Amillennialism

[Ariel82]

1. Where is God's throne located, in Heaven or on Earth?

2. Where do the Saints reign with Jesus?

3. Where does it LITERALLY say that JESUS IS REIGN ON THE PHYSICAL EARTH in these passages concerning the 1000 years?

4. Did you notice the qualifications to get a throne? Being beheaded "for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands."

****
Revelation 20

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheadedfor their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a[a] thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

 

[Ariel82]

So, its in his word.

the rainbow covenent is not in rev. also, are you covered under it ?

Mmmm moving the goal post?

Why don't you give the bible reference and reasoning behind why you believe Egypt gets no rain during a literal 1000 year reign of Jesus on Earth before Judgement day?

 

[prove-all]

People assume it will be peaceful because Satan is supposedly bound during that time
...however humanity doesn't need Satan to sin....folks do just fine being selfish without
outside temptation....

What we need is God to teach us to do good. We need God to place in us clean hearts.

After human misrule causes great tribulation that almost wipes out civilization, Jesus Christ
will return to Earth to establish His rule. Before any rebuilding occurs, Christ will first resolve
the problem of unconquered human nature sabotaging creative efforts mans rebellious nature.


“A new heart also will I give you …. And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk
in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. … In the day that I shall have
cleansed you from all your iniquities I will also cause you to dwell in the cities, and the wastes
shall be builded” (Ezekiel 36:26-27, 33).


God will change the hard hearts of men and women, eliminating hostility, competitiveness,
aggression and selfishness, and replacing it with His own nature—a basic desire to follow
His laws of love, and beieng widely observed, wiping out violence, burglary, vandalism,
immorality, drug use, broken families, and a long host of other social ills.


Tomorrow’s cities will be ruled by spirit beings—the glorified saints of God made perfect!
Read in Luke 19:12-19 and Revelation 2:26-27 Christ’s promise to appoint individuals


All will know the truth. No more religious confusion. Eyes will be opened to the truth.
Humans will become teachable. People will start living God’s way,the way of outgoing
concern for others—the way of the true values—the way of peace, of happiness,
of well-being, of joy.


Crime, sickness, disease, pain and suffering, gone. Poverty, ignorance banished.
Smiles on people’s faces—faces that radiate. Wild animals tame. Air pollution,
water pollution, soil pollution, gone. Crystal pure water to drink; clean, crisp,
pure air to breathe; rich black soil where deserts, mountains and seas formerly
were, producing full-flavored foods, and fantastic beauty in flowers, shrubs, trees.


What a fabulous picture!

 

[Ariel82]

Amillennialism teaches that Jesus is currently reigning with the 1st century saints that were martyred for their faith in Jesus. (people reject this because they envision Jesus reigning on Earth and expect to see changes, but there have been drastic changes from Before Jesus took His heavenly throne. One example: examine the acceptanc of cannibalism and human sacrifice before and after Jesus)

 

[prove-all]

Mmmm moving the goal post?

Why don't you give the bible reference and reasoning behind why you believe Egypt gets no rain during a literal 1000 year reign of Jesus on Earth before Judgement day?

mortals need water to live, after the second res., the second death ,
there will be no mortals left to need water.


When he comes to judge the nations, there weapons will be made usless.

 

[Ariel82]

After human misrule causes great tribulation that almost wipes out civilization, Jesus Christ
will return to Earth to establish His rule. Before any rebuilding occurs, Christ will first resolve
the problem of unconquered human nature sabotaging creative efforts mans rebellious nature.


“A new heart also will I give you …. And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk
in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. … In the day that I shall have
cleansed you from all your iniquities I will also cause you to dwell in the cities, and the wastes
shall be builded” (Ezekiel 36:26-27, 33).


God will change the hard hearts of men and women, eliminating hostility, competitiveness,
aggression and selfishness, and replacing it with His own nature—a basic desire to follow
His laws of love, and beieng widely observed, wiping out violence, burglary, vandalism,
immorality, drug use, broken families, and a long host of other social ills.


Tomorrow’s cities will be ruled by spirit beings—the glorified saints of God made perfect!
Read in Luke 19:12-19 and Revelation 2:26-27 Christ’s promise to appoint individuals


All will know the truth. No more religious confusion. Eyes will be opened to the truth.
Humans will become teachable. People will start living God’s way,the way of outgoing
concern for others—the way of the true values—the way of peace, of happiness,
of well-being, of joy.


Crime, sickness, disease, pain and suffering, gone. Poverty, ignorance banished.
Smiles on people’s faces—faces that radiate. Wild animals tame. Air pollution,
water pollution, soil pollution, gone. Crystal pure water to drink; clean, crisp,
pure air to breathe; rich black soil where deserts, mountains and seas formerly
were, producing full-flavored foods, and fantastic beauty in flowers, shrubs, trees.


What a fabulous picture!

Yes that all happens with the establishment of the New Heaven and New Earth...

If it's the 1000 years...then how is Satan able to gather an army to rebel against God?

 

[Ariel82]

mortals need water to live, after the second res., the second death ,
there will be no mortals left to need water.

???

Revelation 22
And he showed me a pure[a] river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding from the throne of God and of the Lamb.

*****

We will still need pure water to live.

****

Bible verses?

*****

Bedtime will be back when God allows.

 

[prove-all]

The bible says there will be a third temple, but not made by mans hands.
The Eternal has chosen Jerusalem. (1Kings 11:13) And the Lord shall inherit
Judah his portion in the holy land, and shall choose Jerusalem again.Zech 2:12

The whole world will revolve around Jerusalem in the Millennium. And
the whole universe will revolve around Jerusalem after the Millennium.
The future temple of which Ezekiel prophesied will have water flowing
out of the altar (Ezekiel 47:1-5). The Fountain of Eternal Life

Ezekiel describes the water flowing eastward from the temple and rising
continually until it becomes a river too large to pass over.This water is a
symbol of something far more powerful that will impact the entire Earth!

God’s Holy Spirit will bring life spiritually (verse 9). Everything will live
as God intended from the beginning. That will impact the entire Earth!

God’s truth will fill the entire world like the ocean beds
are filled with water (Isaiah 11:9; Habakkuk 2:14).

“And by the river upon the bank thereof, on this side and on that side, shall grow
all trees for meat … because theirwaters they issued out of the sanctuary: and
the fruit thereof shall be for meat, and the leaf thereof for medicine” Ezekiel47:12

God’s Holy Spirit will spiritually heal people of human nature and wrongful thinking.
People will also be healed of physical problems, a dual healing, spiritual and physical.

And notice: The water will flow right out of the holy of holies in that millennial temple!
The whole world is going to be healed! “The waters must spring up within the temples
to symbolize the fountain of life that is associated with God’s dwelling in heaven.”

Those waters are a symbol of the fountain of eternal life.


“Ezekiel saw water (spring waters) ushering forth from the holy place that went out
the right side of the altar of burnt offerings and unto the Dead Sea to make those
acrid waters clean and fresh.” There won’t be burnt offerings in Ezekiel’s temple.

“In Gilgal, the first site of the tabernacle in the Holy Land, there were the
springs from Jericho that supplied an abundance of water,”

“When the tabernacle was at Shiloh (from the times of Joshua to Samuel), there was
a natural spring that supplied water to the temple, the city, and the surrounding area.”


Jerusalem only has one fresh water source: the Gihon Spring.
It’s where Zadok anointed Solomon king (1 Kings 1:38-39) Water from the same
spring flowed within the walls of the temples that Solomon and Zerubbabel built.

Josephus wrote , in the tabernacle in the wilderness, the priests in Israel purified
themselves in spring waters. There is always a spring associated with the sanctuary.

David placed the ark of the covenant directly over the Gihon Spring. The ark is a
symbol of God’s throne. The place from which God ruled the Israelites on Earth.

God’s throne on this Earth was right over the Gihon Spring!

“David also made it clear that there was a fountain, or a spring, within the precincts
of the holy temple in heaven, and there was also a fountain (a spring) positioned in
the replica of God’s house in Jerusalem.

David related these things in his psalms, when the ‘house of the Lord’ was reckoned
to be the tent of the ark located at the Gihon Spring. That special sanctuary for the
ark remained at the Gihon for 38 years.”

Psalm 68:24, 26 read, “They have seen thy goings, O God; even the goings of my God,
my King, in the sanctuary. … Bless ye God in the congregations, even the Lord, from
the fountain of Israel.” God’s sanctuary was by a spring. The blessings came from
the fountain of Israel. That’s where the sanctuary was.


“The earthly symbol for this fountain was the Gihon Spring.”

-
Eusebius Aristeas described the temple before the first coming of Christ: “There is
an inexhaustible reservoir of water, as would be expected from anabundant spring
gushing up naturally from within.” Aristeasstated the Gihon Spring was the only
spring within five miles of Jerusalem. The location of the spring made Jerusalem
the site of the earliest settlement in the area.

Both Aristeas and Tacitus state clearly there was a natural spring within the precincts
of the temple. Accounts and the geographical facts of the area disqualify the Dome of
the Rock as being the site of the temples of Solomon and Zerubbabel.

Isaiah 8:5-6 speak of “the waters of Shiloah that go softly,”meaning water from the Gihon
Spring. This probably is a referenceto the Siloam Channel. It is all a type of God’s Work

Isaiah 12:3 talks about the “water … of the wells of salvation.”The spring is a symbol
of the very salvation of GOD bubbling up from His throne! God is “the fountain of living
waters” (Jeremiah 17:13).

-


the book Ancient Jerusalem Revealed' in it Hillel Giba wrote


“The Gihon does not maintain a constant flow, but is a siphontype karst spring,
fed by groundwater that gushes intermittently through cracks in the cave floor.
The frequency of the outflowvaries with the season of the year and the annual precipitation.

Water from the Gihon could be drawn from either the spring cave or a small pool
cut out in the bedrock close to it.” He continued,

“Three subterranean water supply systems were devised to capture, store, distribute
and protect itswaters. And these three systems are known as Warren’s Shaft,
the Siloam Channel, and Hezekiah’s Tunnel.”

These three systems all brought water from that spring.

Warren’s Shaft is the earliest supply system that enabled Jerusalem’s residents to draw
water without having to leave the fortified confines of the city. They had a lot of enemies.
The Jews needed to make sure they could get to their water.They also would have
needed to bring the water inside for the temple of God.


The Bible records what King Hezekiah did to ensure that Jerusalem’s water supply remained
safe from an Assyrian invasion.2 Kings 20:20 mentions “how he made a pool, and a conduit,
and brought water into the city.” He dug a 1,750-foot tunnel through solid rock to get water!
The full story can be found in 2 Chronicles 32.

“In order to reach the waters of the Gihon from the summit of the Ophel (before building the
temple), Solomon had engineers design and then chisel out of the rock a shaft which led down
to the Gihon Spring. This may or may not be what now is called ‘Warren’s Shaft,’ after the
man who discovered it in the middle of the 19th century.”

Was Warren’s Shaft dug by Solomon’s men? Earlier archaeologists dated the shaft to
the 10th century b.c., the days of Solomon. Whoever dug it carved caves and tunnels
out of the subterranean rock to reach the waters of the Gihon Spring.

Hezekiah directed the water flowing from his tunnel into the Siloam Pool. Unger’s Bible
Dictionary states, “In addition to the tunnel, Hezekiah built a larger reservoir called the
Pool of Siloam. The pool measures about 20 by 30 feet.
-

“In Jesus’s day, the blind man who was healed was directed to go and wash in this pool.”
Christ directed the blind man to the water to be healed (John 9:1-7). This is clearly a
symbol of how this world can remove its blindness with God’s Holy Spirit.

Satan has deceived the whole world. People are blinded and cannot see spiritually.
Only God’s Holy Spirit—typed by water in the Bible—can empower mankind to
enter into God’s Kingdom. Christ was giving the people of His day insight into what
will shortly happen to the whole world.

 

[prove-all]

???

Revelation 22
And he showed me a pure[a] river of water of life, clear as crystal,
proceeding from the throne of God and of the Lamb.

*****

We will still need pure water to live.

Those waters [Holy Spirit]are a symbol of the fountain of eternal life.
Would an inmortal saint have to drink from it , when they already have eternal life?

 

[Deade]

1. Where is God's throne located, in Heaven or on Earth?

2. Where do the Saints reign with Jesus?

3. Where does it LITERALLY say that JESUS IS REIGN ON THE PHYSICAL EARTH in these passages concerning the 1000 years?

4. Did you notice the qualifications to get a throne? Being beheaded "for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands."

****
Revelation 20

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheadedfor their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a[a] thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

Ok Ariel, let's forget about the beheadings and the water for now. Let's address the first three points. The first thing: Nobody is in heaven yet: John 3:13: "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven." They are asleep.

Acts 2:29: "Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day."
Heb. 11:40: "God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect."

The second thing: Nobody is going to heaven: Heaven (the Kingdom of) is coming to earth. Rev. 5:10: "And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth." Rev. 20:6: "Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."

After the 1000 years: Rev 20:5,7,8:"But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea." Then comes the Great White Throne Judgement: in which the rest of the dead will be dealt with.

Actually the little season that Satan is released is simultaneous with the GWTJ. This is pictured as the Last Great Day among the ancient Israeli Festivals.

 

[Nehemiah6]

The first thing: Nobody is in heaven yet... They are asleep.

That would be the false doctrine of Soul Sleep. But the Bible makes it perfectly clear that all the OT and NT saints are in Heaven right now (and very much alive). Study Hebrew 12:22-24 and believe it,

The second thing: Nobody is going to heaven...

Another false doctrine. The saints who die are immediately in Heaven and at the Rapture all the living saints will also be in Heaven. Study Acts 7 & 8 and John 14:1-3.

I am really surprised that you have accepted these false teaching. The reason I am not quoting these Scriptures is so that you will see them for yourself. More importantly you will believe them.

 

[Bladerunner]

1. Where is God's throne located, in Heaven or on Earth?

2. Where do the Saints reign with Jesus?

3. Where does it LITERALLY say that JESUS IS REIGN ON THE PHYSICAL EARTH in these passages concerning the 1000 years?

It is there,,,,but you symbolize it so why bother.

However, I will try but it will hard and long as there is some 1845 Prophecies in the OT attesting to Jesus Reign both on Earth and on David's Throne, by the way which was not around in 70AD.

By I digress, There are also 318 Prophecies in the NT attesting to the same things. Ezekiel 40-48...details the Millennial temple on Earth.....In Chapter 40, God takes Him to a High Mountain and there he sees a Man," there was a man, whose appearance was like the appearance of brass"

For all purposes, I will consider this to have be Jesus......
as we see Chapter 40 is all about the Temple and its measurements.

Look I am going to stop here....This set of instructions and a 50 mile square that will be the Temple and its grounds is on earth.
Face it,,,there will be no cities (World wide) and the rule of the land in all nations will be like those times during Moses.

If this does not cure You...

Other Prophecies include Isaiah 65 and of course Revelation 20 which is symbolize into whatever the person speaking needs it to say.





4. Did you notice the qualifications to get a throne? Being beheaded "for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands."

I always thought it was to have faith in Jesus Christ and His Gospel. Those who are left behind will no longer receive the gift of Grace through Faith but rather they will have to Prove their beliefs by Dying in the name of Jesus Christ.

Again, amellennialist have symbolized that as well.



****
Revelation 20

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheadedfor their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a[a] thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

"I SAW",,,,,,,They sat on them.....Yes, the 24 Elders as given in Rev 4. But Ammellennialist don't read this chapter or any until chapter 20.

If you look at Rev 7:9 "After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;"


and then in Rev 7:13....Where one of the 24 Elders ask John if He knew who these people from Rev 7:9 are? John answered Him in verse 14...."Sir, Thou Knowest" and then the Elder said to John;

Rev 7:14...."And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he(Elder) said to me(John), These are they which came out of Great Tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb." Emphasis Added


I know you don't read this either as it is all symbols...... Notice the Great Tribulation is the Same Jesus told the Apostles at the Olivet Discourse, of the GT, the Second Half of Daniel's 70th Week. Oh, you symbolized that....sorry

This within three and 1/2 years of the Millennium....Here on earth......Oh, the verse that you ignored or symbolized...


definition:You = Ammillennialist in General


[/COLOR]

 

[Adstar]

Yes that all happens with the establishment of the New Heaven and New Earth...

If it's the 1000 years...then how is Satan able to gather an army to rebel against God?

Because satan is released from the bottomless pit after the 1000 years to go out and decieve the nations.. It says it clearly in Revelation 20::

Revelation 20: KJV
7 "And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, {8} And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. {9} And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them."


Why do people have such problems reading the scriptures and just believing what they say?

 

[Nehemiah6]

Why do people have such problems reading the scriptures and just believing what they say?

Because they believe that theologians have more truth than God the Holy Spirit. All the fantasies regarding Bible prophecy are the result of men who refused to take the Bible in its plain literal sense, since that would not fit their agendas.

Full and Partial Preterism, Amillenialism, Post-Millenialism, Post-Tribulationism, etc. are merely the attempts of theologians to avoid interpreting the Bible as given to us.

So you say that God speaks of a literal Millennium six times in seven verses of Revelation 20? So what? Let's put that in our theological spin machine, and it can be made to mean a period of anywhere from 1,000 years to 6,000 years. Or better yet, it is simply a spiritual metaphor for the present age.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Because they believe that theologians have more truth than God the Holy Spirit. All the fantasies regarding Bible prophecy are the result of men who refused to take the Bible in its plain literal sense, since that would not fit their agendas.

Full and Partial Preterism, Amillenialism, Post-Millenialism, Post-Tribulationism, etc. are merely the attempts of theologians to avoid interpreting the Bible as given to us.

So you say that God speaks of a literal Millennium six times in seven verses of Revelation 20? So what? Let's put that in our theological spin machine, and it can be made to mean a period of anywhere from 1,000 years to 6,000 years. Or better yet, it is simply a spiritual metaphor for the present age.

Yeah, they do the same thing with the 144,000 and other numbers. In fact, I created a document listing every number used in Revelation and it is a pretty big list. It demonstrates that God is using literal numbers and that He means what He says. What is really amazing to me is, in chapter 7 two groups mentioned. Regarding the first group, John hears the number of those who were sealed 144,000 and is broken down into 12,000 from each tribe. After that, another group is mentioned as "those in white robes which no man can count," which are all Gentiles. This alone demonstrates that God can and does differentiate between literal numbers and a very large amount too much to count.

You are very correct Nehemiah, it is the teachings and writings of men that have and continue to distort God's word. And unfortunately many have been deceived by them and have adopted these teachings. Then they have the nerve to proclaim this junk attempting to appear knowledgeable, as though it were even plausible!

 

[Ariel82]

See this is the problem:

. Those who are left behind will no longer receive the gift of Grace through Faith but rather they will have to Prove their beliefs by Dying in the name of Jesus Christ.

When you get to the root of it, that's works salvation.

Also ALL of GOD's children are called to die and live for Him.

Even if people deny it.

 

[Ariel82]

In the following line...is the word "near" or in some translations "a short time" literal or symbolic to YOU?
*****

Revelation 1 v 3
blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.

Notice the PRESENT TENSE OF THESE WORDS:

Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth.

****

Revelation 1 v 5
To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood, 6 and has made us to be a kingdom and priests to serve his God and Father—to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen.
*****
Personally I read it LITERALLY and believe what God clearly writes about the generation He lived and physically walked among. Jesus clearly says: the temple would be destroyed and that would usher in a NEW AGE of the NEW COVENANT.

However that isn't important to folks who cling to themselves being raptured out and ruling with Jesus without having to suffer or die for Him at all.

How would your life change if Jesus words and warnings actually apply to YOU?

 

[Ariel82]

1. Do you know what is NEW about the NEW COVENANT?

Some one actually told me a few days ago they don't need the New Covenant, it only applies to Jews. So I have come to realize folks have all sorts of beliefs about it.

2. Do you believe Jesus is King in Heavenly Jerusalem now with His saints?

3. Have you been made a priest and part of Jesus kingdom?

I can say YES and AMEN to all three, can you?

 

[Ariel82]

If you can't say "Yes and amen, Jesus made me a priest in His kingdom and Jesus currently rules from heavenly Jerusalem on Mount Zion"

then something is wrong with your theology and you deny many scriptures that state the spiritual reality of Jesus current rule in HEAVEN.....NOTICE I SAY HEAVEN, watch and see how many will twist my words and make it to mean Earth.

To be expected that people only read what fits their preconceived notions and don't really bother to listen.

 

[Ariel82]

Hebrews 12:22-23
But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels,

Romans 9:33
just as it is written, "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A STONE OF STUMBLING AND A ROCK OF OFFENSE, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."

1 Peter 2:6
For this is contained in Scripture: "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, A PRECIOUS CORNER stone, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."