IF there was a Rapture at the start off a 7 year tribulation period, then

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KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
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#41
You understand the symbolism in the Bible unlike these other guys you are talking with but you still believe in premillennialism. :unsure: That's where I don't get you lol. God bless you anyways. Just get rid of the premill and you will be in better shape!

Amill, postmill and partial-preterism all have good arguments and could be correct. They all have the 1,000 years before the second coming of Christ which is the only possibility according to Scripture. I'm only amill because I think it is most likely to be right.

It's the full-preterist nut jobs and the premills that the Scripture shows cannot be right. Let go of your premillennialism. :p

You are not blind like some of these guys you talk to in these threads and I can tell you let the Spirit lead you into truth.
I’m not premillennial. I believe in the rapture, the future return of Christ and the millennial reign.

I just don’t go for the “7 year tribulation” and “The Antichrist” garbage. None of that can be found in the Bible anywhere unless people cherry pick and twist verses to make it fit.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
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#42
Zech 14

3Then the LORD will go out and fight against those nations as when he fights on a day of battle. 4On that day his feet shall stand on the Mount of Olives that lies before Jerusalem on the east, and the Mount of Olives shall be split in two from east to west by a very wide valley, so that one half of the Mount shall move northward, and the other half southward. 5And you shall flee to the valley of my mountains, for the valley of the mountains shall reach to Azal. And you shall flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD my God will come, and all the holy ones with him.a

Doesn't get any clearer than that.
Amen......yet to be fulfilled....there seems to be this whacked out theology permeating Christianity like leaven today that it was all said and done by 70 A.D.........many scriptures, verbiage and context must all be swept under the table to peddle that garbage!
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
3,580
1,539
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#43
Amen......yet to be fulfilled....there seems to be this whacked out theology permeating Christianity like leaven today that it was all said and done by 70 A.D.........many scriptures, verbiage and context must all be swept under the table to peddle that garbage!
The preterists and post millennialist seem to think that Christs coming amounts to a pathetic whimper when in fact it is going to be a stupefying terrifying earth shattering cataclysm preceded by a collapse of civilization and wars that will kill 2/3 of the inhabitants of the planet.

Totally outrageous. And totally wrong.
 

delirious

Junior Member
Mar 16, 2017
490
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#44
I’m not premillennial. I believe in the rapture, the future return of Christ and the millennial reign.
The rapture is the resurrection which I am sure you would agree so we are probably on the same page there.
We both believe in a future return of Christ so we are on the same page there.

So the question is....do you believe we are in the 1,000 years now or that it happens after the return of Christ? If you answer now, we are on the same page with everything. :cool:

If you answer after, the Scripture refutes you. I believe you told me the other day you thought the 1,000 years was after Christ's return which would make you premill. Did I misunderstand you?
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
12,534
993
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#45
Amen......yet to be fulfilled....there seems to be this whacked out theology permeating Christianity like leaven today that it was all said and done by 70 A.D.........many scriptures, verbiage and context must all be swept under the table to peddle that garbage!
Well that’s kinda strange that you think that’s future because in the day that God goes to destroy the nations that came against Israel is the same time that the spirit of grace was poured out on Jerusalem. It’s also the same time that they looked upon him whom they pierced.

Zec 12:9 (KJV) And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

Zec 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.

Seriously, do you really think that’s future? Oh by the way if you think verse 10 wasn’t fulfilled at the first coming then take a gander at this.

Joh 19:36 For these things were done, that the scripture should be fulfilled, A bone of him shall not be broken.
Joh 19:37 And again another scripture saith, They shall look on him whom they pierced.
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
12,534
993
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#46
The rapture is the resurrection which I am sure you would agree so we are probably on the same page there.
We both believe in a future return of Christ so we are on the same page there.
The future return yes but not the rapture. I believe the first part of the first resurrection took place with Christ and the firsfruits - raised Old Testament saints. I believe the "main harvest" part of the first resurrection takes place at the end along with the rapture.
So the question is....do you believe we are in the 1,000 years now or that it happens after the return of Christ? If you answer now, we are on the same page with everything. :cool:

If you answer after, the Scripture refutes you. I believe you told me the other day you thought the 1,000 years was after Christ's return which would make you premill. Did I misunderstand you?
I'm on the fence about the timing of the 1000 years, I don't know. I would love to see the scripture you're talking about, that's something I don't understand yet but I very much want to. And sorry I didn't respond back to you the other day, I have alot of work stuff going on right now and I'm hit or miss at responses right now. :)
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
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#47
You boys argue among yerselves - the only true view of scripture is Covenant Eschatology - there is no end of the world in scripture just the end of old covenant world.

Eccl 1:4 One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

Eph 3:21 Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
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#48
Well that’s kinda strange that you think that’s future because in the day that God goes to destroy the nations that came against Israel is the same time that the spirit of grace was poured out on Jerusalem. It’s also the same time that they looked upon him whom they pierced.

Zec 12:9 (KJV) And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

Zec 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.

Seriously, do you really think that’s future? Oh by the way if you think verse 10 wasn’t fulfilled at the first coming then take a gander at this.

Joh 19:36 For these things were done, that the scripture should be fulfilled, A bone of him shall not be broken.
Joh 19:37 And again another scripture saith, They shall look on him whom they pierced.
If you think it happened in 70 AD, not only are you deceived but blind to the word ALL NATIONS....but hey, par for the course from one who worships the KJV.....
The preterists and post millennialist seem to think that Christs coming amounts to a pathetic whimper when in fact it is going to be a stupefying terrifying earth shattering cataclysm preceded by a collapse of civilization and wars that will kill 2/3 of the inhabitants of the planet.

Totally outrageous. And totally wrong.
Oh I agree......and you can read he also believes Rome constituted ALL NATIONS
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
12,534
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#50
If you think it happened in 70 AD, not only are you deceived but blind to the word ALL NATIONS....but hey, par for the course from one who worships the KJV.....
I'm surprised that you didn't know all the definitions of nation.... it could mean a country, Gentiles, heathens or people in general.

גּוֹי gôwy, go'-ee; rarely (shortened) גֹּי gôy; apparently from the same root as H1465(in the sense of massing); a foreign nation; hence, a Gentile; also (figuratively) a troop of animals, or a flight of locusts:—Gentile, heathen, nation, people.

The KJV translates Strong's H1471 in the following manner: nation (374x), heathen (143x), Gentiles (30x), people (11x).

Now I'm guessing that you will ignore all the context about grace being given when Christ came and them looking upon him who they pierced and John 19:37 saying specifically that it was fulfilled in Christ at the first coming... You will ignore ALL of that and choose nations to mean countries so it fits YOUR view of the end times. Do you think Luxembourg will participate? How about Bagladesh?
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
20,066
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#51
I'm surprised that you didn't know all the definitions of nation.... it could mean a country, Gentiles, heathens or people in general.

גּוֹי gôwy, go'-ee; rarely (shortened) גֹּי gôy; apparently from the same root as H1465(in the sense of massing); a foreign nation; hence, a Gentile; also (figuratively) a troop of animals, or a flight of locusts:—Gentile, heathen, nation, people.

The KJV translates Strong's H1471 in the following manner: nation (374x), heathen (143x), Gentiles (30x), people (11x).

Now I'm guessing that you will ignore all the context about grace being given when Christ came and them looking upon him who they pierced and John 19:37 saying specifically that it was fulfilled in Christ at the first coming... You will ignore ALL of that and choose nations to mean countries so it fits YOUR view of the end times. Do you think Luxembourg will participate? How about Bagladesh?
All is conclusive of ALL when used in context and no matter how you slice and dice...God gathering ALL NATIONS, races, tribes, people, heathen and or gentiles AGAINST JERUSALEM to battle that he may seek to DESTROY them has not happened yet...but I figure you are too dense to grasp that truth seeing how you think it happend in 70 A.D.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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#52
It doesn't have to mean ALL nations come against Jerusalem - the Romans came against them in the 1st century AD - and this is precisely what we see in John's revelation when he declares "Babylon the great is fallen".
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
12,534
993
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#53
All is conclusive of ALL when used in context and no matter how you slice and dice...God gathering ALL NATIONS, races, tribes, people, heathen and or gentiles AGAINST JERUSALEM to battle that he may seek to DESTROY them has not happened yet...but I figure you are too dense to grasp that truth seeing how you think it happend in 70 A.D.
Well you haven’t offered anything compelling to prove your point, just that all nations in your opinion means all countries tribes and peoples.

I guess you don’t understand that grace started for Jerusalem when Christ came. That’s a no brainer for most folks, it certainly trumps your idea of all nations but that’s pretty much how you operate, ignore the obvious context and base your whole view on the vaguest part of the evidence.

So you think them looking upon him whom they pierced is future even though other scripture says it’s already been fulfilled? Maybe it’s more dispensational “double fulfillment”?
 

KJV1611

Senior Member
Nov 23, 2013
12,534
993
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#54
It doesn't have to mean ALL nations come against Jerusalem - the Romans came against them in the 1st century AD - and this is precisely what we see in John's revelation when he declares "Babylon the great is fallen".
I’m still wondering if the phillpines are gonna join in.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,144
20,066
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#55
It doesn't have to mean ALL nations come against Jerusalem - the Romans came against them in the 1st century AD - and this is precisely what we see in John's revelation when he declares "Babylon the great is fallen".
Not hardly...and the key that places it at the end of the age and not 70 A.D. is the phrase -->that he may seek to destroy them

Wake up....the dual prophecy of Matthew was not only applicable to Rome in 70 A.D. bit also to the end of the AGE when Jesus as Lord and God seizes control of ALL KINGDOMS to judge and destroy AFTER they are gathered AGAINST JERUSALEM and even NOW we see this beginning to come to fruition.....by DEFAULT or Direct conflict ALL WILL BE GUILTY....
 

TabinRivCA

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2018
5,459
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#57
Lk 21:36 'Watch and pray always that you may b accounted worthy to escape all the things that shall COME TO PASS...'.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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#58
I’m still wondering if the Philippines are gonna join in.
Don't forget the Fijians, Aussie Aborigines, Samoans etc. etc. they all gotta fit in there somewhere BigSmile.gif

And don't forget the Irish.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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#59
1 Chr 14:17 And the fame of David went out into all lands; and the LORD brought the fear of him upon all nations.

I'm pretty sure the Aussie Abo's ran like hell when they heard about this.
 

iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
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#60
1 Chr 14:17 And the fame of David went out into all lands; and the LORD brought the fear of him upon all nations.

I'm pretty sure the Aussie Abo's ran like hell when they heard about this.
It was the sound of the English swinging the Billy can to settle the tea leaves that made them run...