Daniel 7 Antichrist.

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gotime

Senior Member
Mar 3, 2011
3,537
88
48
#1
Daniel 7 builds on the prophecy of Daniel 2, but before we look at the prophecy itself we need to clarify a few things concerning the antichrist.

2Jn 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

The Term "antichrist" is only mentioned four times in the bible-- all in the letters of John. In each case, the term is used to portray a false teacher or deceptive power that corrupts the faith within the church.

An "antichrist" literally means "instead of Christ" or "in the place of Christ". John said there were "many antichrists" within the early church (1 John 2:18) and these antichrists all had a misconception about Jesus Christ. The Original "antichrist" was the Devil himself which we will look at in a separate study later if you want.

Within Bible prophecy there is one specific "Antichrist" who is described in great detail. This power would rise after the early church in Acts, and have dramatic impact on the history of the world.

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.


Within the Early church there were people who believed that Jesus would return in their day. The apostle Paul refuted this concept. He predicted that before Jesus returned, the church would experience a major spiritual fall. This "falling away" would reveal the "man of sin" This great Antichrist would exalt himself and be involved in breaking or disregarding the law of God.

It is interesting to note that the Antichrist would arise within the church. In a similar way, Jesus referred to his disciple Judas as the "son of perdition" (John 17:12) Judas was a leader "in the church" who wanted power more than he wanted Christ. Most people think the Antichrist will be a Secular political leader. But the bible is clear. The Antichrist will come from the religious world.

Most of the Prophecies concerning the Antichrist are found in the book of Daniel and Revelation. The focus
of this study will be in Daniel chapter 7.

In this chapter the Antichrist is described as you will see as a "little horn"

This chapter is vital because it outlines the empires of history like in Daniel 2, and Identifies the characteristics of the Antichrist. It also lays the foundation for future descriptions of the Antichrist in the book of Revelation. It may be good to read the whole chapter once before we focus on specific parts. notice the characteristics of the little horn.

Dan 7:2 Daniel spake and said, I saw in my vision by night, and, behold, the four winds of the heaven strove upon the great sea.
Dan 7:3 And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another.


While in vision Daniel saw four great animals come up out of the sea. Each of these "beasts" were different animals with unique characteristics.
Before we go on lets identify some prophecy symbols.

The winds.

Read Jeremiah 49:36,37
Winds represent strife, destruction and war. A wind swept sea is one where there is plenty of unrest and commotion. (This method of interpretation is important. we should always let the bible interoperate itself, we could try to guess what the symbols mean, but then we will interoperate according to our won wisdom. It is always best to get our answers from the bible itself.)

The Sea

Read Revelation 17:15
Here the sea represents an area of vast population, a place where there are many people from different nationalities. even today we refer to such a group as a "sea of faces". The beasts of Daniel's vision come up from populated areas on the globe.

A beast

Read Daniel 7:17,23
A beast is a symbol of a kingdom or political power. We still use animals today as representations of our nations. the United states has the "eagle" while here in Australia we have the "kangaroo".

In Daniel 7 we find four great nations or political powers all different form one another, rising up form populated areas of the world, where there has been a history of war and destruction.

By comparing Daniel 2 ( the great image) with this prophecy in Daniel 7, it is evident that Daniel is seeing the same succession of world empires. Both prophecies are aligned perfectly. however Daniel 7 gives greater detail and a number of additional interesting facts. Daniel 2 used metals to symbolize the nations while Daniel 7 uses "Beasts".

To illustrate this link, the fourth beast of Daniel 7 has "iron teeth" and is called the "fourth kingdom" (Daniel 7:7,23). The power represented by Iron in Daniel 2 is also called the "fourth Kingdom" (Daniel 2:40) the four kingdoms represented in both Daniel 2 and Daniel 7 are:
1. Babylon
2. Medo-Persia
3. Greece
4. Rome


Dan 7:4 The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it.

The king of beasts is a perfect symbol for the proud and powerful Babylon and an ideal parallel to the "head of gold" in Daniel 2. the prophet Jeremiah also described the King of Babylon as a being "like a lion" (Jeremiah 50:43,44)

Dan 7:5 And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh.

The coalition government of the Medes and Persians was "lopsided" because the Persians were a much stronger entity than the Medes. The bear had three ribs in its mouth which indicates it had eaten other beast. The three major powers conquered by the Medo-Persia were Babylon, Lydia and Egypt. Amazing how for us this is History, but this prophecy came before these things had taken place.

Dan 7:6 After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it.

A leopard with four wings represents a very fast and attacking empire. No nation ever contoured as fast as the Greeks under the leadership of Alexander. Notice that the leopard had four heads. After the death of Alexander, the Greek empire was divided between his four generals, the heads of his empire. These four Generals were: Ptolomy, Seleucus, Cassander and Lysimachus.

Dan 7:24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

I have skipped to the description of the fourth beast.

Just as the Iron legs of Rome divided into Iron and clay feet and ten toes of Daniel 2, now we find Daniel seeing ten horns arising out of the power of Rome. A "horn" is another symbol of a kingdom (Daniel 7:24, 8:22). The ten horns are the ten powers that rose from the divided Roman Empire. These nations are what we see today as Western Europe.
Now let's take a closer look at this little horn. (v8-28)

Dan 7:8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

The little horn and the judgment is the focus of the rest of this chapter. It is this power that provides the additional information to the Daniel 2 prophecy. Here we will see the character and power of the little horn, the great Antichrist of Prophecy.
Lets now look at 10 clues that the Bible gives us concerning this antichrist power.

clue 1 - It arises from Western Europ.

The Little Horn was seen in amongst the ten horns "coming up from them" - rising out of the head of the fourth beast. (Daniel 7:8) This information provides us with a geographical location of the rise of the little horn. Since the ten horns represent the division of the Roman empire into the nations of Western Europe, the little horn would arise from somewhere within that region.

clue 2 - It is a "little" kingdom

The is political power has the unique characteristics of being a "little horn" (Daniel 7:8). Here we have a small nation that will accomplish large things.

clue 3 - It arises after the ten tribes of Europe were established.

The little horn Antichrist not only comes out of the ten horns but also comes to power after the ten horns were established: "and another shall rise after them" (Daniel 7:24). The ten horns were finally established in 476AD, so we are looking for a power which gained its political clout after this date.

clue 4 - It overcomes three political powers as it rises to prominence.

The Bible says that three of the original ten horns were "plucked out by the roots" (Daniel 7:8). The little horn would overcome three of the tribes of Europe on its way to dominance. Three of the original kingdoms had been removed by 538AD. This kingdom would come to power sometime around 538AD.

clue 5 - Itis different from the other ten powers

The ten tribes of Western Europe were all secular political powers. The "little horn" was unique - there was something different about this power.

clue 6 - It would have a man at its head who speaks for it.

Although this power is a political entity, it would have "eyes like the eyes of a man" (Daniel 7:8). A man would be the focus of this power and would be the absolute spokesperson. (Daniel 7:8).

clue 7 - It would speak blasphemies against God.

This power delves into religion; speaking "pompous words against the most high" (Daniel 7:25).

clue 8 - It would persecute God's people

The "little horn" power would "persecuted the saints of the Most High" (Daniel 7:25). We are looking for a power who is responsible for the deaths of faithful Christians.

clue 9 - It would bin power for 1,260 years.

This power rules for a "time and times and half a times" (Daniel7:25). By comparing Daniel 7:25 with Revelation 12:6,14 it is clear that this time prophecy is another way of saying 1,260 days. A "time" is one year, "times" is two years, and "half a time" is six months or as the Amplified Bible translates it, "Three and one half years". Based on the 30-day calendar used by the Ancient scriptures, three and a half years is 1,260 days.
In Bible Prophecy, a day is symbolic code for a literal year (Ezekiel 4:6). Thus 1,260 days represents 1,260 literal years. Seven times in the books of Daniel and Revelation the same time period is given, using three different phrases, to represent the length of rule for this Antichrist. This means that its rule would end in 1798. Now you may be thinking but that means it is past. you are right it is, but as we will see in further studies later on, this power will rise once more just before Jesus comes.

clue 10 - This power would attempt to change times and law.

In one of the most intriguing clues of all, the "little horn" would "intend to change times and law" (Daniel 7:25). In our search for the identity of the Antichrist we need to discover which power would attempt to alter times in connection with the law.
 

gotime

Senior Member
Mar 3, 2011
3,537
88
48
#2
The Protestant Reformation was one of the greatest events in world history. By the mid 1500's this movement had swept throughout Germany, and was advancing through Switzerland, England, France, Austria and many other parts of Europe.

The reformation was based on the idea of "Sola Scriptura" The Bible and the Bible only. Through a study of the scriptures, the Reformers discovered the refreshing beauty of salvation through faith instead of works.

Prophecy also became a real focus of study. As they investigated the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation, the subject of the antichrist caught their attention. In their view the leadership of their own church fulfilled all the criteria for being the antichrist. This amazed the Reformers because they loved their church so much.

The Reform was started to try and do just that, Reform their own church. I could go on about the history.

Listen to the Wstminster Confession.

"There is no other head of the church but the Lord Jesus Christ: nor can the pope of Rome in any snese be head thereof; but is that Antichrist, that man of sin and son of perdition, that exalts himself in the church against Christ and all that is called God." (chapter 25, art.6).
So without further delay let us examine history in light of the clues of Daniel 7 and see if the reformers were right.

Clue 1 - Arises From Western Europe.

The Papacy arose from Western Europe. The home of "seat" of the Papacy is Rome, Italy - right in the heart of Western Europe.

Clue 2 - It is a "little" kingdom

The Vatican is a "little" nation. The Vatican is a very small independent kingdom within Europe. The entire kingdom is located on just over 40 hectares (108 acres) of land.

Clue 3 - It arises after the 10 tribes of Europe were established.

The Papacy rose to political power in 538 AD. The 10 kingdoms were established by 476AD. The Papacy received its major political power once it overthrew the Arian Ostrogoths in 538AD.

Clue 4 - It overcomes three political powers as it rises to prominence

The Papacy "uprooted" three tribes - the Vandals, Heruli and the Ostrogoths. Over time most of the 10 kingdoms of Europe adopted Roman Christianity. However, three of these kingdoms opposed Rome and refused to cooperate. These three powers were defeated by Catholic emperors - Heruli (493AD), the Vandals (534AD) and the Ostrogoths (538AD). All three kingdoms were "plucked" out by the roots"- They have disappeared from Europe. The Papacy came into power as promised by the Emperor Justinian.

Clue 5 - It is different from the other 10 powers.

The Papacy is a religious power. The Papacy is different from all the other powers in terms of being a religious power. A church controlling politics was certainly "different" from the first ones. (Daniel 7:24). They were secular governments.

Clue 6 - It would have a man at its head who speaks for it.

The Pope is the absolute head of the church. The Papacy has one man at the head. The Papacy is not a democratic government; the Pope is the ultimate authority who speaks for it.

Clue 7 - It would speak blasphemies against God.

The Pope claims to be "God on earth". According to the Bible, Blasphemy is either claiming to forgive sins (Luke 5:21) or claiming to be God (John 10:33). The Papacy claims both. In 1870 the Vatican Council declared that the Pope was infallible whenever speaking from his position of authority. Notice these interesting quotes:
"We (the popes) hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty" (The Great Encyclical Letters of Leo, XIII, p304).

"The Pope is not only the representative of Jesus Christ, but he is Jesus Christ, Himself, hidden under the veil of flesh" (Catholic National, July 1895).

"Thus the priest may, in certain manner be called the creator of the Creator, since by saying these words of consecration, he creats as it were, Jesus in the sacrament" (Duties & Dignities of the Priest, St Alphonsus De Ligouri, p27).

Clue 8 - It would persecute God's people.

The Papacy has persecuted and killed millions of People. During the Dark Ages, the church of Rome killed more people than what Hitler did during WWII. Conservative estimates place the killings at 50 million people with some experts placing the figure closer to 150 million deaths. Millions of people were burnt at the stake for "heresy" when they were simply following the truths of the Scripture instead of the dictates and traditions of the church.

clue 9 - It would be a power for 1,260 years

The Papacy ruled for 1,260 years. The Papacy gained ultimate power in 538AD when the final Opposition, the Ostrogoths were defeated. The church then ruled for 1, 260 years until Pope Pius VI was taken captive by Napoleon's general, Berthier. The Pope was stripped of his political powers. Just as the Prophecy predicted, the antichrist recieved a "deadly wound" in 1798, ending the power of the Papacy.

Clue 10 - This Power would attempt to change times and law.

The Papacy attempted to change god's law, the Ten Commandments. The Catholic catechisms has shortened the Sabbath Commandment, removed the second Commandment, and split the 10th into two Commandments.

Along with this, the church claims to have changed the Sabbath commandment to Sunday. (the Sabbath is the only Commandment associated with "times").

The Roman Papacy fits all the clues perfectly, no other power in history or the future could possible fit all the clues that the Prophecy of Daniel 7 has provided.

The Roman church was deeply concerned about the Reformation. They were fighting the Muslims from without and the Protestants from within. One of the key points of discussion was related to the authority of the bible over church practice and tradition.

The Archbishop of Reggio gave a speech at Trent claiming that Protestants also believe in the authority of the church tradition. He pointed to the fact that the Protestants were keeping Sunday, a day made by authority and tradition.

"The Sabbath, the most glorious day in the law, has been changed into the Lord's day... These and other similar matters have not ceased by virtue of Christ's teaching (For He says He has come to fulfil the law, not to destroy it), but they have been changed by the authority of the church"
Gaspare [Ricciulli] de Fosso (Archbishop of Reggio), Address in the 17th Session of the Council of Trent, Jan, 18, 1562.

This Gave the church confidence against the Protestants, They knew they had a weak link in their theology. The next thing the church did was turn against Prophecy, this was their weakness, many were being turned away because of these Prophecies. So what did they do?

The Jesuit order suggested two alternative views on prophecy. A Spaniard by the name of Alcazar claimed all the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation relate to the Jews and Pagan Rome. By applying all the Prophecies to the past, this approach, called "preterism", resulted in the middle ages church escaping all references in prophecy.

The other by a man named Fancisco Ribera. published a 500-page commentary on the Bible applying the Early parts of Revelation to Pagan Rome, and the latter to a period way in the future. This "futurist" approach was supported by another man named Robert Bellarmine who attacked the Protestant year day principle and said that the antichrist was a Jew who would rule 3 1/2 literal years at the end of time. thus no one would look at the Papacy but apply the prophecy way down in the future.

Many Christians today believe one of these two and many of the popular beliefs held by protestants today are derivatives of these two views.

Later we will look at more prophecy that says that this same antichrist power will rise one more time before Jesus comes. but many are blind to it because they have bought the lie that the Papacy itself put out there to take the heat of themselves.

Rev 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

The Papacy was wounded in 1798. but John saw that it would be healed. even today we are seeing this. Protestants are bowing to the Papacy again. we will see in further studies how this power will rise again and persecute again as it has done in the past.
 
P

peterT

Guest
#3
Daniel 7 builds on the prophecy of Daniel 2, but before we look at the prophecy itself we need to clarify a few things concerning the antichrist.

2Jn 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

The Term "antichrist" is only mentioned four times in the bible-- all in the letters of John. In each case, the term is used to portray a false teacher or deceptive power that corrupts the faith within the church.

An "antichrist" literally means "instead of Christ" or "in the place of Christ". John said there were "many antichrists" within the early church (1 John 2:18) and these antichrists all had a misconception about Jesus Christ. The Original "antichrist" was the Devil himself which we will look at in a separate study later if you want.

Within Bible prophecy there is one specific "Antichrist" who is described in great detail. This power would rise after the early church in Acts, and have dramatic impact on the history of the world.

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Within the Early church there were people who believed that Jesus would return in their day. The apostle Paul refuted this concept. He predicted that before Jesus returned, the church would experience a major spiritual fall. This "falling away" would reveal the "man of sin" This great Antichrist would exalt himself and be involved in breaking or disregarding the law of God.

It is interesting to note that the Antichrist would arise within the church. In a similar way, Jesus referred to his disciple Judas as the "son of perdition" (John 17:12) Judas was a leader "in the church" who wanted power more than he wanted Christ. Most people think the Antichrist will be a Secular political leader. But the bible is clear. The Antichrist will come from the religious world.

Most of the Prophecies concerning the Antichrist are found in the book of Daniel and Revelation. The focus
of this study will be in Daniel chapter 7.

In this chapter the Antichrist is described as you will see as a "little horn"

This chapter is vital because it outlines the empires of history like in Daniel 2, and Identifies the characteristics of the Antichrist. It also lays the foundation for future descriptions of the Antichrist in the book of Revelation. It may be good to read the whole chapter once before we focus on specific parts. notice the characteristics of the little horn.

Dan 7:2 Daniel spake and said, I saw in my vision by night, and, behold, the four winds of the heaven strove upon the great sea.
Dan 7:3 And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another.


While in vision Daniel saw four great animals come up out of the sea. Each of these "beasts" were different animals with unique characteristics.
Before we go on lets identify some prophecy symbols.

The winds.

Read Jeremiah 49:36,37
Winds represent strife, destruction and war. A wind swept sea is one where there is plenty of unrest and commotion. (This method of interpretation is important. we should always let the bible interoperate itself, we could try to guess what the symbols mean, but then we will interoperate according to our won wisdom. It is always best to get our answers from the bible itself.)

The Sea

Read Revelation 17:15
Here the sea represents an area of vast population, a place where there are many people from different nationalities. even today we refer to such a group as a "sea of faces". The beasts of Daniel's vision come up from populated areas on the globe.

A beast

Read Daniel 7:17,23
A beast is a symbol of a kingdom or political power. We still use animals today as representations of our nations. the United states has the "eagle" while here in Australia we have the "kangaroo".

In Daniel 7 we find four great nations or political powers all different form one another, rising up form populated areas of the world, where there has been a history of war and destruction.

By comparing Daniel 2 ( the great image) with this prophecy in Daniel 7, it is evident that Daniel is seeing the same succession of world empires. Both prophecies are aligned perfectly. however Daniel 7 gives greater detail and a number of additional interesting facts. Daniel 2 used metals to symbolize the nations while Daniel 7 uses "Beasts".

To illustrate this link, the fourth beast of Daniel 7 has "iron teeth" and is called the "fourth kingdom" (Daniel 7:7,23). The power represented by Iron in Daniel 2 is also called the "fourth Kingdom" (Daniel 2:40) the four kingdoms represented in both Daniel 2 and Daniel 7 are:
1. Babylon
2. Medo-Persia
3. Greece
4. Rome


Dan 7:4 The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it.

The king of beasts is a perfect symbol for the proud and powerful Babylon and an ideal parallel to the "head of gold" in Daniel 2. the prophet Jeremiah also described the King of Babylon as a being "like a lion" (Jeremiah 50:43,44)

Dan 7:5 And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh.

The coalition government of the Medes and Persians was "lopsided" because the Persians were a much stronger entity than the Medes. The bear had three ribs in its mouth which indicates it had eaten other beast. The three major powers conquered by the Medo-Persia were Babylon, Lydia and Egypt. Amazing how for us this is History, but this prophecy came before these things had taken place.

Dan 7:6 After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it.

A leopard with four wings represents a very fast and attacking empire. No nation ever contoured as fast as the Greeks under the leadership of Alexander. Notice that the leopard had four heads. After the death of Alexander, the Greek empire was divided between his four generals, the heads of his empire. These four Generals were: Ptolomy, Seleucus, Cassander and Lysimachus.

Dan 7:24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

I have skipped to the description of the fourth beast.

Just as the Iron legs of Rome divided into Iron and clay feet and ten toes of Daniel 2, now we find Daniel seeing ten horns arising out of the power of Rome. A "horn" is another symbol of a kingdom (Daniel 7:24, 8:22). The ten horns are the ten powers that rose from the divided Roman Empire. These nations are what we see today as Western Europe.
Now let's take a closer look at this little horn. (v8-28)

Dan 7:8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

The little horn and the judgment is the focus of the rest of this chapter. It is this power that provides the additional information to the Daniel 2 prophecy. Here we will see the character and power of the little horn, the great Antichrist of Prophecy.
Lets now look at 10 clues that the Bible gives us concerning this antichrist power.

clue 1 - It arises from Western Europ.

The Little Horn was seen in amongst the ten horns "coming up from them" - rising out of the head of the fourth beast. (Daniel 7:8) This information provides us with a geographical location of the rise of the little horn. Since the ten horns represent the division of the Roman empire into the nations of Western Europe, the little horn would arise from somewhere within that region.

clue 2 - It is a "little" kingdom

The is political power has the unique characteristics of being a "little horn" (Daniel 7:8). Here we have a small nation that will accomplish large things.

clue 3 - It arises after the ten tribes of Europe were established.

The little horn Antichrist not only comes out of the ten horns but also comes to power after the ten horns were established: "and another shall rise after them" (Daniel 7:24). The ten horns were finally established in 476AD, so we are looking for a power which gained its political clout after this date.

clue 4 - It overcomes three political powers as it rises to prominence.

The Bible says that three of the original ten horns were "plucked out by the roots" (Daniel 7:8). The little horn would overcome three of the tribes of Europe on its way to dominance. Three of the original kingdoms had been removed by 538AD. This kingdom would come to power sometime around 538AD.

clue 5 - Itis different from the other ten powers

The ten tribes of Western Europe were all secular political powers. The "little horn" was unique - there was something different about this power.

clue 6 - It would have a man at its head who speaks for it.

Although this power is a political entity, it would have "eyes like the eyes of a man" (Daniel 7:8). A man would be the focus of this power and would be the absolute spokesperson. (Daniel 7:8).

clue 7 - It would speak blasphemies against God.

This power delves into religion; speaking "pompous words against the most high" (Daniel 7:25).

clue 8 - It would persecute God's people

The "little horn" power would "persecuted the saints of the Most High" (Daniel 7:25). We are looking for a power who is responsible for the deaths of faithful Christians.

clue 9 - It would bin power for 1,260 years.

This power rules for a "time and times and half a times" (Daniel7:25). By comparing Daniel 7:25 with Revelation 12:6,14 it is clear that this time prophecy is another way of saying 1,260 days. A "time" is one year, "times" is two years, and "half a time" is six months or as the Amplified Bible translates it, "Three and one half years". Based on the 30-day calendar used by the Ancient scriptures, three and a half years is 1,260 days.
In Bible Prophecy, a day is symbolic code for a literal year (Ezekiel 4:6). Thus 1,260 days represents 1,260 literal years. Seven times in the books of Daniel and Revelation the same time period is given, using three different phrases, to represent the length of rule for this Antichrist. This means that its rule would end in 1798. Now you may be thinking but that means it is past. you are right it is, but as we will see in further studies later on, this power will rise once more just before Jesus comes.

clue 10 - This power would attempt to change times and law.

In one of the most intriguing clues of all, the "little horn" would "intend to change times and law" (Daniel 7:25). In our search for the identity of the Antichrist we need to discover which power would attempt to alter times in connection with the law.
Gotime that was very good but I don’t think you have it right.

But we do point in the same direction that there is an antichrist in the end, and for that I think the lord as shown you lots which I am extremely thankful for, for God has not revealed these things to the wise and prudent, and have revealed them unto babes.

First in Daniel2 there are five kingdoms not four if you look close

(1)32This image's head was of fine gold,

(2) His breast and his arms of silver,

(3) His belly and his thighs of brass,

(4)33His legs of iron,

(5) His feet part of iron and part of clay.

40And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise.

41And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay.

42And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken..

legs of iron the fourth kingdom shall be strong

Toes of the feet the kingdom is partly strong, and partly broken..

That makes 5 kingdoms in Daniel 2 not four .

And before the head of gold/the kingdom of Babylon was Assyria, and before that was Egypt in Bible history, and that makes 7 altogether

John lived in the day of the legs of iron, so when he said 5 have fallen one is and the other is not yet come

The ten toes I would think represent the ten kings that give their power and strength to the beast in the end Rv17 as The vision was what shall be in the latter days Daniel 2:28

The ten toes in the end of that image in daniel2 is when Jesus comes.

The ten toes I would think represent the ten kings in the end that give their power and strength to the beast, because it says in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, but the kings of these kingdoms in the image of daniel2 are all dead and buried.

Daniel2:44And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed:

I think we are looking for ten kings first in the end before Jesus comes, and another one little horn comes after, the 8th

The vision was what shall be in the latter days Daniel 2:28.

Let me know what you think gotime
 

gotime

Senior Member
Mar 3, 2011
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#4
Gotime that was very good but I don’t think you have it right.

But we do point in the same direction that there is an antichrist in the end, and for that I think the lord as shown you lots which I am extremely thankful for, for God has not revealed these things to the wise and prudent, and have revealed them unto babes.

First in Daniel2 there are five kingdoms not four if you look close

(1)32This image's head was of fine gold,

(2) His breast and his arms of silver,

(3) His belly and his thighs of brass,

(4)33His legs of iron,

(5) His feet part of iron and part of clay.

40And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise.

41And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay.

42And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken..

legs of iron the fourth kingdom shall be strong

Toes of the feet the kingdom is partly strong, and partly broken..

That makes 5 kingdoms in Daniel 2 not four .

And before the head of gold/the kingdom of Babylon was Assyria, and before that was Egypt in Bible history, and that makes 7 altogether

John lived in the day of the legs of iron, so when he said 5 have fallen one is and the other is not yet come

The ten toes I would think represent the ten kings that give their power and strength to the beast in the end Rv17 as The vision was what shall be in the latter days Daniel 2:28

The ten toes in the end of that image in daniel2 is when Jesus comes.

The ten toes I would think represent the ten kings in the end that give their power and strength to the beast, because it says in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, but the kings of these kingdoms in the image of daniel2 are all dead and buried.

Daniel2:44And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed:

I think we are looking for ten kings first in the end before Jesus comes, and another one little horn comes after, the 8th

The vision was what shall be in the latter days Daniel 2:28.

Let me know what you think gotime
I agree there are 5 that was a mistake on my part. thanx, just forgot to put that in.

I believe the feet with 10 toes matches the 10 horns in Daniel 7.

Remember the Iron which represents Pagan Rome is still mixed into the feet (Iron and Clay) and thus the fourth beast in Daniel 4 is where the 10 horns rise from. again Rome.

I did a post on Daniel 2 where i speak of all five, this was a mistake of omission here. glad you saw that.

Dan 2/kingdom/Dan 7

Head of Gold/Babylon/Lion.

Chest arms silver/Medo-Persia/Bear

thighs of Brass/Greece/four headed leopard

Legs of Iron/Rome/Dreadful beast

Feet of Iron and clay/Rome split/10 horns.

hope this makes my view clearer. The Feet still had Iron in them, this was the split of Rome into 10 segments, the 10 horns which come up out of the fourth beast/Rome, are the same division but with the added detail of the little horn which rises up after three fall.


you said "And before the head of gold/the kingdom of Babylon was Assyria, and before that was Egypt in Bible history, and that makes 7 altogether

John lived in the day of the legs of iron, so when he said 5 have fallen one is and the other is not yet come
"
I agree with you on this, just haven't got there yet.

This is the beauty of Prophecy, the 10 horns in Revelation 17 I do not believe are the same 10 horns in Daniel 7. however they are connected, I will get to that later in another study.

The 10 horns of Daniel 7 have happened already but they are a symbol or an example of what will happen again in the end on a world wide scale Rev 17.

you said "The ten toes I would think represent the ten kings in the end that give their power and strength to the beast, because it says in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, but the kings"

And again I agree, but as I said there is a past example to the future fulfillment. For example When the Disciples asked Jesus:

Mat 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

They asked two questions.

1. when shall these things be? referring to the destruction of the Temple.
2. what is the sign of thy coming? referring to the end of the world.

Jesus gave one answer but in it he answered both questions. thus be learning what happened leading up to the destruction of Jerusalem we also learn what will happen leading up to the coming of Jesus. Jerusalem is an example of the world wide fulfillment to come before Christ comes.

The 10 toes represent both the fulfillment that took place after Rome split but also tell us what will happen just before Jesus comes. We can learn from the fulfillment in the past what will happen in the future. Revelation 17 is the Future fulfillment.

Daniel was written before Revelation, and thus They looked for the fulfillment in line with the Prophecy given. But Revelation opens Daniel up and shows a second global fulfillment just before Jesus comes. hope that helps, I will open this up more as we proceed through the Prophecies.
 
P

peterT

Guest
#5
I agree there are 5 that was a mistake on my part. thanx, just forgot to put that in.

I believe the feet with 10 toes matches the 10 horns in Daniel 7.

Remember the Iron which represents Pagan Rome is still mixed into the feet (Iron and Clay) and thus the fourth beast in Daniel 4 is where the 10 horns rise from. again Rome.

I did a post on Daniel 2 where i speak of all five, this was a mistake of omission here. glad you saw that.

Dan 2/kingdom/Dan 7

Head of Gold/Babylon/Lion.

Chest arms silver/Medo-Persia/Bear

thighs of Brass/Greece/four headed leopard

Legs of Iron/Rome/Dreadful beast

Feet of Iron and clay/Rome split/10 horns.

hope this makes my view clearer. The Feet still had Iron in them, this was the split of Rome into 10 segments, the 10 horns which come up out of the fourth beast/Rome, are the same division but with the added detail of the little horn which rises up after three fall.


you said "And before the head of gold/the kingdom of Babylon was Assyria, and before that was Egypt in Bible history, and that makes 7 altogether

John lived in the day of the legs of iron, so when he said 5 have fallen one is and the other is not yet come
"
I agree with you on this, just haven't got there yet.

This is the beauty of Prophecy, the 10 horns in Revelation 17 I do not believe are the same 10 horns in Daniel 7. however they are connected, I will get to that later in another study.

The 10 horns of Daniel 7 have happened already but they are a symbol or an example of what will happen again in the end on a world wide scale Rev 17.

you said "The ten toes I would think represent the ten kings in the end that give their power and strength to the beast, because it says in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, but the kings"

And again I agree, but as I said there is a past example to the future fulfillment. For example When the Disciples asked Jesus:

Mat 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

They asked two questions.

1. when shall these things be? referring to the destruction of the Temple.
2. what is the sign of thy coming? referring to the end of the world.

Jesus gave one answer but in it he answered both questions. thus be learning what happened leading up to the destruction of Jerusalem we also learn what will happen leading up to the coming of Jesus. Jerusalem is an example of the world wide fulfillment to come before Christ comes.

The 10 toes represent both the fulfillment that took place after Rome split but also tell us what will happen just before Jesus comes. We can learn from the fulfillment in the past what will happen in the future. Revelation 17 is the Future fulfillment.

Daniel was written before Revelation, and thus They looked for the fulfillment in line with the Prophecy given. But Revelation opens Daniel up and shows a second global fulfillment just before Jesus comes. hope that helps, I will open this up more as we proceed through the Prophecies.
Thanks for your input gotime I love to read your posts
 

gotime

Senior Member
Mar 3, 2011
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#6
I appreciate your input mate. I can tell by what you wrote that you have done some study into this yourself. praise God. Your input is valued. blessings mate.
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#7
I thought this was gona be a battle of the ten mile long posts :)
 
L

Laodicea

Guest
#8
Daniel 7:25 KJV
(25) And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.
2 Thessalonians 2:3 KJV
(3) Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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#9
Rev 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

The Papacy was wounded in 1798. but John saw that it would be healed. even today we are seeing this. Protestants are bowing to the Papacy again. we will see in further studies how this power will rise again and persecute again as it has done in the past.
tsk.
its not the just 'the papacy'. she's a daughter.

Mount Moriah received a deadly wound in 70AD.
but.....oh look....it's being healed! and all the world wonders...

i s'pose 'fire' might even 'come down from heaven'. on renewed animal sacrifices.
deceiving those who dwell upon the earth. hmmm....

The Temple Mount Faithful: Working to Build the Third Temple in Jerusalem << click

there's even a 'false prophet' cheering it on: CUFI
 

gotime

Senior Member
Mar 3, 2011
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#10
I would say the Papacy is the Mother but Ill address that later as the prophecies of Daniel continue into revelation.

Revelation does mention Fire coming from heaven but not from God. Israel does serve as an example of what will come in the end. but whether they rebuild the temple or not. I believe that is just a distraction. Israel does not fit all the points given of this power.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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#11
I can see how the evil Rebellion are where they appear not to be.

The muslim brotherhood seem to be the muscle that will be defeated by those that appear good but are not.

I also think there will be many twists and turns to take place.

Even so we make our Foundation Yahvah God and Yahshua the Messiah who tell us what we need to know through the Bible let us adhere to what is written for us.

All this common good and peace and safety they propose is what we are warned about in the Bible.

all this talk of the collapse of currency....

i say to you if we took all the money in the world and burnt it nothing but a large fire and a lot of smoke.

someone said to me once but we need money to buy food...

Is it not Yahvah God who sends the sun and rain to grow the food he gave us?

This money system was to gain control over things that we had freely.

Anyhow all things have come to pass to show us the Truth.

Let us keep our self full with oil.

Peace and Blessings in the name of Yahvah God and Yahshua the Messiah.
 

gotime

Senior Member
Mar 3, 2011
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#12
Did not God send food to Elijah?

Did he not save Daniel from the wrath of those who wanted him dead?

In fact when I get the time we will see that these stories of Elijah and Daniel and his friends are there to serve as examples and will come in to play again according to Revelation. but I am getting ahead of myself lol. one step at a time.

God be praised.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
8,086
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#13
Did not God send food to Elijah?

Did he not save Daniel from the wrath of those who wanted him dead?

In fact when I get the time we will see that these stories of Elijah and Daniel and his friends are there to serve as examples and will come in to play again according to Revelation. but I am getting ahead of myself lol. one step at a time.

God be praised.

Yes, let us rely not on self for we can do nothing.

You know that nothing can come against us if it is His Will for us to remain....

I mean that with all my heart and soul.

The only time the Israelite people were beat in battle was in disobedience and lack of Faith.

If he say move that mountain then do not consider your strength, know that if he said do it then you will do it through his Strength.
 

gotime

Senior Member
Mar 3, 2011
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#14
Amen, I have come to that very conclusion.

I take everything that happens to me good or bad as if it were from My Father himself.

because I know that nothing can touch me except that which my Heavenly Father allows for my good or the good of others.

Rom 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

Thus good or bad I rest in Him.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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#15
I would say the Papacy is the Mother but Ill address that later as the prophecies of Daniel continue into revelation.
you won't be able to prove it cuz the vatican isn't the mother.

Revelation does mention Fire coming from heaven but not from God. Israel does serve as an example of what will come in the end. but whether they rebuild the temple or not. I believe that is just a distraction. Israel does not fit all the points given of this power.
ya, israel does fit every single bit.
and the last 2 popes have been in on it.
rome's actually had an internal battle on this since her beginning.
she lost.

point being - stop helping either of them.
they're all in it together at the top at this point.
 
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loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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#16
Luke 23

12And the same day Pilate and Herod were made friends together: for before they were at enmity between themselves.
this little mention i believe very significant.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#17
I agree for the most part. Except for the part of the papacy being the man of sin. I disagree with this.

I believe the papacy is pagan Rome, In OT times, Pagan nations and cities were called Babylon By God. thus I believe the roman church and her children will be slaughtered by the man of sin, before he commits the abomination. As she will be a threat to him. Pagan rome may be in denial that she is the false church, But she still believes enough about God and Christ, she would never worship, or force worship of anyone who claims to be god or the messiah. I just can't see this happening, her followers would not even allow this. That is why she must be destroyed, As she would fight against the beast, and her power is great worldwide.

Daniel saw 4 beasts, 4 gentile nations which will be kingdoms. The 4th (being Rome) will be strong, Be split apart. then at the end, be reformed greater than it ever was. it will not just have power over Europe and the middle east, but scripture says it will have power over the whole earth. It will be at the end of this time that the "times of the Gentile" will be complete. when Christ returns.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
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#18
is my friend Santo still here?

Santo: if you read this, could you provide any insight on what the catholic laity (or authorities) believe concerning JPII and Benedict?
it seems Vatican II and Nostra Aetate have dealt some serious blows.

am i off base?
zone
 
W

webchatter

Guest
#19
a greek Pope?
 
P

peterT

Guest
#20
The Protestant Reformation was one of the greatest events in world history. By the mid 1500's this movement had swept throughout Germany, and was advancing through Switzerland, England, France, Austria and many other parts of Europe.

The reformation was based on the idea of "Sola Scriptura" The Bible and the Bible only. Through a study of the scriptures, the Reformers discovered the refreshing beauty of salvation through faith instead of works.

Prophecy also became a real focus of study. As they investigated the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation, the subject of the antichrist caught their attention. In their view the leadership of their own church fulfilled all the criteria for being the antichrist. This amazed the Reformers because they loved their church so much.

The Reform was started to try and do just that, Reform their own church. I could go on about the history.

Listen to the Wstminster Confession.

"There is no other head of the church but the Lord Jesus Christ: nor can the pope of Rome in any snese be head thereof; but is that Antichrist, that man of sin and son of perdition, that exalts himself in the church against Christ and all that is called God." (chapter 25, art.6).
So without further delay let us examine history in light of the clues of Daniel 7 and see if the reformers were right.

Clue 1 - Arises From Western Europe.

The Papacy arose from Western Europe. The home of "seat" of the Papacy is Rome, Italy - right in the heart of Western Europe.

Clue 2 - It is a "little" kingdom

The Vatican is a "little" nation. The Vatican is a very small independent kingdom within Europe. The entire kingdom is located on just over 40 hectares (108 acres) of land.

Clue 3 - It arises after the 10 tribes of Europe were established.

The Papacy rose to political power in 538 AD. The 10 kingdoms were established by 476AD. The Papacy received its major political power once it overthrew the Arian Ostrogoths in 538AD.

Clue 4 - It overcomes three political powers as it rises to prominence

The Papacy "uprooted" three tribes - the Vandals, Heruli and the Ostrogoths. Over time most of the 10 kingdoms of Europe adopted Roman Christianity. However, three of these kingdoms opposed Rome and refused to cooperate. These three powers were defeated by Catholic emperors - Heruli (493AD), the Vandals (534AD) and the Ostrogoths (538AD). All three kingdoms were "plucked" out by the roots"- They have disappeared from Europe. The Papacy came into power as promised by the Emperor Justinian.

Clue 5 - It is different from the other 10 powers.

The Papacy is a religious power. The Papacy is different from all the other powers in terms of being a religious power. A church controlling politics was certainly "different" from the first ones. (Daniel 7:24). They were secular governments.

Clue 6 - It would have a man at its head who speaks for it.

The Pope is the absolute head of the church. The Papacy has one man at the head. The Papacy is not a democratic government; the Pope is the ultimate authority who speaks for it.

Clue 7 - It would speak blasphemies against God.

The Pope claims to be "God on earth". According to the Bible, Blasphemy is either claiming to forgive sins (Luke 5:21) or claiming to be God (John 10:33). The Papacy claims both. In 1870 the Vatican Council declared that the Pope was infallible whenever speaking from his position of authority. Notice these interesting quotes:
"We (the popes) hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty" (The Great Encyclical Letters of Leo, XIII, p304).

"The Pope is not only the representative of Jesus Christ, but he is Jesus Christ, Himself, hidden under the veil of flesh" (Catholic National, July 1895).

"Thus the priest may, in certain manner be called the creator of the Creator, since by saying these words of consecration, he creats as it were, Jesus in the sacrament" (Duties & Dignities of the Priest, St Alphonsus De Ligouri, p27).

Clue 8 - It would persecute God's people.

The Papacy has persecuted and killed millions of People. During the Dark Ages, the church of Rome killed more people than what Hitler did during WWII. Conservative estimates place the killings at 50 million people with some experts placing the figure closer to 150 million deaths. Millions of people were burnt at the stake for "heresy" when they were simply following the truths of the Scripture instead of the dictates and traditions of the church.

clue 9 - It would be a power for 1,260 years

The Papacy ruled for 1,260 years. The Papacy gained ultimate power in 538AD when the final Opposition, the Ostrogoths were defeated. The church then ruled for 1, 260 years until Pope Pius VI was taken captive by Napoleon's general, Berthier. The Pope was stripped of his political powers. Just as the Prophecy predicted, the antichrist recieved a "deadly wound" in 1798, ending the power of the Papacy.

Clue 10 - This Power would attempt to change times and law.

The Papacy attempted to change god's law, the Ten Commandments. The Catholic catechisms has shortened the Sabbath Commandment, removed the second Commandment, and split the 10th into two Commandments.

Along with this, the church claims to have changed the Sabbath commandment to Sunday. (the Sabbath is the only Commandment associated with "times").

The Roman Papacy fits all the clues perfectly, no other power in history or the future could possible fit all the clues that the Prophecy of Daniel 7 has provided.

The Roman church was deeply concerned about the Reformation. They were fighting the Muslims from without and the Protestants from within. One of the key points of discussion was related to the authority of the bible over church practice and tradition.

The Archbishop of Reggio gave a speech at Trent claiming that Protestants also believe in the authority of the church tradition. He pointed to the fact that the Protestants were keeping Sunday, a day made by authority and tradition.

"The Sabbath, the most glorious day in the law, has been changed into the Lord's day... These and other similar matters have not ceased by virtue of Christ's teaching (For He says He has come to fulfil the law, not to destroy it), but they have been changed by the authority of the church"
Gaspare [Ricciulli] de Fosso (Archbishop of Reggio), Address in the 17th Session of the Council of Trent, Jan, 18, 1562.

This Gave the church confidence against the Protestants, They knew they had a weak link in their theology. The next thing the church did was turn against Prophecy, this was their weakness, many were being turned away because of these Prophecies. So what did they do?

The Jesuit order suggested two alternative views on prophecy. A Spaniard by the name of Alcazar claimed all the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation relate to the Jews and Pagan Rome. By applying all the Prophecies to the past, this approach, called "preterism", resulted in the middle ages church escaping all references in prophecy.

The other by a man named Fancisco Ribera. published a 500-page commentary on the Bible applying the Early parts of Revelation to Pagan Rome, and the latter to a period way in the future. This "futurist" approach was supported by another man named Robert Bellarmine who attacked the Protestant year day principle and said that the antichrist was a Jew who would rule 3 1/2 literal years at the end of time. thus no one would look at the Papacy but apply the prophecy way down in the future.

Many Christians today believe one of these two and many of the popular beliefs held by protestants today are derivatives of these two views.

Later we will look at more prophecy that says that this same antichrist power will rise one more time before Jesus comes. but many are blind to it because they have bought the lie that the Papacy itself put out there to take the heat of themselves.

Rev 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

The Papacy was wounded in 1798. but John saw that it would be healed. even today we are seeing this. Protestants are bowing to the Papacy again. we will see in further studies how this power will rise again and persecute again as it has done in the past.
Gotime

Personally I can’t see it being a pope, just looking through my glass darkly I can’t see that.

Doesn’t seem to have enough power, or the ability to deceive to whole world.

Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

But as for the religious aspects of it, I can see that, for he can comes as an angel of light and his ministers, transformed as the ministers of righteousness .

14And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
15Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

I have been of the understanding that he comes from an extension of the Roman Empire the legs of iron. But all of the western worlds as come from Europeans.

And that makes me think he could rise from any western country or European country.

The ability to deceive to whole world, his kingdom I would think is democracy and capitalism which is sweeping the whole world, even Christians love it. And I would expect him to rise from that.

But I only see through a glass darkly