Not By Works

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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#1
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
#1
It does not get any plainer..........Our righteous works have ZERO to do with Salvation!

English Standard Version
he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

Berean Study Bible
He saved us, not by the righteous deeds we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of new birth and renewal by the Holy Spirit.

Berean Literal Bible
He saved us, not by works in righteousness that we did, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,

New American Standard Bible
He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,

King James Bible
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
 
J

JesusRules1

Banned
#2
Nov 19, 2016
502
23
0
#2
Our works cannot save us,for our works is as filthy rags,and there is none that does good,no not one,and all are sinners and come short of the glory of God.

So no matter what we do we cannot ever do good enough to receive salvation.

In that position the only thing we can do to correct this position is to have faith,that is why we are saved by faith for that is all we can do,for our works cannot do it.

All we have to do is believe.

Paul said we are not saved by works,but by accepting Christ,which he was addressing Gentiles,and their false religions,that thought they could have favor with God by their religious ways,but Paul said you are not saved by those works but by confessing Christ.

Paul was speaking from a fleshy perspective,not saved by works,and James is speaking from a spiritual perspective,accepting Christ,and being led of the Spirit,justified by works and not faith alone.

If a person does confess Christ,they only have to love people for love is the fulfilling of the law,which is what James is saying,and that is why he said if you do not feed someone when you can,then how do you have faith,and any work they would do apart from that,loving people,like if they go by Old Testament physical ordinances,or do something that another religion would do has no bearing on their salvation,but a waste of time.

Paul,not saved by works,James,but led of the Spirit loving people to have faith active in our life.
 
L

LaurenTM

Guest
#3
#3
It does not get any plainer..........Our righteous works have ZERO to do with Salvation!
Click to expand...
you trying to cause trouble here?.....:eek:
 
P

Pilkington

Senior Member
#4
Jan 13, 2015
640
101
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#4
Not only can we never be good enough to deserve salvation nor can we be so bad that we can not be saved.

Ephesisians 2:8-9 [SUP]8 [/SUP]For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— [SUP]9 [/SUP]not by works, so that no one can boast.

I feel overwhelmed with gratitude that God has given me the gift of salvation.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#6
#6
Pilkington said:
Not only can we never be good enough to deserve salvation nor can we be so bad that we can not be saved.

Ephesisians 2:8-9 [SUP]8 [/SUP]For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— [SUP]9 [/SUP]not by works, so that no one can boast.

I feel overwhelmed with gratitude that God has given me the gift of salvation.
Click to expand...

I find it amazing, that God said he saved us when we were at our worse. that people think AFTER we have been adopted as a child of God, Given the HS who helps giude us, and chastens us, that we can become WORSE that we were BEFORE we were saved.

That seem to be an impossible task. It basically says GOD totally failed in growing us, they even with his inluence and power. we went backward, NOT FORWARD.

 
P

Pilkington

Senior Member
#7
Jan 13, 2015
640
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#7
eternally-gratefull said:

I find it amazing, that God said he saved us when we were at our worse. that people think AFTER we have been adopted as a child of God, Given the HS who helps giude us, and chastens us, that we can become WORSE that we were BEFORE we were saved.

That seem to be an impossible task. It basically says GOD totally failed in growing us, they even with his inluence and power. we went backward, NOT FORWARD.

Click to expand...

If we have been saved, I agree with you that we can not become worse than we were before. I think sometimes we forgot that over time through the work of the Holy Spirit we become more like Jesus. The difficulty can be that we become more aware and more sensitive to our own sinfulness. We also forget thatwe and others have been on a journey and loose sight on where we have come from and what we and they wre like.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#8
#8
Pilkington said:
If we have been saved, I agree with you that we can not become worse than we were before. I think sometimes we forgot that over time through the work of the Holy Spirit we become more like Jesus. The difficulty can be that we become more aware and more sensitive to our own sinfulness. We also forget thatwe and others have been on a journey and loose sight on where we have come from and what we and they wre like.
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Thats why I think we must always be others focused, and not look at self We can tend to puff self up and in doing so judge others..

when in reaity, When God sees us, he sees us in the same boat (either back due to sin, or perfectly white due to his son)
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#9
#9
I just posted this in another... Abraham believed was Counted righteousness then did a work to show or prove his faith... Circumcisions.. You can't throw out works.. they prove your faith
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

Senior Member
#10
Apr 7, 2014
25,423
13,359
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#10
Pilkington said:
Ephesisians 2:8-9 [SUP]8 [/SUP]For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— [SUP]9 [/SUP]not by works, so that no one can boast.

I feel overwhelmed with gratitude that God has given me the gift of salvation.
Click to expand...
Amen! I've heard works-salvationists attempt to explain Ephesians 2:8,9 away by interpreting it as such:

8 For it is by grace you have been saved through faith (and good works, just not works of the law) and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God 9 not by "those" works (works of the law) so that no one can boast (but by these works/good works). Which of course is bogus. Good works cannot be dissected from the moral aspect of the law.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#11
#11
HisHolly said:
I just posted this in another... Abraham believed was Counted righteousness then did a work to show or prove his faith... Circumcisions.. You can't throw out works.. they prove your faith
Click to expand...

Yes you can throw out works. Unless you think God can not know our faith, God does not need proof, We may, But God does not.

That passage said Abraham was declared righteous (saved) before he did one work.

The work was a natural response to faith. Not an addendum to faith to help his get saved.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#12
#12
mailmandan said:
Amen! I've heard works-salvationists attempt to explain Ephesians 2:8,9 away by interpreting it as such:

8 For it is by grace you have been saved through faith (and good works, just not works of the law) and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God 9 not by "those" works (works of the law) so that no one can boast (but by these works/good works). Which of course is bogus. Good works cannot be dissected from the moral aspect of the law.
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Amen

Not of works LEST ANYONE SHOULD BOAST.

If you can take credit, or boast, Then it is a work,, You can boast of works outside the law. Not just the law.

Not to mention, at no time is the law mentioned in these chapters of Ephesians in regard to works, so they are ADDING to the word.
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#13
#13
What a load of garbage... You clearly need to go seek the truth..
eternally-gratefull said:

Yes you can throw out works. Unless you think God can not know our faith, God does not need proof, We may, But God does not.

That passage said Abraham was declared righteous (saved) before he did one work.

The work was a natural response to faith. Not an addendum to faith to help his get saved.
Click to expand...
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#14
#14
HisHolly said:
What a load of garbage... You clearly need to go seek the truth..
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yep. this proved me wrong. (SMH)

I have truth my friend, When you stop trying to add your works to grace, And thinking GOD NEEDS PROOF. or at least can open your eyes and be open minded, then come to me, maybe we can have a discussion.
 
P

Pilkington

Senior Member
#15
Jan 13, 2015
640
101
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#15
Our righteousness is as filthy rags.

Any good deeds I do flow out of my salvation.

Ephesisians 2: [SUP]10 [/SUP]For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.


Any good deeds I do are as a result of my salvation and in no way can they earn me salvation. Anything I do is out of loving gratitude to God.
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

Senior Member
#16
Apr 7, 2014
25,423
13,359
113
58
#16
Pilkington said:
Our righteousness is as filthy rags.

Any good deeds I do flow out of my salvation.

Ephesisians 2: [SUP]10 [/SUP]For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

Any good deeds I do are as a result of my salvation and in no way can they earn me salvation. Anything I do is out of loving gratitude to God.
Click to expand...
Amen! Faith is the root of salvation and good works are the fruit. We are saved FOR good works and NOT BY good works.
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#17
#17
I never said He needs it... If you don't have them they are a sign you don't have IT...
eternally-gratefull said:
yep. this proved me wrong. (SMH)

I have truth my friend, When you stop trying to add your works to grace, And thinking GOD NEEDS PROOF. or at least can open your eyes and be open minded, then come to me, maybe we can have a discussion.
Click to expand...
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#18
#18
We know them by what they produce, if you produce nothing, then.... You're all talk
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#19
#19
You throw out grace like its the subject.. you can count and hope if you want... Faith and walking with Christ produces .. if you have nothing you're doing nothing but reading.. hearer only
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#20
#20
HisHolly said:
I never said He needs it... If you don't have them they are a sign you don't have IT...
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how can "you" know someone has good works? And is not just religious?

You can't so what good is it? God does not need it, You can't use it to determine someone elses salvation, so other than you examining you own faith, what good is it?

 
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