Election teaches that salvation comes from the Lord.

[Cameron143]

If you were in Christ before the foundation of the world, then there never could have been a time when your were a child of wrath.

Ephesians 2
1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

By nature...is the key phrase. All come into the world with a fallen nature. That's why we become partakers of the divine nature and no longer live after the flesh.
Wheat and tares look alot alike, but their ends are very different.

 

[rogerg]

Roger adheres to a doctrine called 5 Graces.

But believes God does not give Grace to basically 80% of His OWN Offspring known as His Creation.

Ever heard anything more ridiculous than that? To believe in something that only happens to less than 20% of Creation?

The doctrine literally sounds like a drunk man in a bar trying to preach repentance.

I do? Really? News to me.
So where does the 80% come from since you know the doctrine that I follow (but which I don't follow)

 

[Cameron143]

Roger adheres to a doctrine called 5 Graces.

But believes God does not give Grace to basically 80% of His OWN Offspring known as His Creation.

Ever heard anything more ridiculous than that? To believe in something that only happens to less than 20% of Creation?

The doctrine literally sounds like a drunk man in a bar trying to preach repentance.

Where do you get 80-20?

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

I do? Really? News to me.
So where does the 80% come from since you know the doctrine that I follow (but which I don't follow)

Only 20% of the worlds population claim to be Christian. By your doctrine that means 20% are elected to be Christian and 80% for hell.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Where do you get 80-20?

Only 20% of the worlds population claim to be Christian. By your doctrine that means 20% are elected to be Christian and 80% for hell.

 

[rogerg]

If you were in Christ before the foundation of the world, then there never could have been a time when your were a child of wrath.

Ephesians 2
1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Chosen from before the foundation of the world. We all come into this world dead in sin- from Adam and Eve's fall - and remain in it, unless and until becoming born again.

 

[rogerg]

Only 20% of the worlds population claim to be Christian. By your doctrine that means 20% are elected to be Christian and 80% for hell.

Wrong
You shouldn't just pull stuff out of the air.

[Rev 7:9 KJV] 9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Wrong
You shouldn't just pull stuff out of the air.

[Rev 7:9 KJV] 9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

20% of todays population is 2 billion which is a great multitude.

 

[John146]

By nature...is the key phrase. All come into the world with a fallen nature. That's why we become partakers of the divine nature and no longer live after the flesh.
Wheat and tares look alot alike, but their ends are very different.

Impossible to be a child of wrath in Christ.

 

[John146]

Chosen from before the foundation of the world. We all come into this world dead in sin- from Adam and Eve's fall - and remain in it, unless and until becoming born again.

Nope, you were eluding that the elect were in Christ before the foundation of the world.

 

[rogerg]

20% of todays population is 2 billion which is a great multitude.

Oh my! Doesn't the verse say, "no man could number"? You don't care about that?

 

[rogerg]

Nope, you were eluding that the elect were in Christ before the foundation of the world.

I never said that, you did.
Repost me saying that.

 

[Cameron143]

Only 20% of the worlds population claim to be Christian. By your doctrine that means 20% are elected to be Christian and 80% for hell.

Your eschatology leads you to believe that this is all there is. Heaven will be populated with a number that no man can number. How high can you count?

 

[Cameron143]

Impossible to be a child of wrath in Christ.

They aren't children of wrath. They only appeared to be before they were saves. It says as others in verse 3, not are others.

You may not believe in election as some others do, but this is a horrible proof text for your argument.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Oh my! Doesn't the verse say, "no man could number"? You don't care about that?

Today we could add them up.

 

[rogerg]

Today we could add them up.

No, we can't. And you're in violation of scripture in saying that we could.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Your eschatology leads you to believe that this is all there is. Heaven will be populated with a number that no man can number. How high can you count?

We can count beyond quadrillion which is million to billion to trillion to quadrillion and beyond. I doubt a trillion people ever lived.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

No, we can't. And you're in violation of scripture in saying that we could.

How many people do you think was ever born?

 

[rogerg]

How many people do you think was ever born?

No idea and this is getting ridiculous

 

[Cameron143]

We can count to quadrillion which is million to billion to trillion to quadrillion and beyond. I doubt a trillion people ever lived.

So what does this suggest to you?