God does not love all mankind.

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Mar 23, 2016
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#81
Before we pass judgement on God, lets consider a couple of things here. One, we should never compare ourselves to God for any reason.

God doesn't reveal everything to us about Himself, He has told us enough so we can know Him well but we will never Know everything about Him.
I am not passing judgment on God, nor am I comparing myself to God. I merely pointed out that, according to some erroneous beliefs, God requires something of us which He does not require of Himself.

When God tells us to love our enemies, bless them, do good to them, pray for them, He tells us that when we do these things, we reveals ourselves to be His children –

Matthew 5:

44 Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven
 
P

pjharrison

Guest
#82
Rev 3:19, As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten; Be zealous therefore, and repent. Psalms 73:5, They are not in trouble as other men; neither are they PLAGUED ( Greek translation = divinely punished ) like other men. If God divinely punishes everyone that he loves, why does he not punish the wicked mentioned in Psalms 73, if he loves all mankind?
The ones God loves are Godly, but the ones that he do not chasten are not his children, they are of the children of the devil.
 

Embankment

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2017
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#83
I am not passing judgment on God, nor am I comparing myself to God. I merely pointed out that, according to some erroneous beliefs, God requires something of us which He does not require of Himself.

When God tells us to love our enemies, bless them, do good to them, pray for them, He tells us that when we do these things, we reveals ourselves to be His children –

Matthew 5:

44 Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven
The thing is that God sacrificed his Son so we may have eternal life. He did this very act despite that man kind is an enemy to God. It is the same thing.
 
Mar 23, 2016
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#84
Don't think that we mere mortals are on the same level as our Lord who knows the end of all things from the beginning. The judgment and punishment of wickedness is His job, not ours.
I have never thought, nor have I stated, that we are "on the same level as our Lord", nor have I ever thought or stated that the judgment and punishment of wickedness is our job.



plaintalk said:
he did harden the heart of pharaoh, who he knew would not change.
Pharaoh's heart was hardened by pharaoh himself.


In Ex 1 we know the pharaohs of Egypt treated the children of Israel poorly. The midwives were instructed to kill the male infants at birth. Sick, sick, sick.

Moses left Egypt when he was at least 40 years old and then stayed in Midian for another 40 years (Acts 7:23-30). So at least 80 years had passed between the time the pharaohs were telling the midwives to kill the infants and the time Moses went back to Egypt. The heart of pharaoh got worse and worse over time ... just as Romans 1 tells us happens.



God shows us in Rom 1:18-32 that as men (or women) step further and further into their foolishness, God loosens His hold:

Rom 1:18 – God's wrath is revealed from heaven against those who restrain the truth in unrighteousness;

Rom 1:19-20 – God reveals Himself (His eternal power and Godhead) through creation and those who turn from Him are without excuse;

Rom 1:21 – those who see God's creation and do not glorify Him but rather become unthankful and vain in their empty imaginings have their foolish hearts darkened;

Rom 1:22-24 – because their foolish hearts are darkened, they deem themselves wise, but in reality they become fools and change God's glory into idols. God gives them over to uncleanness.

Rom 1:24-26 – because they have been given over to uncleanness, they dishonor their own bodies and change the truth of God into a lie, worshipping and serving creation more than the Creator. God gives them up to vile affections;

Rom 1:26-27 – because they are given up to vile affections, they burn in their lust and work that which is unseemly. They receive in themselves the adequate consequence of their error.

Rom 1:28-32 – they do not like to retain God in their knowledge so God gives them over to a reprobate mind.


These things do not happen overnight. For the most part, it takes years before a person becomes reprobate, and there are several steps a person goes through as he or she strays further and further from God.

There are many verses in Scripture in which God tells us to turn to Him and He will heal our hearts. It is not God's desire to turn these fools over to worse and worse behaviors and foolishness, but at some point He's got to let go and leave them to their devices.




plaintalk said:
God bless
Are you following the instruction of Matt 5:44 in "blessing" me?
 
Mar 23, 2016
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#85
The thing is that God sacrificed his Son so we may have eternal life. He did this very act despite that man kind is an enemy to God. It is the same thing.
Yes. And praise God for His excellent lovingkindness, mercy, grace to mankind. :cool:
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
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#86
And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world. (1 John 2: 2)

Who desires all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth. (1 Tim. 2: 4)

Who gave Himself as a ransom for all, the testimony borne at the proper time. (1 Tim. 2: 6)

The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance. (2 Peter 3: 9)
I have explained the above scriptures so many times and they fell on deaf ears. All of the scriptures must harmonize. We cannot ignore any one of them and understand the truth of the doctrine that Jesus taught. All scripture is given by inspiration of God.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
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#87
I have explained the above scriptures so many times and they fell on deaf ears. All of the scriptures must harmonize. We cannot ignore any one of them and understand the truth of the doctrine that Jesus taught. All scripture is given by inspiration of God.
You are the one who cannot stand sound doctrine.

2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

selfdissolving

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Jun 29, 2018
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#88
God is looking for His love to be reflected. They who do not reflect His love...He hates. But He first loves and is patient for us to learn how to reflect His love. He gives us time and many chances. But in the end they who cannot love will not be permitted to continue with God.
every breath taken, every meal eaten, every article of clothing, every hopeful thought and happy moment, all display the love of God for mankind.

God does love all of mankind, but some vessels he has made for honor and some for dishonor. Both vessels honor God: some display his mercy and kindness, some display his judgment and justice. In all things he is glorified.

"No man can come to me except my Father who sent me draws him, and i will raise him up at the last day"

The elect are those whom God foreknew and elected to be conformed to the image of Christ and be heirs of eternal life.
Those who reject Christ are also chosen for this, just like Pharaoh was raised up so that God could show his glory through him by breaking him off in front of everybody.
 

Dayone

Junior Member
May 22, 2018
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#89
Psalm 145:8.
The Lord is gracious and full of compassion, Slow to anger and great in mercy. The Lord is good to ALL, and His tender mercies are over all His works.
 

OstrichSmiling

Well-known member
Jun 17, 2018
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#90
every breath taken, every meal eaten, every article of clothing, every hopeful thought and happy moment, all display the love of God for mankind.

God does love all of mankind, but some vessels he has made for honor and some for dishonor. Both vessels honor God: some display his mercy and kindness, some display his judgment and justice. In all things he is glorified.

"No man can come to me except my Father who sent me draws him, and i will raise him up at the last day"

The elect are those whom God foreknew and elected to be conformed to the image of Christ and be heirs of eternal life.
Those who reject Christ are also chosen for this, just like Pharaoh was raised up so that God could show his glory through him by breaking him off in front of everybody.
That's why God sent the plagues upon Egypt. Every plague did challenge every deity in charge of those areas afflicted , the nile, the crops, because of that particular god or goddess that protected them by their power.
In bringing the plagues that ravaged the land of Pharaoh unabated by intercession of those Egyptian deities God showed all of Egypt what God is the true eternal power ruling all that exists.
 

OstrichSmiling

Well-known member
Jun 17, 2018
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#91
I have never thought, nor have I stated, that we are "on the same level as our Lord", nor have I ever thought or stated that the judgment and punishment of wickedness is our job.




Pharaoh's heart was hardened by pharaoh himself.
Exodus 9:12 tells us it was God who hardened Pharaoh's heart.







Are you following the instruction of Matt 5:44 in "blessing" me?
From that referenced verse, are you thinking they hold you as their enemy or persecutor here? :(
 

OstrichSmiling

Well-known member
Jun 17, 2018
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#92
Psalm 145:8.
The Lord is gracious and full of compassion, Slow to anger and great in mercy. The Lord is good to ALL, and His tender mercies are over all His works.
"The Lord is good to ALL". What about when he was not? See old testament.
 

Latour

Active member
Jun 11, 2018
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#93
every breath taken, every meal eaten, every article of clothing, every hopeful thought and happy moment, all display the love of God for mankind.

God does love all of mankind, but some vessels he has made for honor and some for dishonor. Both vessels honor God: some display his mercy and kindness, some display his judgment and justice. In all things he is glorified.

"No man can come to me except my Father who sent me draws him, and i will raise him up at the last day"

The elect are those whom God foreknew and elected to be conformed to the image of Christ and be heirs of eternal life.
Those who reject Christ are also chosen for this, just like Pharaoh was raised up so that God could show his glory through him by breaking him off in front of everybody.

The vessels of honour and dishonour are among the brethren...apart from the world. The elect are they that persevere in their seeking of God. Even Cain was not a lost cause if he had just persisted in trying to please God...
 

Dayone

Junior Member
May 22, 2018
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#94
Psalm 145:15
The Lord is righteous in all his ways, Gracious in all His works. The Lord is near to all who call upon Him, to all who call upon Him in truth. He will fulfill the desire of those who fear Him; He also will hear their cry and save them the Lord preserves all who love Him, but all the wicked He will destroy.
 
Mar 23, 2016
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#95
Exodus 9:12 tells us it was God who hardened Pharaoh's heart.
In Exodus 7:23, pharaoh disregarded warnings (Aaron's rod turning into a serpent and the waters turning to blood). And in Exodus 8:32 pharaoh hardened his heart … then (after pharaoh hardened his heart) the Lord hardened pharaoh's heart (Exodus 9:12).

God did not harden pharaoh's heart before pharaoh hardened his own heart.
 

Embankment

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2017
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#96
God did harden Judis’ heart and the nation of Israel.
 

OstrichSmiling

Well-known member
Jun 17, 2018
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#97
In Exodus 7:23, pharaoh disregarded warnings (Aaron's rod turning into a serpent and the waters turning to blood). And in Exodus 8:32 pharaoh hardened his heart … then (after pharaoh hardened his heart) the Lord hardened pharaoh's heart (Exodus 9:12).

God did not harden pharaoh's heart before pharaoh hardened his own heart.
In Exodus 7:23, pharaoh disregarded warnings (Aaron's rod turning into a serpent and the waters turning to blood). And in Exodus 8:32 pharaoh hardened his heart … then (after pharaoh hardened his heart) the Lord hardened pharaoh's heart (Exodus 9:12).

God did not harden pharaoh's heart before pharaoh hardened his own heart.
God's action then was redundant?
Why would God harden Pharaoh's heart if God's omniscience would show Pharaoh's heart was already hardened?
 
Mar 23, 2016
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#99
God's action then was redundant?
Not redundant per se.

God gave pharaoh many opportunities to let the children of Israel go. Pharaoh kept resisting God’s Will and each judgment was a response from God to pharaoh’s hardening of his heart.

At any time pharaoh could have let the people go, but he persisted in his foolishness.

Even after the final judgment, pharaoh pursued the children of Israel and finally left off after the incident at the Red Sea.

We also have to keep in mind that the children of Israel were steeped in the idolatry of Egypt. They had been living in Egypt for 400+ years and had picked up many of the idolatrous practices. God brought the children of Israel out of Egypt with His Mighty Hand. He led them with a cloud by day and a pillar of fire by night.




OstrichSmiling said:
Why would God harden Pharaoh's heart if God's omniscience would show Pharaoh's heart was already hardened?
Again, Romans 1:18-32 shows all the steps on the downward spiral to reprobate mind. It doesn’t happen overnight. It happens over time and over many, many instances of resisting God.

Sad, really, because God does give mankind many, many opportunities to turn from their foolishness.

When all is said and done and the unbeliever stands before God come Judgment Day, they will have no excuse before Him. God gives every opportunity to man to turn from his foolishness and no one will be able to say to God that He did not give them a chance to believe in Him.
 

Dayone

Junior Member
May 22, 2018
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Psalm 51:12-13
Restore to me the joy of Your salvation, and uphold me by Your generous Spirit. Then I will teach transgressors Your ways, and sinners shall be converted to you...

What a awesome thing the joy of our salvation. the joy of being loved by a gracious,andcompassionate,Mercyful long suffering powerful God who is mighty to save. The important responsibility of Christians to preach the gospel the good news.sinners need so desperately to know the ways of God and to believe that he sent his only son to die for the sins of the whole world. (John 16:26-26) In that day you will ask in My name, and I do not say to you that I shall pray the Father for you; for the Father Himself loves you, because you have loved Me,and believed that I came forth from God. Let the heart of a evangelist be like the heart of God . His love is generous able to reach and available to all who desire it through Jesus we have direct access to God. Jesus is Gods love....... Gods love is available to ALL the tragedy is people reject His love...