Can I change reality with my words?

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Guojing

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Jan 12, 2019
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"
Those wounds in Isa. 53, are in context with words about sin and transgression. There is not a single word there about physical healing, although certainly, part of the Messiah's ministry was to heal us from our sin, and physical healing was part of Jesus earthly ministry.

Wounds = sin, iniquity, unrighteousness, evil, corruption, forsaking God!

"Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes his life an offering for sin," Isa. 53:10


See - The end of Isaiah 53 makes it clear - The suffering servant makes his life an offering for SIN!

My challenge to all is that you read Isaiah and all the Old Testament prophets, and then you will understand the message of the Bible. That we are a sinful and evil people, and Jesus came to save them/us from our sins and make us righteous.
From my experience with discussing with people who believed that Isaiah is talking about spiritual healing from sin instead of physical healing from diseases and infirmities, I think their mind is quite set from this teaching and I respect their differing views.

The one thing they could never explain well, in my opinion, is the link to the account in Matthew 8

14 And when Jesus was come into Peter's house, he saw his wife's mother laid, and sick of a fever.

15 And he touched her hand, and the fever left her: and she arose, and ministered unto them.

16 When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with his word, and healed all that were sick:

17 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare our sicknesses.

The New Testament is written in Greek but OT was in Hebrew, and the Holy Spirit clearly used this translation to emphasize that Isa 53 is talking about Jesus healing us from physical sicknesses. Matthew says that the healing ministry of Jesus was the fulfillment of
Isaiah 53:4–5. And he emphasizes that he healed every one. Why did he heal every one? Because he had taken, or was going to take—but in the eternal counsel of God he had already taken—our sicknesses and borne our pains

I notice you left this particular passage out, so I would be most keen to hear your own perspective towards this.
 

Kim82

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Jun 17, 2018
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Joyce also believes that Jesus went to hell, and became the "first born-again Christian" when he left hell. She believes we are "little gods" which is another torn out of context verse resulting in terrible theology. Plus, you have to believe lies, or you ate not even saved, according to her distorted doctrine.

"(audio clip) Joyce Meyer, “The Devil thought he had it, the devil thought he had won. Oh they were having the biggest party that has ever been had. They had my Jesus on the floor and they were standing on his back jumping up and down laughing and he had become sin. Don’t you think that God was pacing wanting to put a stop to what was going on. All the hosts of hell were up on him, up on him, up on him. The angels are in agony, all the creation is groaning. All the hosts of hell was up on him, up on him, they got on him. They got him down in the floor and got on him and they were laughing and mocking, “haha you trusted God and look where you ended up. You thought he would save you and get you off that cross – he didn’t haha.”

Just in case you doubt Joyce right now she wrote in her above mentioned, quote, “There is no hope of anyone going to heaven unless they believe this truth I am presenting. You cannot go to heaven unless you believe with all your heart that Jesus took your place in hell.”
(audio clip) Joyce Meyer, “The Devil thought he had it, the devil thought he had won. Oh they were having the biggest party that has ever been had. They had my Jesus on the floor and they were standing on his back jumping up and down laughing and he had become sin. Don’t you think that God was pacing wanting to put a stop to what was going on. All the hosts of hell were up on him, up on him, up on him. The angels are in agony, all the creation is groaning. All the hosts of hell was up on him, up on him, they got on him. They got him down in the floor and got on him and they were laughing and mocking, “haha you trusted God and look where you ended up. You thought he would save you and get you off that cross – he didn’t haha.”


Just in case you doubt Joyce right now she wrote in her above mentioned, quote, “There is no hope of anyone going to heaven unless they believe this truth I am presenting. You cannot go to heaven unless you believe with all your heart that Jesus took your place in hell.”

According to Meyer Jesus only meant that The Old Covenant was finished but she said that the atonement was really just getting started when Jesus said these words. However Meyer fails to understand that the words, “It is finished” are one Greek word which means to complete a process to accomplish, to pay in full. Joyce Meyer should take James 3:1 seriously as it says, “My brethren let not many of you become teachers knowing that we shall receive a stricter judgement.” You know it is very interesting that you can search The New Testament from front to back and never exegete this sensationalistic teaching from it.

Meyer like many in The Word of Faith camp who teach extra biblical doctrine appeals to what she would call Revelation Knowledge to substantiate her teachings as coming from God. In other words the Bible doesn’t actually teach this, I got it through a direct revelation from God’s Spirit to my Spirit. That is why Meyer said in her audio tape dealing with the exact same subject quote, “The Bible can’t even find any way to explain this. Not really that is why you have got to get it by revelation. There are no words to explain what I am telling you. I have got to just trust God that he is putting it into your spirit like he put it into mine.”

(audio clip) Joyce Meyer, “The Bible can’t even find any way to explain this. Not really that is why you have got to get it by revelation. There are no words to explain what I am telling you. I have got to just trust God that he is putting it into your spirit like he put it into mine.”

(audio clip) Joyce Meyer, “The Bible can’t even find any way to explain this. Not really that is why you have got to get it by revelation. There are no words to explain what I am telling you. I have got to just trust God that he is putting it into your spirit like he put it into mine.”

(audio clip), “Sunday morning here comes the sun. Sunday morning God gets himself together. Justice has been met somehow everything has been taken care of and oh God gets his voice together and he hummers up three words and they go roaring through the universe and entering the gates of hell. He said it is enough. It is enough.”

Again chapter and verse please!!!! Where in the World does the Bible say this? Well we will pick up more about Joyce Meyer and her born again Jesus teaching next week."



Here is the link to the whole article, with the audio clips with Joyce Meyer saying all this unbiblical nonsense.

https://craigbrownsreformedtheology...r-joyce-meyer’s-shocking-doctrine-and-heresy/

Why would you trust a person, just because they are positive, when their whole theology is so far from the truth of Scripture, as to be something totally made up? There are so many good preachers, and books, for that matter, on good theology, on real theology, on deep theology, that listening to this stuff, except to debunk it is lies, is not only dangerous, but soul destroying. We need to read about Jesus, not about some made up supposed revelations like Joyce proclaims above. .

And, I am beginning to see where you are coming from, and that you have listened to Joyce Meyer too many times!
I do not agree with all of Joyce's teachings or her lifestyle. I was just pointing out one aspect of her teaching. I'm not here to defend every thing that comes out of her mouth.
 

Guojing

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Jan 12, 2019
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Please show me in any of my posts where I said "God does not heal!" I specifically said:
"we are not automatically healed...when we believe in the atonement."

In other words, healing is not guaranteed in the atonement, but God does heal when it is his will.
It will take time for anyone to renew their mind about this. Do you believe that God hates sin? Most of us do.

Most of us agree that Sin came in because of Adam's disobedience and as Paul explained in Romans 5:12-19, as sin came in thru Adam, death also came in, spiritual and physical. Think of sickness and poverty as the fruit of death. When God created the earth in Genesis, there was no sickness at all, he did not meant for Man to fall sick and die and to be poor. It is the devil that uses sickness to kill steal and destroy.

Once more Christians realized that God hates sickness with the same intensity as he hates sin, it will be hard to hold to the belief that "God does heal when it is his will". God does not use sin to teach us any lessons, although yes we can learn lessons from it, it is similar to sicknesses.

Some scriptures to back up the points I have made

Acts 10:38
38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

1 John 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
 

unclesilas

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Feb 6, 2019
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An Evangelist, who saw tremendous miracles of healing in their services, including someone who was an atheist, was once asked: ''Why are not all healed in your services?''
The reply came quickly
''That is the first thing I want to ask Jesus when I get to Heaven''
 

Kim82

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Jun 17, 2018
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Here you go - NO!!!

Scriptures? See above! In fact, I don't really have to post Scriptures, it is the Word Faith people who need to justify theirs. And every single time, those Scriptures are pulled out of context, and twisted and distorted, or in the case of Joyce Meyer, completely made up. And yet, I have posted the context on every verse presented, and not one single WoF person has countered them! That's because you cannot.
You are a very bitter and angry person. No one has time to waste reading your rants.
 

Guojing

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It is not just that God does not automatically heal, but it is his will that sometimes, that he uses the lack of healing for his glory, and to transform us into the image of Christ. (Rms 12:1-2; 2 Cor. 3:18)
If all the atonement does is to save us from sin, then all it takes to do that, is for Jesus to simply shed his blood. As Hebrews 9:22 said,

… without the shedding of blood, there can be no forgiveness of sins.

Jesus was the Lamb of God and like the sacrificial lamb in the OT, they all had to be killed for sins to be put away. There is one thing special that Jesus had to go through, that none of the other animals in OT had to, that is to bear stripe after stripe, before being killed.
There was a video shown in my church that showed this process


The key lesson I have learned, is that Jesus bore all those stripes to pay for my healing. Thus, every time I think in my heart, “Jesus I don’t want to trouble you to heal me, I want to be humble and just believe that you have saved me from hell, just like many other Christians.” I can imagine Jesus, sitting on the right hand of God, saying the same rebuke that he often gave to his 12 disciples, “Oh you of little faith, if all I did was to save you from hell, I did not need to bear those stripes as well. Why do you take so little from the divine exchange when your healing has already been paid for?”
 

Lanolin

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Dec 15, 2018
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This is so North American centric! Go to China or India. Evangelists there just walk, just as the apostles did. Sometimes, you can buy a bicycle for them, but mostly, they have nothing but their feet and their passion for God.

No one needs a car. Do you know why? Because, first it is an older beater. Then, it's not reliable or has too many expensive repairs. So, then a new or almost new car, but plain! And fairly cheap! But that is not comfortable to drive in, a lot. So, a more expensive car? Then a small airplane? Then a big jet?

If you don't believe me, look at all these charlatan tele-evangelists, and their pleas for a jet "to do the Lord's work." Greed begets greed. If God shows up with a car, then take it. We have given away cars to needy people, because God told us to. Not because someone named and claimed it. (This was in the days long before the Word Faith doctrine was well known outside of some circles.)

The whole claiming things, material things, is based on greed. I could recite so many people who got caught in this trap. And God had a way of breaking that delusion, by making them poor.
Thats why Jesus said blessed are the feet of those who bring the gospel...cos people walked mostly. Although Jesus did kind of commandeer a ship even though he could walk on water.

Most of those prosperity preachers tend to originate from america. Dont know why. It seems like its got a reputation for materialism. I have visited, actually a cousin of mine did go there to work on wall street, so I guess the money attracts people, but I personally wouldnt go I'd rather serve God than mammon. One of our prime ministers (the previous one) did the same thing and became a millionaire and then said he wanted to be prime minister and people just voted for him cos he made a lot of money in america. But he never did a thing for the poor really. The rich got richer and the poor got poorer.
 

MJ1

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Jan 22, 2019
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First, you missed this in post #161 above, where I dealt again, with pulling verses out of context.

"Then, there is the 1 Peter passage, which quotes it.

""He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness. By his wounds you have been healed." 1 Peter 2:24 ESV

Notice the words in the first part of the sentence have to do with the last part of the verse.

bore our sins

die to sin

live to righteousness.

So what are we healed from?? From sin and unrighteousness. There is absolutely nothing to do in context with physical healing, in either Isa. 53:5-6 or 1 Peter 2:24. Try reading the verses for what they are saying, not the lies you have been fed by the Word Faith movement!!"
You made a blanket statement “But neither healing, nor prosperity is included in the atonement” which is not true. However, I do agree that 1 Peter 2:24 refers to healing of sin and unrighteousness, I have no argument there. However, sin can cause debilitating affects when considering the psychosomatic effect sin can have on people. The mind is not separate from the body, nor is the body separate from the mind. Therefore, sin can have an affect on the physical wellbeing of a person.

Matthew 9:1-7 So He got into a boat, crossed over, and came to His own city. Then behold, they brought to Him a paralytic lying on a bed. When Jesus saw their faith, He said to the paralytic, “Son, be of good cheer; your sins are forgiven you.” And at once some of the scribes said within themselves, “This Man blasphemes!” But Jesus, knowing their thoughts, said, “Why do you think evil in your hearts? For which is easier, to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven you,’ or to say, ‘Arise and walk’? But that you may know that the Son of Man has power on earth to forgive sins”—then He said to the paralytic, “Arise, take up your bed, and go to your house.” And he arose and departed to his house."

Are you willing to tell me that when one comes to the cross and accepts the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ that there is no room in His sacrifice for healing of their physical being through the forgiveness of sins?

1 Corinthians 11:28-30 "But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy manner eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this reason many are weak and sick among you, and many sleep." What bread are they eating and cup are they drinking? Is it not in remembrance to the atoning blood and sacrifice of our Lord Jesus Christ, which was to forgive sins? So, if they do it in an unworthy manner, what physical results does it bring? Therefore, if they do it in a worthy manner will it not do the opposite?

The function of human blood in the body is to keep it healthy and alive. The same is true of the blood of Jesus Christ. His blood keeps the body of Christ healthy and alive. Not just spiritually, but also physically. I am not saying that all physical ailments will be taken away, but what physical ailments a person will have will be strengthen through God’s sufficient grace, which only comes when one receives the atoning blood of Christ through faith.

Yes, there is physical healing through the atoning blood of Jesus Christ because the sin that has been forgiven (removed), can no longer have a psychosomatic effect on our physical being. People will stop drinking, smoking, and doing things that once brought harm to their physical bodies.
 

MJ1

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Jan 22, 2019
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Second, I absolutely do not believe in synergistic, decisional regeneration. I did NOTHING to be saved. God just saved me, when I deserved nothing, and then told me John 3:16, which I remembered from Sunday school, and told me to repent. No nonsense about me having to help God to deserve salvation, just God for the entire salvation, or monergistic process! So, bad theology is affecting you in more ways than you can imagine, isn't it? All these things come after salvation. If they do not, I fear legalism, a complete lack of understanding of the sovereignty of God, and a lack of relationship with God. If you think you have followed these instructions to be saved, rest assured that the sovereign God saved you, and then you realized what you needed to do, as the beginning of your Christian walk. (ie Sanctification)
If you did nothing to be saved, then your not saved. God does not force people to accept Him; therefore you had to make a choice. That is doing something. And in accordance with John 3:16, you would have had to believe in Him to be save, so again you did do something to be saved. I think in respect to "bad theology" you may have judged yourself? Salvation comes first by recognizing that you are a sinner and that you need a Saviour, so again you had to do something. Secondly, you have to recognize that Jesus is the only One who can save you from you sinful state, so you had to act. You either accepted or rejected Him, again that is doing something to be saved. God's word is very clear that you must believe, repentance, confess, accept, and have faith. The onus was placed on you to do these things in order to be saved.
 

Guojing

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Jan 12, 2019
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Y
Are you willing to tell me that when one comes to the cross and accepts the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ that there is no room in His sacrifice for healing of their physical being through the forgiveness of sins?
Its much easier to us to tell ourselves, and others, that 'your sins are forgiven', because there is no physical proof. With no possible physical evidence, its harder to have unbelief.

When it comes to 'rise, take up your bed and walk', its so easy to be deceived by your 5 senses when it did not happen based on the info you get from those senses. So most people, to deal with this cognitive dissonance, will like to think, "Maybe God did not want me to be healed".
 

wolfwint

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Feb 15, 2014
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I am not too clear what you meant by that phrase but judging from the rest of your paragraph, you believed you are saved the moment you repented and declared that Jesus is your Lord correct? The only proof you had for that belief was because of God's word correct?

That is how most Christians believe they are saved, the process of "I believe and therefore I speak", regardless of however they feel at the moment. I would propose that. when it comes to trusting God for healing, to follow the same process, regardless of whether or not healing is manifested physically. That is faith, and it pleases God.
It is Gods word which says it and the Holy Spirit who came into our live.
Who believes has eternal life. That is written and I can say to our father you have prommissed it.
If you pray for healing you should of course trust that he can do it.
But you have no scripture that guarent that he will heal. So that I can say to our father you have prommised it.
There is a different.
 

jaybird88

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Jan 7, 2015
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I've gotten confused reading through the comments. I pointed that out yesterday.

I wanted to know if by declaring something, it would happen in reality.

Yes that was my simple question.

A "yes" or "no" followed by a scripture to back up the yes or no would have sufficed. Its that simple really.
im not sure what "claiming" means but IMO a believer has the power to make a car appear in their driveway if their faith is strong enough.
Matthew 17:20
He said to them, “Because of your little faith. For truly, I say to you, if you have faith like a grain of mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move, and nothing will be impossible for you.”

the problem with this is by the time your faith grew to this point a car in the driveway would be no more important than the clouds.
 

Angela53510

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Jan 24, 2011
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It will take time for anyone to renew their mind about this. Do you believe that God hates sin? Most of us do.

Once more Christians realized that God hates sickness with the same intensity as he hates sin, it will be hard to hold to the belief that "God does heal when it is his will". God does not use sin to teach us any lessons, although yes we can learn lessons from it, it is similar to sicknesses.

Some scriptures to back up the points I have made

Acts 10:38
38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

1 John 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Acts 10:38 What was Jesus healing? Clearly all that were oppressed by the devil. Not a single thing about sickness. There are lots of reasons for sickness, none of them necessarily directly related to the devil. After the Flood, the life expectancy of humans fell dramatically! Why? The devil was around before the Flood? But after the canopy fell, humans were exposed to radiation which damaged and mutated genes. These were passed along, multiplying until Moses is told to stop marriages of siblings or close relatives. Abraham married his half sister, Isaac married a family member of his mothers family, and Jacob also married someone from his mother's family, with no mentioned harm. A trip across the Sinai and that was over.

So, mutations are a big source of disease. Often fatal! Then there are diseases which cross the species barrier, like Ebola and AIDS. Of course the second is associated with sin, although in the early stages, before it was identified, everyone from babies to nuns were getting it from tainted blood.

So now that we have identified, that oppression of the devil does not necessarily mean sickness, these people oppressed by the devil were probably demonically possessed and Jesus cast out the demon.

As far as the devil and sin, of course Jesus came to destroy sin and the devil.

You seem to have confused sin with disease. My disease is genetic, it runs in my father's family. Or perhaps you think my cousin, who got JRA at the age of 1 1/2 was a wicked sinner who deserved a lifetime disabled by RA? Certainly, if we are punished for sin by disease, I have some serial killers in Canada, (where I am from) who need to go to the front of that line.

As for you, I am done. What kind of ethical Christian comes into this forum, posts a supposedly neutral question about Word Faith, then proceeds to go in the attack, badly defending her twisted doctrines. Such dishonesty I cannot abide by. I have argued this issue with many others in this forum on this topic. Sometimes for 100s of pages. Not one was a liar and dishonest like this.

Between your absolute manipulation, straw men and every other type of gross attempt to push your heresy, I am done with you.

I do hope others will beware of this.
 

Angela53510

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Jan 24, 2011
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From my experience with discussing with people who believed that Isaiah is talking about spiritual healing from sin instead of physical healing from diseases and infirmities, I think their mind is quite set from this teaching and I respect their differing views.

The one thing they could never explain well, in my opinion, is the link to the account in Matthew 8

14 And when Jesus was come into Peter's house, he saw his wife's mother laid, and sick of a fever.

15 And he touched her hand, and the fever left her: and she arose, and ministered unto them.

16 When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with his word, and healed all that were sick:

17 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare our sicknesses.

The New Testament is written in Greek but OT was in Hebrew, and the Holy Spirit clearly used this translation to emphasize that Isa 53 is talking about Jesus healing us from physical sicknesses. Matthew says that the healing ministry of Jesus was the fulfillment of
Isaiah 53:4–5. And he emphasizes that he healed every one. Why did he heal every one? Because he had taken, or was going to take—but in the eternal counsel of God he had already taken—our sicknesses and borne our pains

I notice you left this particular passage out, so I would be most keen to hear your own perspective towards this.
So, you didn't read my exegesis of Isaiah 53? In fact, I did 2 very long posts on it. Namely, posts 161 and 162 on page 9.

I admit I didn't get into verse 4 as much. That is because the Septuagint, a Greek translation from 300 BC, is a better translation than the much later Masoretic Hebrew from 800-1000 AD days, "He carried our sins" makes so much more sense in terms of the verse!
 

Sackcloth-N-Ashes

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Oct 25, 2018
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If I want a car can I go to the dealership, place my hand on a car and say, I'm declaring that this car will be mine's RIGHT NOW!
Absolutely!! Right after you get the paperwork filled out, get a loan from a finance company, agree to make monthly payments, &c. :p :D
 

Guojing

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Jan 12, 2019
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You seem to have confused sin with disease. My disease is genetic, it runs in my father's family. Or perhaps you think my cousin, who got JRA at the age of 1 1/2 was a wicked sinner who deserved a lifetime disabled by RA? Certainly, if we are punished for sin by disease, I have some serial killers in Canada, (where I am from) who need to go to the front of that line.

As for you, I am done. What kind of ethical Christian comes into this forum, posts a supposedly neutral question about Word Faith, then proceeds to go in the attack, badly defending her twisted doctrines. Such dishonesty I cannot abide by. I have argued this issue with many others in this forum on this topic. Sometimes for 100s of pages. Not one was a liar and dishonest like this.

Between your absolute manipulation, straw men and every other type of gross attempt to push your heresy, I am done with you.

I do hope others will beware of this.
Hmm I thought we were having a matured discussion, I have no idea why you suddenly became so antagonistic. :)

I am not saying anything about your particular history with disease. I am saying, because of Adam's sin, death came to this world, and sickness is just a fruit of that death. When God rested from creation in the seventh day and proclaim all aspects of his creation as very good, was there any sickness in the Garden of Eden? The clear answer is NO.

You are not disputing that explanation right?
 

Guojing

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Jan 12, 2019
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So, you didn't read my exegesis of Isaiah 53? In fact, I did 2 very long posts on it. Namely, posts 161 and 162 on page 9.

I admit I didn't get into verse 4 as much. That is because the Septuagint, a Greek translation from 300 BC, is a better translation than the much later Masoretic Hebrew from 800-1000 AD days, "He carried our sins" makes so much more sense in terms of the verse!
I did and I stated that I respected your view on Isaiah 53 being on spiritual healing from sins, because you are not the first to do so.

But I linked it to the account in Matthew 8 to show you that the Holy Spirit obviously quoted that link to Isaiah to teach us that passage is talking about physical healing from sicknesses. I am seeking your opinion on that Matthew passage, which you have left out in your explanation. You made no reference to Matt 8, in your reply. If you can properly explain Matt 8, then I think your view would be more strongly backed.

But since you said you are done, I guess that link will remain unexplained among all those who share the same view as yours, what a pity.
 

Guojing

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Jan 12, 2019
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It is Gods word which says it and the Holy Spirit who came into our live.
Who believes has eternal life. That is written and I can say to our father you have prommissed it.
If you pray for healing you should of course trust that he can do it.
But you have no scripture that guarent that he will heal. So that I can say to our father you have prommised it.
There is a different.
There are scriptures that promised healing, but its about whether you want to believe them and claim that promise thru faith. Other than Isaiah 53, we have Psalms 103, 3 John 1:2, Proverbs 4:22 and many others.

Its just that we can see that someone is healed, or not, with our eyes but we cannot see eternal life, so its easier to fall into unbelief for the former.
 

Guojing

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Matthew 9:1-7 So He got into a boat, crossed over, and came to His own city. Then behold, they brought to Him a paralytic lying on a bed. When Jesus saw their faith, He said to the paralytic, “Son, be of good cheer; your sins are forgiven you.” And at once some of the scribes said within themselves, “This Man blasphemes!” But Jesus, knowing their thoughts, said, “Why do you think evil in your hearts? For which is easier, to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven you,’ or to say, ‘Arise and walk’? But that you may know that the Son of Man has power on earth to forgive sins”—then He said to the paralytic, “Arise, take up your bed, and go to your house.” And he arose and departed to his house."

Are you willing to tell me that when one comes to the cross and accepts the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ that there is no room in His sacrifice for healing of their physical being through the forgiveness of sins?
.
Nice passage, I like how Barry Bennett used this to teach us that "Once you have got rid the sin issue, sickness would have to go too!"

If sickness came in because of Adam's sin, and Jesus made us the righteousness of God in him, sickness no longer have any right to remain in our bodies. :)
 

wolfwint

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Feb 15, 2014
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There are scriptures that promised healing, but its about whether you want to believe them and claim that promise thru faith. Other than Isaiah 53, we have Psalms 103, 3 John 1:2, Proverbs 4:22 and many others.

Its just that we can see that someone is healed, or not, with our eyes but we cannot see eternal life, so its easier to fall into unbelief for the former.
Well, if you take the scripture in this way, then you can create every doctrine you like.
To whom psalm 103, 3 is speaking? To christians? Ore the nation of Israel?
According deuteronomia the nation got the promise from God: obiedience - blessing and physical health and wealth. Disobedience - curse

So far i know we cant ocupy all promisses which Israel became 1:1 for us.

3.John1,2 is a wish John told to the reciever to the letter, but no promis.

And about Jes 53 Angela already wrote enough.

If these scriptures arw the base of such doctrine and if this doctrine is also not proofed in the reality, i would say this doctrine is wrong.