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Then God doesn't care about the goodness and decency of an atheist, a buddhist, etc. And if that is the message you are telling me, then there is no point to being a good person. There is no point of fighting on behalf of the oppressed, as America did, in WWII. The only purpose of fighting the Japanese, and beating back the Nazi's should have been so that we could bring more people to christ...is that what your saying? Should America be sending food and aid to heathens in Haiti? Should America be helping out muslims in disaster relief fallowing a natural disaster, unless it is to bring them to Christ? Is a person's only value to you, there potential to become a convert? They have no humanity beyond that?
You have an old testament my_adonai, and you are to be as obsessed with its obsessions, as you are with the new testament's. And the Old Testament's preoccupation is fighting evil, championing the good, and making a more ethical existence, during this lifetime.
And unless you think Christians alone can make this lifetime a little better, a little less genocidal, with a little less starvation, a little less torture, etc, it is an unethical message to peddle, that a good God would demand goodness, unless one doesn't believe in his son. Then one's goodness is pointless. One might as well not care about not gossiping behind other people's back, destroying someone's dignity in public, sleeping with a coworker's wife, extorting an elderly couple that one was hired to help, raping a pre-pubcescent child, killing another human being because of their skin color, etc, etc, etc.
You have an old testament my_adonai, and you are to be as obsessed with its obsessions, as you are with the new testament's. And the Old Testament's preoccupation is fighting evil, championing the good, and making a more ethical existence, during this lifetime.
And unless you think Christians alone can make this lifetime a little better, a little less genocidal, with a little less starvation, a little less torture, etc, it is an unethical message to peddle, that a good God would demand goodness, unless one doesn't believe in his son. Then one's goodness is pointless. One might as well not care about not gossiping behind other people's back, destroying someone's dignity in public, sleeping with a coworker's wife, extorting an elderly couple that one was hired to help, raping a pre-pubcescent child, killing another human being because of their skin color, etc, etc, etc.
what ive found is if you believe in the holy bible.its prophecy and understanding.that other religions admit who they are.
a quick example
The first interpretation is reflected well in Indian context in the eleventh canto of Bhagavad Gita, a holy book of Hindus in a verse as said by Krishna, a godhead of Hindus, to Arjuna inspiring him to fight the battle of Kurukshetra, which translated into English means, "I am Time who wastes and destroys the people; lo, I have arisen in my might, I am here to swallow up the nations. Even without thee all they shall not be, the men of war who stand arrayed in the opposing squadrons. Therefore do thou arise and get thee great glory, conquer thy foes and enjoy a great and wealthy empire. For these, they were already slain and it is I who have slain them; be the occasion only, O Savyasachin".
and it reminds me of the prophecy of daniel "and many will fall down slain"
in bible history india is cush.....
currently researching this battle........
a quick example
The first interpretation is reflected well in Indian context in the eleventh canto of Bhagavad Gita, a holy book of Hindus in a verse as said by Krishna, a godhead of Hindus, to Arjuna inspiring him to fight the battle of Kurukshetra, which translated into English means, "I am Time who wastes and destroys the people; lo, I have arisen in my might, I am here to swallow up the nations. Even without thee all they shall not be, the men of war who stand arrayed in the opposing squadrons. Therefore do thou arise and get thee great glory, conquer thy foes and enjoy a great and wealthy empire. For these, they were already slain and it is I who have slain them; be the occasion only, O Savyasachin".
and it reminds me of the prophecy of daniel "and many will fall down slain"
in bible history india is cush.....
currently researching this battle........
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This!
I've been told many times that as an atheist in no better in gods eyes that a rapist or a murder. Unless of course that murderer or rapist asks for gods forgiveness then he goes to heaven and I apparently go to hell.
Christians say that morality comes from god. This is obviously nonsense because it really doesn't matter what good or bad deeds you do, as long as you believe and seek his forgiveness you'll be fine. There is no morality in that, there's no responsibility.
Look at Jesus, he died for people's sins... Took their sins away... But he couldn't take away their responsibility. Did they care? Any remorse for
Their sins? Nope. Doesn't matter cos their forgiven in gods eyes.
Yet a non Christian can harm
No one and still go to hell. This is an appalling and downright evil belief system.
One lady in here told me that she accepts the fact that she would be up in heaven with the murderer of her own child while her non believing family burn in hell... Cos god forgave The murderer.
How people can take comfort in this wicked, evil and disgusting belief system is beyond me.
God gave us morals remember. Yeah right.
I've been told many times that as an atheist in no better in gods eyes that a rapist or a murder. Unless of course that murderer or rapist asks for gods forgiveness then he goes to heaven and I apparently go to hell.
Christians say that morality comes from god. This is obviously nonsense because it really doesn't matter what good or bad deeds you do, as long as you believe and seek his forgiveness you'll be fine. There is no morality in that, there's no responsibility.
Look at Jesus, he died for people's sins... Took their sins away... But he couldn't take away their responsibility. Did they care? Any remorse for
Their sins? Nope. Doesn't matter cos their forgiven in gods eyes.
Yet a non Christian can harm
No one and still go to hell. This is an appalling and downright evil belief system.
One lady in here told me that she accepts the fact that she would be up in heaven with the murderer of her own child while her non believing family burn in hell... Cos god forgave The murderer.
How people can take comfort in this wicked, evil and disgusting belief system is beyond me.
God gave us morals remember. Yeah right.
H
I have read your posts...and you do open threads up a lot!! Which of course you are freely able to do, but sometimes....quantity is not quality? I was just wondering why you post such questions? when you write how secure you are in your faith so therefore obviously know the answer? and also, you post...post....& post again but never come back onto the thread you start. Just wondering why? and why you post such potentially controversial & often rather obvious questions? is there anything wrong? God Bless you, <><
It pains me to hear the non-thought that qualifies as a Christian rebuttal.
And you wonder why the Left and the Secular have carted off your children, an entire generation.
I've heard many even tell me that Mother Teresa and Hitler would share the same fate, if Hitler had sought the love of Christ and asked him into his heart as his lord and savior. If Hitler and Mother Teresa shared the same reality in the next lifetime, then God is not a good God. And I would not care about being an ethical person.
And because I never espouse a position that so lowers the creator of the universe to such a pathetic level, I simply ask that people wrestle with the text, study the tradition that it was born out of, and fully analyze the ramifications of their beliefs. There are many Christians who have done exactly that, and they don't believe in such silly notions. God gave us common sense: USE IT!
And you wonder why the Left and the Secular have carted off your children, an entire generation.
I've heard many even tell me that Mother Teresa and Hitler would share the same fate, if Hitler had sought the love of Christ and asked him into his heart as his lord and savior. If Hitler and Mother Teresa shared the same reality in the next lifetime, then God is not a good God. And I would not care about being an ethical person.
And because I never espouse a position that so lowers the creator of the universe to such a pathetic level, I simply ask that people wrestle with the text, study the tradition that it was born out of, and fully analyze the ramifications of their beliefs. There are many Christians who have done exactly that, and they don't believe in such silly notions. God gave us common sense: USE IT!
This is the clincher.
There is no relationship either, unless (this goes for 'christianity' also) one comes to Jesus through His sacrificial blood/His cross. That is the DOOR God has placed before all mankind to gain access to Him. Free access for us, and whosoever will may enter but it cost His Son dearly.
There is no relationship either, unless (this goes for 'christianity' also) one comes to Jesus through His sacrificial blood/His cross. That is the DOOR God has placed before all mankind to gain access to Him. Free access for us, and whosoever will may enter but it cost His Son dearly.
I did come here to learn! And all it seems to have done is confirm what I suspected. I've met some great people on here with amazing perspectives and insight.
For every well worded response I've seen, I saw an equally evil one. The religion is rife with prejudice and a twisted sense of morality. And then people have the nerve to say "maybe it's not fair that this bad stuff happens, but that's gods word and who am I to question that".
That's the equivalent of me defending the holocaust by saying "that was hitlers word, who am I to question that"
I'd be rightfully despised for using that defence, but you think it's acceptable
For every well worded response I've seen, I saw an equally evil one. The religion is rife with prejudice and a twisted sense of morality. And then people have the nerve to say "maybe it's not fair that this bad stuff happens, but that's gods word and who am I to question that".
That's the equivalent of me defending the holocaust by saying "that was hitlers word, who am I to question that"
I'd be rightfully despised for using that defence, but you think it's acceptable
Danschance, there is a reason Christianity is irrelevant today.
Please look up on youtube John Lennox, Stephen Barr, Dennis Prager(Jew), David Berlinski(Agnostic) and Dinesh D Souza. They are amongst the most articulate Christians/theists I know of that are accessible on youtube, and please consider their arguments.
You make us theists look bad when you quote mine the text for scripture that reaffirms something ONLY YOU believe, or coward away from intellectual challenges. There is an intellectual case for God...
Please look up on youtube John Lennox, Stephen Barr, Dennis Prager(Jew), David Berlinski(Agnostic) and Dinesh D Souza. They are amongst the most articulate Christians/theists I know of that are accessible on youtube, and please consider their arguments.
You make us theists look bad when you quote mine the text for scripture that reaffirms something ONLY YOU believe, or coward away from intellectual challenges. There is an intellectual case for God...
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H
Well, if you are off, i wish you all the very best. I think its great that you dropped by but it was always going to be tough wasn't it? listening to answers that are just plain wrong to you...but i think its sad you are leaving...you have been honest and have asked some great questions, gets us digging deep to address our apologetic stances!! 
I liked the Welsh presence!! Take care, stay safe...& you can always come back? God Bless you. <><
I liked the Welsh presence!! Take care, stay safe...& you can always come back? God Bless you. <><
D
I sort of agree with you! The bible says that Christianity is foolishness to a dying world. The message of the cross does seem to be irrelevant to those who desperately need it the most.
I was once an athiest and while I was an atheist I hated Christianity and Christians with a passion. No argument no persuasion could unseat me from my position, except for God Himself. I won't bore you with the details but God allowed certian things to happen in my life which left me with the inescapable conclusion that God is real. All my presumptions about God and Christianity fell apart like a house of cards.
So if you don't mind, I will reject your plea to study things I know to be false. I only hope that someday you too will understand.
I was once an athiest and while I was an atheist I hated Christianity and Christians with a passion. No argument no persuasion could unseat me from my position, except for God Himself. I won't bore you with the details but God allowed certian things to happen in my life which left me with the inescapable conclusion that God is real. All my presumptions about God and Christianity fell apart like a house of cards.
So if you don't mind, I will reject your plea to study things I know to be false. I only hope that someday you too will understand.
J
God is the judge. He gave us the Bible so we would know what to do to get to Heaven. If we follow His commands we will go to Heaven. We are under the New Testament so we have to read and study it. God's plan of salvation is for us to Believe, Repent of our sins, Confess Jesus as Son of God, and Be Baptized. Acts. 2:38 Mark 16:15 & 16 I Peter 3:21. We can't just pick the commands we want we have to do them all. God said it and we have to do it. Those of us that have the Bible have no excuse. God will judge those who don't access to it for one reason or another.