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[Live4Him]

Hear two more parables of JESUS:

Matthew chapter 25

[1] Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.
[2] And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.
[3] They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:
[4] But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.
[5] While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.
[6] And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
[7] Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.
[8] And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
[9] But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.
[10] And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.
[11] Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
[12] But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.
[13] Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.

Here, we have an account of ten virgins (vs. 1), and not an account of five virgins and five fornicators, whores, adulteresses, etc. All ten of these virgins “took their lamps and went forth to meet the bridegroom” (vs. 1).

Who is “the bridegroom"?

Of course, it’s none other than Jesus Christ (John 3:29). In other words, all ten of these virgins were saved at some point in time and they were all awaiting the second coming of Jesus Christ. However, five of these virgins were wise, and five were foolish (vs. 2). Those who “were foolish took their lamps and took no oil with them” (vs. 3). We know that “oil” signifies the anointing in scripture, but we are not to mistakenly believe that these five foolish virgins were never anointed or never Christians to begin with.

Why shouldn’t we make such a mistake?

Well, because we are told of the five foolish virgins “our lamps are gone out” (vs. 8). A lamp cannot “go out” if it was never lit to begin with. In other words, these five foolish virgins initially had lamps which were lit with “oil”, or they all initially had the light of Christ in them in that they were born again of his Spirit.

Were these five foolish virgins “once saved, always saved”?

No, they were not. In fact, Jesus ultimately shut the door to them (vs. 10) and told them, “Verily I say unto you, I know you not” (vs. 12).

Continuing on in this same 25th chapter of Matthew’s gospel, we read:

[14] For the kingdom of heaven is as a man travelling into a far country, who called his own servants, and delivered unto them his goods.
[15] And unto one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one; to every man according to his several ability; and straightway took his journey.
[16] Then he that had received the five talents went and traded with the same, and made them other five talents.
[17] And likewise he that had received two, he also gained other two.
[18] But he that had received one went and digged in the earth, and hid his lord's money.
[19] After a long time the lord of those servants cometh, and reckoneth with them.
[20] And so he that had received five talents came and brought other five talents, saying, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me five talents: behold, I have gained beside them five talents more.
[21] His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
[22] He also that had received two talents came and said, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me two talents: behold, I have gained two other talents beside them.
[23] His lord said unto him, Well done, good and faithful servant; thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
[24] Then he which had received the one talent came and said, Lord, I knew thee that thou art an hard man, reaping where thou hast not sown, and gathering where thou hast not strawed:
[25] And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.
[26] His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
[27] Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
[28] Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.
[29] For unto every one that hath shall be given, and he shall have abundance: but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath.
[30] And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Here, we see the same exact principle.

All three of the “servants” in this parable are “his own servants” (vs. 14) in that Jesus is “the lord of those servants” (vs. 19). All three of the Lord’s servants were given "talents" (vs. 15) by Jesus, but one of them had it taken back by Jesus (vs. 28) because he didn’t give it back to the Lord with “usury” or interest (vss. 26-27), and he was ultimately “cast…into outer darkness” where “there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth” (vs. 30).

Again, does this sounds like Jesus was teaching “once saved, always saved”?

Of course, he wasn’t, and he never did.

 

[throughfaith]

You are correct, the gospel of the kingdom, which was preached by Jesus in the 4 gospels, does not allow OSAS

Yes this is what happens. Trying to prove salvation can be lost from places that don't apply to the body of christ .

 

[throughfaith]

Hear two more parables of JESUS:

Matthew chapter 25

[1] Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.
[2] And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.
[3] They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:
[4] But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.
[5] While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.
[6] And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
[7] Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.
[8] And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
[9] But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.
[10] And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.
[11] Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
[12] But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.
[13] Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.

Here, we have an account of ten virgins (vs. 1), and not an account of five virgins and five fornicators, whores, adulteresses, etc. All ten of these virgins “took their lamps and went forth to meet the bridegroom” (vs. 1).

Who is “the bridegroom"?

Of course, it’s none other than Jesus Christ (John 3:29). In other words, all ten of these virgins were saved at some point in time and they were all awaiting the second coming of Jesus Christ. However, five of these virgins were wise, and five were foolish (vs. 2). Those who “were foolish took their lamps and took no oil with them” (vs. 3). We know that “oil” signifies the anointing in scripture, but we are not to mistakenly believe that these five foolish virgins were never anointed or never Christians to begin with.

Why shouldn’t we make such a mistake?

Well, because we are told of the five foolish virgins “our lamps are gone out” (vs. 8). A lamp cannot “go out” if it was never lit to begin with. In other words, these five foolish virgins initially had lamps which were lit with “oil”, or they all initially had the light of Christ in them in that they were born again of his Spirit.

Were these five foolish virgins “once saved, always saved”?

No, they were not. In fact, Jesus ultimately shut the door to them (vs. 10) and told them, “Verily I say unto you, I know you not” (vs. 12).

Continuing on in this same 25th chapter of Matthew’s gospel, we read:

[14] For the kingdom of heaven is as a man travelling into a far country, who called his own servants, and delivered unto them his goods.
[15] And unto one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one; to every man according to his several ability; and straightway took his journey.
[16] Then he that had received the five talents went and traded with the same, and made them other five talents.
[17] And likewise he that had received two, he also gained other two.
[18] But he that had received one went and digged in the earth, and hid his lord's money.
[19] After a long time the lord of those servants cometh, and reckoneth with them.
[20] And so he that had received five talents came and brought other five talents, saying, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me five talents: behold, I have gained beside them five talents more.
[21] His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
[22] He also that had received two talents came and said, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me two talents: behold, I have gained two other talents beside them.
[23] His lord said unto him, Well done, good and faithful servant; thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
[24] Then he which had received the one talent came and said, Lord, I knew thee that thou art an hard man, reaping where thou hast not sown, and gathering where thou hast not strawed:
[25] And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.
[26] His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
[27] Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
[28] Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.
[29] For unto every one that hath shall be given, and he shall have abundance: but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath.
[30] And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Here, we see the same exact principle.

All three of the “servants” in this parable are “his own servants” (vs. 14) in that Jesus is “the lord of those servants” (vs. 19). All three of the Lord’s servants were given "talents" (vs. 15) by Jesus, but one of them had it taken back by Jesus (vs. 28) because he didn’t give it back to the Lord with “usury” or interest (vss. 26-27), and he was ultimately “cast…into outer darkness” where “there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth” (vs. 30).

Again, does this sounds like Jesus was teaching “once saved, always saved”?

Of course, he wasn’t, and he never did.

Your applying verses that don't describe the body of christ . Yes you could lose salvation in the OT and during the tribulation it will be the same ( taking the Mark of the beast for example ) . The wise and foolish virgin ( s ) have nothing to do with the body of christ .

 

[Live4Him]

Your applying verses that don't describe the body of christ . Yes you could lose salvation in the OT and during the tribulation it will be the same ( taking the Mark of the beast for example ) . The wise and foolish virgin ( s ) have nothing to do with the body of christ .

There is but one gospel, and it is the gospel of the kingdom, with Christ as its King.

I know, from reading many of your posts throughout this forum, that you disagree, based in part on what Jesus' disciples preached prior to his death, burial, and resurrection. To that point, they should have known about his pending death, burial, and resurrection because Jesus not only told them about the same, but the Old Testament scriptures consistently foretold of the same as well. Their problem stemmed from their mistaken belief that Christ would establish the kingdom of God here on earth at his first coming, and he needed to inform them that it wouldn't happen until his second coming.

In fact, this was the purpose behind the following parable of Jesus:

Luke chapter 19

[11] And as they heard these things, he added and spake a parable, because he was nigh to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear.
[12] He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.
[13] And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come.
[14] But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying, We will not have this man to reign over us.
[15] And it came to pass, that when he was returned, having received the kingdom, then he commanded these servants to be called unto him, to whom he had given the money, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading.
[16] Then came the first, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained ten pounds.
[17] And he said unto him, Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities.
[18] And the second came, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained five pounds.
[19] And he said likewise to him, Be thou also over five cities.
[20] And another came, saying, Lord, behold, here is thy pound, which I have kept laid up in a napkin:
[21] For I feared thee, because thou art an austere man: thou takest up that thou layedst not down, and reapest that thou didst not sow.
[22] And he saith unto him, Out of thine own mouth will I judge thee, thou wicked servant. Thou knewest that I was an austere man, taking up that I laid not down, and reaping that I did not sow:
[23] Wherefore then gavest not thou my money into the bank, that at my coming I might have required mine own with usury?
[24] And he said unto them that stood by, Take from him the pound, and give it to him that hath ten pounds.
[25] (And they said unto him, Lord, he hath ten pounds.)
[26] For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him.
[27] But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.

It had long been prophesied that Christ, as the prophesied son of David, would sit on David's throne within a temple in Jerusalem from which he shall reign over this earth. A lot of the people believed this, but they believed that it would happen at his first coming, and not at a second coming. In other words, they missed the whole part about him having to FIRST be crucified, buried, resurrected, and ascended back to heaven. This is where you and certain others here are missing it. It's still the same coming kingdom that applies to all of us, but some people had the timing of its coming wrong.

Anyhow, as was the case in Matthew's parable, we once again see a servant of Christ having that which was initially given him taken away, so this whole "once saved, always saved" nonsense flies directly in the face of what Christ himself taught.

 

[Live4Him]

Hear another parable of JESUS:

Luke chapter 14

[25] And there went great multitudes with him: and he turned, and said unto them,
[26] If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
[27] And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.
[28] For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have sufficient to finish it?
[29] Lest haply, after he hath laid the foundation, and is not able to finish it, all that behold it begin to mock him,
[30] Saying, This man began to build, and was not able to finish.
[31] Or what king, going to make war against another king, sitteth not down first, and consulteth whether he be able with ten thousand to meet him that cometh against him with twenty thousand?
[32] Or else, while the other is yet a great way off, he sendeth an ambassage, and desireth conditions of peace.
[33] So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.
[34] Salt is good: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be seasoned?
[35] It is neither fit for the land, nor yet for the dunghill; but men cast it out. He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.

Unlike the compromising "hirelings" (John 10:12) of today, Jesus didn't tickle the ears of his audience. Instead, he told the great multitudes that followed him exactly what the cost of discipleship is.

If our love for others doesn't seem to be hatred by comparison to our love for Jesus, then we cannot be his disciples.

Similarly, if we do not truly bear our crosses or if we truly are not crucified with Christ to this world, then we cannot be his disciples.

As we're about to see yet again, even if we begin correctly, then we simply are not saved if we do not endure to the end.

Regarding the builders of towers, we need to FIRST sit down and count the cost to see whether or not we have sufficient to finish it (vs. 28).

Why?

Well, because even after we have laid the foundation (vs. 29), and there is no other foundation that can be laid other than Jesus Christ (I Cor. 3:11), we still might not be able to finish it (vss. 29-30). Again, it matters not if we begin correctly if we do not endure unto the end to be saved.

The same exact principle applies to those going to war (vs. 31). Again, we need to FIRST sit down and consult whether we are able to overcome our enemy (vs. 31) or else we will ultimately send out an ambassage or ambassadors and desire conditions of peace with the enemy of our souls, Satan (vs. 32). Those who make peace with Satan simply are not saved.

As Jesus continued on to say, we simply must forsake all that we have in order to be his disciples (vs. 33).

Jesus also warned of salt that has lost its savor or its saltiness (vs. 34). Christians are called to be "the salt of the earth" (Matt. 5:13), but we can lose our saltiness. Again, it doesn't matter if we begin "salty". What matters is that we remain "salty" until the end.

What happens to us if we don't?

Well, Jesus said that we're not even fit for a dunghill or to be thrown in a heap of crap (vs. 35). No, instead, he said that we'll be "cast out" (vs. 35). Those who are "cast out" are not “once saved, always saved”.

Anyhow, Jesus never taught anything even remotely close to "once saved, always saved". Instead, he regularly taught the polar opposite because he wasn't a man-pleasing heretic like many today.

 

[throughfaith]

There is but one gospel, and it is the gospel of the kingdom, with Christ as its King.

I know, from reading many of your posts throughout this forum, that you disagree, based in part on what Jesus' disciples preached prior to his death, burial, and resurrection. To that point, they should have known about his pending death, burial, and resurrection because Jesus not only told them about the same, but the Old Testament scriptures consistently foretold of the same as well. Their problem stemmed from their mistaken belief that Christ would establish the kingdom of God here on earth at his first coming, and he needed to inform them that it wouldn't happen until his second coming.

In fact, this was the purpose behind the following parable of Jesus:

Luke chapter 19

[11] And as they heard these things, he added and spake a parable, because he was nigh to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear.
[12] He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.
[13] And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come.
[14] But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying, We will not have this man to reign over us.
[15] And it came to pass, that when he was returned, having received the kingdom, then he commanded these servants to be called unto him, to whom he had given the money, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading.
[16] Then came the first, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained ten pounds.
[17] And he said unto him, Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities.
[18] And the second came, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained five pounds.
[19] And he said likewise to him, Be thou also over five cities.
[20] And another came, saying, Lord, behold, here is thy pound, which I have kept laid up in a napkin:
[21] For I feared thee, because thou art an austere man: thou takest up that thou layedst not down, and reapest that thou didst not sow.
[22] And he saith unto him, Out of thine own mouth will I judge thee, thou wicked servant. Thou knewest that I was an austere man, taking up that I laid not down, and reaping that I did not sow:
[23] Wherefore then gavest not thou my money into the bank, that at my coming I might have required mine own with usury?
[24] And he said unto them that stood by, Take from him the pound, and give it to him that hath ten pounds.
[25] (And they said unto him, Lord, he hath ten pounds.)
[26] For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him.
[27] But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.

It had long been prophesied that Christ, as the prophesied son of David, would sit on David's throne within a temple in Jerusalem from which he shall reign over this earth. A lot of the people believed this, but they believed that it would happen at his first coming, and not at a second coming. In other words, they missed the whole part about him having to FIRST be crucified, buried, resurrected, and ascended back to heaven. This is where you and certain others here are missing it. It's still the same coming kingdom that applies to all of us, but some people had the timing of its coming wrong.

Anyhow, as was the case in Matthew's parable, we once again see a servant of Christ having that which was initially given him taken away, so this whole "once saved, always saved" nonsense flies directly in the face of what Christ himself taught.

Today..are you not sealed unto the day of redemption?

 

[Live4Him]

Today..are you not sealed unto the day of redemption?

A seal can be broken, as anybody in their right mind knows.

The Bible uses certain words for specific reasons.

 

[throughfaith]

Hear another parable of JESUS:

Luke chapter 14

[25] And there went great multitudes with him: and he turned, and said unto them,
[26] If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
[27] And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.
[28] For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have sufficient to finish it?
[29] Lest haply, after he hath laid the foundation, and is not able to finish it, all that behold it begin to mock him,
[30] Saying, This man began to build, and was not able to finish.
[31] Or what king, going to make war against another king, sitteth not down first, and consulteth whether he be able with ten thousand to meet him that cometh against him with twenty thousand?
[32] Or else, while the other is yet a great way off, he sendeth an ambassage, and desireth conditions of peace.
[33] So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.
[34] Salt is good: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be seasoned?
[35] It is neither fit for the land, nor yet for the dunghill; but men cast it out. He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.

Unlike the compromising "hirelings" (John 10:12) of today, Jesus didn't tickle the ears of his audience. Instead, he told the great multitudes that followed him exactly what the cost of discipleship is.

If our love for others doesn't seem to be hatred by comparison to our love for Jesus, then we cannot be his disciples.

Similarly, if we do not truly bear our crosses or if we truly are not crucified with Christ to this world, then we cannot be his disciples.

As we're about to see yet again, even if we begin correctly, then we simply are not saved if we do not endure to the end.

Regarding the builders of towers, we need to FIRST sit down and count the cost to see whether or not we have sufficient to finish it (vs. 28).

Why?

Well, because even after we have laid the foundation (vs. 29), and there is no other foundation that can be laid other than Jesus Christ (I Cor. 3:11), we still might not be able to finish it (vss. 29-30). Again, it matters not if we begin correctly if we do not endure unto the end to be saved.

The same exact principle applies to those going to war (vs. 31). Again, we need to FIRST sit down and consult whether we are able to overcome our enemy (vs. 31) or else we will ultimately send out an ambassage or ambassadors and desire conditions of peace with the enemy of our souls, Satan (vs. 32). Those who make peace with Satan simply are not saved.

As Jesus continued on to say, we simply must forsake all that we have in order to be his disciples (vs. 33).

Jesus also warned of salt that has lost its savor or its saltiness (vs. 34). Christians are called to be "the salt of the earth" (Matt. 5:13), but we can lose our saltiness. Again, it doesn't matter if we begin "salty". What matters is that we remain "salty" until the end.

What happens to us if we don't?

Well, Jesus said that we're not even fit for a dunghill or to be thrown in a heap of crap (vs. 35). No, instead, he said that we'll be "cast out" (vs. 35). Those who are "cast out" are not “once saved, always saved”.

Anyhow, Jesus never taught anything even remotely close to "once saved, always saved". Instead, he regularly taught the polar opposite because he wasn't a man-pleasing heretic like many today.

Yes in the OT you could lose salvation . Do you have anything that applies to the person in Christ who's sealed by the Holy Spirit unto the day of redemption. Circumcised with the circumcision made WITHOUT hands ? your pointing to the OT and the tribulation ect where there is no sealing of the Holy Spirit unto the day of redemption. No regeneration, No spiritual circumcision. No one had Jesus ' in ' them. No one was predestined. No one was ' seated in heavenly places in Christ . No one was in the body of Christ. I could go on and on and on ......

 

[gb9]

A seal can be broken, as anybody in their right mind knows.

The Bible uses certain words for specific reasons.

here is a question- does Jesus save you, or does Jesus give you a chance to get saved, but it is up to you to maintain that salvation.

 

[Live4Him]

Today..are you not sealed unto the day of redemption?

Regarding this very same "seal", we read:

"Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts." (II Cor. 1:22)

As I've previously mentioned to you and others on another thread, Paul's use of the word "earnest" pertains directly to "earnest money":

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/e/earnest-money.asp

What Is Earnest Money?

Earnest money is a deposit made to a seller that represents a buyer's good faith to buy a home. The money gives the buyer extra time to get financing and conduct the title search, property appraisal, and inspections before closing. In many ways, earnest money can be considered a deposit on a home, an escrow deposit, or good faith money.

Earnest money can be returned to the potential purchaser before the purchase is complete. In fact, I've personally had earnest money returned to me twice.

Like I said, the Bible uses certain words for specific reasons.

 

[throughfaith]

A seal can be broken, as anybody in their right mind knows.

The Bible uses certain words for specific reasons.

It doesn't say that does it . THE seal IS the Holy spirit . Not like a stamp you get on your hand at a fun fair lol . It literally tells you, were sealed unto the day of redemption PREDESTINED to it by God . the Holy Spirit being the GUARENTEE. No were says anything like a condition. That we are sealed until we mess up ect .
Eph 1.13 is also crystal clear. No need to go into the Ot to change the meaning.
13¶In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

 

[Live4Him]

here is a question- does Jesus save you, or does Jesus give you a chance to get saved, but it is up to you to maintain that salvation.

I have a question for you.

If you answer it correctly, then you'll have the correct answer to your own question as well.

When a marriage takes place, can either party break the covenant thereafter via adultery or departing?

In scripture, Christ is the Bridegroom and the church is his bride.

 

[throughfaith]

Regarding this very same "seal", we read:

"Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts." (II Cor. 1:22)

As I've previously mentioned to you and others on another thread, Paul's use of the word "earnest" pertains directly to "earnest money":

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/e/earnest-money.asp

What Is Earnest Money?

Earnest money is a deposit made to a seller that represents a buyer's good faith to buy a home. The money gives the buyer extra time to get financing and conduct the title search, property appraisal, and inspections before closing. In many ways, earnest money can be considered a deposit on a home, an escrow deposit, or good faith money.

Earnest money can be returned to the potential purchaser before the purchase is complete. In fact, I've personally had earnest money returned to me twice.

Like I said, the Bible uses certain words for specific reasons.

Again your analogies could only apply to fallible and untrustworthy men . The Bible however doesn't include the description along side those verses in Eph 1.13 and eph 4.30 . Your adding the doubt in . Paul was quite capable of including a " your sealed so long as you don't mess up , be sure to maintain that seal now " wink 😉

 

[Live4Him]

It doesn't say that does it . THE seal IS the Holy spirit . Not like a stamp you get on your hand at a fun fair lol . It literally tells you, were sealed unto the day of redemption PREDESTINED to it by God . the Holy Spirit being the GUARENTEE. No were says anything like a condition. That we are sealed until we mess up ect .
Eph 1.13 is also crystal clear. No need to go into the Ot to change the meaning.
13¶In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

In trying to refute my point, you only managed to prove it because of your ignorance (willful?...I have explained it to you twice already) surrounding the meaning of the word "earnest".

Again, it pertains to "earnest money" which can be returned to the purchaser before the purchase is complete.

In relation to our redemption, it is not yet complete.

Instead, we're waiting for the redemption of our bodies.

Romans chapter 8

[22] For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
[23] And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

This "firstfruits of the Spirit" is the same "earnest of the Spirit" that Paul wrote of elsewhere.

 

[throughfaith]

I have a question for you.

If you answer it correctly, then you'll have the correct answer to your own question as well.

When a marriage takes place, can either party break the covenant thereafter via adultery or departing?

In scripture, Christ is the Bridegroom and the church is his bride.

Salvation today is not a contract. Its not a commitment. We don't make a covenant with God today. This is not church age salvation . You will find no verse like this that applies to the body of Christ . Your adding in factors which don't apply .

 

[Live4Him]

Again your analogies could only apply to fallible and untrustworthy men . The Bible however doesn't include the description along side those verses in Eph 1.13 and eph 4.30 . Your adding the doubt in . Paul was quite capable of including a " your sealed so long as you don't mess up , be sure to maintain that seal now " wink 😉

And he did just that by using the word "earnest" in relation to the same...whether you like it or not.

 

[Live4Him]

Salvation today is not a contract. Its not a commitment. We don't make a covenant with God today. This is not church age salvation . You will find no verse like this that applies to the body of Christ . Your adding in factors which don't apply .

Wow!

I'll wait to see if anybody else here refutes that nonsense before commenting on it myself.

I need to take care of some things now. Be back later.

 

[throughfaith]

In trying to refute my point, you only managed to prove it because of your ignorance (willful?...I have explained it to you twice already) surrounding the meaning of the word "earnest".

Again, it pertains to "earnest money" which can be returned to the purchaser before the purchase is complete.

In relation to our redemption, it is not yet complete.

Instead, we're waiting for the redemption of our bodies.

Romans chapter 8

[22] For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
[23] And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

This "firstfruits of the Spirit" is the same "earnest of the Spirit" that Paul wrote of elsewhere.

We haven't received ' money ' . Its not even remotely the same. GOD SEALS !!! the person, for how long ? glad you asked UNTO THE DAY OF REDEMPTION.
We have no control over it . Just like we have no control over this .

¶In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

12Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

13And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

Your probably going to tell me about vasectomy reversals as a comparison on this one 😜

How about this one .
4¶But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

5Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved

6And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

You might say that sure we can un seat ourselves from Christ .
We can reverse regeneration, change predestination to the Adoption, Make ourselves un alive in Christ . make ourselves unjustified or to reverse God's decision, give back the righteousness of Christ imputed to us ?

 

[throughfaith]

And he did just that by using the word "earnest" in relation to the same...whether you like it or not.

Your assuming things the bible doesn't say .

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Why do I feel like somebody just offered me a baloney sandwich?

Would you like to address the words of Jesus which I've already presented here?

Lets see.

You gave one passage

I gave many passage,

and this is a baloney sandwich?

In the passage you gave, there was only one true saved person

4 And it happened, as he sowed, that some seed fell by the wayside; and the birds [a]of the air came and devoured it. 5 Some fell on stony ground, where it did not have much earth; and immediately it sprang up because it had no depth of earth. 6 But when the sun was up it was scorched, and because it had no root it withered away. 7 And some seed fell among thorns; and the thorns grew up and choked it, and it yielded no [b]crop. 8 But other seed fell on good ground and yielded a crop that sprang up, increased and produced: some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some a hundred.”

If you look here. Only one produced fruit. All the rest did not produce fruit. The reason is is because they were not saved. How can one be saved and not produce fruit? Fruit is produced by work. If one claims to have faith yet has no work (proven by the fact they have no fruit) can that faith save them?

Sorry Bro Your passage does not support you, Call it a bologny sandwich all you want.

The other ones were easily taken away because they had no faith. I used all the passages I posted to try to show you this. Now can you show me how I am wrong?