-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Would like to get view of what it means that 144,000 are SEALED. I know that the Bible says 12 from each of the 12 tribes of Isreal, but I thought we were all sealed by God when we become Christians, Give our lives to God. Curious here 
BeanieD
The 144,000, are the fullness (or Completion) of the faithful of Old Covenant Israel.
The males represent, the firstborn.
Or Israel bringing a first born unto the Resurrection of the Dead.
They represented the faithful of the dead in Shoel, 'Abraham's Bosom'.
Satan had the right to keep them there until Messiah,
There sins were forgiven, looking forward to Christ.
The Jews of Jesus' day and the generation that followed would have understood this.
This is not speaking about 144,000 actual people.
It was a reminder to those who heard it of God's Covenant Promises.
The 144,000, are the fullness (or Completion) of the faithful of Old Covenant Israel.
The males represent, the firstborn.
Or Israel bringing a first born unto the Resurrection of the Dead.
They represented the faithful of the dead in Shoel, 'Abraham's Bosom'.
Satan had the right to keep them there until Messiah,
There sins were forgiven, looking forward to Christ.
The Jews of Jesus' day and the generation that followed would have understood this.
This is not speaking about 144,000 actual people.
It was a reminder to those who heard it of God's Covenant Promises.
They are not male virgins.
144000 is just another name for the vast masses who belong to the kingdom, describe in the same chapter in Revelation. In one aspect they are numbered, in another aspect they can't be counted (by man). Sorry, I'm lazy, here is an article from the Christian Research Institute:
144000 is just another name for the vast masses who belong to the kingdom, describe in the same chapter in Revelation. In one aspect they are numbered, in another aspect they can't be counted (by man). Sorry, I'm lazy, here is an article from the Christian Research Institute:
Last edited:
A
Would like to get view of what it means that 144,000 are SEALED. I know that the Bible says 12 from each of the 12 tribes of Isreal, but I thought we were all sealed by God when we become Christians, Give our lives to God. Curious here
N
Would like to get view of what it means that 144,000 are SEALED. I know that the Bible says 12 from each of the 12 tribes of Isreal, but I thought we were all sealed by God when we become Christians, Give our lives to God. Curious here
This sealing will be marked in the minds of God's elect in all the tribes of Israel. If you believe this is referring only to the Jews, then you are far off base. The "House of Israel" comprise ten of the twelve tribes, and they were scattered long ago. We know them today as the Christian nations of the Americas, Western Europe, and wherever else they migrated to, and now exist. The book of Hosea details this fact for us.
If you want a more complete study just write .
Last edited:
I agree with CoooCaw, read the text! And keep it in it's historical setting! Or you can make it mean what ever the hell you want it to mean. It's not just speaking of the Jews it's speaking of the 12 Tribes of Israel. Old Covenant Israel was abolished in 70 AD. It is damning to start spiritualizing things in Revelations and trying to make them fit into what ever time period you live in. Every nut job thinks they are apart of the 144,000 literal, or spiritual people spoken of here.
You first must recognize that Scripture was written by Jews. What you struggle to comprehend as gentiles is easy to recognize when you understand we are adopted Jews. Natural vines were cut off so we could be grafted in.
Now considering myself an adopted Jew understanding scripture from a Hebrew's point of view only comes from understanding their customs and culture. If you know what they thought it is easy to understand the text. Hebrews had a type of language expressed by numbers. We would call it symbolism but it was more literal than symbolic if you are a Jew. IF you consider this
Jewish symbolism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Few people who consider themselves Christian even try to comprehend what it means to be Jewish or how our(yes OUR) historical thought pattern can clarify the meaning of scripture to us who are so long separated from our heritage. Anyway, There are answers here that are very close to the truth.
This is a quote from the page I linked:
"The number twelve, being the product of three and four, typified the union of the people with God.[SUP][6][/SUP][SUP][7][/SUP][SUP][8][/SUP] On the table were twelve loaves of show-bread, and the breastplate of the priest contained twelve precious stones as emblems of the twelve tribes of Israel, which camped round about the Sanctuary.
From this it is clear. The entirety of Chapter 7 in Revelation is talking about one people. The 144,000 and the multitude are one in the same people. When we read King of Kings most of us recognize that it means The utmost King or the king that rules over all...or the King who is the completion of kings. We see this throughout scripture. When something is complete or utmost the name is doubled. Since we don't consider numerology to be a language the numbers were not translated(which to be certain God has a perfect purpose for this) IF they had been translated, we would read the first part of chapter 7 differently.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000(the completion of the completion of those united with God) from all the tribes of Israel.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]From the tribe of Judah 12,000(the completion of those united with God) were sealed,
AS was stated in a previous reply, the number 1000 is used in scripture to describe a multitude...like a number that is uncountable. Consider all these things and the text is perfectly clear. The 144,000(the completion of the completion of those united with God) and the multitude are one in the same. It is the same thing being said twice...just as was typical of Jewish writings King of Kings, Lord of Lords, I am who I am, holy of holy and so on.
Now considering myself an adopted Jew understanding scripture from a Hebrew's point of view only comes from understanding their customs and culture. If you know what they thought it is easy to understand the text. Hebrews had a type of language expressed by numbers. We would call it symbolism but it was more literal than symbolic if you are a Jew. IF you consider this
Jewish symbolism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Few people who consider themselves Christian even try to comprehend what it means to be Jewish or how our(yes OUR) historical thought pattern can clarify the meaning of scripture to us who are so long separated from our heritage. Anyway, There are answers here that are very close to the truth.
This is a quote from the page I linked:
"The number twelve, being the product of three and four, typified the union of the people with God.[SUP][6][/SUP][SUP][7][/SUP][SUP][8][/SUP] On the table were twelve loaves of show-bread, and the breastplate of the priest contained twelve precious stones as emblems of the twelve tribes of Israel, which camped round about the Sanctuary.
From this it is clear. The entirety of Chapter 7 in Revelation is talking about one people. The 144,000 and the multitude are one in the same people. When we read King of Kings most of us recognize that it means The utmost King or the king that rules over all...or the King who is the completion of kings. We see this throughout scripture. When something is complete or utmost the name is doubled. Since we don't consider numerology to be a language the numbers were not translated(which to be certain God has a perfect purpose for this) IF they had been translated, we would read the first part of chapter 7 differently.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000(the completion of the completion of those united with God) from all the tribes of Israel.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]From the tribe of Judah 12,000(the completion of those united with God) were sealed,
AS was stated in a previous reply, the number 1000 is used in scripture to describe a multitude...like a number that is uncountable. Consider all these things and the text is perfectly clear. The 144,000(the completion of the completion of those united with God) and the multitude are one in the same. It is the same thing being said twice...just as was typical of Jewish writings King of Kings, Lord of Lords, I am who I am, holy of holy and so on.
The 144,000 are again seen in the 14 ch. of Revelation; 14:4 states they are male virgins which has been mentioned already. So I ask you, were not all of the 1st born males of Israel, 'unto the Resurrection of the Dead', not virgins at their birth? Yes! In the 3rd vs. it says....the hundred and forty-four thousand who were redeemed from the earth.... Earth here referring to the Covenant land of Israel.
Bringing a first-born unto the Resurrection of the Dead was so important that it had to itself another law to help secure it, it was called the Levi-rite Law. These faithful of Old Covenant Israel, were Jesus' first obligation, beings after His death on the Cross He was in Shoel (Paradise), with them; some of them had been there for thousands of years. In vs. 1 they are standing with the risen Lamb having been risen with Him on Mt. Zion; Mt Zion is a reference to New Covenant Israel 'The Church' being established in 70 AD. In vs. 6 Now is .....the everlasting Gospel preached.......to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people..... Now the whole earth has become the Covenant Land of New Covenant Israel in the preaching of the Gospel. What ever else you may choose to do, you cannot confuse, .....bringing forth a first-born male unto the resurrection of the dead, with the 1st Resurrection! The former is specifically a promise to Old Covenant Israel, the latter is to all in Christ who follow after. All who are born-again Christians are sealed by the Holy Spirit in this everlasting Covenant by God with Israel. But if God did not fulfill His Word with these faithful dead of Old Covenant Israel, between Jesus' death in 30 AD and Old Covenant Israel becoming obsolete in the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD. Then there is nothing for you to be sealed in except for a bunch of 'hogwash' that pretenders have created in spiritualizing these texts. Did not Jesus explain once, that He did not come to do away with the Law and the Prophets but to fulfill them? Bringing forth a first-born unto the Resurrection of the Dead was the ultimate fulfilling of the Law and the Prophets. In Ch. 7 we see these first-born male virgins sealed, either literal or symbolic; in Ch. 14 we see them resurrected with Christ at the establishing of the present day Church. Remember these first-born sons represented many more then themselves. The Church began 40 years earlier at Pentecost, but it could not be established as apart of this everlasting Covenant of God and Israel, until God fulfilled His Word with the faithful dead of Old Creation World in Adam.
Bringing a first-born unto the Resurrection of the Dead was so important that it had to itself another law to help secure it, it was called the Levi-rite Law. These faithful of Old Covenant Israel, were Jesus' first obligation, beings after His death on the Cross He was in Shoel (Paradise), with them; some of them had been there for thousands of years. In vs. 1 they are standing with the risen Lamb having been risen with Him on Mt. Zion; Mt Zion is a reference to New Covenant Israel 'The Church' being established in 70 AD. In vs. 6 Now is .....the everlasting Gospel preached.......to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people..... Now the whole earth has become the Covenant Land of New Covenant Israel in the preaching of the Gospel. What ever else you may choose to do, you cannot confuse, .....bringing forth a first-born male unto the resurrection of the dead, with the 1st Resurrection! The former is specifically a promise to Old Covenant Israel, the latter is to all in Christ who follow after. All who are born-again Christians are sealed by the Holy Spirit in this everlasting Covenant by God with Israel. But if God did not fulfill His Word with these faithful dead of Old Covenant Israel, between Jesus' death in 30 AD and Old Covenant Israel becoming obsolete in the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD. Then there is nothing for you to be sealed in except for a bunch of 'hogwash' that pretenders have created in spiritualizing these texts. Did not Jesus explain once, that He did not come to do away with the Law and the Prophets but to fulfill them? Bringing forth a first-born unto the Resurrection of the Dead was the ultimate fulfilling of the Law and the Prophets. In Ch. 7 we see these first-born male virgins sealed, either literal or symbolic; in Ch. 14 we see them resurrected with Christ at the establishing of the present day Church. Remember these first-born sons represented many more then themselves. The Church began 40 years earlier at Pentecost, but it could not be established as apart of this everlasting Covenant of God and Israel, until God fulfilled His Word with the faithful dead of Old Creation World in Adam.
