GOD is hiding information from his only Son.

[pottersclay]

Since you gave me the ever-rude red X on my post about Christ not telling the Truth, please copy and paste John 7:10 from your favorite translation, and explain why Jesus kept his "time" a secret. How did Jesus keep His going to the festival a secret? What did He do to accomplish that task? Please quote your favorite translation and explain why it doesn't mean what it clearly says.

This will be interesting . . . to see how you people will twist and turn this one. Unbelievable.

Sorry for the long wait of my reply...family gathering.

Have you studied the feast of tabernacle? Do you know what it is? This may help you in understanding why jesus did not participate in the week long feast but only in certain parts of it.

His brothers asked him to openly go up and display himself as a prophetic miracle worker.
This is not what the feast is about. He refrained from doing this . Later going up to only partially fulfill this feast.

 

[TheLearner]

read to here

 

[posthuman]

Posthuman,

You say the “brothers” were murderers or didn’t believe because they wanted Jesus to perform more miracles at the festival. How you think like that as if they were evil or something?

Hello, welcome to the forums!

I said this because of this:

John 7:5-7
For even His brothers did not believe in Him. Then Jesus said to them, "My time has not yet come, but your time is always ready. The world cannot hate you, but it hates Me because I testify of it that its works are evil."



These do not believe Jesus. The Bible plainly says so.
Jesus identifies them with the world, saying the world cannot hate them, but the world hates Jesus. So Christ Himself says they hate Him. So it's Jesus who is saying they are wicked.
In another place Jesus says anyone who hates his brother is guilty of murder. So it's the Bible that says they are trying to murder Him.

So the Bible is telling me they are false brothers, unbelievers, and that they hate Jesus, and want to murder Him.
So you tell me, did you just not understand? Or do you not believe the Bible?

John 7 opens by telling us the people who hated Jesus were trying to kill Him, and Jesus wasn't going around publicly because of that. So you tell me, why do these half-brothers of His who do not believe Him, try to get Him to go into the middle of all the people who are trying to murder Him and draw as much attention to Himself as possible?
It's because they are trying to get Him killed.

 

[posthuman]

how you gonna judge anyone the same ever again?

How is it you're judging me?

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

thank you for bringing this topic up! it's really interesting.
it's something that, on the surface, looks like Jesus 'THE TRUTH' is being untruthful.

clearly that can't be the case -- which means that this passage is a lot more complex than it appears, and there's something absolutely wonderful hidden here, a gem, for us to dig out and understand.
it means we really need to study John 7:1-12 or so -- that we really need to understand all the elements of it to know why it is He says and does this, and what it means.

so we need to start asking questions and making a list of the big points here:

• the Jews are trying to kill Him, at this point ((v.1))
  • so He's in Galilee, not walking openly in Judea
• it's the feast of tabernacles ((v.2))
  • what is this feast, what's the spiritual significance, the 'substance' that the law of the feast is a shadow of?
  • the feast testifies of Christ - all scripture testifies of Him - how?
• his brothers are unbelievers ((v.5))
  • they want Him to go out publicly in Judea ((vv. 3-4))
    • why?
    • are they trying to get Him killed?
• He tells them "My time is not yet come: but your time is alway ready" ((v.6))
  • what's 'His time' ? when is 'His time' ?
    • what's it have to do with:
      • Tabernacles
      • the Jews trying to kill Him
      • their unbelief
      • He hides Himself
  • what's 'your time' ? why is it 'always ready' ?
    • what's 'the time of unbelief'?
    • the time of attempting to murder God?
• He says "The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil"
  • why is this here? right here? why is the perfect answer to them?
  • this isn't out of place at all -- it's God speaking; it's perfect
    • He's saying his unbelieving brothers works are evil
      • so what they say in vv. 3-4 is "evil"
      • revisit that
    • so by telling Him to go up to the feast with them, they are hating Him
• remaining in Galilee ((v.9)) He says then "Go ye up unto this feast: I go not up yet unto this feast: for my time is not yet full come." ((v.10))
  • why isn't He going yet?
    • why not with the unbelieving who hate Him and seek to kill Him, to tabernacles?
  • what does He mean, 'not yet full come' ?
    • how can His time be 'partially' come but not 'fully' come?
      • when is it fully time?
      • what's He waiting for?
        • if we think He's afraid, we blaspheme. that can't be it. He is God, and not afraid of anything
  • what's significant about staying in Galilee?
  • what's the OT compliment to this? where do we find a man of God staying in someplace like Galilee, refusing to go with unbelievers to something like Tabernacles, because the time is not yet right?
    • the unbelieving prophets looking for the body of Elijah - when Elisha tells them not to go, until they make him ashamed with their persistence? ((2 Kings 2)) ?
    • something else?
• after the unbelieving false brothers who hate Him and seek to kill Him and want Him to go to Judea performing signs leave, at some later point He goes to Tabernacles too, "as it were in secret" ((v.10))
  • how much time passes?
  • why does He go 'in secret' ?
    • what's the significance of God hiding Himself, in Tabernacles?
    • why is this not openly declared to unbelieving false brethren who want to murder God and demand signs from Him?
    • why does He teach in parables? ha!
• He's there presumably for the whole feast - but 'hiding Himself' - and then 'about the middle of the feast' He suddenly comes into the Temple and teaches. ((v.14))
  • is this "His time" fully come?
  • is it still 'partially come' ?
  • why in the middle of Tabernacles?
  • what does it mean that He reveals Himself by teaching in the temple?
  • reveals Himself to who?
  • reveals Himself as Who?

Outstanding. Did you turn to a commentary for this knowledge or is the above text penned from your own hand?

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

whenever it appears that God is a liar or that God is doing something that is sinful

Thanks again for your work. However, I have never said that Jesus sinned when he clearly told his "brothers" that he wouldn't be going to the festival. When Rahab clearly lied, I don't see this "lying" as a sin, for she saved the lives of Holy men in the process. Is that wrong? Is it wrong to lie in order to save the Lives of Righteous, Holy men? I would say "no, it isn't."

Did Jesus sin when He said what He said to His brothers? Impossible. There is no way that what Jesus did was a sin . . . utterly impossible, for I would never put my Faith and Trust into someone that wasn't perfect, and Jesus was certainly perfect.

 

[posthuman]

Outstanding. Did you turn to a commentary for this knowledge or is the above text penned from your own hand?

Aw, thanks!
That's all just my thoughts as I turned to look into it.

My pastor is a good teacher, I guess. He hardly ever directly answers questions, but teaches us how to figure things out on our own. I've learned to make lists, to ask lots of questions, and to pay lots of attention to details.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

2Timothy

I like the way you think

Posthuman,

You say the “brothers” were murderers or didn’t believe because they wanted Jesus to perform more miracles at the festival. How you think like that as if they were evil or something? The men already seen miracles so they already believed. They wanted those at the festival to see Jesus do miracles so those at the festival could believe. If Jesus did miracles for the apostles and brothers so they would believe He is God, then why on earth you act like these men were evil for having the loving intention that more people at the festival get to see that Jesus is God through miracles? I mean why do people like your doing judge people so rediculous as if humans are born with innate knowledge of how to be holy and other mysteries?

Also did you know that every character in Jesus story good or bad was so and acted so because God made them to be that way without their choice unawares? If that’s the case how you gonna judge anyone the same ever again?

What’s this verse say?

Acts 4:26
Why do the nations rage
and the peoples plot in vain?
26The kings of the earth take their stand
and the rulers gather together
against the Lord
and against His Anointed One.
27In fact, this is the very city where Herod and Pontius Pilate conspired with the Gentiles and the people of Israel against Your holy servant Jesus, whom You anointed. 28They carried out what Your hand and will had decided beforehand would happen.

Amplified
They did whatever Your hand and Your purpose PREDESTINED [before the creation of the world] to occur [and so WITHOUT KNOWING IT, they served Your own purpose].

Nice work, Brother. Very few at this forum want to accept the fact that the Lord is in control of all things. Verse 28 is the bomb!

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Aw, thanks!
That's all just my thoughts as I turned to look into it.

My pastor is a good teacher, I guess. He hardly ever directly answers questions, but teaches us how to figure things out on our own. I've learned to make lists, to ask lots of questions, and to pay lots of attention to details.

If you would, please give the majority of the credit to our Powerful God for allowing you to see the Truth. This ability does not come by our own Power, but we are Enabled to know the Truth. Your Eternal future looks very, very good.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Sorry for the long wait of my reply...family gathering.

Have you studied the feast of tabernacle? Do you know what it is? This may help you in understanding why jesus did not participate in the week long feast but only in certain parts of it.

His brothers asked him to openly go up and display himself as a prophetic miracle worker.
This is not what the feast is about. He refrained from doing this . Later going up to only partially fulfill this feast.

I'm not playing games. I asked you to show us what your Bible says, but you won't do it.

Take care.

 

[pottersclay]

I'm not playing games. I asked you to show us what your Bible says, but you won't do it.

Take care.

Wow...bet you attract a lot of fish with that bait😂😂😂

So I guess he never considered what feast it was and why....huh

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Wow...bet you attract a lot of fish with that bait😂😂😂

Thanks for your feedback.

 

[Blade]

Jesus says that only the Father knows when the 2nd coming will happen. I did not know that GOD would hide information from 1/3 of the Trinity. What am I missing here?

Well here on earth as man He did not know but who is He "“I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty. " "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. " Is He still a man sitting on the throne?

 

[posthuman]

If you would, please give the majority of the credit to our Powerful God for allowing you to see the Truth.

Thanks, you're right.

 

[HatedForNoReason]

Nice work, Brother. Very few at this forum want to accept the fact that the Lord is in control of all things. Verse 28 is the bomb!

Am glad God is in control of all things, removes fear of end times.

 

[HatedForNoReason]

Thanks for your feedback.

How Did Jesus Suffer Eternal Punishment in Only 3 Hours?
https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/jesus-eternal-punishment-hours/

https://testallthings.com/2012/01/02/a-study-of-mark-15-verses-33-and-34/

Jesus drank the cup of the wrath of God when he was on the cross, in order to pay for all of God’s elects’s sin debts. Jesus started drinking the cup of the wrath of God=sixth hour and finished at ninth hour. Jesus finished drinking the cup of the wrath of God when he said “It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.” (John 19:30)

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Am glad God is in control of all things, removes fear of end times.

100% - I wish that all people felt this way, for there is peace in knowing that God will work out all things accordingly. There isn't anything that we can do to change His Eternal Plan. No human will is greater than the Will of God, and it's absurd to think that the will of man would overturn the Will of God. Anyway, I'm just glad that the Lord is clearly in control of the direction of my life. I wouldn't be where I am if it weren't for the Holy Spirit. Because my Life has been completely Transformed, I am able to confidently say that the Bible is True in that when the Heart is Circumcised, a changed Heart is the result. Romans 2:28-29.

 

[TheLearner]

good night

 

[pottersclay]

thank you for bringing this topic up! it's really interesting.
it's something that, on the surface, looks like Jesus 'THE TRUTH' is being untruthful.

clearly that can't be the case -- which means that this passage is a lot more complex than it appears, and there's something absolutely wonderful hidden here, a gem, for us to dig out and understand.
it means we really need to study John 7:1-12 or so -- that we really need to understand all the elements of it to know why it is He says and does this, and what it means.

so we need to start asking questions and making a list of the big points here:

• the Jews are trying to kill Him, at this point ((v.1))
  • so He's in Galilee, not walking openly in Judea
• it's the feast of tabernacles ((v.2))
  • what is this feast, what's the spiritual significance, the 'substance' that the law of the feast is a shadow of?
  • the feast testifies of Christ - all scripture testifies of Him - how?
• his brothers are unbelievers ((v.5))
  • they want Him to go out publicly in Judea ((vv. 3-4))
    • why?
    • are they trying to get Him killed?
• He tells them "My time is not yet come: but your time is alway ready" ((v.6))
  • what's 'His time' ? when is 'His time' ?
    • what's it have to do with:
      • Tabernacles
      • the Jews trying to kill Him
      • their unbelief
      • He hides Himself
  • what's 'your time' ? why is it 'always ready' ?
    • what's 'the time of unbelief'?
    • the time of attempting to murder God?
• He says "The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil"
  • why is this here? right here? why is the perfect answer to them?
  • this isn't out of place at all -- it's God speaking; it's perfect
    • He's saying his unbelieving brothers works are evil
      • so what they say in vv. 3-4 is "evil"
      • revisit that
    • so by telling Him to go up to the feast with them, they are hating Him
• remaining in Galilee ((v.9)) He says then "Go ye up unto this feast: I go not up yet unto this feast: for my time is not yet full come." ((v.10))
  • why isn't He going yet?
    • why not with the unbelieving who hate Him and seek to kill Him, to tabernacles?
  • what does He mean, 'not yet full come' ?
    • how can His time be 'partially' come but not 'fully' come?
      • when is it fully time?
      • what's He waiting for?
        • if we think He's afraid, we blaspheme. that can't be it. He is God, and not afraid of anything
  • what's significant about staying in Galilee?
  • what's the OT compliment to this? where do we find a man of God staying in someplace like Galilee, refusing to go with unbelievers to something like Tabernacles, because the time is not yet right?
    • the unbelieving prophets looking for the body of Elijah - when Elisha tells them not to go, until they make him ashamed with their persistence? ((2 Kings 2)) ?
    • something else?
• after the unbelieving false brothers who hate Him and seek to kill Him and want Him to go to Judea performing signs leave, at some later point He goes to Tabernacles too, "as it were in secret" ((v.10))
  • how much time passes?
  • why does He go 'in secret' ?
    • what's the significance of God hiding Himself, in Tabernacles?
    • why is this not openly declared to unbelieving false brethren who want to murder God and demand signs from Him?
    • why does He teach in parables? ha!
• He's there presumably for the whole feast - but 'hiding Himself' - and then 'about the middle of the feast' He suddenly comes into the Temple and teaches. ((v.14))
  • is this "His time" fully come?
  • is it still 'partially come' ?
  • why in the middle of Tabernacles?
  • what does it mean that He reveals Himself by teaching in the temple?
  • reveals Himself to who?
  • reveals Himself as Who?

Post human its everything to do with his first coming. The feast of tabernacle is the second coming.
The feast last a week there are 2 things jesus did that is significant to this feast.

Pointing to moses
The pouring of water over the alter.
Study the feast of the tabernacle....or feast of booths..same.

 

[HatedForNoReason]

100% - I wish that all people felt this way, for there is peace in knowing that God will work out all things accordingly. There isn't anything that we can do to change His Eternal Plan. No human will is greater than the Will of God, and it's absurd to think that the will of man would overturn the Will of God. Anyway, I'm just glad that the Lord is clearly in control of the direction of my life. I wouldn't be where I am if it weren't for the Holy Spirit. Because my Life has been completely Transformed, I am able to confidently say that the Bible is True in that when the Heart is Circumcised, a changed Heart is the result. Romans 2:28-29.

So when you received the Holy Spirit, what was the affect it gave you?