By Works

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throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
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I disagree.

No one looses salvation if that is what you are stating since it is a bit unclear.
The bible never speaks of anyone being spiritually unjustified. .. eternal security is eternal not a temporal status.
No one in the OT was born again or sealed by the Holy Spirit. Nor will a person during the Tribulation. They will not be saved if they take the Mark of the beast . That's clear.
No one loses salvation in the church age till the rapture .
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
No one in the OT was born again or sealed by the Holy Spirit. Nor will a person during the Tribulation. They will not be saved if they take the Mark of the beast . That's clear.
Abraham was justified by faith and stated justified by faith.
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
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Yep, I recall a song that is still quite popular among churches, that attempted to use this Psalms and apply it to the church today, despite Paul telling us that we are sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise.

A scary song to sing for this age of grace :)

A beautiful song giving direct Scripture and applying the Psalm to us today.

It is a beautiful song to sing in this age of grace.
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
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1 Peter 4
12 Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you:

13 But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy.

14 If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified.

15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters.

16 Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

Notice Peter even told Israel that the "righteous scarcely be saved"?

Doesn't that sound like trying to earn salvation?
You asked "Doesn't that sound like trying to earn salvation?"

NO! (and yes, I am yelling! :eek:)
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
21,407
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My "view" doesn't really matter in eternity's perspective. But I do know that James says that a faith without works is a dead faith. And I do not suppose that a dead faith will save a person.
An empty profession of faith that merely “claims” to be genuine, yet produces no works at all (James 2:14) is certainly not going to save anyone. That is not genuine faith, but a “bare profession of faith.”
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
7,254
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You asked "Doesn't that sound like trying to earn salvation?"

NO! (and yes, I am yelling! :eek:)
What do you think peter meant in 1 peter 4 when he stated the righteous scarcely be saved?
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
7,254
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A beautiful song giving direct Scripture and applying the Psalm to us today.

It is a beautiful song to sing in this age of grace.
You believe the Holy Spirit can be taken away from you when you sin?
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
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In that case, you also don't believe that faith, apart from works, can save you right?
LOL! Now you are introducing another preposition you didn't use before (at least where I picked up the connversation).

I do not know what you mean by apart from works, so I cannot answer your question.
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
3,726
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No one in the OT was born again or sealed by the Holy Spirit. Nor will a person during the Tribulation. They will not be saved if they take the Mark of the beast . That's clear.
No one loses salvation in the church age till the rapture .
Do you have a verse that says that people in church age are "once saved always saved"?
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
7,254
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LOL! Now you are introducing another preposition you didn't use before (at least where I picked up the connversation).

I do not know what you mean by apart from works, so I cannot answer your question.
You were the one who tried to distinguish between these 2 in the first place correct?

I regard these 2 as the same, when it comes to salvation.
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
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What do you think peter meant in 1 peter 4 when he stated the righteous scarcely be saved?
It does not say they are scarcely saved because they are earning their salvation. That is your own "conclusion".
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
7,254
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It does not say they are scarcely saved because they are earning their salvation. That is your own "conclusion".
So if one is righteous, according to peter, why is he scarcely saved?

Is he saved or not?
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
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You believe the Holy Spirit can be taken away from you when you sin?
Huh, ???!!!!! What I do know is that David cried out to God and said "take not thy Holy Spirit from me"
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
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You were the one who tried to distinguish between these 2 in the first place correct?

I regard these 2 as the same, when it comes to salvation.
LOL! Here is going back to our original conversation:

You said:
"You should address the other guy, I was asking him a question
And yes I agree with you there
But I am curious though, what do you think is the difference between without works and not of works?


I said:
""Without works" means that there are no works present.
Not of works" means that salvation is not caused by works."


The question was the difference between "without works" and "not of works"! Now you have introduced "apart from works"!
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
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So if one is righteous, according to peter, why is he scarcely saved?

Is he saved or not?
The text says he is saved. That is Peter's words and not mine.