When God saves someone, repentance and good works will follow. We don't repent first and then become saved, that would be a salvation based on works. I agree that anyone who claims to be saved and yet still lives in their sins as before are just kidding themselves. True salvation brings true repentance and good works, not the other way around.
God bless.
Tom
Look at the order.
Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
Repent (change of mind) -----------> Conversion (change of action) ---------------> Sins forgiven.
Look at the order...
Luk 15:16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.
Luk 15:17 And when
he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!
Luk 15:18
I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,
Luk 15:19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.
Luk 15:20 And
he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.
Luk 15:21 And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight, and am no more worthy to be called thy son.
Luk 15:22 But the father said to his servants, Bring forth the best robe, and put it on him; and put a ring on his hand, and shoes on his feet:
Luk 15:23 And bring hither the fatted calf, and kill it; and let us eat, and be merry:
Luk 15:24 For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.
Came to himself (changed his mind) -------------> Left the pig pen (conversion/change of action) ------------> Return to father confessing sins ------------------> forgiveness and restoration granted.
Look at the order...
Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Wickedness layed aside (repentance and conversion) -------------------> received the word with meekness --------------------> soul saved.
Look at the order...
Pro 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.
Sins confessed and forsaken ---------------------> Forgiveness granted.
Look at the order...
1Jn 1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that
God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
1Jn 1:7 But
if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
Walking in the light with no darkness at all ---------------------------------> Cleansed by the blood.
Look at the order...
2Co 7:10 For
godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
2Co 7:11 For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
Godly sorrow --------------------> Repentance -------------------> Salvation
Yet what do you say?
"When God saves someone, repentance and good works will follow. We don't repent first and then become saved, that would be a salvation based on works."
Salvation ----------------------> Repentance/good works.
You have it completely backwards.
Your Gospel is in REVERSE!
Read these verses with more care.
Eph 2:8 For by
grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Grace is the gift of God. It is through this grace by which we are saved. There are no works we could do to somehow conjure up salvation apart from grace. That is what Paul is teaching here. Salvation is sourced in what God does. Yet we have to yield to that grace by faith.
The faith through which we are saved is the DOING of the word. God provides the word by His grace and we are to do it.
Jesus said...
Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine,
and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
It looks like a works salvation to me. Jesus said DO. You won't find Jesus saying anywhere DON'T DO ANYTHING. In fact he says the opposite...
Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
Mat 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
Mat 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
Mat 25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
Mat 25:35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
Mat 25:36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.
Mat 25:37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
Mat 25:38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
Mat 25:39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
Mat 25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as
ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
Mat 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
Mat 25:42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
Mat 25:43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
Mat 25:44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
Mat 25:45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
Those who DID found eternal life and those who DID NOT were cast out. Every single parable is like that, those that DO and those that DO NOT. yet people say "it is not of works." That is a satanic lie.
it is not of WORKS DONE APART FROM GOD. Salvation is most definitely of WORKS DONE IN FAITHFUL OBEDIENCE.
Heb 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Who is God the author of salvation of? Those whom OBEY Him.
Why?
Because those whom OBEY have a REAL FAITH which puts into effect GRACE. Hence they are saved by GRACE THROUGH FAITH.
You see GRACE TAUGHT THEM...
Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that,
denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
They yielded to that teaching and put it into practice and thus they were redeemed and made pure.
Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
They were redeemed because they walked in the light as He is in the light because they denied ungodliness and worldly lusts and thus they were cleansed by the blood.
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
They were WORKERS TOGETHER with God putting to use the grace of God by their faith.
2Co 6:1 We then, as
workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain.
Thus they did not receive that GRACE IN VAIN. In other words they did not receive that grace to NO EFFECT.
Instead they were cleansed by their obedient faith...
1Pe 1:22 Seeing ye have
purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:
Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them,
purifying their hearts by faith.
Joh 15:3 Now ye are
clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and
receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Jas 1:22 But
be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
It's very simple. The question though is will you receive it?
You directly contradicted what the Bible teaches. You can either deny it, ignore it and try to isolate and twist some scripture and take that to the judgement.
Or you can examine these things carefully and dig deep into the Bible and see if what I am saying is the truth.
Jesus said this...
Mat 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Does that sound like what you are hearing in the churches or even on these boards?
The ball is in your court.
God bless.
