Did Jesus Die on The Cross for The Just/Elect/Saved Whose Names Are Written in The Book of Life OR

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,061
6,873
113
62
So, do you believe that if Adam had not sinned, God would never have made available to Him what he has made available to repentant sinners?
No.
Your question was a double negative, but I believe you will understand the answer.
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
3,505
468
83
That Adam's sinless estate was preferable to the believer's current estate?
That God walked in a physical form with Adam.

studier said:
Yes & Yes: NKJ Genesis 3:8 And they heard the sound of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of the garden.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,061
6,873
113
62
That God walked in a physical form with Adam.

studier said:
Yes & Yes: NKJ Genesis 3:8 And they heard the sound of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of the garden.
This is preferable to Christ living in you?
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
3,505
468
83
Nothing wrong with what you have stated, but God has done far more than what you have stated. He has made it possible for us to walk moment by moment with Him and have Christ live in and through us. This is absolute dependence. Some would call it absolute surrender.
What have you added to what I said? We agree on what you just posted. Namely, "He has made it possible for us to walk moment by moment with Him and have Christ live in and through us. This is absolute dependence. Some would call it absolute surrender.."
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
3,505
468
83
This is preferable to Christ living in you?
You are misrepresenting studier's argument.

You asked
Cameron143 said:
Just an aside, as you mentioned face-to-face relationship:
Do you believe God was manifest physically in the garden?
Do you believe what Adam and Eve experienced in the garden pre-fall is superior to the indwelling believers experience now?

This was "the first part". The first part was not about the superiority of the experience of Adam to ours. Did you agree, in passing over the first part and focusing only on the second, that God was appearing in physical form to Adam?
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,061
6,873
113
62
You are misrepresenting studier's argument.

You asked
Cameron143 said:
Just an aside, as you mentioned face-to-face relationship:
Do you believe God was manifest physically in the garden?
Do you believe what Adam and Eve experienced in the garden pre-fall is superior to the indwelling believers experience now?

This was "the first part". The first part was not about the superiority of the experience of Adam to ours. Did you agree, in passing over the first part and focusing only on the second, that God was appearing in physical form to Adam?
I don't believe the Bible is conclusive on this. I don't discount the notion, but I don't believe it is necessarily true either.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
61,107
30,239
113
The sad thing to me is to hear so many say we can't be what God commands us to be
and Jesus Christ died to give us the ability to become. We have way too much admixture
of human viewpoint thinking imposing on what His Word says.
I am curious to know what you mean here. I wonder if you believe the natural man has an
inherent ability, without any help from God, to throw over his hostile mindset toward Him.
Since that is an admixture of human viewpoint thinking imposing on what His Word says.



Ephesians 2:8-9
:)
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,061
6,873
113
62
Would you say, since we have the incorruptible eternal Living Word
of God indwelling us, that we have eaten of the Tree of Life?
We certainly have a foretaste of glory divine.
 

MerSee

Active member
Jan 13, 2024
796
119
43
We are able to fail, but nothing will take us out of either the Father or Son's hand.
Hebrews 10:26-30
26 For if we sin wilfully after having the knowledge of the truth, there is now left no sacrifice for sins. 27 But a certain dreadful expectation of judgment, and the rage of a fire which shall consume the adversaries. 28 A man making void the law of Moses, dieth without any mercy under two or three witnesses: 29 How much more, do you think he deserveth worse punishments, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath esteemed the blood of the testament unclean, by which he was sanctified, and hath offered an affront to the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him that hath said: Vengeance belongeth to me, and I will repay. And again: The Lord shall judge his people.