Backsliding

[Gardenias]

I thank the Lord for his amazing grace and love!
I also pray that none here get so low or bad off that you feel like an island alone.

The only way to obtain heaven in Christ is to be born again,confessing and repenting of sin. Never think YOU have it made.

Putting your hand to,looking back,endure to the end ( not like some see it as written to the Jews only in their tribulations) . these all speak to those who once had a relationship with God! We must be full of his righteousness at all times.

There are people who CLAIM to be saved here and in all churches who will face the wrath of God. They are delusional in themselves and God has turned them over!

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

I thank the Lord for his amazing grace and love!
I also pray that none here get so low or bad off that you feel like an island alone.

The only way to obtain heaven in Christ is to be born again,confessing and repenting of sin. Never think YOU have it made.

Putting your hand to,looking back,endure to the end ( not like some see it as written to the Jews only in their tribulations) . these all speak to those who once had a relationship with God! We must be full of his righteousness at all times.

There are people who CLAIM to be saved here and in all churches who will face the wrath of God. They are delusional in themselves and God has turned them over!

Oh no! I've been "turned over"?

1 John 3:19 NLT - "Our actions will show that we belong to the truth, so we will be confident when we stand before God."

I am absolutely confident of my relationship with the Lord, and have been a recipient of the same Promise, or Blessing, given to Abraham. Thank God that He Chose me instead of me thinking that I chose Him. And it is because He Chose me that I stand confidently before the Lord, having well begun a total Transformation that has caused me to become an entirely new person. And if "you" knew me before, you'd be GLAD that the Lord got ahold of me.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

what do you mean by backsliding ?

making mistakes and repenting ? Or turning away from God ?

chrirts doctrine is designed for imperfect people who struggle at times and make mistakes so one of the core principles is how we judge others whether with mercy or with unforgiving judgement will be applied to us .

a perfect person without any sin or need for mercy wouldnt get the value of this doctrine but repentant sinners will always see it’s immense value

“Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:

Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall be given into your bosom.

For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:36-

if we live and act as those who will
Be judged according to that law of Christ the law of mercy for the merciful . Then we really can’t “fall away “ it’s the center and compass of the gospel

“Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭5:7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty. For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy;

and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.”
‭‭James‬ ‭2:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

If we fall away from mercy towards others we are falling away from our own mercy that’s really what we can’t be like the judgemental religious folk demanding perfection from others when they fail to shine Christs light on themselves first

if we’re judgemental and demanding in what we share about God with others and present a demanding unmerciful God to them that’s going to be our judgement when we face God for our deeds but if we’re merciful hat day when we do this

“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we can expect mercy by Gods promise in the gospel we all have sinned and have to face judgement for the bad things and good things we’ve done . We can have a judgement according to the letter and rules or a judgement according to what Christ the judge said for us to believe and follow

“to fall away “ is a pretty ambiguous term. Which people interpret many ways

what do you mean by falling away ?

When I say backsliding I mean Is It possible to turn away from GOD and be lost forever and If a born again of the SPIRIT of GOD person CAN turn away from GOD do they lose their salvation and If a person can lose their salvation after their Spirit has been made perfect by GOD then would you agree that the corruptible seed which Is the flesh can corrupt the Incorruptible Spirit of a Just man that GOD made perfect causing them to lose their salvation?It's really a yes or no question.🙂

 

[seed_time_harvest]

I thank the Lord for his amazing grace and love!
I also pray that none here get so low or bad off that you feel like an island alone.

The only way to obtain heaven in Christ is to be born again,confessing and repenting of sin. Never think YOU have it made.

Putting your hand to,looking back,endure to the end ( not like some see it as written to the Jews only in their tribulations) . these all speak to those who once had a relationship with God! We must be full of his righteousness at all times.

There are people who CLAIM to be saved here and in all churches who will face the wrath of God. They are delusional in themselves and God has turned them over!

Would you agree that they were never saved,Is It possible for a person to REALLY be born again and not renew their mind to the new creation they have become and lose their salvation?☺️

 

[seed_time_harvest]

I look at backsliding as a person that is living in sin after confessing Jesus and repenting of their sins knowing God hates sin and does not want us to do it and gives us the Spirit to help us to overcome sin.

Which a Spirit led life will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh, and God will give them an escape from temptations.

So there is no excuse.

But all sin can be forgiven and the backslider can repent of living in sin and be led of the Spirit.

I look at these people as having not abandoned Jesus but are living like the world when they should not.

Living in sin and repenting of the sin when a person does it is not repenting for repenting means turn away from sin and not hold on to sin and then repent when you do it.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

If we sin intentionally knowing the truth that God does not want us to sin then the sacrifice of Jesus cannot wash away that sin until we repent of the sin.

If we live in sin not giving up that sin then the blood of Jesus cannot wash it away for God will not take away a sin we hold on to.

So a backslider is on dangerous ground at the time until they repent and mean it and allows the Spirit to lead them.

But some people say you cannot lose salvation so if this is true then the backslider will always repent and do right and be saved.

But there is no excuse a person can live in sin and still be saved.

God does not like the world to sin and they will be in trouble for it if they do not come to the truth but the Christian can sin and it is alright and they are not in trouble which makes no sense.

Everybody has to repent whether the world or a Christian that sins for everybody has to get rid of sin.

Isa 59:1 Behold, the LORD'S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear:
Isa 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.

Luk 9:62 And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God.

It appears a Christian that is backslidden is not fit for the kingdom of God but if they cannot lose salvation then they will always get back in the truth led by the Spirit.

Would you agree that AFTER salvation a person WILL seek to purify themselves even as their Spirit Is pure but salvation at that point doesn't depend on repentance, IOW salvation Does depend on repentance before being saved but salvation does not depend on repentance After being saved?

 

[Gardenias]

No,I would not agree they were never saved. That is ludicrous for God alone knows the heart and judges accordingly.

Yes to second question.

The way is STRAIGHT and NARROW,and few there be that find it.
It is also treacherous and dangerous when we fail to be Chris like and do not repent!

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Why would God "choose" us only to allow us to let us go? Does Jesus squander His Pearls upon pigs? No, He wouldn't do such a thing.

John 15:16 NKJV - "You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you."

 

[seed_time_harvest]

If a person can lose their salvation After their Spirit has been judged by GOD to be just and their Spirit made perfect,wouldn't saying that they can be lost forever be saying that the Incorruptible seed can be corrupted?Yes or No.

Lot of vague responses but no CLEAR yes or no responses.

 

[Charlie24]

Why would God "choose" us only to allow us to let us go? Does Jesus squander His Pearls upon pigs? No, He wouldn't do such a thing.

John 15:16 NKJV - "You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you."

God never fails in any, it's man that fails! Some will fail to continue in the faith, that is not God's fault.

I personally know some that for reasons I will not mention have lost faith in Christ,

They are not backslidden, the backslider has just lost his way but still believes in Christ's finished work on the Cross.

The persons I'm speaking of have denied faith in Christ, they no longer believe.

God didn't take their salvation from them, they took it from themselves.

This is what Paul is discussing in Hebrews 6 and 10.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

When we sin we sin body, soul and spirit!

My point is that as Paul says, we are given a down-payment on our salvation, the Holy Spirit. By faith in Christ we are as saved as we will ever be, BUT, we have to hold on to that faith in Christ in order for our salvation to be completed at the resurrection.

If for whatever reason you no longer have faith in Christ, you will not obtain the resurrection of life where your salvation is paid in full and you become as Christ, perfect.

When we sin we sin body, soul and spirit!

So would you agree that the Incorruptible seed (the Spirit of just men made perfect by GOD) can be corrupted by the flesh?

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

God never fails in any, it's man that fails! Some will fail to continue in the faith, that is not God's fault.

I personally know some that for reasons I will not mention have lost faith in Christ,

They are not backslidden, the backslider has just lost his way but still believes in Christ's finished work on the Cross.

The persons I'm speaking of have denied faith in Christ, they no longer believe.

God didn't take their salvation from them, they took it from themselves.

This is what Paul is discussing in Hebrews 6 and 10.

I hear you. And, I also don't think that "we" will ever get to the bottom of these discussions. Scripture points in both directions, it seems.

As for those who you knew who fell astray . . . perhaps they just had no root as described below:

Mark 4:4-6 NKJV - "And it happened, as he sowed, that some seed fell by the wayside; and the birds of the air came and devoured it. "Some fell on stony ground, where it did not have much earth; and immediately it sprang up because it had no depth of earth. "But when the sun was up it was scorched, and because it had no root it withered away."

 

[Magenta]

When I say backsliding I mean Is It possible to turn away from GOD and be lost forever and If a born again of the SPIRIT of GOD person CAN turn away from GOD do they lose their salvation and If a person can lose their salvation after their Spirit has been made perfect by GOD then would you agree that the corruptible seed which Is the flesh can corrupt the Incorruptible Spirit of a Just man that GOD made perfect causing them to lose their salvation?It's really a yes or no question.🙂

1 John 2:19

 

[Charlie24]

So would you agree that the Incorruptible seed (the Spirit of just men made perfect by GOD) can be corrupted by the flesh?

First of all let's determine what is meant by "corruptible seed and incorruptible seed."

1 Peter 1:23

"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever."

Peter is telling us that we are born-again NOT by any virtue of descent from human parents.

But we are born-again by the incorruptible seed of Christ. He was perfect in His life and never sinned, we are granted His perfect righteousness by faith and we become the seed of God, the Children of God.

We were given this status by God through faith, if we fail to exhibit that faith and walk away from Christ, we are no longer His.

I'm not speaking of the backslider as in my previous post, but no longer having faith.

 

[justbyfaith]

Peter was the ultimate "backslider." Galatians chapter two tells us that he forgot that Christ made us all "one." Pete forgot that there was neither Greek nor Jew.

Does it get any worse than that? Yet, we are told that Peter was "filled with the Spirit."

Acts 4:8 NKJV - "Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, "Rulers of the people and elders of Israel . . ."

It seems that we must still contend with our human minds. Thank God for Christ, that when we "forget," Christ has made us whole and complete, and this is apart from ourselves.

Colossians 2:9-10 NKJV - "For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily; and you are complete in Him, who is the head of all principality and power."

The question is whether Peter was filled with the Spirit at the time of his sin in Galatians chapter 2.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

The question is whether Peter was filled with the Spirit at the time of his sin in Galatians chapter 2.

I see. So the Indwelling Spirit just slips in and out.

2 Peter 1:4 KJV - "Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust."

 

[justbyfaith]

So then would you say that the Incorruptible seed cab be corrupted?

I would say, no, the incorruptible seed cannot be corrupted; which would indicate that if someone backslides, they need to question whether they were really born again in the first place.

 

[Charlie24]

I hear you. And, I also don't think that "we" will ever get to the bottom of these discussions. Scripture points in both directions, it seems.

As for those who you knew who fell astray . . . perhaps they just had no root as described below:

Mark 4:4-6 NKJV - "And it happened, as he sowed, that some seed fell by the wayside; and the birds of the air came and devoured it. "Some fell on stony ground, where it did not have much earth; and immediately it sprang up because it had no depth of earth. "But when the sun was up it was scorched, and because it had no root it withered away."

I do agree that this subject will be argued until Christ returns and sets it straight.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

First of all let's determine what is meant by "corruptible seed and incorruptible seed."

1 Peter 1:23

"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever."

Peter is telling us that we are born-again NOT by any virtue of descent from human parents.

But we are born-again by the incorruptible seed of Christ. He was perfect in His life and never sinned, we are granted His perfect righteousness by faith and we become the seed of God, the Children of God.

We were given this status by God through faith, if we fail to exhibit that faith and walk away from Christ, we are no longer His.

I'm not speaking of the backslider as in my previous post, but no longer having faith.

Which would mean that the person was never born again or would It mean that the Incorruptible seed of a person born again can be corrupted by the corruptible seed(flesh)?

 

[justbyfaith]

I see. So the Indwelling Spirit just slips in and out.

2 Peter 1:4 KJV - "Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust."

There is a difference between being indwelt by the Spirit and being filled with the Spirit.

 

[Charlie24]

Which would mean that the person was never born again or would It mean that the Incorruptible seed of a person born again can be corrupted by the corruptible seed(flesh)?

I'm sure that is sometimes, maybe often the case! But Paul goes beyond this scenario in Heb. 6 and 10 letting us know that who he is speaking of has indeed been born-again and walked away from Christ having no more faith in Him!