Eating Swine (hogs)?

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DustyRhodes

Senior Member
Dec 30, 2016
1,037
55
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#21
Matt.15: [SUP]10 [/SUP]Jesus called the crowd to him and said, “Listen and understand.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]What goes into someone’s mouth does not defile them, but what comes
out of their mouth, that is what defiles them.”

also...

[SUP]15 [/SUP]Peter said, “Explain the parable to us.”
[SUP]16 [/SUP]“Are you still so dull?” Jesus asked them. [SUP]17 [/SUP]“Don’t you see that whatever
enters the mouth goes into the stomach and then out of the body? [SUP]18 [/SUP]But the
things that come out of a person’s mouth come from the heart, and these
defile them. [SUP]19 [/SUP]For out of the heart come evil thoughts—murder, adultery,
sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander. [SUP]20 [/SUP]These are what defile
a person; but eating with unwashed hands does not defile them.”

Gal.3: The curse of the law
Galatians 3: [SUP]10 [/SUP]For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse,
as it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything
written in the Book of the Law.”[SUP][[/SUP][SUP]e[/SUP][SUP]][/SUP] [SUP]11 [/SUP]Clearly no one who relies on the law is
justified before God, because “the righteous will live by faith.”[SUP][[/SUP][SUP]f[/SUP][SUP]][/SUP] [SUP]12 [/SUP]The law
is not based on faith; on the contrary, it says, “The person who does these
things will live by them.”[SUP][[/SUP][SUP]g[/SUP][SUP]][/SUP] [SUP]13 [/SUP]Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law
by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung
on a pole.”[SUP][[/SUP][SUP]h[/SUP][SUP]][/SUP] [SUP]14 [/SUP]He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to Abraham
might come to the Gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might
receive the promise of the Spirit.
************************

If you Choose to be Jewish, be the best Jew you can be.
If You Choose to be Christian, be the best Christian you can be.
You can't do both.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
5,800
553
113
#22
Leviticus 11
7 And the pig, though it has a divided hoof, does not chew the cud; it is unclean for you
Well Jackson, if it is unclean for you, don't eat it. But don't try to get Christians to abandon their liberty in Christ. And study the passage I posted regarding what God has said regarding ALL MEATS.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
9,257
376
83
#23
Leviticus 11

7 And the pig, though it has a divided hoof, does not chew the cud; it is unclean for you
"For it doesn't go into their heart but into their stomach, and then out of the body." (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean.)"
Mk 7:19

Mark was written later than Leviticus, so it is more actual.

Jesus is a higher authority than Moses, so it is more authoritative.
 
Apr 30, 2016
5,162
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0
#25
Where in Scripture does it’s now okay to eat swine?

If you can, please document your answer.
You'll get some scripture, I'm sure.

I don't know you, so here's your serious answer:

JESUS DID ABOLISH SOME OF THE LAW!
In the O.T. there were three kinds of Law:
Ceremonial
Civil
Moral

The ceremonial (eating pork) and civil Law WAS ABOLISHED.

The MORAL LAw (10 commandments) was NOT abolished.

All you have to do is study up on this and you'll have your answer.
 

graceNpeace

Senior Member
Aug 12, 2016
2,180
83
48
#26
Leviticus 11

7 And the pig, though it has a divided hoof, does not chew the cud; it is unclean for you
No dispute about Leviticus and what it says but New Covenant believers are not subject to the laws of Moses.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
5,800
553
113
#27
You mean
you mean
there's fake bacon!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What is this world coming to????
Well check out "soy bacon" or "vegetarian bacon" on the internet, and then grab some for your scrupulous friends who shun swine and hogs.
 
Apr 30, 2016
5,162
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0
#28
Well check out "soy bacon" or "vegetarian bacon" on the internet, and then grab some for your scrupulous friends who shun swine and hogs.
Does this vegetarian bacon or soy bacon make that very unhealthy fat all by its very own self in the pan?

No?

Then it can't be good.

Plus, I'd have to come to NY to get some.
That's pretty far to go for some veggie bacon !!
 
Apr 30, 2016
5,162
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#29
Well check out "soy bacon" or "vegetarian bacon" on the internet, and then grab some for your scrupulous friends who shun swine and hogs.
I have a vegan niece.
She shuns almost ALL food.

I know this is funny, but it's really difficult to cook for her...
 

graceNpeace

Senior Member
Aug 12, 2016
2,180
83
48
#30
You'll get some scripture, I'm sure.

I don't know you, so here's your serious answer:

JESUS DID ABOLISH SOME OF THE LAW!
In the O.T. there were three kinds of Law:
Ceremonial
Civil
Moral

The ceremonial (eating pork) and civil Law WAS ABOLISHED.

The MORAL LAw (10 commandments) was NOT abolished.

All you have to do is study up on this and you'll have your answer.
ALL of the law of Moses was abolished - and that includes the ten commandments.
If what you say is true then you have no option but to observe the Sabbath (as per all the restrictions of the law of Moses).
One cannot slice and dice bits and pieces out of a covenant (contract).

Also, if you place yourself under part of a covenant then you are subject to all its provisions (laws in the case of the Mosaic covenant).
 

Yonah

Senior Member
Oct 31, 2014
1,074
102
48
#31
;) would that be one of these:



Proverbs 14:12 is one of those verses that people tend to quote anywhere, anytime, as though to justify literally anything they say. you can just append it to any statement, with the implication that what you say is true, and what the person you're talking to says is "a way that seemeth right"

but it's pretty double edged, don't you think?
because what you say, i bet, "
seemeth right" to you, doesn't it?

in the end then, for the vast majority of cases i've seen, it doesn't lend any credence to what it's quoted with after all.

[HR][/HR][HR][/HR]
what i believe is generally far more applicable to instances of Proverbs 14:12 being quoted is another adage, Proverbs 18:17

The one who states his case first seems right,
until the other comes and examines him.



if it is I'm not sure how, the wisdom in proverbs can be understood and applied in many ways. however if I have misapplied it please show me how.
 
Apr 30, 2016
5,162
74
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#33
ALL of the law of Moses was abolished - and that includes the ten commandments.
If what you say is true then you have no option but to observe the Sabbath (as per all the restrictions of the law of Moses).
One cannot slice and dice bits and pieces out of a covenant (contract).

Also, if you place yourself under part of a covenant then you are subject to all its provisions (laws in the case of the Mosaic covenant).
This is true.
And what I've been saying in the "Sabbath" thread.

It is HOWEVER, true that the MORAL LAW was NOT abolished. Jesus said so, not me.
Mathew 5:17

In fact, if we want to be honest, Jesus made the Law MORE stringent, not less.

We can be sure it was NOT abolished because Jesus left us with two commandments that cover all the rest.
Mathew 22:37-39

IF the moral law had been abolished, it would mean we could
curse God
never go to worship
dishonor our parents
steal
give false witness
covet
etc.

Think about it.
 
Apr 30, 2016
5,162
74
0
#34
ALL of the law of Moses was abolished - and that includes the ten commandments.
If what you say is true then you have no option but to observe the Sabbath (as per all the restrictions of the law of Moses).
One cannot slice and dice bits and pieces out of a covenant (contract).

Also, if you place yourself under part of a covenant then you are subject to all its provisions (laws in the case of the Mosaic covenant).
BTW

You're talking about Covenants and Law.
It's two different works by God.
A covenant is, as you said, a TYPE of contract.
Laws are what are to be followed to be a member of that contract.
 
Sep 6, 2014
3,195
712
113
#35
1 Timothy 4:1-5
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; 3Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. 4For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: 5For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

That being said.......
Browsing this thread has inspired me and made me hungry for some bbq pork.

Bbq pork ribs,pulled pork,brisket,pulled chicken, corn bread, a side of bbq beans, and some home cut fries to be exact. (not all included in the image below)

We are grateful to God for providing this food and look forward to receiving it with thanksgiving. :)

Perhaps even Ellen White couldn't resist a plate like that :p
 

graceNpeace

Senior Member
Aug 12, 2016
2,180
83
48
#36
This is true.
And what I've been saying in the "Sabbath" thread.

It is HOWEVER, true that the MORAL LAW was NOT abolished. Jesus said so, not me.
Mathew 5:17

In fact, if we want to be honest, Jesus made the Law MORE stringent, not less.

We can be sure it was NOT abolished because Jesus left us with two commandments that cover all the rest.
Mathew 22:37-39

IF the moral law had been abolished, it would mean we could
curse God
never go to worship
dishonor our parents
steal
give false witness
covet
etc.

Think about it.
Go back a reread Matt 5:17.
Jesus has actually fulfilled the law...

We are part of a new Covenant now called the New Covenant.
None of the covenant God made with Moses on Mount Sinai is binding on us.
The Mosaic covenant was a conditional covenant between God and the nation of Israel (no-one else) - the conditions being obedience to every precept of the law.
The New Covenant is very different - we are invited (by grace) to participate in a covenant where the conditions for the covenant have already been fulfilled by Jesus Christ.
Think of a covenant as a contract (thats exactly what it is).
If you place yourself under a covenant you are obliged to obey all its precepts exactly as you would when you sign a contract - there is no provision for picking and choosing which clauses in a contract you will honour.

New Covenant believers have no excuse for amoral behaviour but it has nothing to do with the law of Moses per se.
 

Billyd

Senior Member
May 8, 2014
3,102
105
63
#37
You mean
you mean
there's fake bacon!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What is this world coming to????
That fake bacon ain't fit for a dog. I gave my poodle one of those fake bacon treats. She was sick for two days.

Things get pretty miserable around here, if we don't have some bacon or sausage.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
18,619
1,135
113
#38
if it is I'm not sure how, the wisdom in proverbs can be understood and applied in many ways. however if I have misapplied it please show me how.

brother, i'm sorry; i said that first part tongue-in-cheek hoping you would understand me. if we'd been face to face i trust from my look you'd have known.. which was what the smiley face was supposed to communicate.

and then i took the opportunity to comment on how i seem to have seen Proverbs 14:12 used as an '
all-purpose-i-quoted-scripture-therefore-i'm-right' kind of verse.

not to say that you've necessarily misapplied it, because that saying in particular has a very very broad application: but that stating it, especially alone, usually doesn't actually support any argument in particular. what i take it to mean is simply that '
just because something seems right to a person, doesn't mean it is' - which could either lend weight to any particular stance, or alternatively, undercut it just as easily as it could any opposite view.
 
Apr 30, 2016
5,162
74
0
#39
Go back a reread Matt 5:17.
Jesus has actually fulfilled the law...

We are part of a new Covenant now called the New Covenant.
None of the covenant God made with Moses on Mount Sinai is binding on us.
The Mosaic covenant was a conditional covenant between God and the nation of Israel (no-one else) - the conditions being obedience to every precept of the law.
The New Covenant is very different - we are invited (by grace) to participate in a covenant where the conditions for the covenant have already been fulfilled by Jesus Christ.
Think of a covenant as a contract (thats exactly what it is).
If you place yourself under a covenant you are obliged to obey all its precepts exactly as you would when you sign a contract - there is no provision for picking and choosing which clauses in a contract you will honour.

New Covenant believers have no excuse for amoral behaviour but it has nothing to do with the law of Moses per se.
GraceNPeace

I'm not willing to argue accepted Christian theology.
I don't have to reread Mathew 5:17.
Read all of chapter 5.
Concentrate on 5:17-20
Also Mathew 5:27-32
Also Mathew 5:48

The Covenant God made with Moses is still binding.
I keep asking this and don't get an answer:
Does every Covenant abolish the previous one?
I'll answer it
NO, it does not. It BUILDS on it.
Think back to the Adamic and all the way up to now...
WHICH ONE has been abolished?
NONE.

The New Covenant is better, it doesn't mean the other ones are no longer in force.

The difference between the Mosaic Covenant and the New Covenant is HOW the New Covenant is kept by us.


It IS sometimes argued whether or not the New Covenant has the conditon of believing.
It IS A NON-CONDITIONAL covenant, however, we must believe to be in it, so some may ask if believing then becomes a condition. And IF we believe, then we are to believe in all of it.

Also, we are placed under a LAW, we cannot be placed under a non-conditional covenant.
You yourself have stated that there are no conditions, or clauses.

We are still to obey the Law.
God did not change.
 
Apr 30, 2016
5,162
74
0
#40
That fake bacon ain't fit for a dog. I gave my poodle one of those fake bacon treats. She was sick for two days.

Things get pretty miserable around here, if we don't have some bacon or sausage.
LOL

DITTO...