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N
Since I already said what scripture Peter calls Jesus the corner stone... which is the rock the church is built on... I'm going to let you figure that out for yourself.
None of the Apostles, Peter included, are the rock that the church is built on... the only one that can claim that is Jesus Christ... It doesn't matter how old a church is, or what connections to the Apostles it claims to have, none of them are the church that Jesus Christ established.
None of the Apostles, Peter included, are the rock that the church is built on... the only one that can claim that is Jesus Christ... It doesn't matter how old a church is, or what connections to the Apostles it claims to have, none of them are the church that Jesus Christ established.
E
Truly rose. Those who control history and they are going to write history to go their way. Meaning it will be biased to make them look good. Can you imagine what history would read if Hitler won world war two? Do you think we would be reading how evil that man was? Of course not. Because he would have wrote history.
You want to base your eternity on men and not God? I am saddened by that
You want to base your eternity on men and not God? I am saddened by that
E
No Scott. I have translated it for what it says. People used the same excuses your church does back then. And paul condemned it. The jews used this same excuse to reject Christ and have him crucified. Just because you can't see it does not make it so.
Scott. I have been a Christian for 38 Years. I am not a newbie. If I need someone to teach me now. I have wasted many years of my life. I am not saying I am perfect. Nor that you should listen to me. You should test what I say. As we should do for ALL PEOPLE. Men have the ability to distort Gods word. Paul warned people in the NT that people in their OWN church. Leaders of their church would distort Gods word. and turn it to a different gospel Can you prove it did nto happen with your church? Well yeah you can. Read the word. Study it. Stop listening to men, and you will see your doctrines do not line up with the word. Without tradiditon and your many excuses, your church falls on its face. it has no where to stand. why do you think they demand you listen to them. they scare you to believe only they can translate. This is not of God. this is fear based phariseeism.
Have you not read corinthians where Paul tells them THEY SHOULD BE TEACHING OTHERS. But they have to be taught because they are still babes.
It is one thing to have a guide to help you start. It is another to rely on men, and not learn scripture so YOU CAN TEACH OTHERS. How do you do this?> You study to show yourself approved, a workman who needeth not be ashames, rightly deviding the word of truth. How can we rightly devide the word if we have to be taught and only certain men have that ability?
Do you serve as your own pope (Protestant) over the word of God,[/quote]
God is my leader. Christ is my rock and cornerstone, and the HS is my teacher. Men help guide me. But I test what they say. because men have led me wrong before.
How can I know what church is the church? Listen to men or listen to God. You assume your church is right. yet scripture does not support it. Sorry I put my faith in no man. Eternity is forever. If I listen to a man just because they say what you say and they are wrong. I am doomed for eternity. That to dangerous.. God will hold me responsible for what I believe. nor what orthodox, catholic or protestant tells me what to believe!
How do I know? My Gospel does not cause scripture to contradict itself. Your churches gospel does. I need no more proof.
E
No Scott. I have translated it for what it says. People used the same excuses your church does back then. And paul condemned it. The jews used this same excuse to reject Christ and have him crucified. Just because you can't see it does not make it so.
Scott. I have been a Christian for 38 Years. That guy was new and needed shown the way.
I am not a newbie. If I need someone to teach me now. I have wasted many years of my life. I am not saying I am perfect. Nor that you should listen to me. You should test what I say. As we should do for ALL PEOPLE. Men have the ability to distort Gods word. Paul warned people in the NT that people in their OWN church. Leaders of their church would distort Gods word. and turn it to a different gospel Can you prove it did nto happen with your church? Well yeah you can. Read the word. Study it. Stop listening to men, and you will see your doctrines do not line up with the word. Without tradiditon and your many excuses, your church falls on its face. it has no where to stand. why do you think they demand you listen to them. they scare you to believe only they can translate. This is not of God. this is fear based phariseeism.
Have you not read corinthians where Paul tells them THEY SHOULD BE TEACHING OTHERS. But they have to be taught because they are still babes.
It is one thing to have a guide to help you start. It is another to rely on men, and not learn scripture so YOU CAN TEACH OTHERS. How do you do this?> You study to show yourself approved, a workman who needeth not be ashames, rightly deviding the word of truth. How can we rightly devide the word if we have to be taught and only certain men have that ability?
Do you serve as your own pope (Protestant) over the word of God,[/quote]
God is my leader. Christ is my rock and cornerstone, and the HS is my teacher. Men help guide me. But I test what they say. because men have led me wrong before.
How can I know what church is the church? Listen to men or listen to God. You assume your church is right. yet scripture does not support it. Sorry I put my faith in no man. Eternity is forever. If I listen to a man just because they say what you say and they are wrong. I am doomed for eternity. That to dangerous.. God will hold me responsible for what I believe. nor what orthodox, catholic or protestant tells me what to believe!
How do I know? My Gospel does not cause scripture to contradict itself. Your churches gospel does. I need no more proof.
S
Dear NitzWalsh,
So the only other alternative, then, was that the church, true church, was established
during your own lifetime, and there was no true Christian church on earth before you and I
came on the scene. Or, maybe, perhaps, we can only find our way back to 1517 AD, with
Martin Luther's 95 theses; surely, then, Herr Doctor Martin Luther, Augustinian, had the
whole, gospel truth. Or, if Luther wasn't the founder of "our church", maybe it was John
Wycliffe, or the Waldensians, or some other medieval group. After Catholicism fell away in
1054 AD. Only by reforming the false , papist church can we find the true church! The true
church is found by reforming the Antichrist. The pope of Rome is the Antichrist, and, so, if
you reform the pope's doctrines according to the Bible alone, you get a Reformed
Antichrist "church"! No matter that the true Church existed for 1054 years in the East, in
Antioch, Jerusalem, Alexandria, Constantinople, and even in Western Rome until 1014 AD
(or 1054 AD). Really, Rome was in heresy since 1014 AD!
The only church, then, according to you, is whatever you say that the Bible says that the
church is, that is what the church is. It's church doctrine according to your own personal,
private opinion. You know better than any of the church fathers or saints or any average
Christian of the first 1000 years of Christianity. You are free to accept or to reject any of
their doctrines as you yourself see fit, for, in the end, the final authority for you is your
own personal, private reading of the Bible by yourself, as you read the Bible "for yourself".
Baptist preacher Tim LaHaye even wrote a book titled, "How to Read the Bible For
Yourself". So, you accept the Apostolic writings, but you reject that Apostolic Church that
gave you the writings! The Bible just fell "magically" out of the sky, dictated by God, word
for word, in "perfect", King James English! Minus the Apocrypha, of course! Because
Martin Luther told you so! So, it's up to you and me to go it all alone; we don't need any
bishop or successor of the apostles to gather around; we don't need an Orthodox priest to
confess to.
Well, I have said enough.
I need to get back to church.
Really, unless and until you attend an Orthodox Church, you don't know what you are
missing! I'm glad every time I actually do enter an Orthodox Church. It tells me more
than my finite mind can absorb. I get a feeling for the true worship of the true NT church
every time I attend Divine Liturgy. The place even smells better than the average
Protestant iconoclastic assembly.
God bless you.
Goodbye for now. I'll just ask you to read every post I posted before you make
comments on me personally.
I don't sit here judging any of you. Of course, some of you say I'm a cult member or a
sect member, or say I am immature. You use all kinds of ad hominem language about me
personally, but you never read the Bible and show how the Church Fathers are wrong, or
how what I say about John 15:26 is wrong. And I believe what the Church says about John
15:26. I believe that one verse shows Eastern Orthodoxy to be preaching the true
doctrine about the Holy Trinity, along with the other doctrines of Chalcedonian
Christology, the Christology of the Creed (of 381 AD0, the doctrines of the 7 holy councils
of the One Church. I just need to get back to church in September.
Starting in September.
Before you go off into error, save your soul from false translations of the Bible, and read:
Orthodox New Testament. 2 volumes. Volume 1, The Holy Gospels, Evangelistarion.
Volume 2, Acts, Epistles, Revelation, Praxapostolos. Copyright 2000, by Holy Apostles
Convent, Buena Vista, CO. You can't criticize what you do not understand. You can't say
the Eastern Orthodox Church is false if you have never taken the time to see whether or
not what she says, does, and preaches, and teaches, is the Gospel truth. You need to
show that your Protestant doctrine was taught between 100 AD and 200 AD. Where is
justification by faith alone and scripture alone in any of the Ante-Nicene Apostolic
Fathers? If it's not taught by the early church, it is not true!
God bless and save you. Lord have mercy on us all. Amen and Amen.
In Erie PA Scott R. Harrington
S
So, you were there, too, and so you know that Saint John did not have any disciples?
You say and claim that we cannot know who the disciples of John were? You can't learn
who the followers of John and the other of Christ's disciples were? The names Polycarp,
Justin Martyr, Linus, Stachys, Ignatius of Antioch, Clement of Rome, these names mean
nothing to you, because you are only interested in what happens in Christianity after
Martin Luther in 1521 AD?
S
Dear "EG":
There is no genealogy in what I said. A genealogy is the list of natural children of natural fathers and
mothers.
The disciples had spiritual children, converts.
That is not a genealogy. It's apostolic succession! Spiritual conversion (born again) through water
baptism in the Trinity!
The disciple of Saint Andrew was Stachys, and he was the bishop of Byzantium. He is mentioned in the NT
under Stachys as one of the 70 disciples of Christ in the book of Acts, etc. See Strong's Exhaustive
Concordance of the KJV Bible for proof. See also: McBirnie, William Steuart. (1973). The Search for the
Twelve Apostles. Wheaton, IL: LIVING BOOKS/ Tyndale House Publishers, Inc.
God bless and have mercy on you. With love and peace to you in Christ Jesus our Saviour. Amen.
In Erie PA Scott R. Harrington
N
Did you even read my post that you're replying to? I said Jesus Christ is the one that formed the church. Where you're getting this "only alternative" from I don't know but it wasn't from anything I said.
Quit grasping at straws, I already said that Jesus Christ founded the church.
I don't know when Rome went into heresy, but replacing one false church with another isn't really fixing any problems. Oh and that other false church I'm referring to is of course the Eastern Orthodox church in case you were unclear on that.
There's some more straw grasping, like I said, the church is founded by Jesus Christ, and the doctrine comes from the Holy Scriptures which the Eastern Orthodox seems to have put on the back burner in favour of the traditions of men.
Every time you post like this it makes me see the low regard you hold for God's word.
Usually when people have "said enough" they don't keep going further and further into nonsense.
Why would I want to attend an Orthodox Church after the glowing reviews you've been giving?
I don't need to read every post by you to see how you skirt around things and focus on things like a persons nickname when you can't find fault in their arguments. Or how you start talking about Luther and Protestant churches when you can't answer questions.
It's Homonym, and I don't think you even know what it means.Plenty of people, including myself have shown from the scriptures that the Eastern Orthodox church has 'wrong' traditions of men, you just refuse to believe what is written in the scriptures.
Like I said once before, I don't identify as protestant, I get my beliefs from the Bible, not from the false teachings and traditions of men. Your question about justification by faith alone has been answered countless times. As for the rest, if the traditions taught by anyone, Ante-Nicene, or otherwise, are found to be in disagreement with what is written in the scriptures, those traditions are false teachings and should be put aside.
If it's taught by the early church (100 - 200) it doesn't automatically make it true.
Again Scott...a lot of hot air and personal accusations but failure to address the scripture or doctrines.
You are failing badly here....tell EOC to send someone else.
Yes that is where we differ.
You trust MEN enough to risk NECROMANCY.
Why not just NOT risk it? It is an abomination to the Lord, and theres a good chance that you practice this abomination.
There is no command to pray to saints. Therefore we dont need to.
By doing so, and trying to ensnare others ito yor sect that practices this, is to bring people into danger.
All from a matter of trust of MEN.
(Deuteronomy 18:10) There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,
(Deuteronomy 18:11) Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.
(Deuteronomy 18:12) For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.
You are failing badly here....tell EOC to send someone else.
Yes that is where we differ.
You trust MEN enough to risk NECROMANCY.
Why not just NOT risk it? It is an abomination to the Lord, and theres a good chance that you practice this abomination.
There is no command to pray to saints. Therefore we dont need to.
By doing so, and trying to ensnare others ito yor sect that practices this, is to bring people into danger.
All from a matter of trust of MEN.
(Deuteronomy 18:10) There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,
(Deuteronomy 18:11) Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.
(Deuteronomy 18:12) For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.
S
Dear zone, Fraudulent attacks on the true Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church.
Bad, false book with poor, fraudulent scholarship:
Dr. Robert A. Morey. (2007). Is Eastern Orthodoxy Christian. Las Vegas, NV: Christian Scholars Press.
Proofs the Robert Albert Morey is a fraud (fake):
Robert Morey's National Mail Fraud: Morey's Fraudulent Mailings YouTube.com
Discredited former radio personality Robetr Morey Bye Bye Morey -- Robert Albert Morey << True Faith Defenders
rzhblog.wordpress.com/.../bye-bye-morey-robert-albert-morey.hr....
The Saint Augustinian: Criminal Fraud and Slander Routinely
saintaugustinian.blogspot.com/.../criminal.fraud-slander-routinely.ht....
Well, for me to be real, I need to get back to church.
I won't write any more threads to any of you until I have been to church again at the
Russian Orthodox Church.
Whenever I do go to church, maybe I'll tell you how I'm feeling.
My plan is for the beginning of September to start the new church year.
God bless you.
If you want to talk to me, just send me a personal email to scotth1960. I believe that I have not to say much more stuff on Eastern Orthodoxy. I wish you God bless all of you and I suggest you don't comment any more on Eastern Orthodoxy until you have read the following book.
Gillquist, Fr. Peter E. (1992). Becoming Orthodox: A Journey to the Ancient Christian Faith. revised and expanded edition. Ben Lomond, CA: Conciliar Press.
If and when you DO read all of that book, and compare every page to the Old and New Testaments in your Bible(s), then you can say what you will. Whatever you believe. If you agree with things, fine. If you disagree, okay. Whatever you do, you will have let me know you care even just a little about Eastern Orthodoxy. I care about Anglicanism and Catholicism and Lutheranism, too. I learned a lot of things from the historic Western denominations, especially Roman Catholicism. I have also learned a lot from Lutheranism and the Book of Concord. And I think the 39 Articles of Faith of the Church of England are interesting. Not everything in non-Orthodox Christians are all and completely heterodox. There is much of Orthodoxy in the non-Orthodox confessions. Whatever is true and right and good in the West must be believed in, lest we also reject the same things which are present in Orthodoxy. The West inherits a lot of good things from the Western and Eastern Church Fathers. And not everything Augustine of Hippo said was wrong.
Well, zone and other friends, etc., if you want to send me questions or comments, just privately email me at Christian Chat at scotth1960. God bless you.
God have mercy on us. Amen.
In Erie PA USA Scott R. Harrington
Bad, false book with poor, fraudulent scholarship:
Dr. Robert A. Morey. (2007). Is Eastern Orthodoxy Christian. Las Vegas, NV: Christian Scholars Press.
Proofs the Robert Albert Morey is a fraud (fake):
Robert Morey's National Mail Fraud: Morey's Fraudulent Mailings YouTube.com
Discredited former radio personality Robetr Morey Bye Bye Morey -- Robert Albert Morey << True Faith Defenders
rzhblog.wordpress.com/.../bye-bye-morey-robert-albert-morey.hr....
The Saint Augustinian: Criminal Fraud and Slander Routinely
saintaugustinian.blogspot.com/.../criminal.fraud-slander-routinely.ht....
Well, for me to be real, I need to get back to church.
I won't write any more threads to any of you until I have been to church again at the
Russian Orthodox Church.
Whenever I do go to church, maybe I'll tell you how I'm feeling.
My plan is for the beginning of September to start the new church year.
God bless you.
If you want to talk to me, just send me a personal email to scotth1960. I believe that I have not to say much more stuff on Eastern Orthodoxy. I wish you God bless all of you and I suggest you don't comment any more on Eastern Orthodoxy until you have read the following book.
Gillquist, Fr. Peter E. (1992). Becoming Orthodox: A Journey to the Ancient Christian Faith. revised and expanded edition. Ben Lomond, CA: Conciliar Press.
If and when you DO read all of that book, and compare every page to the Old and New Testaments in your Bible(s), then you can say what you will. Whatever you believe. If you agree with things, fine. If you disagree, okay. Whatever you do, you will have let me know you care even just a little about Eastern Orthodoxy. I care about Anglicanism and Catholicism and Lutheranism, too. I learned a lot of things from the historic Western denominations, especially Roman Catholicism. I have also learned a lot from Lutheranism and the Book of Concord. And I think the 39 Articles of Faith of the Church of England are interesting. Not everything in non-Orthodox Christians are all and completely heterodox. There is much of Orthodoxy in the non-Orthodox confessions. Whatever is true and right and good in the West must be believed in, lest we also reject the same things which are present in Orthodoxy. The West inherits a lot of good things from the Western and Eastern Church Fathers. And not everything Augustine of Hippo said was wrong.
Well, zone and other friends, etc., if you want to send me questions or comments, just privately email me at Christian Chat at scotth1960. God bless you.
God have mercy on us. Amen.
In Erie PA USA Scott R. Harrington
S
False. I was merely speaking in a human way. I know many of you want an emotional experience with God. That's not the main reason a person should attend worship services and worship God in a church. But it's okay to feel good and have joy in the Lord. A person like me who suffers a lot (greatly) from bad depression needs more joy in his life.
As for Mysticism, it is Christian. What is "Christ in you, the hope of glory", but Christian mysticism. If we are Christians, Christ is IN us. That's MYSTICISM. As for Gnosticism, the EOC is NOT Gnostic. So again, you criticism is FALSE.
Criticize me if you will, but don't wonder if people feel bad about how you're acting if all you can come up with is ad hominem arguments. I want to know what you believe and why you believe the doctrines that you DO believe. What Scriptures are the basis of your doctrines and how do you know your doctrines were taught by the early Christians? Don't just criticize and attack me when I don't say bad things about you ever. It is not fair. If this forum is Christian, it will be by certain rules. Well, maybe I am taking things a bit personally. Can you blame me? Perhaps you will try to! God bless you.
As for Mysticism, it is Christian. What is "Christ in you, the hope of glory", but Christian mysticism. If we are Christians, Christ is IN us. That's MYSTICISM. As for Gnosticism, the EOC is NOT Gnostic. So again, you criticism is FALSE.
Criticize me if you will, but don't wonder if people feel bad about how you're acting if all you can come up with is ad hominem arguments. I want to know what you believe and why you believe the doctrines that you DO believe. What Scriptures are the basis of your doctrines and how do you know your doctrines were taught by the early Christians? Don't just criticize and attack me when I don't say bad things about you ever. It is not fair. If this forum is Christian, it will be by certain rules. Well, maybe I am taking things a bit personally. Can you blame me? Perhaps you will try to! God bless you.