Colossians 2.

[Hizikyah]

You will do whatever your heart wants to do. So to day it is dangerous to use “where our focus is” is just wrong.

If our focus is on serving others. We will by practice obey the law

If our focus is on the law. Wow will by practice be forced to 1. Lie to ourselves how good we are doing it (non of us can keep it) water it down, so we do not look so bad, judge others, because it takes our focus off ourselves. And finally, be so focused on self. We are not actually going out to serve others.

And please. Do not say this is not true, I not only lived it out. I have witnessed it for decades with people who were right there with me.

I generally say I respect and agree with most of what you say, except for telling me "Im focused on lettrs and your focus is on serveing" You have no way of knowing this but can readily make the claim. Also, everyone who believes in guarding the 7th day Sabbath is not "focused on letters" I agge with self righteous false Sabbath guarding to be error, yet the 7th day Sabbath guarded in truth is not for a self physical rest, but rather a rest from doing our own will; i.e. working a job for income, mowing the lawn, personal recreation, etc. it's true purpose is to do the will of YHWH:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Isaiah 58:11-14, "YHWH will guide you continually, and satisfy your soul in drought, and make fat; (strengthen), your bones. You will be like a watered garden, and like a spring of water, whose waters do not fail. And those of you will rebuild the old waste places; you will raise up the foundations of many generations; and you will be called the Repairer of the Breach, the Restorer of Streets to Dwell In; If you turn away your foot from breaking the Sabbath: from doing your pleasure; your own business, your own pleasure, on My holy day, and call the Sabbath a delight; the holy day of YHWH honorable, and will honor Him by not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor engaging in idle conversation: Then you will find your joy in YHWH; and I will cause you to ride on the high places of the earth, and feed you with the heritage of Yaaqob your father, for the mouth of YHWH has spoken it."

To ignore this is to ignore what YHWH says the day is for and use a pharisaic approach to "discredit" "Sabbath keepers" just as the pharisees did. This is falsehood. (also I want to say, to guard against any misrepresentation; none can do the will of Yah 24/7, going to work, doing chores, etc. are not evil but they are not the will of YHWH, nobody has ever watched a football game for God or done their own dishes for God, thu people who claim they are doing the will of Yah everyday to "discredit" thjose who believe in guardiung the 7th day Sabbath are not being truthful imo)
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[eternally-gratefull]

I generally say I respect and agree with most of what you say, except for telling me "Im focused on lettrs and your focus is on serveing" You have no way of knowing this but can readily make the claim. Also, everyone who believes in guarding the 7th day Sabbath is not "focused on letters" I agge with self righteous false Sabbath guarding to be error, yet the 7th day Sabbath guarded in truth is not for a self physical rest, but rather a rest from doing our own will; i.e. working a job for income, mowing the lawn, personal recreation, etc. it's true purpose is to do the will of YHWH:

Isaiah 58:11-14, "YHWH will guide you continually, and satisfy your soul in drought, and make fat; (strengthen), your bones. You will be like a watered garden, and like a spring of water, whose waters do not fail. And those of you will rebuild the old waste places; you will raise up the foundations of many generations; and you will be called the Repairer of the Breach, the Restorer of Streets to Dwell In; If you turn away your foot from breaking the Sabbath: from doing your pleasure; your own business, your own pleasure, on My holy day, and call the Sabbath a delight; the holy day of YHWH honorable, and will honor Him by not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor engaging in idle conversation: Then you will find your joy in YHWH; and I will cause you to ride on the high places of the earth, and feed you with the heritage of Yaaqob your father, for the mouth of YHWH has spoken it."

To ignore this is to ignore what YHWH says the day is for and use a pharisaic approach to "discredit" "Sabbath keepers" just as the pharisees did. This is falsehood. (also I want to say, to guard against any misrepresentation; none can do the will of Yah 24/7, going to work, doing chores, etc. are not evil but they are not the will of YHWH, nobody has ever watched a football game for God or done their own dishes for God, thu people who claim they are doing the will of Yah everyday to "discredit" thjose who believe in guardiung the 7th day Sabbath are not being truthful imo)

You will have to forgive me, 90 % of your posts have to do with obeying the law. If this is not focused on the law I do not know what else is.. maybe you can help me see what your really focused on?

Now if you were focused on telling people to serve others. And how ministry and serving others should be our focus, then maybe you would have a point.

I am not going to get in to a sabbath debate. The NT says we are not to judge people on sabbath days.. and vice verse. So it is a mute subject. Unless your focused on letters. And not spirit.

Jesus came to save not judge,, Lets be like Jesus like we are told to be. People who come judging others. That is an automatic red flag.

 

[Hizikyah]

not sure where this “Make law of no effect” is coming from

The law is of no effect when it stop condemning those who break it. Otherwise, it is in effect (only atonement can make th law of no effect)

I mean if one say "my focus s on Jesus" BUT IS ONLY DOING SO as a excuse to actually ignore what He commands and live their own path while claiming to "focus on Jesus" I am not saying you are this at all, but I have seen people that say their focus is on Jesus and WWJD? while they ignore every teaching He ever gave, honestly I grew up something like this, as I weas taught the Law was done away my whole life and thus thought my actions had no bearing because I was already saved. He sent me a wake up call that changed my life, and I am thankfukl for this.

Do you realise youy do not keep the law? Not the way God requires?

Certianly I am not without sin, which is transgression of the Law, i am aware of this. Howver this does not mean or give excuse to ignore the Law nor to excuse myself for sinning. But rather makes me aware that I have errored and need correction.

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 1:8-10, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His Word is not in us."[/FONT]


It is not about being perfect and never sinning, it is about submitting to YHWH and not living constantly in isn.

As there is a difference between a single transgression and not being subject to;

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 7:21-23, “Not everyone who says to Me; Master! Master! will enter into the Kingdom of YHWH, but only he who does the will of My Father Who is in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day; Master! Master! Have we not prophesied in Your Name, and cast out demons in Your Name, and in Your Name performed many wonderful works? But then I will declare to them; I never knew you. Get away from Me, you who practice iniquity.”[/FONT]



“[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]practice” is word #G2038 Strong's Concordance - ergazomai: I work, trade, do, Original Word: ἐργάζομαι, Part of Speech: Verb, Transliteration: ergazomai, Phonetic Spelling: (er-gad'-zom-ahee), Short Definition: I work, trade, do, Definition: I work, trade, perform, do, practice, commit, acquire by labor.[/FONT]


“[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]iniquity” is word #G458 Strong's Concordance - anomia, lawlessness, Short Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, disobedience, sin

[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]"iniquity" is: #0458 anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1) the condition of without law 1a) because ignorant of it1b) because of violating it, 2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness

in greek "nomia" is Law

"a" is without

"anomina" means without Law thus the definition; "[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]the condition of without law[/FONT]"

Yahshua/Jesus does not say get away from me those who committed sin, He says get away from Me those who "[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]practice iniquity[/FONT]" they thought they did many wonderful works yet they practiced being without Law that is the literal definition of "practice iniquity"

why is this so?
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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif] [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 24:12, "And because iniquity will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]This is not self juystification it is simply accepting the words of Messiah. Jumping to the idea "self ! justification!" from this pasage usually comes ffrom those in oppistion to the Law[/FONT]
[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif][/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."


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[Hizikyah]

You will have to forgive me, 90 % of your posts have to do with obeying the law. If this is not focused on the law I do not know what else is.. maybe you can help me see what your really focused on?

Now if you were focused on telling people to serve others. And how ministry and serving others should be our focus, then maybe you would have a point.

I am not going to get in to a sabbath debate. The NT says we are not to judge people on sabbath days.. and vice verse. So it is a mute subject. Unless your focused on letters. And not spirit.

Jesus came to save not judge,, Lets be like Jesus like we are told to be. People who come judging others. That is an automatic red flag.

There is a differnt\ce between juding ones eternal palce and judging between right and wrong, :

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Matthew 7:1-5, “Do not judge, lest you be judged. For with what judgment you judge, you shall be judged. And with the same measure you use, it shall be measured to you. And why do you look at the splinter in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the plank in your own eye? Or how is it that you say to your brother, ‘Let me remove the splinter out of your eye,’ and see, a plank is in your own eye? Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you shall see clearly to remove the splinter out of your brother’s eye.”[/FONT]
​

​

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Luke 17:3-4, “Take heed to yourselves. If your brother sins against you, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him. And if he sins against you seven times in a day, and seven times in a day comes back to you, saying, ‘I repent,’ you shall forgive him.”

[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 7:24, “Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”

Also I do post alot about the importeance of YHWH Laws, because we are literally in the time of the mystery of iniquity:

[/FONT]​

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]*What is the "mystery of iniquity?"[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2 Thessalonians 2:6-12, "For the mystery of iniquity is already working, but the One restraining him will continue to restrain him, until he is made to appear in the midst. And then that lawless one will be revealed, whom Yahshua will remove with the breath of His mouth, and make powerless with the appearance of His coming-- Whose coming is according to the energy of Satan, who works with all power, and signs, and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of sin in those who are perishing, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason, YHWH will send them strong delusion, that they would believe the deception, In order that all those may be judged as not having believed the truth, but as having delighted in sin."[/FONT]


—[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Thayer's (New Testament Greek-English Lexicon) From a derivative of μύω [[muo]] (to shut the mouth); a secret or "mystery" (through the idea of silence imposed by initiation into religious rites):—mystery.[/FONT]


“[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]iniquity” is word # G458 - anomia Strong's Concordance, lawlessness, Short Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, disobedience, sin[/FONT]

​

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]the secret initiation of lawlessness.

One can not have love if it is not accoring to Yah's standard:

[/FONT]​

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy." [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”

[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mattithyah 24:12, "And because iniquity (lawlessness) will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
and the argument that "following the law is actually lawlessness" is a reprobate assessment IMO.

[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
[/FONT]
​

 

[Magenta]

Jesus said until heaven and earth disappear the law remains in effect.

This is an improvement over what you used to say

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I mean if one say "my focus s on Jesus" BUT IS ONLY DOING SO as a excuse to actually ignore what He commands and live their own path while claiming to "focus on Jesus" I am not saying you are this at all, but I have seen people that say their focus is on Jesus and WWJD? while they ignore every teaching He ever gave, honestly I grew up something like this, as I weas taught the Law was done away my whole life and thus thought my actions had no bearing because I was already saved. He sent me a wake up call that changed my life, and I am thankfukl for this.

well of curse, but the law still should not be the focus, The way they live should prove their focus is not on jesus, If it was. They would not be living that way.

If your focus is on jesus, you life should resemble his life. If not. The law is not going to help change them, They need to see Jesus not the law. If anything, it may make them do a 180. And go from licentiousness to legalism. (I have witnessed this many times)

Certianly I am not without sin, which is transgression of the Law, i am aware of this. Howver this does not mean or give excuse to ignore the Law nor to excuse myself for sinning. But rather makes me aware that I have errored and need correction.

1 John 1:8-10, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His Word is not in us."


It is not about being perfect and never sinning, it is about submitting to YHWH and not living constantly in isn.

As there is a difference between a single transgression and not being subject to;

Mat 7:21-23, “Not everyone who says to Me; Master! Master! will enter into the Kingdom of YHWH, but only he who does the will of My Father Who is in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day; Master! Master! Have we not prophesied in Your Name, and cast out demons in Your Name, and in Your Name performed many wonderful works? But then I will declare to them; I never knew you. Get away from Me, you who practice iniquity.”



“practice” is word #G2038 Strong's Concordance - ergazomai: I work, trade, do, Original Word: ἐργάζομαι, Part of Speech: Verb, Transliteration: ergazomai, Phonetic Spelling: (er-gad'-zom-ahee), Short Definition: I work, trade, do, Definition: I work, trade, perform, do, practice, commit, acquire by labor.


“iniquity” is word #G458 Strong's Concordance - anomia, lawlessness, Short Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, disobedience, sin




"iniquity" is: #0458 anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459

Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law 1a) because ignorant of it1b) because of violating it, 2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness

in greek "nomia" is Law

"a" is without

"anomina" means without Law thus the definition; "the condition of without law"

Yahshua/Jesus does not say get away from me those who committed sin, He says get away from Me those who "practice iniquity" they thought they did many wonderful works yet they practiced being without Law that is the literal definition of "practice iniquity"

why is this so?




Mat 24:12, "And because iniquity will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."


This is not self juystification it is simply accepting the words of Messiah. Jumping to the idea "self ! justification!" from this pasage usually comes ffrom those in oppistion to the Law




1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

So you admit you can not keep the very law you claim we need to keep. That seems kind of odd does it not. If it does not. It should.

It is like Obey the law.. we need to focus on it, DO it, guard it. And even though I can not do it, you should follow me as we both fail together

again, Why not focus on serving others, and living as Christ lived, The law did its job if you have found christ,

 

[eternally-gratefull]

There is a differnt\ce between juding ones eternal palce and judging between right and wrong, :

Matthew 7:1-5, “Do not judge, lest you be judged. For with what judgment you judge, you shall be judged. And with the same measure you use, it shall be measured to you. And why do you look at the splinter in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the plank in your own eye? Or how is it that you say to your brother, ‘Let me remove the splinter out of your eye,’ and see, a plank is in your own eye? Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you shall see clearly to remove the splinter out of your brother’s eye.”
​

​

Luke 17:3-4, “Take heed to yourselves. If your brother sins against you, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him. And if he sins against you seven times in a day, and seven times in a day comes back to you, saying, ‘I repent,’ you shall forgive him.”

John 7:24, “Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”

Also I do post alot about the importeance of YHWH Laws, because we are literally in the time of the mystery of iniquity:

​

*What is the "mystery of iniquity?"


2 Thessalonians 2:6-12, "For the mystery of iniquity is already working, but the One restraining him will continue to restrain him, until he is made to appear in the midst. And then that lawless one will be revealed, whom Yahshua will remove with the breath of His mouth, and make powerless with the appearance of His coming-- Whose coming is according to the energy of Satan, who works with all power, and signs, and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of sin in those who are perishing, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason, YHWH will send them strong delusion, that they would believe the deception, In order that all those may be judged as not having believed the truth, but as having delighted in sin."


—Thayer's (New Testament Greek-English Lexicon) From a derivative of μύω [[muo]] (to shut the mouth); a secret or "mystery" (through the idea of silence imposed by initiation into religious rites):—mystery.


“iniquity” is word # G458 - anomia Strong's Concordance, lawlessness, Short Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, disobedience, sin

​

the secret initiation of lawlessness.

One can not have love if it is not accoring to Yah's standard:

​

1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."


Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”


John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”


Mattithyah 24:12, "And because iniquity (lawlessness) will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."


and the argument that "following the law is actually lawlessness" is a reprobate assessment IMO.

​

The law can only judge write and wrong so far. It was not given for that purpose. And it requires perfection.

Why keep focusing on something not given for that purpose. I can just righteous judgment, If I see a person putting their needs over others peoples needs, i can judge they are in sin. The law will not help me do that, I can not use the law when I am guilty of breaking the law myself.

 

[posthuman]

Nothing to do with "Jews following commands" - The Greek "stoicheion" is used by Paul in Galatians (elements of the world) in regards to the Mosaic observances - in Colossians he is doing the same thing.

yes, thank you

I mean that the heir, as long as he is a child, is no different from a slave,though he is the owner of everything, but he is under guardians and managers until the date set by his father. In the same way we also, when we were children, were enslaved to the elementary principles of the world. But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the Law, to redeem those who were under the Law, so that we might receive adoption as sons.
(Galatians 4:1-5)​

"elementary principles of the world" -- stoicheion
obviously referencing the Law in the Torah

But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how can you turn back again to the weak and worthless elementary principles of the world, whose slaves you want to be once more? You observe days and months and seasons and years!
(Galatians 4:9-10)​

"elementary principles of the world" -- stoicheion
specifically referencing the ritual observance of days - in context, obviously associated with the rites of the Mosaic covenant

See to it that no one takes you captive by philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elementary principles of the world, and not according to Christ.
(Colossians 2:8) ​

"elementary principles of the world" -- stoicheion
sharp contrast with the righteousness that is through Christ. the contrast is re-iterated and further developed in v.11, stating that our circumcision is spiritual, not physical ((physical circumcision being emblematic of being under the Law))

If with Christ you died to the elementary principles of the world, why, as if you were still alive in the world, do you submit to regulations — "Do not handle, Do not taste, Do not touch” ?!
(Colossians 2:20-21)​

"elementary principles of the world" -- stoicheion
as opposed to Christ, specifically linked here regulations regarding ritual purity & diet

 

[posthuman]

if Paul is really saying to the believers in Colossae "don't let anyone judge you because you are observing days and months" ((Col. 2:16))

why is Paul himself judging the believers in Galatia for observing days and months ? ((Gal. 4:10))



if Paul is really saying to the believers in Colossae "do not let anyone judge you because you are observing dietary laws" ((Col. 2:16)

why does Paul immediately judge them himself for observing dietary laws? ((Col. 2:20-21))

 

[Hizikyah]

The law can only judge write and wrong so far. It was not given for that purpose. And it requires perfection.

Why keep focusing on something not given for that purpose. I can just righteous judgment, If I see a person putting their needs over others peoples needs, i can judge they are in sin. The law will not help me do that, I can not use the law when I am guilty of breaking the law myself.

You isolate, the Law also shos us what love is, you ignore that.

1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”

John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”

and just because one sin does not mean they shouild then reject Instruction from Yah. You know, you say the Law has not passed but you seem to fight against it, find ways to disarm iot or find excuses or something... It is odd to me.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You isolate, the Law also shos us what love is, you ignore that.

1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”

John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”

and just because one sin does not mean they shouild then reject Instruction from Yah. You know, you say the Law has not passed but you seem to fight against it, find ways to disarm iot or find excuses or something... It is odd to me.

Your wrong, you have it backwards.

Love shows us how to obey the law. The law does not show us what love is, It shows us what sin is, and condemns us all as sinners.

1 John 5 is not saying the law shows us what love is, It is saying if we love God we will obey his commands.

Loe is the filfiment of the law. The law is not fulfiment of love, I can keep the law (letter) and not love anyone.

 

[posthuman]

Colossae.

major Roman trade hub city. rich & diverse; populated by Greeks, Jews, Chaldeans, Persians, Egyptians, Romans - people from all over the region.

all these diverse people worshiping many gods. many of them, handfuls or even dozens of gods. all these gods being worshiped by observance of codes and special days. dietary laws. special feasts and festivals. regulations against doing certain things and regulations requiring different things to be done.

in one corner of the city, a small minority of people associated somewhat with the god of the Jews are following laws and honoring special days associated with the religion of the Jews. just like literally everyone else in the city, in the whole region, in all the known world, actually. keeping laws. keeping feasts. one god of thousands, one set of ordinances and appointed festivals out of hundreds.

the picture Studyman would like for us to have is that in this context, all the people are ridiculing Christians because they are keeping feasts and observing dietary & other religious laws.
the people who are all doing the same things, themselves, most of them to & for at least a half a dozen gods, themselves.

how is this scenario supposed to seem obvious, instead of the scenario literally described throughout Acts & the epistles, where observant Jews, misunderstanding the grace of God, were adamant to force gentile believers to place themselves under the Law of Moses, and were going behind Paul in every place he started churches trying to convert them to Judaism, accusing them because they were not keeping the feasts, festivals, sabbaths and dietary laws of the marriage covenant between God and the nation Israel?

forget for a moment how completely opposite this interpretation of Col. 2:16 is to the rest of Colossians and to everything else Paul wrote: it makes no sense in the historical & cultural context.

 

[Hizikyah]

Your wrong, you have it backwards.

Love shows us how to obey the law. The law does not show us what love is, It shows us what sin is, and condemns us all as sinners.

1 John 5 is not saying the law shows us what love is, It is saying if we love God we will obey his commands.

Loe is the filfiment of the law. The law is not fulfiment of love, I can keep the law (letter) and not love anyone.

twisting of the Law is not love, guarding it correctly is love.


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."[/FONT]


Lev 19:17, "‘Do not hate your brother in your heart. Reprove your neighbor, for certain, and bear no sin because of him."

Titus 1:9, "Holding fast the teaching according to the faithful word in order that he may be able, by sound doctrine, both to exhort and to refute those who contradict."


Deuteronomy 6:5, “And you shall love יהוה your Strength with all your heart, and with all your being, and with all your might.”



Leviticus 19:18, ‘Do not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the children of your people. And you shall love your neighbour as yourself. I am יהוה.”


Mat 7:12, "So then, whatever you desire that others would do to and for you, even so do also to and for them, for this is (the intent/sums up) the Law and the Prophets."



1 Yahanan /John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”


Mat 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."


“all” is word #G3650 - holos - Strong's Concordance, holos: whole, complete, Original Word: ὅλος, η, ον, Part of Speech: Adjective, Transliteration: holos, Phonetic Spelling: (hol'-os), Short Definition: all, the whole, entire, Definition: all, the whole, entire, complete


Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) all, whole, completely


Romans 13:9-10, "For the commandments: You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not bring false testimony, You shall not covet, and (#G5100 & #G2087) any othercommandments aresummed up (#G346) in these Laws; namely: You must love your neighbor as yourself. Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law."


“any”is word #G5100 - tis: a certain one, someone, anyone, Original Word: τις, τι, Part of Speech: Indefinite Pronoun, Transliteration: tis, Phonetic Spelling: (tis), Short Definition: any one, some one, Definition: any one, some one, a certain one or thing.


“other”is word #G2087 - heteros
Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the other, another, other, 1 to number,1a1) to number as opposed to some former person or thing,1a2) the other of two,1b) to quality,1b1) another: i.e. one not of the same nature, form, class, kind, different


“summed up” is word #G346 – anakephalaioó: to sum up, gather up, Original Word: ἀνακεφαλαιόω, Part of Speech: Verb, Transliteration: anakephalaioó, Phonetic Spelling: (an-ak-ef-al-ah'-ee-om-ahee), Short Definition: I sum up, summarize, recapitulate, gather up in one, Definition: I sum up, summarize, recapitulate, gather up in one

Deuteronomy 6:5, “And you shall love יהוה your Strength with all your heart, and with all your being, and with all your might.”



Leviticus 19:18, ‘Do not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the children of your people. And you shall love your neighbour as yourself. I am יהוה.”

 

[gb9]

You isolate, the Law also shos us what love is, you ignore that.

1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”

John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”

and just because one sin does not mean they shouild then reject Instruction from Yah. You know, you say the Law has not passed but you seem to fight against it, find ways to disarm iot or find excuses or something... It is odd to me.

you scolded me for calling you " Hebrew roots " , then denied you were a part of it ( in another thread ). well, let's see.

Hebrew roots beliefs- Jesus's death and resurrection did not end the Mosaic Law, but renewed it. you say this.

Paul's letters are not taught as they should. you say this.

question the translation of the N.T., say the proper greek was not used. you again.

all believers should live by Torah. you again.

celebrating Christmas and Easter and wrong. you one more time.

so, you know, if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, swims in a pond. it is probably a duck. even if it denies that it is one.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

twisting of the Law is not love, guarding it correctly is love.


1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."


Lev 19:17, "‘Do not hate your brother in your heart. Reprove your neighbor, for certain, and bear no sin because of him."

Titus 1:9, "Holding fast the teaching according to the faithful word in order that he may be able, by sound doctrine, both to exhort and to refute those who contradict."


Deuteronomy 6:5, “And you shall love יהוה your Strength with all your heart, and with all your being, and with all your might.”



Leviticus 19:18, ‘Do not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the children of your people. And you shall love your neighbour as yourself. I am יהוה.”


Mat 7:12, "So then, whatever you desire that others would do to and for you, even so do also to and for them, for this is (the intent/sums up) the Law and the Prophets."



1 Yahanan /John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”


Mat 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."


“all” is word #G3650 - holos - Strong's Concordance, holos: whole, complete, Original Word: ὅλος, η, ον, Part of Speech: Adjective, Transliteration: holos, Phonetic Spelling: (hol'-os), Short Definition: all, the whole, entire, Definition: all, the whole, entire, complete


Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) all, whole, completely


Romans 13:9-10, "For the commandments: You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not bring false testimony, You shall not covet, and (#G5100 & #G2087) any othercommandments aresummed up (#G346) in these Laws; namely: You must love your neighbor as yourself. Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law."


“any”is word #G5100 - tis: a certain one, someone, anyone, Original Word: τις, τι, Part of Speech: Indefinite Pronoun, Transliteration: tis, Phonetic Spelling: (tis), Short Definition: any one, some one, Definition: any one, some one, a certain one or thing.


“other”is word #G2087 - heteros
Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the other, another, other, 1 to number,1a1) to number as opposed to some former person or thing,1a2) the other of two,1b) to quality,1b1) another: i.e. one not of the same nature, form, class, kind, different


“summed up” is word #G346 – anakephalaioó: to sum up, gather up, Original Word: ἀνακεφαλαιόω, Part of Speech: Verb, Transliteration: anakephalaioó, Phonetic Spelling: (an-ak-ef-al-ah'-ee-om-ahee), Short Definition: I sum up, summarize, recapitulate, gather up in one, Definition: I sum up, summarize, recapitulate, gather up in one

Deuteronomy 6:5, “And you shall love יהוה your Strength with all your heart, and with all your being, and with all your might.”



Leviticus 19:18, ‘Do not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the children of your people. And you shall love your neighbour as yourself. I am יהוה.”

No one said anything about twisting the law. So not sure what your talking about. How come every time we get to this point in our discussion you do this?

Why can you not admit, Love God, Love thers (including our enemy’s, including those who persecute us) is the way to be obedient children of God who by practice follow Gods commands?

The law does not tell UC how to love, Love is the way to fulfill the law.

 

[Endoscopy]

This is an improvement over what you used to say

Incorrect!! It is completely in line with what I was saying about the quote of Jesus. The law is in effect until heaven and earth disappear!!!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Incorrect!! It is completely in line with what I was saying about the quote of Jesus. The law is in effect until heaven and earth disappear!!!

To who? What is the purpose of the law?

 

[posthuman]

thousands of religious Jews living in Colossae.

all those thousands of people keeping dietary laws and the feasts and festivals and sabbaths of the Law of Moses, i'm supposed to think, were judging the Christian believers because the believers were observing exactly the same things?

that's what "do not let anyone judge you with regard to food or drink, feasts or festivals or sabbaths" is supposed to obviously mean?

exactly the opposite of common sense, context, the book of Acts and all the Pauline epistles, and the historical record says?






hmm. i'll have to think about that.

 

[Hizikyah]

No one said anything about twisting the law. So not sure what your talking about. How come every time we get to this point in our discussion you do this?

Why can you not admit, Love God, Love thers (including our enemy’s, including those who persecute us) is the way to be obedient children of God who by practice follow Gods commands?

The law does not tell UC how to love, Love is the way to fulfill the law.

This is what I mean; If someone is twisting the Law it is not love, but someone is truly applying the Law in its true intention it is love.

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

“all” is word #G3650 - holos - Strong's Concordance, holos: whole, complete, Original Word: ὅλος, η, ον, Part of Speech: Adjective, Transliteration: holos, Phonetic Spelling: (hol'-os), Short Definition: all, the whole, entire, Definition: all, the whole, entire, complete[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 7:12-14, "Therefore, all things you want men to do to you, do the same to them, for this is the (intent of the) Law and the Prophets. Enter in through the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and many are those who go that way. Because straight is the gate, and narrow is the way which leads to life, and few there are who find it." [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 Timothy 1:5, “Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned.”

1 Timothy 1:5-7, " But the goal* of the commandment is love from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith. For some men, straying from these things, have turned aside to fruitless discussion, wanting to be teachers of the Law, even though they do not understand either what they are saying or the matters about which they make confident assertions."

(goal)is word #G5056 –télos; Greek Dictionary (Lexicon-Concordance) - #5056 telos {tel'-os} from a primary tello (to set out for a definite point or goal)

HELPS Word-studies – 5056 télos (a neuter noun) – properly, consummation (the end-goal, purpose), such as closure with all its results.

1 John 4:20, “"If someone says, "I love Yah," and hates his brother, he is a liar; for the one who does not love his brother whom he has seen, cannot love Yah whom he has not seen."

1 John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”


1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."[/FONT]

 

[Locutus]

"heaven and earth" passed in the conflagration of 66-70 AD with the passing of the old covenant:

Heb 8:13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Peter used the same word Greek "stoicheion" as Paul used to describe the passing of the "elements" of the Mosaic system here:

2 Pet 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Peter was not speaking of molecules, atoms and electrons of creation.