Revelation is about the fulfillment of the fall festivals (just as the gospels are about the fulfillment of the spring festivals) and is about tribes, nations and languages. And the beasts are definitely divided, apostate Israel; and the false prophet is the son of perdition, the head of the serpent.

The carnal mind is Satan, and the spiritual mind is Christ; just as the spiritual is a body with an individual "head" the King of Israel, the carnal is also a body with an individual "head" the King of Babel- and he's coming on the 10th day of the 10th month just like he did the first time. And this is when the course of the Revelation is fulfilled.
 
T

Therapon

Guest
#32
You say that 'all muslims' have the goal of world domination for their religion. This is only true when the religion is used in extroverted fashion, against which Muhammad has warned.
The Koran has an infinitesimal vocabulary. And each word has to be taken in it's proper context.



Forgotten 9/11 already? How about a dose of reality . . . real people all over the world, including right here in the USA, getting murdered in the name of allah . . . .

Posted on www.creepingsharia.com



"There is unanimity that the male apostate must be put to death."

Liberal talk show host Tawfiq Okasha recently appeared on "Egypt Today," airing a video of Muslims slicing off a young man’s head off for the crime of apostasy — in this instance, the crime of converting to Christianity and refusing to renounce it. The video can be seen here — but be warned, it is immensely graphic . . .

http://creepingsharia.wordpress.com/2012/06/10/graphic-video-muslims-slaughter-apostate-in-tunisia/


(the actual execution appears from minute 1:13-4:00). For those who prefer not to view it, a summary follows: A young man appears held down by masked men. His head is pulled back, with a knife to his throat. He does not struggle and appears resigned to his fate. Speaking in Arabic, the background speaker, or "narrator," chants a number of Muslim prayers and supplications, mostly condemning Christianity, which, because of the Trinity, is referred to as a polytheistic faith: "Let Allah be avenged on the polytheist apostate"; "Allah empower your religion, make it victorious against the polytheists"; "Allah, defeat the infidels at the hands of the Muslims," and "There is no god but Allah and Muhammad is his messenger."
Then, to cries of "Allahu Akbar!"— Allah is greater!"—the masked man holding the knife to the apostate’s throat begins to hack away, severing the head completely after approximately one minute of graphic knife-carving, as the victim drowns in his own blood. Finally, the severed head is held aloft to more Islamic slogans of victory.
Visibly distraught, Tawfiq Okasha, the host, asks: "Is this Islam? . . . these are the images that are disseminated throughout the electronic media in Europe and America. Can you imagine?" Then, in reference to Egypt’s Muslim Brotherhood and Salafis, whose political influence has grown tremendously, he asks, "How are such people supposed to govern?"

Only the other day, a prominent Egyptian Salafi leader — referring to the canonical hadiths, including Muhammad’s command, "Whoever leaves his religion, kill him" — openly stated that no Muslim has the right to apostatize, or leave Islam.

Any number of Islamic legal manuals make explicitly clear that apostasy is a capital crime, punishable by death. The first "righteous caliph," a model of Muslim piety, had tens of thousands of former Muslims slaughtered—including by burning, beheading, and crucifixion—simply because they tried to break away from Islam. According to the Encyclopaedia of Islam, the most authoritative reference work on Islam in the English language, "there is unanimity that the male apostate must be put to death."

 
Finally, a word on the "prayers" or supplications to Allah made by the Muslim executioners in the video: these are standard and formulaic. In other words, these are not just masked, anonymous butchers who pray to Allah as they engage in acts of cutting throats and holding up heads, these are top-ranking Muslim leaders, who appear regularly on TV, who invoke such hate-filled prayers. See here for examples of Muslims supplicating Allah to strike infidels with cancer and disease "till they pray for death and do not receive it;" there are even formalized prayers in Mecca, blasted on megaphones as Muslims honor their obligation to go on a pilgrimage at least once in their lives, supplicating Allah to make the lives of Christians and Jews "hostage to misery; drape them with endless despair, unrelenting pain and unremitting ailment; fill their lives with sorrow and pain and end their lives in humiliation and oppression."

 


Galatians 5:1 "Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage."
The bondage Islam would inflict on the world is directly opposed to the freedom we have in Christ Jesus.
Worldwide, there have been over 20,100 deadly Islamic terrorist attacks since 9/11.  
In England, mostly in London, there have been approximately 3000 so-called "honor killings" perpetrated by Muslims.

 
The point being: Any "god" whose holy book directs people to commit unspeakable acts of cruelty and murder is not the Creator of the Universe, but Satan in disguise. Islam has not changed its goals or its behavior just because it crossed the Atlantic, so don’t be fooled by their lies!

 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,709
3,650
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#33
The "false prophet" is an individual, Muhammad! He was here 1300 years ago and he has led almost two billion people away from the Savior of the world, 1Jo 2:2.
so by Rev. 19:20 what miracles did Mohammed do?
 
T

Therapon

Guest
#34
Revelation is about the fulfillment of the fall festivals (just as the gospels are about the fulfillment of the spring festivals) and is about tribes, nations and languages. And the beasts are definitely divided, apostate Israel; and the false prophet is the son of perdition, the head of the serpent.


Actually, Revelation itself tells us what the book is about . . .

Revelation 1:1 "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him . . ."

So Revelation is actually God the Father’s telling us about His Son Jesus.

"to shew unto his servants . . ."

So Jesus is to show Revelation to His servants. The Greek word translated servants in this verse is doulos, which by definition means a slave.


In Greek, the original language of the New Testament, the Lord names many different kinds of servants: the pais, the presbuteros the diakonos, the episkopos, the leitourgikos, the huperetes, the therapon, etc., but Revelation wasn’t written to any of those servants. It was written to Jesus’ doulos, His slaves! One may indeed be Jesus’ servant, even a church leader, a presbuteros or episkopos, but to understand Revelation, that person must also be Jesus’ slave!

"things which must shortly come to pass (i.e., right away, not 2000 years in the future); and he sent and signified it by his angel (Greek: aggelos, a messenger. In this verse Jesus is that messenger) unto his servant John."

Position of the Church During the Christian Era

Revelation 1:6 "And hath made (past tense) us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen."

Revelation 1:9 (LITV) "I, even your brother John, and co-sharer in THE (the Greek definite article "te") affliction (thlipsis, usually translated "tribulation"), and in THE "te" kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ."

Pretty hard to be a king if there isn't a kingdom to be in. So unless we want to rip Rev 1:9 out of the Bible, the tribulation and Jesus’ kingdom are the Christian era.

 

Revelation 1:19 "Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter."

Note the tense of the verbs . . . past, present and future. So the book of Revelation is partly about events that took place before John’s time, partly about events that happen during John’s time and partly about events future to John’s time!

Revelation is thus a summation of God the Father's dealings with man over our 6000 years of recorded history.
 
T

Therapon

Guest
#35
so by Rev. 19:20 what miracles did Mohammed do?
Muslim imams will tell you many, not the least of which is their claim that Muhammad bodily ascended into heaven from the Temple Mount in Jerusalem. Oh yeah, and he supposedly cruised around the countryside on a flying camel.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#36
Forgotten 9/11 already? How about a dose of reality . . . real people all over the world, including right here in the USA, getting murdered in the name of allah
ugh.
how about a real dose of reality, ellis?

muslims didn't do 9-11.

ISRAEL AND THE NEOCONS DID.

want proof? or are you going to continue to slander billions of muslims?

more like: 'real people all over the world getting murdered in the name of The Judeo-Christian God....in reality the g-d of Judaism - jewry itself' < READ THE TALMUD
 
Last edited:
T

Therapon

Guest
#37
ugh.
how about a real dose of reality, ellis?

muslims didn't do 9-11.

ISRAEL AND THE NEOCONS DID.

want proof? or are you going to continue to slander billions of muslims?
Don't leave out the tooth fairy. Like I've told you before, Zone, you go ahead and believe whatever you want to. I wouldn't for the world try to change one iota of it.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#38
Don't leave out the tooth fairy. Like I've told you before, Zone, you go ahead and believe whatever you want to. I wouldn't for the world try to change one iota of it.
tooth fairy? hehe....great.

your muslims from a cave taking down 3 buildings (one never struck by a plane - #7 ...and the twin towers lucky larry silverstein had a double insurance clause on), and making a clean missle...i mean jetliner strike on the pentegon without so much as bending a blase of grass...all while using boxcutters is quite a tall tale and an extremely elaborate conspiracy theory. did you know many of those muslims are still alive today, ellis?

lucky for the magically reincarnated muslim evildoers alive in their home countries today, NORAD was doing a drill that just happened to go hot that very day.....imagine that.



since your entire thesis is founded on muslims doing 9-11 and attempting to take over the world, is it okay to prove you wrong on your thread?

i mean it's part of your foundation, right?
with your permission, of course.

it won't take long.

(do you read and write hebrew ellis?)
 
Dec 6, 2012
213
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#40



Forgotten 9/11 already? How about a dose of reality . . . real people all over the world, including right here in the USA, getting murdered in the name of allah . . . .

Posted on www.creepingsharia.com



"There is unanimity that the male apostate must be put to death."

Liberal talk show host Tawfiq Okasha recently appeared on "Egypt Today," airing a video of Muslims slicing off a young man’s head off for the crime of apostasy — in this instance, the crime of converting to Christianity and refusing to renounce it. The video can be seen here — but be warned, it is immensely graphic . . .

http://creepingsharia.wordpress.com/2012/06/10/graphic-video-muslims-slaughter-apostate-in-tunisia/


(the actual execution appears from minute 1:13-4:00). For those who prefer not to view it, a summary follows: A young man appears held down by masked men. His head is pulled back, with a knife to his throat. He does not struggle and appears resigned to his fate. Speaking in Arabic, the background speaker, or "narrator," chants a number of Muslim prayers and supplications, mostly condemning Christianity, which, because of the Trinity, is referred to as a polytheistic faith: "Let Allah be avenged on the polytheist apostate"; "Allah empower your religion, make it victorious against the polytheists"; "Allah, defeat the infidels at the hands of the Muslims," and "There is no god but Allah and Muhammad is his messenger."
Then, to cries of "Allahu Akbar!"— Allah is greater!"—the masked man holding the knife to the apostate’s throat begins to hack away, severing the head completely after approximately one minute of graphic knife-carving, as the victim drowns in his own blood. Finally, the severed head is held aloft to more Islamic slogans of victory.
Visibly distraught, Tawfiq Okasha, the host, asks: "Is this Islam? . . . these are the images that are disseminated throughout the electronic media in Europe and America. Can you imagine?" Then, in reference to Egypt’s Muslim Brotherhood and Salafis, whose political influence has grown tremendously, he asks, "How are such people supposed to govern?"

Only the other day, a prominent Egyptian Salafi leader — referring to the canonical hadiths, including Muhammad’s command, "Whoever leaves his religion, kill him" — openly stated that no Muslim has the right to apostatize, or leave Islam.

Any number of Islamic legal manuals make explicitly clear that apostasy is a capital crime, punishable by death. The first "righteous caliph," a model of Muslim piety, had tens of thousands of former Muslims slaughtered—including by burning, beheading, and crucifixion—simply because they tried to break away from Islam. According to the Encyclopaedia of Islam, the most authoritative reference work on Islam in the English language, "there is unanimity that the male apostate must be put to death."

&#12288;
Finally, a word on the "prayers" or supplications to Allah made by the Muslim executioners in the video: these are standard and formulaic. In other words, these are not just masked, anonymous butchers who pray to Allah as they engage in acts of cutting throats and holding up heads, these are top-ranking Muslim leaders, who appear regularly on TV, who invoke such hate-filled prayers. See here for examples of Muslims supplicating Allah to strike infidels with cancer and disease "till they pray for death and do not receive it;" there are even formalized prayers in Mecca, blasted on megaphones as Muslims honor their obligation to go on a pilgrimage at least once in their lives, supplicating Allah to make the lives of Christians and Jews "hostage to misery; drape them with endless despair, unrelenting pain and unremitting ailment; fill their lives with sorrow and pain and end their lives in humiliation and oppression."

&#12288;


Galatians 5:1 "Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage."
The bondage Islam would inflict on the world is directly opposed to the freedom we have in Christ Jesus.
Worldwide, there have been over 20,100 deadly Islamic terrorist attacks since 9/11. &#12288;
In England, mostly in London, there have been approximately 3000 so-called "honor killings" perpetrated by Muslims.

&#12288;
The point being: Any "god" whose holy book directs people to commit unspeakable acts of cruelty and murder is not the Creator of the Universe, but Satan in disguise. Islam has not changed its goals or its behavior just because it crossed the Atlantic, so don’t be fooled by their lies!

Have you already forgotten all the corrupt christian practices through thr ages? The millions of deaths in the name of the christian God?

People skew scripture.