Does anyone know of....

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Cameron143

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Mar 1, 2022
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That was Darth Vader in Episode IV "A New Hope" at the 1hour and 34 minute point.

On the "Touche" --- Morticia, you spoke French!!!
You should read it a little more carefully.
 

Rufus

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2024
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Nehemiah6 is simply quoting the scripture, nothing more.

Here is the verse:

2 Kings 22:2 New International Version
2 He did what was right in the eyes of the Lord and followed completely the ways of his father David, not turning aside to the right or to the left.

2 Kings 22:2 Common English Bible
2 He did what was right in the Lord’s eyes, and walked in the ways of his ancestor David—not deviating from it even a bit to the right or left.

It is the scriptures that "classify" King Josiah as prefect in what God had commanded him to obey.

Now present the quote where Nehemiah6 states that King Josiah was sinless?
You're delusional. Neither translations says what you claim. Are you mistaking king David for God in the NIV translation that says "....completely followed the ways of his father David..."? Yet, David was not without sin. In fact, David committed grievous sins against God, which means that "righteous" king David did not "obey God's law perfectly", which harmonizes nicely with Eccl 7:20; 1Ki 8:46. Anyone with a half a brain, who knew anything about king David, would understand that since Josiah was being compared to imperfect David, that his obedience to God's commands could not logically have been "perfect".

Nehemiah's statement implied without sin! If Josiah wasn't sinless when he "obeyed the Law perfectly" (Nehemiah's words), then neither was Jesus who also "obeyed the Law perfectly" -- but yet scripture also speaks of Jesus as being WITHOUT SIN, i.e. "sinless" (Heb 4:15). So, since this was the case with Jesus, how could it not be the same for the perfect law-keeper Josiah? Explain that to me, Einstein! Was Jesus' perfect obedience to his Father's commandments more perfect than Josiah's? :rolleyes: Explain to me how any superlative can be improved upon or diminished, since by definition "superlative" means "supreme", "excellent" and denotes "an extreme or unsurpassed level or extent"?
 

PaulThomson

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Oct 29, 2023
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Well then...going by your own logic, if it doesn't matter to you how you interpret Jer 10:23 (or any verse for that matter), then why should it matter to me how I interpret Ps 119:105? If Jer 10:23 is an inconvenient truth that you don't want to deal with in terms of your theology, then why should I be concerned about Ps 119:105? What's good for the goose shouldn't also be good for the gander?

Secondly, what I bolded in red is your fallacious, finite reasoning, which you make your final authority for determining your theology, when instead you should let the Word of God be your final authority.

Thirdly, the fact that the verse is "general in nature" greatly weakens your argument, since such sweeping, broad-brushed verses are teaching us biblical principles. And "principles", by definition, are comprehensive fundamental laws, doctrines or assumptions. Moreover, this principle is taught in many places in scripture besides Jer 10:23.

Lastly, I recently proved on another thread that this theological principle is true from Natural Revelation (reality as we all know it in the external world). Man is not a sovereign, autonomous being, as so many pride themselves as being There are also things in this natural world to which man is subservient.
Leaving Egypt is not how one becomes a child of God.
 

Rufus

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Feb 17, 2024
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Leaving Egypt is not how one becomes a child of God.
Oh but it is! The alternative is to remain helplessly in bondage to sin and the devil and the kingdom of darkness. You don't have first clue what the Exodus is teaching. If you can't figure out the easier-to-understand physical types, how in the world are going to understand the spiritual antitype substances?
 

PaulThomson

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Oct 29, 2023
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Oh but it is! The alternative is to remain helplessly in bondage to sin and the devil and the kingdom of darkness. You don't have first clue what the Exodus is teaching. If you can't figure out the easier-to-understand physical types, how in the world are going to understand the spiritual antitype substances?
Some people leave Egypt to go to Mecca, or Shrinigar or Tibet. Leaving one culture does not mean you must be going to God's culture.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
59,779
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Please, Magenta, define "the natural man" biblically.

1 Corinthians 2:12 + 14
Do you and your faithful peanut gallery have none of your usual attempts
to subvert the truth of Scripture in answer to this request of yours?
 

Rufus

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2024
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Some people leave Egypt to go to Mecca, or Shrinigar or Tibet. Leaving one culture does not mean you must be going to God's culture.
As I said earlier, you don't have a clue on what typology of the Exodus, a major theme in the bible, is teaching. It's no wonder at all that you don't understand God's great salvation. As Jesus basically said to Nicodemus (to paraphrase), "If you don't understand or believe earthly things, then how will you believe heavenly things?"
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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Ah! I also meant to ask @Cameron143 where in Isaiah you are currently studying?

Three of my recent panels have been from Isaiah...
 

Lamar

Active member
May 21, 2023
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You're delusional. Neither translations says what you claim. Are you mistaking king David for God in the NIV translation that says "....completely followed the ways of his father David..."? Yet, David was not without sin. In fact, David committed grievous sins against God, which means that "righteous" king David did not "obey God's law perfectly", which harmonizes nicely with Eccl 7:20; 1Ki 8:46. Anyone with a half a brain, who knew anything about king David, would understand that since Josiah was being compared to imperfect David, that his obedience to God's commands could not logically have been "perfect".

Nehemiah's statement implied without sin! If Josiah wasn't sinless when he "obeyed the Law perfectly" (Nehemiah's words), then neither was Jesus who also "obeyed the Law perfectly" -- but yet scripture also speaks of Jesus as being WITHOUT SIN, i.e. "sinless" (Heb 4:15). So, since this was the case with Jesus, how could it not be the same for the perfect law-keeper Josiah? Explain that to me, Einstein! Was Jesus' perfect obedience to his Father's commandments more perfect than Josiah's? :rolleyes: Explain to me how any superlative can be improved upon or diminished, since by definition "superlative" means "supreme", "excellent" and denotes "an extreme or unsurpassed level or extent"?
In your zeal to defend your belief in mankind's total depravity you have been blinded to the absurdity of your complaint against Nehemiah6. He is not claiming or even implying that King Josiah led a sinless life.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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We are in Isaiah 60. Only taken 5 and a half years to get here.
That's approximately twelve chapters per year = one chapter per month! Six months to go... woo hoooo!


Isaiah 42:16 ~ I will lead the blind by a way they did not know; I will guide them on unfamiliar paths. I will turn darkness into light before them and rough places into level ground. These things I will do for them, and I will not forsake them.
:)
 

Rufus

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2024
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In your zeal to defend your belief in mankind's total depravity you have been blinded to the absurdity of your complaint against Nehemiah6. He is not claiming or even implying that King Josiah led a sinless life.
Just making wild, crazy claims doesn't make it so! Why don't you answer this question? What does it take to be sinless besides keeping the law perfectly? Since Josiah and Jesus both kept the law perfectly and Jesus was "without sin", how can Josiah also not be without sin, since Nehemiah66 claimed that this king also obeyed God's law perfectly?
 

Lamar

Active member
May 21, 2023
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Just making wild, crazy claims doesn't make it so! Why don't you answer this question? What does it take to be sinless besides keeping the law perfectly? Since Josiah and Jesus both kept the law perfectly and Jesus was "without sin", how can Josiah also not be without sin, since Nehemiah66 claimed that this king also obeyed God's law perfectly?
Does quoting the following make me guilty of calling God a liar?

Luke 1:5-6
5 In the days of Herod, king of Judea, there was a priest named Zacharias, of the division of Abijah; and he had a wife from the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elizabeth. 6 They were both righteous in the sight of God, walking blamelessly in all the commandments and requirements of the Lord.
 

Rufus

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Feb 17, 2024
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As many of you know, I did a very brief series of posts on the Typology of The Exodus on the Atonement thread. Correct understanding of the visible, physical, temporal redemption of God's chosen, covenant people is critically important to the proper understanding of its antitype, which is the invisible, spiritual, eternal redemption promised in the New Covenant. The other morning I was having my devotions in the Psalms and Ps 105 strongly reinforced a few parallels I made between the types and antitypes, which I'd like to briefly share with you.

Ps 105:17-20
17 and he sent a man before them —
Joseph, sold as a slave.
18 They bruised his feet with shackles,
his neck was put in irons,
19 till what he foretold came to pass,
till the word of the LORD proved him true.

20 The king sent and released him,
the ruler of peoples set him free.


One of the types I made in my above mentioned series is that godless, pagan Egypt was a type of an equally wicked world. Verse 20 in the above passage reinforces this type by telling us, essentially, that Egypt was very likely the first world empire. The tip off to this conclusion is the term "peoples", which is just another way of saying "nations". Pharaoh was a ruler of nations, just as Satan is the "god of this age" (2Cor 4:4) and the "ruler of the kingdom of the air" (Eph 2:2) which is also Satan's kingdom of darkness (Col 1:13).

Also, as a brief aside, many conservative bible scholars understand the "seven heads and seven hills" and the "seven kings" in Rev 17:9-10 as referring to kingdoms in the context passage, which speaks of five that have fallen, one is and one is to come. So, these kingdoms or empires would have chronologically been Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Mede-Persia, Greece and Rome, with one more to come. I totally agree with this interpretation; for "heads" can be understood as individual kings or kingdoms with context, of course, being the determinate.

And we must not forget that God raised Pharaoh up to literally make him a shameful, humiliating spectacle on the world stage, and to actually diminish the Egyptian empire in the eyes of the other nations, since the God of the Israelites totally defeated Egypt's pantheon of Gods, including Pharaoh who was considered be the god of Egypt who mediated between his nation and the other gods.

Then we have this passage in the same Psalm:
Ps 105:24-25
24 The LORD made his people very fruitful;
he made them too numerous for their foes,
25 whose hearts he turned to hate his people,
to conspire against his servants.

NIV


In this passage, too, we can certainly see another strong parallel between Egypt the type and the world the antitype. Egypt hated God's chosen, covenant people just as the world hates God's New Covenant people (Jn 15:18-19; 1Jn 3:13).

We know that God hardened Pharaoh's heart so that he would not let his chosen people go. But this passage takes to "hardening" to another level by including all Egypt ("their foes"). This passage very strongly reinforces the sovereinty of God that is found in several Proverbs, in Jer 10, etc. Tthe hearts of kings are not the only hearts that God controls (Prov 21:1) but the hearts of entire nations, as well!

Moreover, the implication to this passage is that God gave Egypt over to a reprobate mind. One of the major premises to my typology series is that God "came down" to resucue solely HIS firstborn -- only HIS chosen, covenant people -- only Abraham's descendants. God did not come down to rescue Egypt anymore than Christ came down from heaven to rescue the entire world from its sins. Christ came into this world to save his Father's elect -- all whom the Father gave to him in eternity.