DEAD WORKS!

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
GraceAndTruth

GraceAndTruth

Well-known member
#41
Sep 28, 2015
2,031
637
113
#41
EleventhHour said:
It is not temporal good works that are in view in that verse.
Click to expand...
Your "rebuttal" verse to my post (Matt 20:14-15) are out of the context of the question at hand and my response to it. Jesus is referring to rewards for our "works" whatever they may be and that each person receives the same reward no matter how many "good works" of the flesh he thinks he has done.

For the desire to do what is good is with me, but there is no ability to do it. ... For I know that in me, that is, in my flesh, dwells no good thing. For the desire to do good is present within me; but how to work out that which is good, I do not find. ... Thanks be to God, through Jesus Christ our Lord! Romans 7:18 and
For it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. Phil 2:13

Remember all those 'crowns' we receive will be cast at HIS feet, HE ALONE is worthy.
And just to make sure you understand man's inablity and total worthlessness outside from Christ........there are no crowns for 'good works' As scripture says, mans' works are as filthy rags (Is 64:6)
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#42
#42
GraceAndTruth said:
Your "rebuttal" verse to my post (Matt 20:14-15) are out of the context of the question at hand and my response to it. Jesus is referring to rewards for our "works" whatever they may be and that each person receives the same reward no matter how many "good works" of the flesh he thinks he has done.

For the desire to do what is good is with me, but there is no ability to do it. ... For I know that in me, that is, in my flesh, dwells no good thing. For the desire to do good is present within me; but how to work out that which is good, I do not find. ... Thanks be to God, through Jesus Christ our Lord! Romans 7:18 and
For it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. Phil 2:13

Remember all those 'crowns' we receive will be cast at HIS feet, HE ALONE is worthy.
And just to make sure you understand man's inablity and total worthlessness outside from Christ........there are no crowns for 'good works' As scripture says, mans' works are as filthy rags (Is 64:6)
Click to expand...
Actually in context

“He also raised us up with Him and seated us with Him in the heavens in Christ Jesus.” (Ephesians 2:6)
Paul is not speaking about temporal works
Paul is not speaking about a quota of good works that need to be fulfilled.

This is about the message of the Gospel .. it is DONE
 
GraceAndTruth

GraceAndTruth

Well-known member
#43
Sep 28, 2015
2,031
637
113
#43
Jesus made a point to someone who thought they had more reward coming for their works.........Jesus says HE IS IN CHARGE of who gets what, not the worker. He also says in another place that we should not require payment for doing what we should be doing in the first place. And these verses do apply to our temporal works.

My kids did not get an allowance because they made their beds in the morning but because they were my kids.

Anyway it seems you are all over the place with this particular forum. Could be my misinterpretation of your intent.
 
Blain

Blain

The Word Weaver
#44
Aug 28, 2012
19,215
2,551
113
#44
GraceAndTruth said:
Jesus made a point to someone who thought they had more reward coming for their works.........Jesus says HE IS IN CHARGE of who gets what, not the worker. He also says in another place that we should not require payment for doing what we should be doing in the first place. And these verses do apply to our temporal works.

My kids did not get an allowance because they made their beds in the morning but because they were my kids.

Anyway it seems you are all over the place with this particular forum. Could be my misinterpretation of your intent.
Click to expand...
I agree completely and I think if one is truly in a relationship you don't do it because of what you can receive you do it because of the love inside it is as if by instinct
 
Lafftur

Lafftur

Senior Member
#45
Apr 18, 2017
6,739
3,556
113
#45
MessageOfTheCross said:
Notice out of the Seven Churches only One Church had entered into that narrow way. Matthew 7:14

Paul said that ALL the Churches in Asia have forsaken him.

This is why only a Remnant will be saved. See Romans 11

Only one tribe of the twelve tribes of Israel came out from among the Golden Calf worshippers in Exodus 32. The Way of the Cross might feel lonely, but we are never alone!

Out of 603,550 men who were readied for war that came out of Egypt under the power of God (Numbers 1:44-46), only two took their inheritance; Joshua (a type of Christ) and Caleb (a type of the body of Christ) (Matthew 7:14).

There is only one message that changes the body of Christ into the image of Christ, and that is Jesus Christ and Him Crucified.
Click to expand...
True....Jesus Christ and Him crucified is the message of the cross but, what is the message of the empty tomb? :unsure:
 
MessageOfTheCross

MessageOfTheCross

Senior Member
#46
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#46
Blain said:
Because it is in his timing not ours spalm 103:2 is speaking of praising him and always remembering and cherishing his promises it never said that we would recieve all of them whenever we please.
What is good is learning patience and learning to trust him if we can treat him like a wishmaker? a tree that produces fruit is a perfect example to look at.
Click to expand...
Without "GRACE" we are doomed. We need "GRACE" every day! No need to wait on"GRACE" if the Believers Faith is placed and maintained exclusively in Christ and the Cross daily.
 
Blain

Blain

The Word Weaver
#47
Aug 28, 2012
19,215
2,551
113
#47
MessageOfTheCross said:
Without "GRACE" we are doomed. We need "GRACE" every day! No need to wait on"GRACE" if the Believers Faith is placed and maintained exclusively in Christ and the Cross.
Click to expand...
Did I ever once say that we don't need grace? trust me as one who is always worried about not being good enough I have no choice but to rely entirely on his grace but you asked I answered you keep asking questions and I answer then you post scripture out of context and I rebuke them then you keep changing the subject you asked about works I gave my thoughts you asked about faith I gave my reply you asked about love I gave my answer but I never once said we don't need grace or need to wait on it did it in fact the second we are saved we have his grace there is no waiting

Let me ask you this your username is message of the cross can you tell me what that message is?
 
4

49

Guest
#49
#49
Dino246 said:
Yes, the first is a better definition in this case. MoTC constantly quotes Jimmy Swaggart's material, some of which is clearly contradictory to Scripture. It's usually not so bad that I would call it "false" but it is definitely emphasizing the wrong things and is based around Swaggart's personal opinions about Scripture, not Scripture itself.
Click to expand...
Thank you. Jimmy Swaggart...didn't he sing a song 'There is a River'? Sounds familiar anyway...
 
Blain

Blain

The Word Weaver
#50
Aug 28, 2012
19,215
2,551
113
#50
Lafftur said:
True....Jesus Christ and Him crucified is the message of the cross but, what is the message of the empty tomb? :unsure:
Click to expand...
Actually Jesus Jesus being crucified on the cross is what he did but what was the message of those actions?
For me it was a message of the depth of the love God has, to show just how far he was willing to go to rescue us. It was a message of his grace and how much we mean to him the division of man and God no longer seperated.

I also like to look at the cross like this the four points being the left jews the right gentiles the bottom earth and the top heaven and Jesus pinned connecting them all.
 
G

garee

Banned
#51
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#51
It is impossible to separate faith, the will, from the action, the work (let there be and it was good.)

Dead works. as dead faith are works mankind offer "towards" Him and not Him working in us to both will and empower us to do His good pleasure .

The example shown are those who have tasted the good things to come and in effect saying . . I will not trust a God not seen but will work to gain salvation as a sign to myself.. My own will and power.

Hebrews 6:1 King James Version (KJV) Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

Faith is a work.

Those who acknowledge it is Christ working in them are persuaded by that faith that does work of His faith, a labor of His love. in us, towards us. . Called the better things that accompany salvation . He promise us he will not forget the good works that he has empowered us to do . He makes our burden lighter daily. . . .as we rest in His love.


Hebrews 6:9-10 King James Version (KJV) But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak. For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.
 
Lafftur

Lafftur

Senior Member
#52
Apr 18, 2017
6,739
3,556
113
#52
MessageOfTheCross said:
Without "GRACE" we are doomed. We need "GRACE" every day! No need to wait on"GRACE" if the Believers Faith is placed and maintained exclusively in Christ and the Cross daily.
Click to expand...
We have GRACE, we just need to grow up now! :love:(y)

Renew our minds with God's Word and God's Holy Spirit so we can know the perfect Will of God which helps us to learn to walk by the Spirit and not fulfill the lusts of the flesh. :love:(y)
 
MessageOfTheCross

MessageOfTheCross

Senior Member
#53
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#53
Lafftur said:
We have GRACE, we just need to grow up now! :love:(y)

Renew our minds with God's Word and God's Holy Spirit so we can know the perfect Will of God which helps us to learn to walk by the Spirit and not fulfill the lusts of the flesh. :love:(y)
Click to expand...
The truth is most believe as you do that grace is working in their life. Jesus has a different take on what you believe. Matthew 7:14
 
Lafftur

Lafftur

Senior Member
#54
Apr 18, 2017
6,739
3,556
113
#54
MessageOfTheCross said:
The truth is most believe as you do that grace is working in their life. Jesus has a different take on what you believe. Matthew 7:14
Click to expand...
You are so loved and sooooo accepted in the Beloved....just let Him love you.....He bids you to come into the Holy of Holies.....meet Him where His Blood flows from the Mercy Seat.....He bids you, “Come!”
 
O

Ogom

Active member
#57
Aug 22, 2020
385
100
43
ogom.co
#57
MessageOfTheCross said:
Why not receive all the LORD’s benefits of this resurrection life now? Psalms 103:2
Click to expand...
Blain said:
Because it is in his timing not ours spalm 103:2 is speaking of praising him and always remembering and cherishing his promises it never said that we would recieve all of them whenever we please.
What is good is learning patience and learning to trust him if we can treat him like a wishmaker? a tree that produces fruit is a perfect example to look at.
Click to expand...
seek and you will find, knock and it will be opened to you.

you have not because you ask not or because you ask amiss.
 
MessageOfTheCross

MessageOfTheCross

Senior Member
#58
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#58
Ogom said:
seek and you will find, knock and it will be opened to you.

you have not because you ask not or because you ask amiss.
Click to expand...
Notice the word "amiss." If the Believers heart is not trusting and placing and maintaining their Faith in Christ and the Cross (the Blood of Jesus) we ask "amiss." Why? Because we have removed ourselves from Christ (Gal. 1:6, Rev.3:1). This is called "The Good Fight Of Faith." This is what Christ meant when He said "Take Up Your Cross Daily."
 
You must log in or register to reply here.