How Old Is The Earth?

[Percepi]

You first stated there was nothing in the bible that said otherwise and I said you may want to take another look. That means study for YOURSELF. I won't do it for you.

If you aren't willing to back up your claims, don't expect people to believe your claims. If you won't go further to back up your claims after I addressed the few you provided, maybe it's you who needs to study the Bible. Someone else provided verses of the Bible for me to look up, so I'll have to get around to that.

The answers are right there in Genesis.

Is it? I've read Genesis. The answer is not there.

God permitted man and animals to eat plants.

This is assumed - not stated. (God stated Man can eat fruits, but this didn't include animals).

Yes. Also, most evolutionists don't believe in God.

Most atheists accept the theory of evolution, but the majority of evolutionists are Christian.

Many don't want anything to do with Him.

Considering how most evolutionists are Christian, what you said is wrong.

Sadly it seems the vast majority of Christians in the Western world seem to be theistic evolutionists though.

Actually, you're correct with this one.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You first stated there was nothing in the bible that said otherwise and I said you may want to take another look. That means study for YOURSELF. I won't do it for you. The answers are right there in Genesis. God permitted man and animals to eat plants. He never permitted them to eat meat. BElieve what you want. It isn't my words you are calling asinine. It's Gods. You can take that disagreement up with Him.

the first death was when God covered the nakedness of man.

Talk about showing how sin not only caused man to die spiritually. But how it affected the whole earth.

 

[Percepi]

the first death was when God covered the nakedness of man.

This, literally, doesn't make sense. Yes, it's a metaphor. But, that's the problem, it's a metaphor. You can't treat metaphors literal.

Second, it never states that in the Bible. Again, you're assuming.

Third, the Bible doesn't describe how the rest of the Earth was affected by sin (or rather, it doesn't specify animals began to eat meat).

 

[eternally-gratefull]

This, literally, doesn't make sense. Yes, it's a metaphor. But, that's the problem, it's a metaphor. You can't treat metaphors literal.

it was not A metaphor.

is that what you do take things you can not explain and make a metaphor out of them.. what church are you a part of?

Second, it never states that in the Bible. Again, you're assuming.

Third, the Bible doesn't describe how the rest of the Earth was affected by sin (or rather, it doesn't specify animals began to eat meat).

lol.. wow.. all I can say is wow...

 

[Elizabeth619]

I

f you aren't willing to back up your claims, don't expect people to believe your claims. If you won't go further to back up your claims after I addressed the few you provided, maybe it's you who needs to study the Bible. Someone else provided verses of the Bible for me to look up, so I'll have to get around to that.

Actually, the fact the I study the bible is how I know this stuff. One thing you also should understand is one learns by studying on their own. Not by others telling them. Only lazy people refuse to research facts.

Is it? I've read Genesis. The answer is not there.

My apologies. I had no idea you don't understand the bible.

29 God said, “I am giving you all the grain bearing plants and all the fruit trees. These trees make fruit with seeds in it. This grain and fruit will be your food.30 And I am giving all the green plants to the animals. These green plants will be their food. Every animal on earth, every bird in the air, and all the little things that crawl on the earth will eat that food.” And all these things happened. Gen 1:29-30



This is assumed - not stated. (God stated Man can eat fruits, but this didn't include animals).
Here is you a little link for you to look at.
Biblically, Could Death Have Existed before Sin? - Answers in Genesis

 

[Elizabeth619]

Romans 5:12
Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned

 

[Percepi]

it was not A metaphor.

Then it's total gibberish.

How is nudity "death"? Do you even know what the definition of nudity and death are? The only way your statement could make sense is if it was a metaphor, where nudity represented spiritual death - I gave you the benefit of the doubt on that one.

Actually, the fact the I study the bible is how I know this stuff. One thing you also should understand is one learns by studying on their own. Not by others telling them. Only lazy people refuse to research facts.

Actually, that's entirely wrong. There's a good reason why we use teachers in schools, why we specify on papers not only our sources but the specific locations of those sources.

29 God said, “I am giving you all the grain bearing plants and all the fruit trees. These trees make fruit with seeds in it. This grain and fruit will be your food.

Alright, I stand corrected. I forgot about this verse.

Romans 5:12
Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned

This verse is clearly referring to men, not other species of animal.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Then it's total gibberish.

How is nudity "death"? Do you even know what the definition of nudity and death are? The only way your statement could make sense is if it was a metaphor, where nudity represented spiritual death - I gave you the benefit of the doubt on that one.



Actually, that's entirely wrong. There's a good reason why we use teachers in schools, why we specify on papers not only our sources but the specific locations of those sources.



Alright, I stand corrected. I forgot about this verse.



This verse is clearly referring to men, not other species of animal.

again, why are you hear?? do you think your going to convince us your anti biblical crap and get us to leave God?

 

[Percepi]

I took a look at the link you provided and skimmed through it. I have no problem with its literal interpretation of the Bible - I disagree, but it's all in context. But I do have a problem with the website lying about the views of "secularists". Secularists refer to people who want to keep religion out of certain organizations. Secularists tend to want religion out of government, or you have secular schools - referring to schools that are separate from religion. There isn't a "secularist" view of death. There's a naturalist view of death - but AnswersInGenesis wants to pretend those two are the same.

More importantly, there are many Christians who take certain parts of the Bible figuratively. Not all Christians believe in young earth creationism. To suggest only "secularists" believe death existed before sin is incredibly wrong and an insult to fellow Christians.

 

[Tintin]

Percepi.
Silly me! I thought the Holy Spirit was given to us to teach us God's Word and what He reveals in the Bible?

I'm not against commentaries or research materials, I love that stuff, but they're not to take the place of God's Word. It's very important to first and foremost read the Bible as it's written, a plain reading as possible, without the influences of others.

 

[Tintin]

I took a look at the link you provided and skimmed through it. I have no problem with its literal interpretation of the Bible - I disagree, but it's all in context. But I do have a problem with the website lying about the views of "secularists". Secularists refer to people who want to keep religion out of certain organizations. Secularists tend to want religion out of government, or you have secular schools - referring to schools that are separate from religion. There isn't a "secularist" view of death. There's a naturalist view of death - but AnswersInGenesis wants to pretend those two are the same.

More importantly, there are many Christians who take certain parts of the Bible figuratively. Not all Christians believe in young earth creationism. To suggest only "secularists" believe death existed before sin is incredibly wrong and an insult to fellow Christians.

Of course they hold to that view. They believe that there are two kingdoms at work in this world. That of God and that belonging to the Enemy. To religions - One God-oriented, one with Man as god.

 

[Percepi]

again, why are you hear?? do you think your going to convince us your anti biblical crap and get us to leave God?

No, I don't. That's not my goal. I am merely arguing in favor of the evidence that exists out there and answering OPs question honestly. Just an FYI, it's possible to believe in a naturally formed Earth, evolution, God, and Jesus all at the same time. As I said before, most evolutionists are Christian.

If you may, lease refrain from breaking the 9th commandment. I'm not trying to turn you away from God - I am merely arguing in defense of scientific evidence.

 

[Percepi]

Of course they hold to that view. They believe that there are two kingdoms at work in this world. That of God and that belonging to the Enemy. To religions - One God-oriented, one with Man as god.

Wrong.

First of all, you don't know what a secularist is.

Second, who believes "man is God"? Secularists? Be more specific! Christians who accept the theory of evolution - no, they believe God is God. Atheists? No, atheists don't believe there are any Gods (and they don't believe themselves to be gods either).

I also noticed everyone is trying to change the topic, save for Elizabeth619. If we're to continue our discussion, let's address my points. It's senseless to ignore them.

 

[Kerry]

No, I don't. That's not my goal. I am merely arguing in favor of the evidence that exists out there and answering OPs question honestly. Just an FYI, it's possible to believe in a naturally formed Earth, evolution, God, and Jesus all at the same time. As I said before, most evolutionists are Christian.

If you may, lease refrain from breaking the 9th commandment. I'm not trying to turn you away from God - I am merely arguing in defense of scientific evidence.

Liar, tell the truth. Your here because you have unanswered questions. In the back of your mind you are hoping to find answers here. EVO has failed you, science has failed you. You knowingly or not are on a journey for truth.

Man Jesus loves you, I know you don't understand that. In your scientific mind, what is the most powerful force on Earth.

Money doesn't solve anything in fact it creates problems. Fights with the wife, What does science have for that? children that are unruly and doing drugs, Maybe you can find a self help book for that as well. How will science fix your children? Taching your children that there is nothing and only the knowledge of man. That's teaching them no accountability. Think of it, if you teach your child that when we die it's the same as a dog. Then why excel, why not live off the government. So I have a big house and a yacht. I can"t take it with me, I'm just leaving it for someone else to squander. Telling your child that their father is a monkey is the most stupidest thing a man can do. Why should they respect you, monkeys don't.

Jesus loves man, and He wants to fix things. Just ask with faith. That's all it takes. Yes there will be problems, but if you hold the faith, they will be solved. Science cannot and wile and cares not, Jesus does.

 

[Tintin]

Wrong.

First of all, you don't know what a secularist is.

Second, who believes "man is God"? Secularists? Be more specific! Christians who accept the theory of evolution - no, they believe God is God. Atheists? No, atheists don't believe there are any Gods (and they don't believe themselves to be gods either).

I also noticed everyone is trying to change the topic, save for Elizabeth619. If we're to continue our discussion, let's address my points. It's senseless to ignore them.

Mankind think they're top dog, that they define truth (nowadays it seems most believe truth is relative) and everything else. They worship their accomplishments and get others to do likewise (eg. science and technology will be our saviour, look how good we are, we can do all of this without the help of a divine power). That's the behaviour of mankind trying to be god.

 

[Brother_Don]

Not sure how old the earth is but i think its older than the sun. genesis 1:1-3, In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. And God said, let there be light: and there was light.

 

[Fishbait]

Yes. Also, most evolutionists don't believe in God. Many don't want anything to do with Him. Sadly it seems the vast majority of Christians in the Western world seem to be theistic evolutionists though.

Can one believe in the evolution creator god and remain a Christian? - that is, still be saved by faith in Christ the Creator? Not for long, it seems.

 

[Fishbait]

You don't that the creators you mentioned (Behemoth) above are dinosaurs, it could be a Hippopotamus, and the text doesn't say it has a tail of a cedar tree, its it has a tail LIKE a cedar- it's a metaphor.

The phrase “first of the ways of God” suggests this was the largest land animal God had made. So what kind of animal was “behemoth”?

Bible translators, not being sure what this beast was, often transliterated the Hebrew, and thus the word behemoth (e.g., KJV, NKJV, NASB, NIV). However, in many Bible commentaries and Bible footnotes, “behemoth” is said to be “possibly the hippopotamus or elephant.” Some Bible versions actually translate “behemoth” this way. Besides the fact that the elephant and hippo were not the largest land animals God made (some of the dinosaurs far eclipsed these), this description does not make sense, since the tail of behemoth is compared to the large cedar tree (Job 40:17).

Now an elephant’s tiny tail (or a hippo’s tail that looks like a flap of skin) is quite unlike a cedar tree. Clearly, the elephant and the hippo could not possibly be “behemoth.”

No living creature comes close to this description. However, behemoth is very much like Brachiosaurus, one of the large dinosaurs. More: What Really Happened to the Dinosaurs? - Answers in Genesis

 

[Fishbait]

No, I don't. That's not my goal. I am merely arguing in favor of the evidence that exists out there and answering OPs question honestly. Just an FYI, it's possible to believe in a naturally formed Earth, evolution, God, and Jesus all at the same time. As I said before, most evolutionists are Christian.

If you may, lease refrain from breaking the 9th commandment. I'm not trying to turn you away from God - I am merely arguing in defense of scientific evidence.

Can one believe in the evolution creator god and remain a Christian? - that is, still be saved by faith in Christ the Creator? Not for long, it seems.

 

[Fishbait]

Wrong.

First of all, you don't know what a secularist is.

Second, who believes "man is God"? Secularists? Be more specific! Christians who accept the theory of evolution - no, they believe God is God. Atheists? No, atheists don't believe there are any Gods (and they don't believe themselves to be gods either).

I also noticed everyone is trying to change the topic, save for Elizabeth619. If we're to continue our discussion, let's address my points. It's senseless to ignore them.

Can one believe in the evolution creator god and remain a Christian? - that is, still be saved by faith in Christ the Creator? Not for long, it seems.