Does Holy Spirit interpret Scripture for us?

[superdave5221]

I was wondering, what does everyone think of the doctrine of illumination?

Do you believe that as we read the bible, that Holy Spirit interprets it for us, or that we must study it, using proper hermeneutics and exegetical principles to understand it's message?

If we truly do get a direct interpretation of Scripture from Holy Spirit, then why is there disagreement among Christians on Scriptural passages, with one Christian, supposedly supplied with an interpretation by Holy Spirit, seeing it differently then another, equally supplied by Holy Spirit with a different interpretation? Also, it is common among Christians, that as we grow and mature in our walk with Christ, that we come to recognize that we were wrong in our interpretations of certain biblical passages. When we first read them, we felt that they were interpreted by Holy Scripture, and that it was the correct interpretation, but now we know better. How is this possible?

Many of the verses used to support what I think is a wrong teaching of this doctrine, such as John 14:26 is not directed at us, but at the apostles. Holy Spirit inspired the writing of the bible, (through direct discernment), but He does not do so today typically, though in some instances He may.

I believe that it is not a major work of Holy Spirit today to give us knowledge. We gain knowledge through the study of God's word, (the bible) which was inspired by Holy Spirit. The major work of Holy Spirit (under the New Covenant) is to convict us of our sin and need of repentence, and to sanctify us.

This is not to say that Holy Spirit is not active in teaching us. All three members of the Godhead can assist in this process. It is through prayer, study of the scriptures, and sanctification, that we gain knowledge. When we pray for knowledge, God will sharpen our intellect, lead us to specific scripture, provide experiences that cause us to gain insight, or use other providential means, such as causing us to cross paths with others who can teach us, or perhaps God may even disipline us. As we become more sanctified, we become more discerning. This is not necessarily a direct instillment of knowledge from Holy Spirit. As you walk in the ways of the Lord, you become more discerning of those ways, in the same way that you become more discerning of your spouse, family, or friends, as you get to know them. Certainly, Holy Spirit does not teach us to love God, we learn this through loving others, and in coming to know Him, by worshipping and obeying Him.

In the same way that we learn to love God, we learn His will for us. We do this by studying His word, and walking in the ways in which we are taught by those words.

I believe that Satan, and those who belong to him, would like to lead us away from the bible. He would rather us learn the ways of men, rather than God. He uses God's own word against Christians. Saying things like "puffed up in knowledge", his followers disdain the word of God. But if you look closely, most of these sayings are against the "knowledge of this world", not the bible. If directed at Christians, it is the pride and arrogance of the person, not the knowledge itself, which is bad.

With all of the false prophets on this site, (all speaking against God's word), it is more important than ever to study God's word, and know what His will for us is. I pray that everyone will make quality time each day to spend with the Lord in prayer, and in study of His word.

 

[Abiding]

Why would the Holyspirit tell us to study and rightly divide the word and work skillfully at it...then a few centuries later reveal it to us? I dont know the doctrine of illumination i just know the bible uses the term to say that the Spirit enables us to understand.

Ive made people look at me wierd when i tell them that i hold to what i understand as being the best ive come up with in my studies and will always be open to change anytime i learn better. As i keep on studying to grow in knowledge. I rekon if i disagree with someone that either their wrong, im wrong, or were both wrong...haha..and im not that startled. Im expected to have the truth with no doubt that im right...well im not there,,haha

Yes the John 14:26 is surely aimed at the diciples directly its appearant but it seems applicable to us the way the context reads but surely not in the same way. We would have to have something in us to remind us of. Teach us as we learn and obey. You would certianly have to be a doer or be decieving yourself. and guidence is needful. He is a helper. But i hear today people say just read it and pray and the Holyspirit will reveal it to you.
Thats not gona happen to a faith movement mentality that thinks in order to make it so you have to believe. Then the result is to pray and whatever pops into your mind is the Holyspirit. Even worst if your mind shuffles in a thought placed there by tv.

Yes the mantra today is that i dont study i just read and pray. The old testement is bad..look what it did to Isreal..Dont look at commentaries there just the words of men...dont look at church history or theology...becuase thats why we have so many denominations and a dead noncharismatic church. And if anyone corrects you their judging or puffed up or have a religious spirit.

I have a personal belief i cant defend. But i believe as i study and live the Holyspirit empowers obedience and gives me the understanding i need to do it. So if i refuse to study then im giving up something. Sowing sparingly reaping sparingly. sow to the flesh, or sow to the spirit. But mainly im saying that when there is something i need to understand to obey a command and im willing to obey then He will see that i learn it in my studies. Im not saying play by play. But it will be there. And if i dont study...then sorry charlie.

Well not only do I know we have been commanded to study with a list of rewards...but i know if we dont study we will not recieve those rewards..and we cant afford that.

Others claim all you need is love and knowledge puffeth up...I agree,,faith which worketh by love..but the bible also says that our love must abound more and more in all knowledge and in all judgement, that ye may approve things that are excellent, that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ.

There also a wind of boasting blowing around that people have a great discernment and as i ask them where they got it im told from the spirit...yet i see they only discern evil in those that dont treat them favoribly and all that like them are the genuine people. Yet discernment comes again from studying scripture. Heb 5:13-14 For everyone that uses milk is unskillful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Lord I pray for all saints to feed on the manna daily such as they need.amen.

 

[superdave5221]

Why would the Holyspirit tell us to study and rightly divide the word and work skillfully at it...then a few centuries later reveal it to us? I dont know the doctrine of illumination i just know the bible uses the term to say that the Spirit enables us to understand.

Ive made people look at me wierd when i tell them that i hold to what i understand as being the best ive come up with in my studies and will always be open to change anytime i learn better. As i keep on studying to grow in knowledge. I rekon if i disagree with someone that either their wrong, im wrong, or were both wrong...haha..and im not that startled. Im expected to have the truth with no doubt that im right...well im not there,,haha

Yes the John 14:26 is surely aimed at the diciples directly its appearant but it seems applicable to us the way the context reads but surely not in the same way. We would have to have something in us to remind us of. Teach us as we learn and obey. You would certianly have to be a doer or be decieving yourself. and guidence is needful. He is a helper. But i hear today people say just read it and pray and the Holyspirit will reveal it to you.
Thats not gona happen to a faith movement mentality that thinks in order to make it so you have to believe. Then the result is to pray and whatever pops into your mind is the Holyspirit. Even worst if your mind shuffles in a thought placed there by tv.

Yes the mantra today is that i dont study i just read and pray. The old testement is bad..look what it did to Isreal..Dont look at commentaries there just the words of men...dont look at church history or theology...becuase thats why we have so many denominations and a dead noncharismatic church. And if anyone corrects you their judging or puffed up or have a religious spirit.

I have a personal belief i cant defend. But i believe as i study and live the Holyspirit empowers obedience and gives me the understanding i need to do it. So if i refuse to study then im giving up something. Sowing sparingly reaping sparingly. sow to the flesh, or sow to the spirit. But mainly im saying that when there is something i need to understand to obey a command and im willing to obey then He will see that i learn it in my studies. Im not saying play by play. But it will be there. And if i dont study...then sorry charlie.

Well not only do I know we have been commanded to study with a list of rewards...but i know if we dont study we will not recieve those rewards..and we cant afford that.

Others claim all you need is love and knowledge puffeth up...I agree,,faith which worketh by love..but the bible also says that our love must abound more and more in all knowledge and in all judgement, that ye may approve things that are excellent, that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ.

There also a wind of boasting blowing around that people have a great discernment and as i ask them where they got it im told from the spirit...yet i see they only discern evil in those that dont treat them favoribly and all that like them are the genuine people. Yet discernment comes again from studying scripture. Heb 5:13-14 For everyone that uses milk is unskillful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Lord I pray for all saints to feed on the manna daily such as they need.amen.

Amen abiding! Keep studying and you will be rewarded.

If you read the book of Acts, many times when Paul went into a new city, he would go into the synagogue, and the bible says, "he reasoned with them from the scriptures". Why did he do this? Why didn't he just pray for Holy Spirit to open their eyes and be saved? In Matthew 28 when Jesus gave the apostles the Great Commission, He said to go into the nations and teach them all that He had commanded them. Why did they need to do this? Jesus was sending the Holy Spirit. Why not let Holy Spirit teach them?

Well the answer of course, is that Holy Spirit would eventually do the teaching. It would be done through the inspired work of the N.T. canon, and the providential work of God and Jesus Christ in the lives of Christians everywhere, which taught them, and inspired them to spread the word to the masses.

This is how God has decided to work under the new covenant, and who are we to question Him?

 

[AnandaHya]

lol When I study and read the Bible I hear two voices saying two different things about what the scripture means. I just pray and watch and listen. Sometimes I find out they both are lying because their words will contradict what God has written in His Holy Word. Sometimes there is insight that I don't understand until later. I think the Holy Spirit tries and teaches us but also Satan sends out deceiving spirits that also whisper lies into people's ears but they don't take the time to keep reading and studying God's words to realize they are lies.

LOL I'm so with you Abiding on these statements (weird looks and all, lol):

"Ive made people look at me wierd when i tell them that i hold to what i understand as being the best ive come up with in my studies and will always be open to change anytime i learn better. As i keep on studying to grow in knowledge. I rekon if i disagree with someone that either their wrong, im wrong, or were both wrong...haha..and im not that startled. Im expected to have the truth with no doubt that im right...well im not there,,haha"

 

[Abiding]

I see no problem in His way...we all esteem others higher than ourselves...feet washing becomes the top job the first will be last...we die to live..if we have anything good it was given so boasting is out...moderation...quiet, keepers at home working with our hands to give to him who needeth. Powers of darkness broken, translation into the light...asked to rest, abide in Him and let the fruit flow from Him. No fret, no worry casting our cares on Him, no fear can stand in the power of His love....easy yoke..burden is light...no grievious commands. Even provides the new heart that craves holyness so we dont even have to provide the drive to please Him. So much more that comes from the knowledge of the word empowered by His Spirit.

Yes He rules by Providence. We live by faith.

 

[Scotth1960]

I was wondering, what does everyone think of the doctrine of illumination?

Do you believe that as we read the bible, that Holy Spirit interprets it for us, or that we must study it, using proper hermeneutics and exegetical principles to understand it's message?

If we truly do get a direct interpretation of Scripture from Holy Spirit, then why is there disagreement among Christians on Scriptural passages, with one Christian, supposedly supplied with an interpretation by Holy Spirit, seeing it differently then another, equally supplied by Holy Spirit with a different interpretation? Also, it is common among Christians, that as we grow and mature in our walk with Christ, that we come to recognize that we were wrong in our interpretations of certain biblical passages. When we first read them, we felt that they were interpreted by Holy Scripture, and that it was the correct interpretation, but now we know better. How is this possible?

Many of the verses used to support what I think is a wrong teaching of this doctrine, such as John 14:26 is not directed at us, but at the apostles. Holy Spirit inspired the writing of the bible, (through direct discernment), but He does not do so today typically, though in some instances He may.

I believe that it is not a major work of Holy Spirit today to give us knowledge. We gain knowledge through the study of God's word, (the bible) which was inspired by Holy Spirit. The major work of Holy Spirit (under the New Covenant) is to convict us of our sin and need of repentence, and to sanctify us.

This is not to say that Holy Spirit is not active in teaching us. All three members of the Godhead can assist in this process. It is through prayer, study of the scriptures, and sanctification, that we gain knowledge. When we pray for knowledge, God will sharpen our intellect, lead us to specific scripture, provide experiences that cause us to gain insight, or use other providential means, such as causing us to cross paths with others who can teach us, or perhaps God may even disipline us. As we become more sanctified, we become more discerning. This is not necessarily a direct instillment of knowledge from Holy Spirit. As you walk in the ways of the Lord, you become more discerning of those ways, in the same way that you become more discerning of your spouse, family, or friends, as you get to know them. Certainly, Holy Spirit does not teach us to love God, we learn this through loving others, and in coming to know Him, by worshipping and obeying Him.

In the same way that we learn to love God, we learn His will for us. We do this by studying His word, and walking in the ways in which we are taught by those words.

I believe that Satan, and those who belong to him, would like to lead us away from the bible. He would rather us learn the ways of men, rather than God. He uses God's own word against Christians. Saying things like "puffed up in knowledge", his followers disdain the word of God. But if you look closely, most of these sayings are against the "knowledge of this world", not the bible. If directed at Christians, it is the pride and arrogance of the person, not the knowledge itself, which is bad.

With all of the false prophets on this site, (all speaking against God's word), it is more important than ever to study God's word, and know what His will for us is. I pray that everyone will make quality time each day to spend with the Lord in prayer, and in study of His word.

Dear friend, We need the Holy Spirit (John 16:13), proper Bible study with proper understanding and process (1 Timothy), we need the Church to guide us (Acts, Matt. 16:18. 1 Tim. 3:15), and Church tradition, written and spoken (2 Thess. 2:15). We need God's help (John 15), for without Christ we can do nothing. God bless you. Amen. In Erie Scott H.
PS It is false prophecy to believe we go by the Bible alone, when the Bible shows there is spoken tradition (2 Thess. 2:15) that we need in order to interpret the Bible. The Bible itself doesn't explain how to baptize or be baptized, and whether or not to use a single immersion or trine immersion. It teaches immersion, but doesn't go into the specifics of how to perform it, or what the priest (presbyter/elder) who baptizes is to say to the candidate for baptism.

 

[loveschild]

The Holy Spirit is helping the ones who believe in him to the rest it's just a book they have memorized.

 

[WordGaurdian]

Ok Good Morning

I'm so excited this morning... but anycase...

Ok a few things we must understand and this is VERY important.
First off the Bible is no substitute for the Holy Spirit. It is the Holy Spirit that guides us, speak to us and reveal things to us within the Bible by speaking to us plainly and explaining this to us. We out of ourselves cannot lean to our own understanding nor to the understanding of another man, but we must put our focus on God and listen to what He says He wanted to say. It is important to understand that without this we will go haywire even if we try to stick to the Bible we can miss God completely.

Second the Bible was written as a foundation of our faith not the entire house. It is clearly written that the text in the Bible is given so that we may come unto salvation in the Lord Jesus Christ. It states that we must adhere to His commands and listen to His voice. With that in mind, some things will be in the Bible and some things will not be in the Bible which God teaches you. One key fact remains and that is that God will never contradict Himself. SO if you get information from God it will never contradict the Bible even though the information might not be inside the Bible the foundation of it will be and the basis of that foundation will not be contradictory to what you've learned.

Thirdly on the basis that you can now get a revelation and later on get a contradictory one...that is impossible. Either one is of God and the other is not or both came from your own mind or from some place else. You cannot trust this. In the last 15-16 years of my life which is basically from my teenage years (people that have less understanding as to life events) to now (a tiny bit more) I never received any message from God that contradicts with any of the messages that I received before. God does not contradict Himself ever. In the Bible you can clearly see it. He never contradicts Himself over centuries. So listening to God's voice is essential if you receive anything at all from God.

God bless
See ya