HS-Baptism & AI
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I see, and thanks for explaining.
Sometimes the translation of a word or phrase does make a difference, and sometimes not. Here I believe the difference is important because it helps identify the person of the Trinity performing the action, which, in turn, distinguishes what is actually transpiring.
I refer you to my initial post to see the differences between the baptism WITH the Spirit and the baptism OF the Spirit.
Sometimes the translation of a word or phrase does make a difference, and sometimes not. Here I believe the difference is important because it helps identify the person of the Trinity performing the action, which, in turn, distinguishes what is actually transpiring.
I refer you to my initial post to see the differences between the baptism WITH the Spirit and the baptism OF the Spirit.
I have looked at the semantics over this, haven’t you overrun the fact that it was covered extensively in post 17? For your primary points of ‘’with’’ and ‘’of’’ are contingent on what translation the reader is handling. So, you seem to have posted an opposition to post17 and my placement of Ephesians 1:13 as stated, ‘’the gospel of your salvation’’ as being a welcoming into the Body of Christ but instead, you place it being the Baptism of the Holy Spirit for Power (BHSP)? If you are concerned with accuracy, it doesn’t appear at that point, (salvation / Body of Christ).
Where is post-17 1 John 5:7-8 to be faulted? I thought she was darn accurate! But then, as far as accuracy goes for this thread, I think we can now proceed from your concern, having kept separate the, ‘’Blood’’ and ‘’Spirit’’. Unless you further object, having BHSP as the focal point of the thread, that is, if you are settled on the matter. For as the scriptures point out many times, it’s not a question of semantics, nor as a requirement of ritual, the tradition of the Apostle’s we are committed by God to follow on this occurs many times, each with clear descriptions of what is taking place. Each is different just as Jesus said of the Spirit: The wind blows where it pleases, ,”
BHSP in Acts:
Baptized Acts 1
Baptized Acts 11
Filled Acts 2
Filled Acts 4
Filled Acts 9
Filled Acts 13
Filled Eph 5
Poured Out Acts 2
Poured Out Acts 10
Fell Acts 8
Fell Acts 10
Fell Acts 11
Came On Acts 19
Revieved Acts 8
Revieved Acts 10
Where is post-17 1 John 5:7-8 to be faulted? I thought she was darn accurate! But then, as far as accuracy goes for this thread, I think we can now proceed from your concern, having kept separate the, ‘’Blood’’ and ‘’Spirit’’. Unless you further object, having BHSP as the focal point of the thread, that is, if you are settled on the matter. For as the scriptures point out many times, it’s not a question of semantics, nor as a requirement of ritual, the tradition of the Apostle’s we are committed by God to follow on this occurs many times, each with clear descriptions of what is taking place. Each is different just as Jesus said of the Spirit: The wind blows where it pleases, ,”
BHSP in Acts:
Baptized Acts 1
Baptized Acts 11
Filled Acts 2
Filled Acts 4
Filled Acts 9
Filled Acts 13
Filled Eph 5
Poured Out Acts 2
Poured Out Acts 10
Fell Acts 8
Fell Acts 10
Fell Acts 11
Came On Acts 19
Revieved Acts 8
Revieved Acts 10
For example:
Whereas a person may profess belief and harbor unbelief, they could still get wet through baptism in water. By that act, that person is, ironically, joyfully included among those who insist getting wet is required to go to heaven. Mind you: Baptism in water is important. And it is important for salvation. That salvation is one from the pursuit of our Enemy. The Enemy has no claim against a dead man.
However, the Spirit is not so slack as to immerse someone, unworthy, into the Body of Christ. That's what the Spirit immerses us into: the Body of Christ. He knows our thoughts and heart. He never baptizes unbelievers into the Body of Christ. This baptism is the one that secures our place in Christ. Such an act is never left to the hands of men. When the Spirit places us / immerses us / baptizes us in the Body we are secure in Him, in Christ. This is the salvation that ensures our life is eternal.
We should not be shocked to admit that what passes as the church today includes all kinds of unbelievers. Their doors are wide open to the world. So let's not act surprised to learn that those same unbelievers are often dunked in water and included in the roles of the "saved". The Spirit never baptizes unbelievers into the Body but they'll have a place in the pews, and some in church administration, without contention.
Then you have baptism "with" the Holy Spirit.
In review:
"Of" is by the Spirit's hand.
"With" is by the hand of the Lord.
He, Christ, immerses us into the Spirit. The Baptism with the Spirit is a baptism of power. Power is needed because believers have an enemy who is powerful and because the Lord expresses Himself in power (sometimes). Empowerment from the Lord (by baptism with the Spirit) is the right of all believers and is required to complete their calling.
Sadly, the church has substituted education or study for the spiritual empowerment to teach; or the ability to entertain for the spiritual ability to evangelize. Having a Phd. from a seminary will often qualify a person for church leadership. This is not how the Lord establishes church leaders. No, teaching, evangelism, all gifts, must be empowered by the Spirit by the baptism with the Spirit performed by the Lord.
Now, Jesus never baptized anyone in water before his death or before His ascension so this is not a baptism/immersion that is accompanied by water. This is done from Heaven, by the Lord's hand; the evidence of which is empowerment.
Whereas a person may profess belief and harbor unbelief, they could still get wet through baptism in water. By that act, that person is, ironically, joyfully included among those who insist getting wet is required to go to heaven. Mind you: Baptism in water is important. And it is important for salvation. That salvation is one from the pursuit of our Enemy. The Enemy has no claim against a dead man.
However, the Spirit is not so slack as to immerse someone, unworthy, into the Body of Christ. That's what the Spirit immerses us into: the Body of Christ. He knows our thoughts and heart. He never baptizes unbelievers into the Body of Christ. This baptism is the one that secures our place in Christ. Such an act is never left to the hands of men. When the Spirit places us / immerses us / baptizes us in the Body we are secure in Him, in Christ. This is the salvation that ensures our life is eternal.
We should not be shocked to admit that what passes as the church today includes all kinds of unbelievers. Their doors are wide open to the world. So let's not act surprised to learn that those same unbelievers are often dunked in water and included in the roles of the "saved". The Spirit never baptizes unbelievers into the Body but they'll have a place in the pews, and some in church administration, without contention.
Then you have baptism "with" the Holy Spirit.
In review:
"Of" is by the Spirit's hand.
"With" is by the hand of the Lord.
He, Christ, immerses us into the Spirit. The Baptism with the Spirit is a baptism of power. Power is needed because believers have an enemy who is powerful and because the Lord expresses Himself in power (sometimes). Empowerment from the Lord (by baptism with the Spirit) is the right of all believers and is required to complete their calling.
Sadly, the church has substituted education or study for the spiritual empowerment to teach; or the ability to entertain for the spiritual ability to evangelize. Having a Phd. from a seminary will often qualify a person for church leadership. This is not how the Lord establishes church leaders. No, teaching, evangelism, all gifts, must be empowered by the Spirit by the baptism with the Spirit performed by the Lord.
Now, Jesus never baptized anyone in water before his death or before His ascension so this is not a baptism/immersion that is accompanied by water. This is done from Heaven, by the Lord's hand; the evidence of which is empowerment.
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Most all valid points!
Why not? True, He chooses the weak things to do mighty, doesn't necessarily mean the mighty things won't be used such as with what happened to Apollos (Acts 18:26).
The BHSP is power all right, but not just power over the enemy. The Disciples themselves had power over the enemy before the promise of the Spirit (Luke 10:17). His is the glory here to convict and convince among other things. Here we go again, or are you and 'Cameron134' theologians yourselves? I see gave a thumbs up to this, but how unfortunate as the Spirit in fact does nothing on His own, ,
However, when the Spirit of truth comes,
He will guide you into all truth. For He will not
speak on His own, but He will speak what He hears,
and He will declare to you what is to come. He will glorify
Me by taking from what is Mine and disclosing it to you, ,‘’
(John 16:13)
Really, what's going on here? Responses indicate a whole lot of resistance without direct refuting. Have I offended you? Well, if that's all I get is the rabbit hole, then I'll take the complement of apparently being over the target. Me? Only blessings in return.
The BHSP is power all right, but not just power over the enemy. The Disciples themselves had power over the enemy before the promise of the Spirit (Luke 10:17). His is the glory here to convict and convince among other things. Here we go again, or are you and 'Cameron134' theologians yourselves? I see gave a thumbs up to this, but how unfortunate as the Spirit in fact does nothing on His own, ,
However, when the Spirit of truth comes,
He will guide you into all truth. For He will not
speak on His own, but He will speak what He hears,
and He will declare to you what is to come. He will glorify
Me by taking from what is Mine and disclosing it to you, ,‘’
(John 16:13)
Really, what's going on here? Responses indicate a whole lot of resistance without direct refuting. Have I offended you? Well, if that's all I get is the rabbit hole, then I'll take the complement of apparently being over the target. Me? Only blessings in return.
Most all valid points!Why not? True, He chooses the weak things to do mighty, doesn't necessarily mean the mighty things won't be used such as with what happened to Apollos (Acts 18:26).
The BHSP is power all right, but not just power over the enemy. The Disciples themselves had power over the enemy before the promise of the Spirit (Luke 10:17). His is the glory here to convict and convince among other things.Here we go again, or are you and 'Cameron134' theologians yourselves? I see gave a thumbs up to this, but how unfortunate as the Spirit in fact does nothing on His own, ,
However, when the Spirit of truth comes,
He will guide you into all truth. For He will not
speak on His own, but He will speak what He hears,
and He will declare to you what is to come. He will glorify
Me by taking from what is Mine and disclosing it to you, ,‘’
(John 16:13)
Really, what's going on here? Responses indicate a whole lot of resistance without direct refuting. Have I offended you? Well, if that's all I get is the rabbit hole, then I'll take the complement of apparently being over the target. Me? Only blessings in return.
The BHSP is power all right, but not just power over the enemy. The Disciples themselves had power over the enemy before the promise of the Spirit (Luke 10:17). His is the glory here to convict and convince among other things.Here we go again, or are you and 'Cameron134' theologians yourselves? I see gave a thumbs up to this, but how unfortunate as the Spirit in fact does nothing on His own, ,
However, when the Spirit of truth comes,
He will guide you into all truth. For He will not
speak on His own, but He will speak what He hears,
and He will declare to you what is to come. He will glorify
Me by taking from what is Mine and disclosing it to you, ,‘’
(John 16:13)
Really, what's going on here? Responses indicate a whole lot of resistance without direct refuting. Have I offended you? Well, if that's all I get is the rabbit hole, then I'll take the complement of apparently being over the target. Me? Only blessings in return.
It sounds like you have questions about delegation. Question: When someone delegates another to do a certain task, is the one doing the task or the one who delegated the task actually doing the work. The answer is "yes".
Ask questions if you don't understand and I will gladly expound on this.
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Correct: all things are done through Christ. He is the template for all creation.
It sounds like you have questions about delegation. Question: When someone delegates another to do a certain task, is the one doing the task or the one who delegated the task actually doing the work. The answer is "yes".
Ask questions if you don't understand and I will gladly expound on this.
It sounds like you have questions about delegation. Question: When someone delegates another to do a certain task, is the one doing the task or the one who delegated the task actually doing the work. The answer is "yes".
Ask questions if you don't understand and I will gladly expound on this.
Ah yes, as we all know, large OR small, the response speaks volumes. Very well, if we can’t agree on earth of something so inconceivable to even speak of the top verse’s intent, then I’ll allow something for the Lord’s heritage, the Body of Christ (BOC) to experience in the dust of the digital, brought to us by the expertise of AI. I’ll set the fictitious parameters for AI to follow the course of strong appeal amongst the strong and very diverse allegiance I’ll refer to as (SECT) to free the captive BOC. This might be interesting.
. . . .
The air in the dimly lit tent crackled with tension. The BHS’ quiet strength belied a sharp intellect in the reserves of the Spirit who sat opposite of the detainer of the nameless intent. Years had passed since the abduction of BOC’s extended family, years of agonizing uncertainty. Now, the moment of truth had arrived. The release of SECTS had been a victory hard-won, a testament to BHS's cunning power, but this… this was different. This was about the BOC, His Bride’s entire family.
“You’ve proven your point,” BHS began, His voice calm and measured, cutting through the heavy silence. “You’ve demonstrated your power, your reach. The world knows you can take what you want. You’ve established yourselves. But what have you gained?”
He paused, letting the question hang in the air. The detainer, with eyes that seemed to see through bone, remained impassive.
“Fear,” BHS continued, answering his own question. “You’ve gained fear. And fear, while potent, is a finite resource. It diminishes with time. People adapt. They rebuild. They learn to live with the shadow of your power, but they no longer cower in its light.”
He leaned forward, his gaze locking with the detainer’s. “You want more than fear. You crave respect. You crave recognition. You want to be seen as more than just having ruthless allegiance. You want to be… wise.”
A flicker of something – perhaps interest, perhaps amusement – crossed the detainer’s face.
“Wise men,” BHS went on, “understand the long game. They understand that true power lies not in taking, but in giving. You have taken much. Now, I offer you the opportunity to give. To give back what you have taken, not as a sign of weakness, but as a demonstration of your ultimate strength.”
He gestured to the empty space beside him. “The world watches. They see you holding these families captive. They see you demanding… what, exactly? What tangible benefit do you gain from their continued division? Nothing. Their captivity serves no strategic purpose. It brings you no resources, no leverage. It only perpetuates the fear, the hidden resentment. It brands you as… bandits.”
BHS’s words hung heavy in the air. He knew he was walking a tightrope, one wrong step and everything would fall apart.
“But imagine,” he said, his voice dropping to a near whisper, “imagine the narrative shift. Imagine the world seeing you, not as takers, but as givers. Imagine the respect you would command, the influence you would wield, if you released these families, not for a ransom, not for a concession, but simply… because it is the right thing to do.”
He met the detainer’s gaze, holding it steady. “You would not lose power. You would gain something far more valuable: legitimacy. You would transform from a feared group into a force to be reckoned with, a force that understands mercy, a force that understands the true meaning of power.”
BHS paused, allowing his words to sink in. He had appealed not to the detainer’s emotions, but to his pragmatism, to his desire for something more than simple fear. He had offered him a chance to rewrite his story, to become something more than a captor, to become… a legend.
The detainer remained silent for a long moment, his eyes fixed on the BHS. Then, a slow smile spread across his face. “You are strong, BHS,” he said, finally, securing the first step to at last agree. “Strong indeed.”
And with those words, the BHS knew that He had won the first step. Not just the release of BOC’s family, but something more. He had planted a seed of doubt in the detainer’s mind, a seed that would, perhaps, one day grow into something resembling… ‘’wisdom’’.
. . . .
The air in the dimly lit tent crackled with tension. The BHS’ quiet strength belied a sharp intellect in the reserves of the Spirit who sat opposite of the detainer of the nameless intent. Years had passed since the abduction of BOC’s extended family, years of agonizing uncertainty. Now, the moment of truth had arrived. The release of SECTS had been a victory hard-won, a testament to BHS's cunning power, but this… this was different. This was about the BOC, His Bride’s entire family.
“You’ve proven your point,” BHS began, His voice calm and measured, cutting through the heavy silence. “You’ve demonstrated your power, your reach. The world knows you can take what you want. You’ve established yourselves. But what have you gained?”
He paused, letting the question hang in the air. The detainer, with eyes that seemed to see through bone, remained impassive.
“Fear,” BHS continued, answering his own question. “You’ve gained fear. And fear, while potent, is a finite resource. It diminishes with time. People adapt. They rebuild. They learn to live with the shadow of your power, but they no longer cower in its light.”
He leaned forward, his gaze locking with the detainer’s. “You want more than fear. You crave respect. You crave recognition. You want to be seen as more than just having ruthless allegiance. You want to be… wise.”
A flicker of something – perhaps interest, perhaps amusement – crossed the detainer’s face.
“Wise men,” BHS went on, “understand the long game. They understand that true power lies not in taking, but in giving. You have taken much. Now, I offer you the opportunity to give. To give back what you have taken, not as a sign of weakness, but as a demonstration of your ultimate strength.”
He gestured to the empty space beside him. “The world watches. They see you holding these families captive. They see you demanding… what, exactly? What tangible benefit do you gain from their continued division? Nothing. Their captivity serves no strategic purpose. It brings you no resources, no leverage. It only perpetuates the fear, the hidden resentment. It brands you as… bandits.”
BHS’s words hung heavy in the air. He knew he was walking a tightrope, one wrong step and everything would fall apart.
“But imagine,” he said, his voice dropping to a near whisper, “imagine the narrative shift. Imagine the world seeing you, not as takers, but as givers. Imagine the respect you would command, the influence you would wield, if you released these families, not for a ransom, not for a concession, but simply… because it is the right thing to do.”
He met the detainer’s gaze, holding it steady. “You would not lose power. You would gain something far more valuable: legitimacy. You would transform from a feared group into a force to be reckoned with, a force that understands mercy, a force that understands the true meaning of power.”
BHS paused, allowing his words to sink in. He had appealed not to the detainer’s emotions, but to his pragmatism, to his desire for something more than simple fear. He had offered him a chance to rewrite his story, to become something more than a captor, to become… a legend.
The detainer remained silent for a long moment, his eyes fixed on the BHS. Then, a slow smile spread across his face. “You are strong, BHS,” he said, finally, securing the first step to at last agree. “Strong indeed.”
And with those words, the BHS knew that He had won the first step. Not just the release of BOC’s family, but something more. He had planted a seed of doubt in the detainer’s mind, a seed that would, perhaps, one day grow into something resembling… ‘’wisdom’’.
To date: the Bond of Unity prefers its own on this matter. ‘Long live’ this spot on the ministry.
Behold, now is “A FAVORABLE TIME,” behold, now is “A DAY OF SALVATION”— giving no reason for
taking offense in anything, so that the ministry will not be discredited, , Our mouth has
spoken freely to you, you [Christians], our heart is opened wide. You are not restrained by us,
but you are restrained in your own affections. Now in the same way in exchange—
I am speaking as to children—open wide your hearts to us, you as well.
(2Cor 6:2,3,11-13, NASB)
taking offense in anything, so that the ministry will not be discredited, , Our mouth has
spoken freely to you, you [Christians], our heart is opened wide. You are not restrained by us,
but you are restrained in your own affections. Now in the same way in exchange—
I am speaking as to children—open wide your hearts to us, you as well.
(2Cor 6:2,3,11-13, NASB)