A reasonable question

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May 24, 2023
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#81
If you mean in the book of Job, then the answer is yes this took place well after the events in the Garden. The book of Job has to take place sometime after the Exodus but before the sack of Jerusalem since several of Job's friends have lineage to the tribes of Israel and in the context that the Israelites have already established themselves in the land.
 

Karlon

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2023
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#82
Something is niggling me.

When satan was invited to heaven and granted every power God had, for satan to use at his disposal,

Was Satan actually fallen at this point and is there any scripture to show that satan was fallen at this point.
satan fell as soon as he sinned which was wanting to be like God. it is in scripture, i don't know where.
 

Fundaamental

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2023
3,289
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#83
If you mean in the book of Job, then the answer is yes this took place well after the events in the Garden. The book of Job has to take place sometime after the Exodus but before the sack of Jerusalem since several of Job's friends have lineage to the tribes of Israel and in the context that the Israelites have already established themselves in the land.
Your saying Satan was the serpent in the Garden.

But however look at this


Ezekiel
who's this speaking of

“‘You were the seal of perfection,
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden,
the garden of God;
every precious stone adorned you:
carnelian, chrysolite and emerald,
topaz, onyx and jasper,
lapis lazuli, turquoise and beryl.[b]
Your settings and mountings[c] were made of gold;
on the day you were created they were prepared.
14 You were anointed as a guardian cherub,
for so I ordained you.
You were on the holy mount of God;
you walked among the fiery stones.
15 You were blameless in your ways
from the day you were created
till wickedness was found in you.
16 Through your widespread trade
you were filled with violence,
and you sinned.
So I drove you in disgrace from the mount of God,
and I expelled you, guardian cherub

Two points of reference here
I'm pretty convinced the above passage is referring to satan.

If you could see he was described as being in the garden of eden but if you read on further he was described as perfect beauty rich in wisdom and a guardian cherub.

At the point of being in eden.

If you read on further we still see he was still thought of as the same person on the holy mount of God which is mount Sinai where the ten commandments where given

Which as you know is well after eden.

It also says he was expelled Cast out become wicked at the point of time from the mount of God which is the days of Moses.




 
May 24, 2023
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#84
Your saying Satan was the serpent in the Garden.

But however look at this


Ezekiel
who's this speaking of

“‘You were the seal of perfection,
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden,
the garden of God;
every precious stone adorned you:
carnelian, chrysolite and emerald,
topaz, onyx and jasper,
lapis lazuli, turquoise and beryl.[b]
Your settings and mountings[c] were made of gold;
on the day you were created they were prepared.
14 You were anointed as a guardian cherub,
for so I ordained you.
You were on the holy mount of God;
you walked among the fiery stones.
15 You were blameless in your ways
from the day you were created
till wickedness was found in you.
16 Through your widespread trade
you were filled with violence,
and you sinned.
So I drove you in disgrace from the mount of God,
and I expelled you, guardian cherub

Two points of reference here
I'm pretty convinced the above passage is referring to satan.

If you could see he was described as being in the garden of eden but if you read on further he was described as perfect beauty rich in wisdom and a guardian cherub.

At the point of being in eden.

If you read on further we still see he was still thought of as the same person on the holy mount of God which is mount Sinai where the ten commandments where given

Which as you know is well after eden.

It also says he was expelled Cast out become wicked at the point of time from the mount of God which is the days of Moses.




Well if you don't omit the first line of verse 12 you will see very quickly who that chapter is addressed to.
 

Fundaamental

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2023
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#89
Yes, I have read the whole Holy Bible many times, even the book of Ezekiel many times.
will you read the source it's not long
I know why your thinking it was the king of tyre but how could it have been as how could the king of tyre Been in eden or a guardian cherub.

Read the source please
 
May 24, 2023
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#90
will you read the source it's not long
I know why your thinking it was the king of tyre but how could it have been as how could the king of tyre Been in eden or a guardian cherub.

Read the source please
I looked at the link you posted if that's what you mean. I find it to be a trite heresy. There is no mystery or hidden agenda here to why I believe it is about the King of Tyre, it is because the actual Bible bluntly says it is about the King of Tyre. It also fits well into that portion of the book of Ezekiel where he is going through and prophesying against the nations outside of Israel and Judah, which Tyre was an incredibly wealthy and famous polity in Ezekiel's time.
 

Fundaamental

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2023
3,289
421
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#91
I looked at the link you posted if that's what you mean. I find it to be a trite heresy. There is no mystery or hidden agenda here to why I believe it is about the King of Tyre, it is because the actual Bible bluntly says it is about the King of Tyre. It also fits well into that portion of the book of Ezekiel where he is going through and prophesying against the nations outside of Israel and Judah, which Tyre was an incredibly wealthy and famous polity in Ezekiel's time.
how was the king of tyre in the garden of eden or how was he a guardian cherub.
 
May 24, 2023
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#94
the garden of eden was no longer open after Adam and Eve to anyone.
It's the prophetic language of Ezekiel towards various kings likening them to various things. Just like the Assyrian was a tree in Eden that was cut down, so too was the King of Tyre a covering cherub in Eden before he was cast down. For that matter, Pharaoh was a dragon in the Nile until God fished him out and left his carcass to rot on the shore.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
56,493
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#95
stop upcasting Thankyou 🙂
I might be able to if only I knew what you meant. Perhaps you could start writing in proper sentences.
That should not be beyond your abilities. Spell check is also available for many browsers. That would help too.
 

Fundaamental

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2023
3,289
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#96
It's the prophetic language of Ezekiel towards various kings likening them to various things. Just like the Assyrian was a tree in Eden that was cut down, so too was the King of Tyre a covering cherub in Eden before he was cast down. For that matter, Pharaoh was a dragon in the Nile until God fished him out and left his carcass to rot on the shore.
are you sure it wasn't the truth about Satan ?

In the form of prophetic language ?.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
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#97
are you sure it wasn't the truth about Satan ?

In the form of prophetic language ?.
It's actually a picture of the physical and spiritual. It speaks both to the actual king as well as the spiritual power undergirding his power.
 
May 24, 2023
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#98
are you sure it wasn't the truth about Satan ?

In the form of prophetic language ?.
I am absolutely 100% positive that Satan isn't even mentioned in Ezekiel 28. Off the top of my head I don't think Satan is even mentioend in the entire book of Ezekiel, much less appears i nthe story directly as a character, but that's jsut off the top of my head, perhaps a reason to read the entire book of Ezekiel to confirm.
 

Fundaamental

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2023
3,289
421
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#99
It's actually a picture of the physical and spiritual. It speaks both to the actual king as well as the spiritual power undergirding his power.
it's a mysterious king is what it is.

Some would argue the king of tyre may not have even been human.

Or he was possessed by satan himself.

But generally speaking even thealogians can't agree on this matter, buy they don't accuse each other of heresy.

But when you first read Ezekiel 28

It's states he was created perfect, all humans since Adam and Eve have been born into sin, and are sinners.

Therefore God would not have said a human ruler was created perfect

Plus God rested on the sixth day so I do not think he would use the word create to describe how a human came into being.

At the beginning of Ezekiel it states the king of tyre was created. Then he describe as a guardian cherub which isn't human at all and refers to an Angelic being.

Plus it also points out the king of tyre will come to a horrible end which seems all related to Satan.
 

Fundaamental

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2023
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421
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What of the glaring evidence that he is called "Satan" or "the adversary or "the accuser"? His nature is clear in the garden. He was already fallen.
Where is the biblical milk 🍼🍼🍼 to prove such thanks.