GOD'S SABBATH AND THE REAL TRUTH OF COL 2:14-17 WHO DO WE BELIEVE GOD or MAN?

LoveGodForever · Jan 5, 2018

Well this is not true whatsoever JBL, all your posts have been answered very clearly with scriptures from myself and others here on this thread. Whether you believe them or not it is up to you. I do not judge you.

We just may have to agree to disagree as you seem to just keep stating the same thing over and over without trying to address the posts and scriptures that have been shared with you.

This makes it difficult to continue a conversation with you if you ignore the posts and the scrioptures being sent to you and you make no effort to exlpain why it is you disagree.

Also editing out your question that was answered to make is look like something else was asked in my view makes me believe you are not interested in a discussion on this topic. It is ok. You are free to believe as you wish. There is nothing hidden that shall not be revealed come judgement day.

Please by all means if you would like to continue and answer the posts and the scriptures in them then I would look forward to hearing from you. If not then we should agree to disagree

.....................

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

There is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says God's 4th commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to worship God on Sunday in it's place.

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

In times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men every where to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

LoveGodForever · Jan 5, 2018

Now UG,

Is it wise to point all to the word of website over the Word of God like your friend do instead of the Word of God? Now how can you know that the Word of website is telling the truth and following the Word of God if you do not know for yourself what the Word of God says. If your trying to find the truth through the words of website instead of the Word of God could it be possible one can be swept away with every wind of doctrine?

UnderGrace said:

Well my dear, all you needed to do is ask and I would have shared with you the scriptures so you can look them up for yourself. Please refer to the post I have just sent to MarcR showing the scriptures from God's WORD showing that God's LAW (10 commandments) and the Mosaic laws of the Old Covenant are indeed different. Both have a different role to play in relation to the plan of Salvation.

I will add some comments to your word of website for your consideration below, then share more scriptures that are different from the ones shared in the post I send to MarcR. We will look at the scriptures showing WHY God commanded the two laws of the Old Covenant to be separated and what each of the purpose was in the Old Covenant and NEW covenant of God’s LAW (10 commandments and the Mosaic book of the law of Moses.

Ok let's look at the scriptures.........

UnderGrace said:

Every time a Sabbatarian sees the expression "the commandments" or "My commandments", they automatically think exclusively of the 10 commandments!

Yet here are many passages where these common expressions refer to what Sabbatarian’s would call "the Ceremonial Law of Moses" and NOT the 10 commandments!

Straight away that statement has no truth in it whatsoever. Right from the very first sentence the premise of this websites whole argument is that those who believe in God’s LAW (10 Commandments) think that every time the word law or Commandments is used then they believe it is referring to the 10 commandments only. This is a strawman premise that the website is using to build their entire argument for what is to follow.

Always CONTEXT within Chapter and SCRIPTURE has to be always considered in reference to weather of NOT the scriptures are referring to either 1. God’s 10 commandments or 2. the Mosaic laws written in the Book of Moses. Together these two laws make up the Old Covenant and are commanded laws of God.

However the scriptures clearly say that both of these laws have different purpose and role outlining God’s plan of Salvation and were to be separated in the Ark of the Covenant.So let’s make it very clear…

THIS IS A FALSE PREMISE THAT THE WEBSITE USES AS THE FOUNDATION OF IT’S WHOLE ARGUMENT THAT FOLLOWS.

* The phrases "commandments", "The commandments" "my commandments", "the Lord commanded", "what Moses commanded" are uses so many times in the Old Testament in reference to what Adventists call the Ceremonial law to the exclusion of the 10 commandments, it would take 10 pages to list all the verses!

No it doesn’t I have outlined it in two paragraphs above.

* Lev 27:34 These are the commandments which the Lord commanded Moses for the sons of Israel at Mount Sinai.

Ditto the CONTEXT within Chapter and SCRIPTURE has to be always considered in reference to weather of NOT the scriptures are referring to either God’s 10 commandments or the Mosaic laws written in the Book of Moses. Together these two laws make up the Old Covenant. Both have a different purpose and role outlining God’s plan of Salvation.

* Num 36:13 These are the commandments and the ordinances which the Lord commanded

Ditto the CONTEXT within Chapter and SCRIPTURE has to be always considered in reference to weather of NOT the scriptures are referring to either God’s 10 commandments or the Mosaic laws written in the Book of Moses. Together these two laws make up the Old Covenant. Both have a different purpose and role outlining God’s plan of Salvation.

* Deut 30:10 obey the Lord your God to keep His commandments and His statutes which are written in this book of the law

Ditto the CONTEXT within Chapter and SCRIPTURE has to be always considered in reference to weather of NOT the scriptures are referring to either God’s 10 commandments or the Mosaic laws written in the Book of Moses. Together these two laws make up the Old Covenant. Both have a different purpose and role outlining God’s plan of Salvation.

* Jesus defined the commandants to include the Law of Moses: Mt 19:17-19 Jesus said: "keep the commandments." The man replied "Which ones?" And Jesus said, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself"

This is not the law of Moses it is the God’s LAW (10 commandments) which is a different set of laws under the Old Covenant to the Mosaic laws written in the book of the Covenant. The writer of the website does not seem to understand what the differences are between God’s LAW and the Mosaic book of the law as outlined in the scriptures in God’s Word (please refer to the recent post to MarcR for the scriptures)

2. Every time a Sabbatarian sees the expression "Statutes, Ordinances and Decrees", they automatically exclude the 10 commandments and apply it only to what they falsely call, "the ceremonial law" Yet here are many passages where these common expressions refer to the 10 commandments exclusively: (or at least in part include)

Ditto the CONTEXT within Chapter and SCRIPTURE has to be always considered in reference to weather of NOT the scriptures are referring to either God’s 10 commandments or the Mosaic laws written in the Book of Moses. Together these two laws make up the Old Covenant. Both have a different purpose and role outlining God’s plan of Salvation.

* Deut 5:1 The Ten commandments are called "My statures and all My ordinances"

The writer of the website does not understand that the Old Covenant was made up of the two laws of the Covenant which includes God’s LAW (10 commandments) written on stone and the Mosaic laws written in the book of the Covenant. Together these make up the Old Covenant and were to be kept separated in the Ark of the Covenant. There is a reason why the words “statutes and judgements” are written in this scripture because the two laws of the Old Covenant are included.

* Ezekiel 20:19-21 The weekly Sabbath is called "My statures and all My ordinances"

Ditto” Also this scripture reference quoted above does not even mention the words "My statures and all My ordinances" God’s 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment however, was also connected to ordinances for remission of sins and the annual festivals under the Mosaic book of the law for remission of sins. This however is not the 10 commandments but a requirement under the Old Covenant for the Mosaic laws for remission of sin that were indeed Shadows pointing to Jesus as our one true sacrifice.

* Mal 4:4 Book closes with a call to keep "statutes and ordinances" which obviously include the 10 commandments because it would be unthinkable for such a doxology to leave them out completely!

Of course it includes the 10 commandments it is talking about the 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] coming

* Neh 9:13-14 the weekly Sabbath is included without distinction: "right judgments, true laws, good statutes, commandments"

Please read this scripture for yourself; The scripture is referring to God’s LAW and the Mosaic laws written in the book of Moses that make up the Old Covenant. v14 precepts, statutes and laws.

* Lev 19:1-37 The Ten commandments and the ceremonial law are mixed together without distinction and called "My statures and all My ordinances"

Because they together make up the OLD Covenant. God’s LAW (10 commandments) and the Mosaic book of the law however both have a different role and purpose under the OLD Covenant. God’s LAW is forever and gives us the KNOWLEDGE of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS. The Mosaic book of the law outlines God’s plan of salvation for the remission of SIN. Please see the latest post to MarcR.

* Deut 5:1-6:25: Two whole chapters that deal exclusively with the 10 commandments and the following 5 terms are used interchangeably without distinction: "statutes", "ordinances", "commandments", "judgments", "testimonies".

No this whole chapter is in reference to both God’s LAW (10 commandment) the knowledge of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS and the Mosaic law written in the book of the covenant for the remission or forgiveness of SIN. Together they both make up the Old Covenant.

The first section of Deuteronomy 5 is talking about God’s LAW (10 commandments) and outlines them v 1-21. Then we have the distinction the website writer has left out in v22 which says NOTHING WAS TO BE ADDED TO IT (God’s 10 Commandments). v22 These words the LORD spoke unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: AND HE ADDED NO MORE. And he wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me. This continues to v29

Then God speaks to Moses and continues….

V31-33 But as for thee, stand thou here by me, and I will speak unto thee all the commandments, and the statutes, and the judgments, which thou shalt teach them, that they may do them in the land which I give them to possess it. 32, Ye shall observe to do therefore as the LORD your God hath commanded you: ye shall not turn aside to the right hand or to the left. 33, Ye shall walk in all the ways which the LORD your God hath commanded you, that ye may live, and that it may be well with you, and that ye may prolong your days in the land which ye shall possess.

* Lev 23 The Weekly Sabbath is lumped in with all the yearly Sabbaths without distinction and they are all called "The Lord's appointed times" and "holy convocations".

Of course it is included in the annual festivals of the Old Covenant as many of those festivals went for longer than one week. However the special Sabbaths of the annual festivals unlike God’s 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment could fall on any day of the week and had a different purpose to that of the 4[SUP]th[/SUP] Commandment. The special Sabbath and Holy Convocations are not God’s 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment.

* Ezek 20 calls the first and fourth commandment, "My statutes and My ordinances"

NO Ezekiel 20 DOES NOT call the first and 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment "My statutes and My ordinances"
V11 says that God gave his people the two laws that made up the OLD Covenant ("My statutes and My ordinances")

Hebrew H2708 Statutes חקּה ;chûqqâh; khook-kaw' Feminine of H2706, and meaning substantially the same: - appointed, custom, manner, ordinance, site, statute. (book of Moses)

Hebrew H4941 Judgements משׁפּט; mishpâṭ; mish-pawt'; From H8199; properly a verdict (favorable or unfavorable) pronounced judicially, especially a sentence or formal decree (human or (particularly) divine law, individual or collectively, including the act, the place, the suit, the crime, and the penalty; abstractly justice, including a particular right, or privilege (statutory or customary), or even a style: - + adversary, ceremony, charge, X crime, custom, desert, determination, discretion, disposing, due, fashion, form, to be judged, judgment, just (-ice, -ly), (manner of) law (-ful), manner, measure, (due) order, ordinance, right, sentence, usest, X worthy, + wrong. (God’s Law)

* Neh 8 uses interchangeably without distinction, the following terms: "the book of the law of Moses", "the law", "the book of the law", "the law of God", "book of the law of God" and includes

Because together God’s LAW (10 commandments) and the Mosaic book of the law make up the Old Covenant.

* Col 2:14 & Eph 2:15 refer to the whole of the Old Covenant law including the ten commandments
The 10 Commandments are called "Statutes, Ordinances and Decrees"

Well this is now what the OP is referring to and is addressed in the OP of this thread I would suggest you read it.

(1) CONTEXT of COL 2:16 is v14. is talking about the Mosaic laws for remission of sin that were shadows pointing to Jesus; not the ten commandments of God’s Law. Nowhere are the 10 commandments mentioned in Col chapter 2.

v11-13 Shadows of Mosaic laws of circumcision of the new heart in Christ

14, BLOTTING OUT < G1813 ἐξαλείφωexaleipho (ex-a-lei'-fō) v.means to rub out, i.e. obliterate, erase>the HANDWRITING < G5498 χειρόγραφονcheirographon (chei-ro'-gra-fon) n.means
something hand-written (“chirograph”), i.e. a manuscript specially, a legal document > of ORDINANCES < G1378 δόγμαdogma (d̮og'-ma) n. meansordinance;civil, ceremonial or ecclesiastical>that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

v20, Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, v21, Touch not; taste not; handle not; v22, Which all are to perish with the using; after the commandments and doctrines of men?

CONTEXT of the chapter is the CEREMONIAL Mosaic laws for remission of sin that are shadows pointing to Jesus and nailed to the cross with our sins. This is further highlighted that at the death of Jesus the temple vail was torn in two meaning the END of the Mosaic ceremonial laws for remission of SINS as these were fulfilled in Christ (Matthew 27:51).

Further proof that Col 2:16 is talking about the annual Jewish festivals and Mosaic laws for remission of sin? Let’s look at the subject matter of v16

(2) SUBJECT MATTER OF v16 is (1) meat, or in drink, or in (2) respect of an holyday, or of the (3) new moon, or of the (4) sabbath days (plural)

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in (1) meat, or in drink, or in (2) respect of an holyday, or of the (3) new moon, or of the (4) sabbath days (plural):
Compare Col 2:16 with the annual Jewish festivals from the Mosic laws for remission of sin...

Ezekiel 45
17, And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and (1) meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the (2) feasts, and in the (3) new moons, and in the sabbaths <Plural>, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.
18, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the first month, in the first day of the month, thou shalt take a young bullock without blemish, and cleanse the sanctuary:
19, And the priest shall take of the blood of the sin offering, and put it upon the posts of the house, and upon the four corners of the settle of the altar, and upon the posts of the gate of the inner court.
20, And so thou shalt do the seventh day of the month for every one that erreth, and for him that is simple: so shall ye reconcile the house.
21, In the first month, in the fourteenth day of the month, ye shall have the (2) passover, a feast of seven days; unleavened bread shall be eaten.

All CONTEXT and points 1-4 match perfectly to the Annual Jewish festivals detailed in both scriptures; also detailed in Leviticus 23; (1) meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the (2) feasts, and in the (3) new moons, and in the sabbaths <Plural>

So it is very clear the Col 2:16 is in reference to the annual Jewish Festivals from the Mosaic laws for remission of sin....

If you build your house on sand great will be the fall of it. The website as shown above is building on a false argument that is not true. The scripture show the website writer does not know the difference between God’s LAW and the Mosaic laws under the Old Covenant.

If the writer does not know the difference between the two laws of the Old Covenant how can he know what the NEW Covenant is? If he does not KNOW what the NEW Covenant is how can he know what the Gospel is? Only those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God’s Word know the Gospel.

………………

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

There is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says God's 4th commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to worship God on Sunday in it's place.

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has led many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

In times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men everywhere to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

LoveGodForever · Jan 5, 2018

MarcR said:

UnderGrace said:

Hello MarcR, I added UG to this as well because she responded your post post wondering why I believe God's Word says God's LAW (10 commandments) are separated from the Mosaic book of the law in the Old Covenant. Although this post is really addressing the original post you have sent above and is addressed to you....

How can you be knowledgeable in the scriptures when you do not use any? How can you deny the authority of scripture when you do not use any? Here lets add some scripture.........

God's LAW was written and made by God alone on two tables of stone and spoken by God himself to his people and nothing was to be added to it. (God's LAW; Ex 32:16; 34:28; Deut 4:13; 10:4; Exodus 20; Romans 3:20, 1 John 3:4; Romans 7:7; Ps 119:172; James 2:8-12; Hebrews 8:10-12; Gal 3:24; Deut 5:22; Ex 34:28; Deut 10:4 Ecc 3:14; Ex 25:16; Deut 10:5) It is called God's LAW or the 10 Commandments, because he was the one alone who made it and commanded Moses to keep in separated from the book of the law in the Ark of the Covenant (Neh 10:29; Deut 10:4-5; Deut 31:26; Deut 4:13; Ex 34:28) God's LAW was not made by Moses it was made by God alone on two tables of stone and nothing was to be added to it and it was to be separated from the Mosaic book of the law. That is why it is referred to in the scriptures are God's LAW or the 10 commandments (not the 613).

The Mosaic law was made and written and spoken by Moses as directed by God in the book of the covenant.
(Mosaic Book of the law; Deut 31:9; Ex 24:3-4; Deut 31:24-27; Col 2:14-17).

Now this is indeed the authority of the scriptures like you refer to in your post. So do you deny it? My motives in quoting scripture are not in question because I share God's Word for everything I believe.

It is your motives that are in question because you do not quote God's Word but try to deny the Word that is written. Indeed this places your motives in question and not mine. Please by all means if you disagree make your case from the Word of God. So far you have places your words over God's Word.

Do we need more scripture................

GODS LAW (10 commandments) ARE FOREVER

The Law of God (10 commandments) which includes the 4th commandment is the work of God (Exodus 32:16) whatsoever God does is forever nothing can be added to it or taken away (Ecclesiastes 3:14).
God's Law is perfect converting the soul (Psalms 19:7).
It is the very standard of the Old and New Covenants (Exodus 20:1:17, Hebrews 8:10-12).
God's Law was spoken by God himself to His people (Exodus 20:1-22). Jesus says Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away (Matthew 25:35). Gods Law is still in force today (Psalms 111:7-8, Revelation 12:17, 14:12, 22:14, 1 John 3:5-8, 1 John 2:3-4 etc.). The Law of God reveals sin to us so we can see ourselves as we truly are sinners in need of a Saviour (Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4).It is the great standard of the judgement (Ecclesiastes 12:13-14, James 2:10-12, 1 John 3:4, Acts 17:31). God's Law is our teacher revealing sin and the character of God and brings us to Christ at the foot of the cross that we might be saved by faith by Him who loves us and washed us in His own blood (Galatians 3:24; Revelation 1:5). Jesus came not to abolish the law, but to fulfil it ( Matt 5:17-20 ). The law is the embodiment of truth that instructs ( Rom 2:18-19 ). It is "holy" and "spiritual, " making sin known to us by defining it; therefore, Paul delights in it ( Romans 7:7-14Romans 7:22). The law is good if used properly ( 1 Tim 1:8 ), and is not opposed to the promises of God ( Gal 3:21 ). Faith does not make the law void, but the Christian establishes the law ( Rom 3:31 ), fulfilling its requirements by walking according to the Spirit ( Rom 8:4 ) through love ( Rom 13:10 ).

You cannot know the power of God or the Gospel of Grace without the 10 commandments. If there is NO LAW then you do not know what SIN is (James 2:11; Romans 7:7; Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4). If you do not know what SIN is you have NO need of a Savior. If you have NO need of a Savior you have NO Salvation. If you have NO Salvation you are LOST because it is written.

Disagree? Where are your scriptures that you tell everyone you know? Only God's Word is true and we should BELIEVE and FOLLOW it.

...............

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

There is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says God's 4th commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to worship God on Sunday in it's place.

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

In times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men every where to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

Deade · Jan 5, 2018

Hello justpassinthrough,

Maybe I can help. You asked some general questions about Sabbath observance.

When does the Sabbath begin, Friday at sundown or Saturday 12:01am ? At sundown Friday.
What can we do? Cook, make bed, travel. How far can we travel? We are allowed to cook (what we eat immediately), make beds and travel for we are not under the strict interpretation of Sabbath law.
Is it required that we attend a church service. How far away can we travel? Nothing required here.
Is Synagogue attendance mandatory? Nothing required here.
What is considered as work? Putting dishes on the table, or picking them up? Laundry or dishwasher? See above.
When does the Sabbath under Christ, officially end. Sundown Saturday or Midnight? Any leeway in the schedule for emergencies? Sundown Saturday. If you have an emergency, I suggest you take care of it.

Paul laid it out for us:
I Corinthians 6:12: “All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.”
I Corinthians 10:23: “All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not.”

The Holy Spirit teaches us to delight in the Sabbath. Not keep in the strict letter of the law. Hope this helps.

Yours, Deade

phil36 · Jan 5, 2018

MarcR said:

Hi MarcR, Very well said. Loveforgod conveniently forgets what scripture says:

Deuteronomy 5:1-22English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)

The Ten Commandments

5 And Moses summoned all Israel and said to them, “Hear, O Israel, the statutes and the rules that I speak in your hearing today, and you shall learn them and be careful to do them.

2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.

3 Not with our fathers did the Lord make this covenant, but with us, who are all of us here alive today.

4 The Lord spoke with you face to face at the mountain, out of the midst of the fire,5 while I stood between the Lord and you at that time, to declare to you the word of the Lord. For you were afraid because of the fire, and you did not go up into the mountain.

He said:
6 “‘I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.
7 “‘You shall have no other gods before me.
8 “‘You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
9 You shall not bow down to them or serve them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 10 but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments.
11 “‘You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes his name in vain.

12 “‘Observe the Sabbath day, to keep it holy, as the Lord your God commanded you. 13 For six days you shall labour and do all your work,14 but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter or your male servant or your female servant, or your ox or your donkey or any of your livestock, or the sojourner who is within your gates, that your male servant and your female servant may rest as well as you. 15 You shall remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and the Lord your God brought you out from there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the Lord your God commanded you to keep the Sabbath day.

-------------------------

22 “These words the Lord spoke to all your assembly at the mountain out of the midst of the fire, the cloud, and the thick darkness, with a loud voice; and he added no more. And he wrote them on two tablets of stone and gave them to me.

Deade · Jan 5, 2018

Hello MarcR and Phil36,

The Sabbath was not established under Mosaic law but at creation. The 4th Commandment starts with "Remember the Sabbath." We are honoring the creation of God. The same Jesus established the Sabbath, why would He change it?
Hebrews 13:8: “Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.”

Yours, Deade

LoveGodForever · Jan 5, 2018

phil36 said:

Hello phil,

How are you today my friend. This has already been addressed with a ton of scripture in post # 3223. If you believe that post # 3223 does not address what MarcR has stated by all means please post your reasons backed by the scriptures. If you cannot you should believe and follow the Word of God. If you do not it will keep you out of God's Kingdom.

Jeremiah 17
5, Thus saith the LORD; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD

Proverbs 28
9, He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

1 John 2
3, And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4, He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

.............

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

There is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says God's 4th commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to worship God on Sunday in it's place.

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

In times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men every where to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

phil36 · Jan 5, 2018

Hi LGF,

What was the fourth commandment about?

LoveGodForever · Jan 5, 2018

phil36 said:

It is one of God's 10 Commandments that gives us the KNOWLEDGE of SIN if it is broken and RIGHTEOUSNESS if obeyed through FAITH that works by LOVE. It is about REMEBERING the GOd of Creation and resting from work as God commanded and keeping the 7th DAY as a HOLY day in honor of the creator

.............

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

There is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says God's 4th commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to worship God on Sunday in it's place.

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

In times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men every where to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

phil36 · Jan 5, 2018

LoveGodForever said:

Hi LGF,

Have you missed anything? What else are you to do on the Sabbath..its a command you should know?

Also, Who did Moses say the 4th commandment was for?

I will post the scripture for you to read!

Deuteronomy 5:1-22English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)

The Ten Commandments

5 And Moses summoned all Israel and said to them, “Hear, O Israel, the statutes and the rules that I speak in your hearing today, and you shall learn them and be careful to do them.

2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.

3 Not with our fathers did the Lord make this covenant, but with us, who are all of us here alive today.

4 The Lord spoke with you face to face at the mountain, out of the midst of the fire,5 while I stood between the Lord and you at that time, to declare to you the word of the Lord. For you were afraid because of the fire, and you did not go up into the mountain.

He said:
6 “‘I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.
7 “‘You shall have no other gods before me.
8 “‘You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
9 You shall not bow down to them or serve them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 10 but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments.
11 “‘You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes his name in vain.

12 “‘Observe the Sabbath day, to keep it holy, as the Lord your God commanded you. 13 For six days you shall labour and do all your work,14 but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter or your male servant or your female servant, or your ox or your donkey or any of your livestock, or the sojourner who is within your gates, that your male servant and your female servant may rest as well as you. 15 You shall remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and the Lord your God brought you out from there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the Lord your God commanded you to keep the Sabbath day.

-----

22 “These words the Lord spoke to all your assembly at the mountain out of the midst of the fire, the cloud, and the thick darkness, with a loud voice; and he added no more. And he wrote them on two tablets of stone and gave them to me.

MarcR · Jan 5, 2018

LoveGodForever said:

Hello MarcR, I added UG to this as well because she responded your post post wondering why I believe God's Word says God's LAW (10 commandments) are separated from the Mosaic book of the law in the Old Covenant. Although this post is really addressing the original post you have sent above and is addressed to you....

How can you be knowledgeable in the scriptures when you do not use any? How can you deny the authority of scripture when you do not use any? Here lets add some scripture.........

God's LAW was written and made by God alone on two tables of stone and spoken by God himself to his people and nothing was to be added to it. (God's LAW; Ex 32:16; 34:28; Deut 4:13; 10:4; Exodus 20; Romans 3:20, 1 John 3:4; Romans 7:7; Ps 119:172; James 2:8-12; Hebrews 8:10-12; Gal 3:24; Deut 5:22; Ex 34:28; Deut 10:4 Ecc 3:14; Ex 25:16; Deut 10:5) It is called God's LAW or the 10 Commandments, because he was the one alone who made it and commanded Moses to keep in separated from the book of the law in the Ark of the Covenant (Neh 10:29; Deut 10:4-5; Deut 31:26; Deut 4:13; Ex 34:28) God's LAW was not made by Moses it was made by God alone on two tables of stone and nothing was to be added to it and it was to be separated from the Mosaic book of the law. That is why it is referred to in the scriptures are God's LAW or the 10 commandments (not the 613).

The Mosaic law was made and written and spoken by Moses as directed by God in the book of the covenant.
(Mosaic Book of the law; Deut 31:9; Ex 24:3-4; Deut 31:24-27; Col 2:14-17).

Now this is indeed the authority of the scriptures like you refer to in your post. So do you deny it? My motives in quoting scripture are not in question because I share God's Word for everything I believe.

It is your motives that are in question because you do not quote God's Word but try to deny the Word that is written. Indeed this places your motives in question and not mine. Please by all means if you disagree make your case from the Word of God. So far you have places your words over God's Word.

Do we need more scripture................

GODS LAW (10 commandments) ARE FOREVER

The Law of God (10 commandments) which includes the 4th commandment is the work of God (Exodus 32:16) whatsoever God does is forever nothing can be added to it or taken away (Ecclesiastes 3:14).
God's Law is perfect converting the soul (Psalms 19:7).
It is the very standard of the Old and New Covenants (Exodus 20:1:17, Hebrews 8:10-12).
God's Law was spoken by God himself to His people (Exodus 20:1-22). Jesus says Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away (Matthew 25:35). Gods Law is still in force today (Psalms 111:7-8, Revelation 12:17, 14:12, 22:14, 1 John 3:5-8, 1 John 2:3-4 etc.). The Law of God reveals sin to us so we can see ourselves as we truly are sinners in need of a Saviour (Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4).It is the great standard of the judgement (Ecclesiastes 12:13-14, James 2:10-12, 1 John 3:4, Acts 17:31). God's Law is our teacher revealing sin and the character of God and brings us to Christ at the foot of the cross that we might be saved by faith by Him who loves us and washed us in His own blood (Galatians 3:24; Revelation 1:5). Jesus came not to abolish the law, but to fulfil it ( Matt 5:17-20 ). The law is the embodiment of truth that instructs ( Rom 2:18-19 ). It is "holy" and "spiritual, " making sin known to us by defining it; therefore, Paul delights in it ( Romans 7:7-14Romans 7:22). The law is good if used properly ( 1 Tim 1:8 ), and is not opposed to the promises of God ( Gal 3:21 ). Faith does not make the law void, but the Christian establishes the law ( Rom 3:31 ), fulfilling its requirements by walking according to the Spirit ( Rom 8:4 ) through love ( Rom 13:10 ).

You cannot know the power of God or the Gospel of Grace without the 10 commandments. If there is NO LAW then you do not know what SIN is (James 2:11; Romans 7:7; Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4). If you do not know what SIN is you have NO need of a Savior. If you have NO need of a Savior you have NO Salvation. If you have NO Salvation you are LOST because it is written.

Disagree? Where are your scriptures that you tell everyone you know? Only God's Word is true and we should BELIEVE and FOLLOW it.

...............

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

There is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says God's 4th commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to worship God on Sunday in it's place.

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

In times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men every where to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

NONSENSE!!!

TMS · Jan 6, 2018

Is there a law today?
If no, fine
If yes, what is the Law today?

please use scripture.

posthuman · Jan 6, 2018

God created the moon on the fourth day.
He didn't rest until the seventh.

if Colossians is actually Paul telling us we'd better keep new moon festivals, feasts and sabbaths **or else** -- where is the thread telling us we're in danger of hell for not keeping Rosh Chodesh?

Seedz · Jan 6, 2018

Wasn't the law fulfilled? Weren't we expected to break the law?

posthuman · Jan 6, 2018

((demolishes arguments))

“Which ones?” the man asked.
Jesus answered,
“‘Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not bear false witness, honor your father and mother, and love your neighbor as yourself.'"
(Matthew 19:18-19)

"love your neighbor as yourself" is not part of the decalogue.

posthuman · Jan 6, 2018

phil36 said:

However, the days are coming, declares the LORD, when it will no longer be said, 'As surely as the LORD lives, who brought the Israelites up out of Egypt'
(Jeremiah 16:14)

Ahwatukee · Jan 6, 2018

Jesus met the righteous requirements of the law on behalf of every believer. Anyone who is trusting in their own works to inherit the kingdom of God will not obtain eternal life. It is by trusting in Christ as the One who provided salvation completely and fully that we are saved. When you bring in other requirements along side of Christ's finished work, it is the same as saying that his sacrifice was insufficient.

Our hope and focus should be on the Lord and not on our keeping of the ten commandments or by performing any works of the law.

TMS · Jan 6, 2018

Seedz said:

This is my attitude
If the law is fulfilled i don't need to keep it.

The Sabbath was created before sin and made holy by God on the 7th day of creation. the Sabbath was not a shadow of Christ, Jesus did not fulfill the Sabbath rest when he died.
The laws that were shadows of the death of Jesus were fulfilled so i do not keep these laws. But if the laws are about heath or loving God i continue to keep them. If the laws are moral laws that teach us to love God and Love our neighbor i believe we should continue to obey them.

Rom 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Rom 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

can i safely say "He that loveth God hath fulfilled the law." Not take His name in vain and the other 3 of the first 4 are all about our love for God.
Love worketh no ill to God: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law. "

Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Jesus said;...
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
Mat 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
Mat 19:19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 19:20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?

Of the last 6 commandments the one that He was breaking was the one that Jesus didn't mention, Thou shalt not covert.

The laws in the old testament do not become void for no reason. If they are fulfilled by Christ than i can see why we no longer need to keep them but if not why do we make them void?
The pass over and all the ceremonies around it were pointing to Jesus, The Sanctuary was a shadow of the heavenly Sanctuary and Jesus is ministering in the heavenly sanctuary so it is now void.

posthuman · Jan 6, 2018

TMS said:

are you sure about that?

Yah actually tells us expressly why He commanded the nation Israel to keep sabbaths. Exodus 31:13 & again Ezekiel 20:12
it is to make them know that it is God who sanctifies.

are you familiar with Hebrews 10:14?

you really think the sabbaths are not a picture of Christ?

posthuman · Jan 6, 2018

TMS said:

the moon was set in the sky on the 4th day. the 4th comes before the 7th.

do you celebrate the new moon festivals according to the Law?

GOD'S SABBATH AND THE REAL TRUTH OF COL 2:14-17 WHO DO WE BELIEVE GOD or MAN?

Banned

Banned

Banned

Called of God

Senior Member

Called of God

Banned

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Seedz

Guest

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member