Martin Luther Invented the "Imputed Righteousness of Christ" Doctrine

valiant · Apr 16, 2017

This is the plainest teaching of redemption through imputed righteousness that I know. The righteousness by which we are justified is said to be the righteousness OF GOD not of ourselves. The law condemns us. God provides a righteousness bought by Jesus with which He can cover us . It is clear as daylight.

He declares HIS RIGHTEOUNESS provided for us through Jesus redemption and propitiation so that He can remain just and at the same time declare righteous we sinners.

He was given as a redemption and propitiation so that we could be bought from under sin and God's wrath could be propitiated in respect of us. There is no room for OUR righteousness here

where does it say past sin? He was our redemption from ALL sin. We find mercy at the foot of the cross (His mercy seat) because Christ paid the price of our sin as a substitute (Mark 10.45). He was made sin for us, so that we might be made the righteousness of God IN HIM. In Him we are made fully righteous. Such righteousness can only be reckoned or imputed.

This is the RESULT of our justification.

Yahshua · Apr 16, 2017

To grow in the grace and knowledge of Christ = To shrink in unrighteousness and knowledge of sin

...so by reason of the process, there has to be an achievable goal of reaching "unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and [to] become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ" (Ephesians 4:13), because God sowed Christ into the earth and God's is expecting a harvest of what he sowed, not a harvest "sort of like" or "nothing like" Christ.

So if unrighteousness remains and we continue in the same sins as before we confessed, then it means the growth of grace and knowledge of the Christ in us is either stalled or non-existent in us, because God is not impotent. His strength is enough to accomplish this task if utilized, so the only reason why we would be stalled in reaching the "whole measure of the fullness of Christ" in heart is if we aren't remaining in Christ to grow in God's strength offered to us, for one reason or another.

There is no sin that Christ's strength did not, and can not, overcome. And Christ is supposedly now in us, so what reason could there be for we to continue sinning? So let's not have "a form of Godliness but denying the power thereof" (2 Timothy 3:5).

We being hid in Christ is only temporary. At some point we won't be hid by Christ anymore, and when that time comes we are expected to be revealed as the righteousness of God; son's and daughters born from above like Christ was.

So let's go on to maturity and have true faith in Christ's strength in us.

Grace777x70 · Apr 16, 2017

We have righteousness now in our new creation. Eph. 4:24 We are a new creation because we are in Christ. Christ is in us and because He is in us - our spirit is righteousness. His righteousness.

Romans 8:10 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.

Where sinless perfection in the flesh believers and all works-righteousness believers have as a major stumbling block is trying to establish their own righteousness by what they do or don't do. The law is a representation of human self-effort and will-power to make themselves righteous by what they do or don't do.

Romans 10:2-4 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge.

[SUP]3 [/SUP] For not knowing about God's righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.

[SUP]4 [/SUP] For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

That is why all works-based-self-righteousness belief systems of which sinless perfection in the flesh is an example of ( albeit an extreme one ) are false gospels which actually deny the very grace of God in Christ that is needed to operate like it should in our lives.

valiant · Apr 16, 2017

Skinski7 said:

We find our propitiation for ALL our sins, past, present and future.

We seek to 'uphold the Law' AFTER we have been justified, otherwise we would be crushed by it. It is the result of our justification. The Law by itself condemns us. It is only because we have been justified by His righteousness that we can even face God.

actually it is the love of God which is shed abroad in our hearts (Rom 5.5), not the Law. And that love is commended towards us in that Christ died for us (verse 8). We are therefore justified BY HIS BLOOD and therefore saved from wrath through HIM.

Yes what I have said is the good news, that we are justified because Christ died for us. This reveals in our hearts the love of God.

Bring pronounced justified while we are still wicked is the ONLY way that we can be justified. God must accept us as righteous before He can begin making us righteous. 'To one who does NOT WORK, but believes Him who JUSTIFIES THE UNGODLY his faith is counted as righteousness' (Rom 4.4-5)

This work is wrought in us after God has justified us. (Romans 5.12-21)

Of course the new birth is real. But it is only possible through the death and resurrection of Christ (Rom 6). First God justifies us by Christ's righteousness AS A GIFT (Rom 3.21-5.21). Then He begins the process of making us righteous.

which is the result of our justification - Rom 8.1-4. But we are NEVER yielded to God completely. Only Jesus was that.

see, it is made possible by Christ's death. The law could not do it. We could not be made righteous by the Law. So Christ had to die, first so that we could be reckoned as righteous by His righteousness, then so that we could walk after the Spirit.

Yes once we are accepted as righteous in God's sight He can then begin the work of reforming the inner man by His Spirit. Rom 3.21-5.21 first. THEN Rom 6-7.

if that is so then Christ being made sin must be putting HIM in a state of impurity and unholiness in actual fact so as to maintain the parallel. It is unthinkable.

If sin had to be purged by the blood of Christ it is because He was made sin for us resulting in our being counted as righteous in Him. This could ONLY happen BEFORE we were accepted as righteous. The propitiation had to be offered and accepted BEFORE He could purge us and purify our hearts. He could not just accept us as we were.

First God's grace found a way by which the sin of Adam could be dealt with (Romans 5.18-19). THEN His grace worked with power in the new birth.

You have overlooked the HOLINESS of God.

Skinski7 · Apr 16, 2017

valiant said:

You cannot be purged of future sins because only past sins pertain to the present conscience.

Heb_10:2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

2Pe 1:9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

You clearly have no concept on what it means to be purged of your old sins and given a fresh start under the New Covenant.

In you mind all you sins are "paid for" because God "punished Jesus" in your place. Thus with the "debt paid in full" it cannot be demanded again. Thus you erroneously believe that your future sin is covered. The Bible doesn't teach anything like that, yet you believe it, probably because you had it preached to you a thousand times and never really questioned it.

The Bible teaches that no sacrifice remains if you willfully sin after having come to a knowledge of the truth, having been sanctified by the blood.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Heb 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
Heb 10:31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

The reason the author of Hebrews wrote that is that he understood that the blood of Jesus as establishing a Covenant in which one enters into once and for all and is cleansed and purified. To willfully engage in wickedness after that is to treat God's grace and mercy with utter contempt. The once cleansing sacrifice is voided by one choosing to go back to wickedness, the recipient is no longer clean, hence no sacrifice remains, only a fearful expectation of judgment.

You have to reject that passage and either ignore it or pretend it means something other than what it plainly states because you believe you can willfully sin and have a remaining sacrifice. You view the sacrifice as a cloak for wickedness in the context of the legal exchange of Penal Substitution that you believe in.

Think about it.

Why would you advocate,

"because Christ paid the price of our sin as a substitute (Mark 10.45)"

When Mark 10:45 says...

Mar 10:45 For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

Mark 10:45 says not a word about "Christ paid the price of our sin as a substitute." Yet you quote it anyway.

Jesus ransoms us from bondage...

Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
Joh 8:35 And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever.
Joh 8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed. Free from what? Committing sin.

Nowhere in the Bible does it teach that Jesus "paid your debt" thus cancelling it out. So now you can sin with impunity because all your future sin is "paid for" and cannot be charged to your account.

Is the death of Christ really just a license to sin for you? He "paid the price" so you can sin and not be condemned for it? Heb 10:26-29 repudiates that erroneous line of thinking.

The Bible speaks of a PURGING and PURIFYING. The Bible does not speak of a "debt paid" anywhere at all. Nowhere. That stuff was invented in the Protestant Reformation.

Skinski7 · Apr 16, 2017

Grace777x70 said:

Your silly strawman of trying to twist "obedience to God" into "self righteousness" is very weak.

It is not "self righteousness" to obey from the heart that form of doctrine once delivered.

Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
Rom 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

It is not "self righteousness" to both HEAR AND DO what Jesus taught...

Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
Mat 7:25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.

It is not "self righteousness" to obey God unto righteousness.

Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

In fact Paul spoke of SUBMITTING to the righteousness of God...

Rom 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Paul contrasts...

1. Submitting to the righteousness of God.

with...

2. Establishing one's own righteousness.

Yet you imply that are one and the same.

Here is another verse about "doing" and "not doing"...

Rom 2:4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
Rom 2:5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
Rom 2:6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
Rom 2:7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
Rom 2:8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
Rom 2:9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
Rom 2:10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
Rom 2:11 For there is no respect of persons with God.

What you do matters very much. God is going to render to every man according to his deeds. Those whom patiently continue in well doing, eternal life. Those whom do not obey the truth but do evil, indignation and wrath.

Grace777x70 · Apr 16, 2017

Skinski7 said:

No one is saying that doing good is wrong. That is your straw-man argument in order to try to justify your sinless perfection in the flesh false doctrine.

There is the righteousness of God by faith in Christ's finished work and there is a righteousness which we do by the law which we know - is not the righteousness needed before God.

There are deeds of righteousness but this is a fruit of already being righteous in Christ because we have His righteousness.

Yes....Romans 2 is talking about what those that do not have Christ as their Savior and telling people that they will be brought to the light.

Answer these 2 questions:

1) Tell me - do you still sin from time to time?

2) Have you sinned since you received Christ ( if you have received Him - I am assuming you have here )

Remember - lying and being deceitful is still a sin.

Please answer these 2 questions. Thank you

Skinski7 · Apr 16, 2017

Grace777x70 said:

First of all you do not denote a difference between a presumptuous sin and a sin of ignorance. In the Old Testament we read...

Num 15:28 And the priest shall make an atonement for the soul that sinneth ignorantly, when he sinneth by ignorance before the LORD, to make an atonement for him; and it shall be forgiven him.
Num 15:29 Ye shall have one law for him that sinneth through ignorance, both for him that is born among the children of Israel, and for the stranger that sojourneth among them.
Num 15:30 But the soul that doeth ought presumptuously, whether he be born in the land, or a stranger, the same reproacheth the LORD; and that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
Num 15:31 Because he hath despised the word of the LORD, and hath broken his commandment, that soul shall utterly be cut off; his iniquity shall be upon him.

In the New Testament we read...

1Jn 5:16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.
1Jn 5:17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.
1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

There are two kinds of sin, willful sin and sins of ignorance. A sin of ignorance is "missing the mark" due to a lack of wisdom and understanding. A sin of ignorance is not a premeditated act of wrong doing, in other words it is not rebellion. I have sinned like this on many occasions and I grow from the experience when I am corrected.

Sins of the flesh like fornication, theft, lying, stealing, lusting in the mind, hatred, etc. are all out of the question for that kind of thing is not rooted in a faith that works by love. Those sins I have not done and do not do. EVER.

I laid aside ALL filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness and received the implanted word in my soul. I thus became a doer of the word when I was previously not a doer.

Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Jas 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

So in answering your questions the answer is yes. I have sinned ignorantly and I can give specific examples if you would like me to elaborate.

Have I sinned willfully? No I have not and no I don't. My mind and body are yolked to Christ and I walk in accordance with the Spirit, thus I keep myself that the wicked one touch me not. I honestly know that if I were to engage in willful sin it would defile me to such an extent that I doubt I would escape, I really doubt I would be able to find repentance again. Not that it is a problem though because I love God and I love righteousness. To engage in willful sin is akin to walking purposefully in front of a truck on a highway, there would simply be no benefit, I prefer the life and peace of a spiritual mind.

Here are two questions for you...

1. Have you laid aside all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness and crucified your flesh with its passions and desires?

2. Can an individual be actively engaged in a pornography addiction and be saved at the very same time?

Just answer plainly without playing any kind of games.

valiant · Apr 16, 2017

Skinski7 said:

are you suggesting that Jesus did not die for my future sins? then we are all undone.

will my future sins not be purged by Christ's cross?. You must not compare it with a temporary offering.

But he is only talking about the past. He is not denying that Christ died for future sins. Indeed ALL my sins were future when Christ died.

LOL here we go again. 'I am so superior to you'. As a matter of interest I was purged from my old sins and given a start under the new covenant. But that was nothing to do with my justification. My justification made it possible.

No one has ever preached it to me. But I know it is true for Jesus said, 'This is the will of Him Who sent Me, that of all He has given me I should lose nothing, but raise them up at the Last Day (John 6.39)

Heb 10.26 is referring to Jewish sacrifice as being unavailable, NOT Christ's sacrifice..

The Jews who were considering Christianity were warned that it was either Christ or judgment. The old sacrifices were no longer valid once they had heard of the Messiah,

Where does it say that LOL?

Most of ours sins are wilful. Fortunately God has more mercy than you would have. You sin once and that is it? Well goodbye lol

It is saying that the Jewish sacrifices are now invalid to one who has heard clearly about the Messiah.

I thank God for His justification every day, and that I do not have to turn to the old sacrifices.

yes He did,

lutron anti pollon means 'a ransom in the place of many'. And I thank God that I am one of the many,

learn Greek LOL

true

true and He has made me free.

free from sin, guilt, worldly life, etc.

He bore our sin in His own body on the tree.

I don't know anyone who teaches that

No, it is the reason that I serve Him with my whole heart. That is the natural reaction.

yes, hallelujah. But none but a churl would take advantage of it.

You interpret Heb 10.26 utterly wrongly

Hmm well Roman 4.4-5 is a good start.

Skinski7 · Apr 16, 2017

Grace777x70 said:

You are the one who labels...

1Jn 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
1Jn 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

... as "sinless perfection in the flesh."

I suppose you do that in order to avoid directly having to deal with the what the Bible teaches. I realise it is much easier to contend for a fiction by ignoring and misrepresenting the facts.

John plainly states that whosoever abides in Jesus Christ "sins not." He also plainly states that he who "does" what is righteous is righteous. It doesn't really surprise me that you have a lot of trouble typing or quoting those words. The facts are surely very inconvenient for you.

Grace777x70 said:

That is a false dichotomy. Again you present a silly strawman as if it is A or B. You have...

A. Righteousness of God by faith in Christ's finished work.
B. Righteousness we do by the law.

Yet you don't have this...

Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

You completely negate any righteousness wrought by WALKING AFTER THE SPIRIT.

Jesus taught this...

A. Righteousness via HEAR AND DO
B. Iniquity via HEAR AND NOT DO.

That is the real scale. Which side are you on? You constantly attack HEAR AND DO and label it "self righteousness." YOu constantly advocate the fiction of Luther, the righteousness credit.

You are a disciple of Martin Luther, not a disciple of Jesus Christ.

Grace777x70 said:

Romans 2 is talking about wicked behaviour versus righteous behaviour.

Grace777x70 · Apr 16, 2017

Skinski7 said:

So, in reality - you have sinned then despite your attempt to justify it by some "category". So, that means in your religion - you are a child of the devil and are not born of God.

I see that you have not answered my 2nd question but I really didn't expect you to be truthful here as it would expose the false doctrine of sinless perfection in the flesh for what it really is.

I will answer your questions.

1) The flesh has already been crucified because I am in Christ. Those that are Christ's have the flesh crucified now they need to walk in that knowledge and I have by the life of Christ manifestoing in me lived a holier live since learning the gospel of the grace of God in Christ then I ever thought possible.

Grace reigns through righteousness. The understanding that Christ is my righteousness has brought this about. There is more to come for me as His life is manifested in me and as He shows me that depending on Him brings life - not my own self-righteousness/holiness. I look forward to repenting as I see Him and what he ahs already done in His finished work.

Galatians 5:24 (KJV)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

have crucified in Greek is Aorist indicative tense which is a one time event in the past that is completed. We have been crucified with Christ. Gal. 2:20 & Rom. 6:6

The flesh has been cut away from the inner man in Christ by the circumcision of Christ. Col. 2:11

2) Of course someone can be caught in the flesh such as pornography or even malice or slander and still be saved. Have you ever read 1 Cor? I'll post about this after this post.

Grace777x70 · Apr 16, 2017

the Holy Spirit knew what He was doing when He had Paul write 1 Corinthians....

Some of them were going to temple prostitutes for sex, they were taking each other to court, they were in divisions and strife, they were not treating the poor amongst them right...etc.

Paul was saying that those in Corinth were acting like mere men and men of flesh - in other words not being spiritually minded.

1 Corinthians 3:1-4 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ.

[SUP]2 [/SUP] I gave you milk to drink, not solid food; for you were not yet able to receive it. Indeed, even now you are not yet able,

[SUP]3 [/SUP] for you are still fleshly. For since there is jealousy and strife among you, are you not fleshly, and are you not walking like mere men?

[SUP]4 [/SUP] For when one says, "I am of Paul," and another, "I am of Apollos," are you not mere men?

I noticed that in verse 1 Paul says that they are "babes in Christ".

- not that you are going to hell because you are sinning. Or that because they were sinning - that they are not born of God.

Grace777x70 · Apr 16, 2017

There is a massive difference between church discipline to protect the people and the Lord sending you to hell as can be seen by the letter Paul said to the 1 Corinthians.

Paul told them who they were in Christ...then corrected their behavior...he didn't say you were all unsaved now or that because they were sinning that they were not born of God like some people try to teach.

( without understanding the new creation in Christ - this "sinning" part will throw people off because they don't understand what is being done by giving in to the flesh and what the new man is Christ really is. )

Paul told them who they were in Christ...Here are 7 things that Paul confirmed as truth in the believers in Corinth before he went on to correct their behavior.

1) The Corinthians have been sanctified in Christ Jesus,

2) The Corinthians were now saints by calling

3) The Corinthians in everything were enriched in Him,

4)The Corinthians had the testimony concerning Christ was confirmed in them,

5) The Corinthians had that God will also confirm them to the end, blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ

6)The Corinthians had that it was by Gods doing that we are in Christ ( Not our own D.I.Y. self-righteousness and holiness )

7) That because the Corinthians were in Christ - Christ Himself became to them wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption

1 Corinthians 1:1-9 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Paul, called as an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother,
[SUP]2 [/SUP] To the church of God which is at Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling, with all who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours:

[SUP]3 [/SUP] Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

[SUP]4 [/SUP] I thank my God always concerning you for the grace of God which was given you in Christ Jesus,

[SUP]5 [/SUP] that in everything you were enriched in Him, in all speech and all knowledge,

[SUP]6 [/SUP] even as the testimony concerning Christ was confirmed in you,
[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that you are not lacking in any gift, awaiting eagerly the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ,

[SUP]8 [/SUP] who will also confirm you to the end, blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

[SUP]9 [/SUP] God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

1 Corinthians 1:30 (NASB)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,

Preach and teach the grace of Christ as it is the only think that teaches us how to live godly in this world. Titus 2:11-12. The word of His grace is the only thing that is able to build us up and that gives us the inheritance that is ours in Christ. Acts 20:32

Skinski7 · Apr 16, 2017

valiant said:

Jesus died for ALL your sins but the mercy is only available if you forsake those sins and thus stop doing them.

Pro 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

It is really that simple.

If you confess your sin and forsake your sin then there is mercy available. If you won't do that then you will die in your sins and it matters not as to how deluded you are in regards to Jesus "paying off your sin debt."

dcontroversal · Apr 16, 2017

Grace...notice his tap dance all around the subject and his qualifying and quantifying of sin.....he cannot answer truthfully...to say yes which is the truth would undermine his sinless perfectionist farce.....

John was clear...he used WE, WE, WE, and US to describe sin in the present tense in ALL believers.....

Those who say they have no sin are

a. DECEIVED
b. HAVE NO TRUTH IN THEM

Grace777x70 · Apr 16, 2017

Looks like it is time for "scripture" again in the area of righteousness. Why do people fight so much against the work of Christ and instead live by their own humanistic works-righteousness thoughts? Why don't we believe in Christ's work? Why are we continually denying Him?

I can give you guys what the scriptures say about righteousness and believers that are "in Christ" now and that Christ Himself is in us. Everyone can believe what they want too.

The understanding of the new creation in Christ and the new identity of the believer is paramount to living the true Christian life.

Here it says our spirit ( the inner person that is a new creation in Christ ) is alive because of righteousness that it is it.

Romans 8:10 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin,yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.
Here righteousness is a gift - you don't earn it.

Romans 5:17 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)

We have grace reigning in our lives because of righteousness in us.

Romans 5:21 (KJV)
[SUP]21[/SUP] That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

Here righteousness comes by faith in Christ's work - not our own.

Romans 9:30 (KJV)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.

Here when we believe - we are righteousness.

Romans 10:10 (KJV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

We are in the kingdom of God which consists of righteousness.

Romans 14:17 (KJV)
[SUP]17[/SUP] For the kingdom of God ( Jesus said that the kingdom of God is within you..He might know a thing or two ) is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

Here it says that God made us righteousness in Christ.

1 Corinthians 1:30 (KJV)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

This says we have become the righteousness of Christ ( this is called a dependent clause in the greek - it is determined as fulfilled because Christ became sin )

2 Corinthians 5:21 (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Believers are called righteousness because Christ is in them.

2 Corinthians 6:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

Here it is saying that "righteousness comes by Christ" - not by what we do or don't do with our own self-works at being righteous.

Galatians 2:21 (NASB)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] "I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness comes through the Law, then Christ died needlessly."

Here we have the breastplate of righteousness - which is the armor of God that we are to be strong in.

Ephesians 6:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, andhaving on the breastplate of righteousness;

This talks about the new man in Christ - the new creation which has been created in God's righteousness.

Ephesians 4:24 (NASB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] and put on the new self, which in the likeness of God has been created in righteousness and holiness of the truth.

Ok..that's enough..there are tons more....

valiant · Apr 16, 2017

Skinski7 said:

Presumptuous sins are to disobey the ten commands. The OT penalty for them was death. All others are 'sins of ignorance'.

LIAR 1 John 1.9

ALL? I do not believe you

ALL? LOL

yes please lol

well that's one lie you've told

ALL the time?

If you had truly met God you would have said, 'I repent in sackcloth and ashes' as righteous Job did.

you must lead a very sheltered life, or simply be unaware of sin.

yes I have tried to. But sometimes I Fail, AS YOU DO

yes if he has backslidden. But the Lord will chastise him to bring him back (Hb 12)

I never play games.

zone · Apr 16, 2017

Skinski7 said:

Sin and righteousness cannot be transferred anyway, they are moral concepts.

Jesus bearing our sins is FIGURATIVE not literal.

Isa 53:11 He shall see of the travailof his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall myrighteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

Jesus bore our sins in the same way that the scapegoat bore sin.

Lev 16:21 And Aaron shall lay both hishands upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all theiniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions inall their sins, putting them upon the head of the goat, and shallsend him away by the hand of a fit man into the wilderness:
Lev 16:22 And the goat shall bearupon him all their iniquities unto a land not inhabited: andhe shall let go the goat in the wilderness.

The goat did not literally receive a transfer of sin. The idea is figurative in being granted a fresh start before God, thus the people would put their past behind them and move on with the future. It is the same with Jesus, he "bore our iniquities" that we may "live unto righteousness."

staring you right in the face.
sins and the guilt transferred to the scapegoat. a transfer.
and a declaration from God, Who alone can declare someone righteous

Grace777x70 · Apr 16, 2017

We that are in Christ have the Lord's righteousness now in our inner man that is in Christ.

Isaiah 45:24-25 (NASB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] "They will say of Me, 'Only in the LORD are righteousness and strength.' Men will come to Him, And all who were angry at Him will be put to shame.

[SUP]25 [/SUP] "In the LORD all the offspring of Israel will be justified ( declared righteous )and will glory."

Here is one more from the OT - Isaiah 54: 17 of the Lord telling what the believer would have because of what Christ did in Isaiah 53 when He died on the cross to take away our sin and make us righteous in Him.

Isaiah 54:17

[SUP]17 [/SUP] "No weapon that is formed against you will prosper; And every tongue that accuses you in judgment you will condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, And their righteousness is from Me," declares the LORD.

Folks we have a great salvation in our Lord Jesus Christ!

Ephesians 3:8 (NASB)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] To me, the very least of all saints, this grace was given, to preach to the Gentiles the unfathomable riches of Christ,

Skinski7 · Apr 16, 2017

Grace777x70 said:

Some category? I quoted what the Bible teaches about two kinds of sin. You label it a "category" and and then claim that I am a child of the devil because of that?

I also very specifically answered both your questions. You just don't like the idea of differentiating sin into "willful sin" and "non-willful sin" because you argue in favour of BOTH continuing. If you admit a distinction, like the Bible teaches, you would just be refuting yourself.

Grace777x70 said:

There it is, I really need say no more. You believe that salvation is a POSITION apart from a heart condition.

Thus in your theology you can have serial murderers and child molesters "caught in the flesh" actively engaged in murder and molestation and be "saved."

What kind of salvation leaves someone filthy, wicked and vile? What kind of god do you worship in order to argue in favour of being able to look at pornography and be justified at the same time?

Can you imagine God reckoning Abraham as righteous whilst he was out fornicating and getting drunk? So foolish.

Honestly, Jesus for you is a "wickedness cloak." You think that Jesus died so people can sin and not surely die.

In your mind the death of Jesus cancelled this verse...

Pro 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

Martin Luther Invented the "Imputed Righteousness of Christ" Doctrine

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