In the Truth God is our safety

Live4Him · Mar 4, 2021

Mind-boggling.

Absolutely mind-boggling.

Can't you see what you've just done?

On the one hand, you "refer to the good news of 2 Cor. 5:19. EXPLAINED BY 1 Cor. 15:1-4", and then, amazingly, you deny what 1 Cor. 15:1-4 is actually about by claiming that you "don't see anyone preaching that good news" to certain people in certain places.

Have you ever even read I Cor. 15:1-4?

We read:

I Corinthians chapter 15

[1] Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
[2] By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
[3] For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
[4] And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

"According to" WHAT "scriptures"?

Wait for it...

ACCORDING TO THE VERY OLD TESTAMENT SCRIPTURES WHERE YOU CLAIM CHRIST WASN'T BEING PREACHED.

Somebody will get it...even if it's not you.

Live4Him · Mar 4, 2021

throughfaith said:

In other words, you'll run away from the truths that I've shared with you here because you cannot refute them, and because you're too proud to admit your error.

Got it.

Live4Him · Mar 4, 2021

Well, now that the truth of God's word has prevailed (temporarily, at least), I'd like to offer my sincere apology to MikkoAinasoja because this thread wound up going in a direction that was obviously not his original intent.

Although I'm not the one who originally derailed it, I obviously jumped on board to try to save any passengers from getting killed by false doctrine.

I don't apologize for that, but I am truly sorry that his actual intended and true point might have gotten lost in the whole train wreck.

God bless you, brother, for your OP.

throughfaith · Mar 4, 2021

phil36 said:

Thats good then you finally agree that Paul and Jesus both taught the one true Gospel (good news). They both agree 100%.

Which leads to the ovious that there is only one church/ekklesia of God's people.. as Paul teaches:

For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. 17 He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. 18 For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit. (Ephesians 2).

When did he do those things in those verses ? Before or after the DBR ?

phil36 · Mar 4, 2021

throughfaith said:

Hi throughfaith you really should read what people write. I'll refer you back to post #84. in fact I'll re post it for you.

I believe this is were you go wrong. We know that the gospel call started in Jerusalem, so the majority of brothers in Christ at first were Jewish.. so that straight away disproves your theory of 2 gospels one for Jews and one for gentiles.

There was a 3 year or so transition period between Jesus' earthly ministry and the cross, and then the spreading of the one true gospel from Jerusalem out to the whole world where it still being spread.

Paul teaches us that in Christ we gentiles have been included into the citizenship of God's people.

There is one Gospel and one people of God.

For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. 17 He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. 18 For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit. (Ephesians 2)

throughfaith · Mar 4, 2021

phil36 said:

You keep doing it . " the gospel started ...." the one true gospel...." Which good news are you taking about ? what information? what was being shared at that time that was good news ? The entire scriptures? 50% sale on sandles? Explain what you mean. Simply saying ' the gospel, the gospel, even putting the ' one " in front of it doesn't communicate what good news your referring to . This is a basic question a Christian should know if he's to tell others how to be saved today.

phil36 · Mar 4, 2021

throughfaith said:

As I said there is only one good news and that is in Christ Jesus, His life, death and resurrection (I've told you this many times). This was promised away back in the garden Gen 3:15.

I don't believe as you do that Jesus taught a different gospel than Paul. Now before the New covenant there was still only one people of God the Hebrews/Jews, however Gentiles could be included if they wished to convert. You see, still only one people.

Let Paul explain. There is one Gospel and one people of God.

For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. 17 He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. 18 For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit. (Ephesians 2)

To stress the point even further, Paul says this:

-----remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world.

But now

Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household,

There is no jew or gentile. We are all one church (ekklesia/people) in Christ Jesus.

The problem you have is that you think the Jews are separate from the body of Christ and saved in a different way. Unbiblical.

oyster67 · Mar 4, 2021

Live4Him said:

I have a couple of questions for you, and if you can answer them correctly, then you should have the answers to some of your own questions as well.

Before I ask you my two questions, let's quickly establish a couple of facts:

1. Cornelius was a Roman centurion.

"There was a certain man in Caesarea called Cornelius, a centurion of the band called the Italian band," (Acts 10:1)

2. Peter said that it was "unlawful" for a Jew to keep company or come unto one of another nation.

"And he said unto them, Ye know how that it is an unlawful thing for a man that is a Jew to keep company, or come unto one of another nation; but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean." (Acts 10:28)

Now, here are my two questions:

1. If it truly was "unlawful" for a Jew to keep company or come unto one of another nation, and, in this particular case, the home of a Roman centurion, then why was Jesus, the consummate Jew, willing to do so himself?

Matthew chapter 8

[5] And when Jesus was entered into Capernaum, there came unto him a centurion, beseeching him,
[6] And saying, Lord, my servant lieth at home sick of the palsy, grievously tormented.
[7] And Jesus saith unto him, I will come and heal him.
[8] The centurion answered and said, Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed.
[9] For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it.
[10] When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.
[11] And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.
[12] But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
[13] And Jesus said unto the centurion, Go thy way; and as thou hast believed, so be it done unto thee. And his servant was healed in the selfsame hour.

In other words, if Jesus, the consummate Jew, was perfectly willing to enter into the HOME of a Roman centurion, then why did Peter say that it was "unlawful"?

Was Jesus about to do something "unlawful", thereby making himself unworthy of being a sinless sacrifice?

2. If entering into the home of a Roman centurion truly was "unlawful", as Peter claimed, then why did God have to show him THREE TIMES that it wasn't?

I await your reply.

In the meantime, recognize that this is yet another example of Jesus ministering to a GENTILE during his earthly ministry.

Not only that, but also recognize that this GENTILE had such a "GREAT FAITH" that Jesus hadn't even found anywhere "IN ISRAEL" (Matt. 8:10).

Amen.

Interesting how it is ok for Paul to preach to and teach the Gentiles, but the Son of God gets smacked in the head for it (right here on CC).

throughfaith · Mar 4, 2021

oyster67 said:

Some are just aware that Jesus wasn't a blue eyed , blonde hair western, American, surfer hippie . No He was is the Jewish messiah being presented to Israel in the four Gospels.

Matthew 15:24
“But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

We come in to the picture after Acts 7 .

Prior to this is Jesus to Israel . The diciples to Israel ..Then !! we get the apostle to the GENTILES. God did not stop speaking and revealing at the Four Gospels or the book of Acts .

throughfaith · Mar 4, 2021

phil36 said:

As I said there is only one good news and that is in Christ Jesus, His life, death and resurrection (I've told you this many times). This was promised away back in the garden Gen 3:15.

I don't believe as you do that Jesus taught a different gospel than Paul. Now before the New covenant there was still only one people of God the Hebrews/Jews, however Gentiles could be included if they wished to convert. You see, still only one people.

Let Paul explain. There is one Gospel and one people of God.

For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. 17 He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. 18 For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit. (Ephesians 2)

To stress the point even further, Paul says this:

-----remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world.

But now

Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household,

There is no jew or gentile. We are all one church (ekklesia/people) in Christ Jesus.

The problem you have is that you think the Jews are separate from the body of Christ and saved in a different way. Unbiblical.

So what's luke 9.6 gosepl then ? There is no death or resurrection in that good news?

phil36 · Mar 4, 2021

throughfaith said:

(Luke 4)

17 and the scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him. Unrolling it, he found the place where it is written:
18 “The Spirit of the Lord is on me,
because he has anointed me
to proclaim good news to the poor.
He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners
and recovery of sight for the blind,
to set the oppressed free,
19 to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor.”
20 Then he rolled up the scroll, gave it back to the attendant and sat down. The eyes of everyone in the synagogue were fastened on him. 21 He began by saying to them, “Today this scripture is fulfilled in your hearing.”

When we read what you say the gospel is you repeat the mantra 'DBR'. However, you are missing a huge part of the gospel message do you know what that is?

oyster67 · Mar 4, 2021

throughfaith said:

Jesus' message to the Jews and His message to the Gentiles was one and the same.

throughfaith · Mar 4, 2021

phil36 said:

I read what Paul says the Gospel is today. Now if your talking about Israel ,Jesus earthly ministry to Israel, his signs his teachings , his miracles ect , the kingdom, the tribulation, end times then ,absolutely we need to understand all scripture.

throughfaith · Mar 4, 2021

oyster67 said:

Thats a broad brush you paint with.

Who was Jesus sent for ?

phil36 · Mar 4, 2021

throughfaith said:

Nope i'm talking about the gospel.

I hear you all the time repeating the mantra 'DBR'.. but what I never hear you talk about really is Jesus and His life here on earth.

Te gospel centers around the ''''LIFE, death and resurrection of Christ.

Do you know what Jesus' life accomplished? it's a very very important part of the gospel message. Paul unpacks it for us using the OT scriptures. So you should no?

oyster67 · Mar 4, 2021

throughfaith said:

The Gospel is about Jesus. Jesus is the good news. That is what Paul taught.

Their is no other Foundation.

throughfaith · Mar 4, 2021

phil36 said:

Nope i'm talking about the gospel.

I hear you all the time repeating the mantra 'DBR'.. but what I never hear you talk about really is Jesus and His life here on earth.

Te gospel centers around the ''''LIFE, death and resurrection of Christ.

Do you know what Jesus' life accomplished? it's a very very important part of the gospel message. Paul unpacks it for us using the OT scriptures. So you should no?

Were saved by his life ( resurrection)

oyster67 · Mar 4, 2021

throughfaith said:

Amen

throughfaith said:

The whole world. Ever heard of John 3?

oyster67 · Mar 4, 2021

throughfaith said:

And His shed blood.

throughfaith · Mar 4, 2021

oyster67 said:

Again thats a broad brush . Every Sunday school kids answer to any question is always Jesus. And they are correct . But the details count .

In the Truth God is our safety

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