Is america becoming a Pagan nation?

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Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
113
#81
To tell you the truth a true pagan people is one that worship another God and doesn't acknowledge the one true God at all.
But to know the true and living God, his blessings and testament and to turn away is a worse offence than having never known.
And most people in the world do worship god money and luxury life style not only people from rich country.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
14,143
5,720
113
#82
The Psychological Community and the Drug manufacturers are complicit in guiding the confused to Gender Change and no matter what the religious community thinks, there is no way back. One can repent in their heart but nothing can be done to surgically put them back together. The Christian Community is replete with those who speak out of turn, and have triggered many suicides. They will face God with their deeds. I say this with the anger of frustration.
yeah I don’t think whatever we do is ever going to change what God said is good and evil. We’re all going to face God for our words and deeds , but it’s not going to be according to what the world thinks is right and wrong it will be according to what God said

Christians are normally going to believe the things they learn from the Bible so there are going to disagree with thkngs like transgenderism and homosexual marriages and thkngs like that. It’s just a reality in the church we can’t let the world decide what’s right and wrong it’s always trying to do that that’s why the country is like it is

we don’t remain in what God said is good and evil, we try to get consensus and make up our own good and evil, and then we get bent against what God said first and consider those things to be “ an evil “ rather than what they are
 

Katia

Active member
Aug 29, 2021
493
219
43
PDX
#83
yeah I don’t think whatever we do is ever going to change what God said is good and evil. We’re all going to face God for our words and deeds , but it’s not going to be according to what the world thinks is right and wrong it will be according to what God said

Christians are normally going to believe the things they learn from the Bible so there are going to disagree with thkngs like transgenderism and homosexual marriages and thkngs like that. It’s just a reality in the church we can’t let the world decide what’s right and wrong it’s always trying to do that that’s why the country is like it is

we don’t remain in what God said is good and evil, we try to get consensus and make up our own good and evil, and then we get bent against what God said first and consider those things to be “ an evil “ rather than what they are
"And he made them Male and Female". I am not challenging you.

Since the fall, this is not strictly true any more. Thankfully the incidence is low, there are folk who are referred to as Intersex, not strictly XX or XY and there are many variations. And then of course there are those with conditions like AIS (Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome) and others. People, sadly including the religious are at times quite cruel to people like this.

I won't moralize about homosexuality because that is not up to me but God only. The argument about it being a moral issue or having been born that way is tiresome and I get angry. There are however, those who get labelled as Transgender by people who have no right to speak about it. It used to be that new born babies born with visible disorders simply disappeared for a while so the Doctor could preform some corrective surgery, so the mother could have either a boy or a girl. After numbers of various disasters that often involved suicides, many Doctors have stopped doing them. It is becoming the normal protocol that as the child grows up, they can decide for themselves. And NO I am not going to write about my own personal experiences. It is private.
 

Icedaisey

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2021
1,398
475
83
#84
To the OP question, the 1st amendment insures the religious freedom of pagans. ;)

American government has always been secular, not Theocratic.

Some think the phrase in the Declaration of Independence, natures God, means that those who oversaw the draft of that document were Christian. Actually, the phrase regarding nature and natures God is taken from the writing of John Locke, Theory of Natural Rights.
Locke was raised in a Puritan household.
He later evolved his theology to that of a Calvinist trinitarian. Gradually he began to embrace the teachings of Faustus Socinus as a "Socinian Christian". Faustus Socinus believed in the separation of church and state.

As to the trajectory of America's state today, I think it's fast moving toward Authoritarianism, with a smattering of Socialism. Both schools of thought raised their head during the lock down. A term and application that was previously relegated to that of prisoners in prisons.

I think the whole thing is a social experiment. To see how far we shall allow ourselves to be pushed away from our inalienable rights. And how easily or if at all, we'll concede to the new rules and stipulations that portend allowance of our being given limited liberty in future. While we'll never return to the liberty we once enjoyed, we even before Covid were being slowly groomed to accept the authoritarian model.
Political Correctness. Thought re-education programs. Etc....

Interestingly the Jeremy Renner film, The Bourne Legacy is being replayed in some markets now. There's a fascinating bit of timing. Especially given the line by "Dr. Marta Shearing"
Well, if you're going to reprogram human genetic material, you need a delivery system, and nothing works better than virus. It's like a suitcase.

Linked:
1632947431452.png
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
113
#86
And the answer is Yes. Paul is difficult to understand, so Paul is often misunderstood. We need to know that Paul did not oppose Jesus to understand Paul. Some people even say that Paul cancelled all law while Jesus expanded the law into the law plus the spirit of the law. We need Jesus to explain Paul.
Both the words of Paul and the words of Jesus are inspired by God the Holy Spirit. The problem is the word twisters, not with Paul or Jesus.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
23,460
7,188
113
#87
you know what

Eunuchs heard the gospel and they got saved. Its right in the Bible, Jesus even addressed them and said people wouldnt understand. some were born eunuchs and some chose to be.

so, why are some christians being so judgy about the whole male and female thing.

both homosexuality and heterosexuality or plain sexuality is actually not right in the bible either. Just because there are male and female doesnt mean just anyone can copulate with anyone! In fact fornication and adultery are seen as major sins too....as well as incest.
 
Nov 26, 2012
3,095
1,050
113
#89
At age 45 I think I’ve seen enough elections both Canadian and American to conclude that candidates have nothing to do with leadership. They are merely the mask of the parties. The parties are the marionettes. The marionettes’ strings are held in the right and left hand of one puppeteer. We the voters are merely are indicators of how the show progresses. If he dangles the left and they cheer then he keeps the crowd entertained while the real changes are made in back rooms off stage. Nothing ever gets better. It only trends further and further into offering up more gods to worship turning hearts from the Creator. First “freedom” under the guise of democracy, money under capitalism, entertainment under free speech. One nation under gods.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
113
#90
Going back to post #33, Jaumie was implying that Paul’s word’s were lesser than Jesus’ words, when in fact Jesus words were written down by the Apostles and Paul’s words were written down by Paul or Luke, but THEY WERE ALL INSPIRED BY THE HOLY SPIRIT, ALL EQUAL, that was my point.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
113
#91
At age 45 I think I’ve seen enough elections both Canadian and American to conclude that candidates have nothing to do with leadership. They are merely the mask of the parties. The parties are the marionettes. The marionettes’ strings are held in the right and left hand of one puppeteer. We the voters are merely are indicators of how the show progresses. If he dangles the left and they cheer then he keeps the crowd entertained while the real changes are made in back rooms off stage. Nothing ever gets better. It only trends further and further into offering up more gods to worship turning hearts from the Creator. First “freedom” under the guise of democracy, money under capitalism, entertainment under free speech. One nation under gods.
Some say illuminati behind that puppet and the devil behind illuminati
 

Katia

Active member
Aug 29, 2021
493
219
43
PDX
#92
you know what

Eunuchs heard the gospel and they got saved. Its right in the Bible, Jesus even addressed them and said people wouldnt understand. some were born eunuchs and some chose to be.

so, why are some christians being so judgy about the whole male and female thing.

both homosexuality and heterosexuality or plain sexuality is actually not right in the bible either. Just because there are male and female doesnt mean just anyone can copulate with anyone! In fact fornication and adultery are seen as major sins too....as well as incest.
In addition to Matt. 19:12, you might be interested in Isaiah 56:4-5. These along with Micah 6:8 are my favorites. Even Intersex are loved by God.
 

Icedaisey

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2021
1,398
475
83
#93
you know what

Eunuchs heard the gospel and they got saved. Its right in the Bible, Jesus even addressed them and said people wouldnt understand. some were born eunuchs and some chose to be.

so, why are some christians being so judgy about the whole male and female thing.

both homosexuality and heterosexuality or plain sexuality is actually not right in the bible either. Just because there are male and female doesnt mean just anyone can copulate with anyone! In fact fornication and adultery are seen as major sins too....as well as incest.
Personally I think Christian's are entitled to be "judgy" if/when we are expected to concede our values to the expectations of the world in such matters.
 

Katia

Active member
Aug 29, 2021
493
219
43
PDX
#94
you know what

Eunuchs heard the gospel and they got saved. Its right in the Bible, Jesus even addressed them and said people wouldnt understand. some were born eunuchs and some chose to be.

so, why are some christians being so judgy about the whole male and female thing.

both homosexuality and heterosexuality or plain sexuality is actually not right in the bible either. Just because there are male and female doesnt mean just anyone can copulate with anyone! In fact fornication and adultery are seen as major sins too....as well as incest.
Isaiah 56:4-5, and Matt 19:12 have been a source of great comfort to me. I'm not like most and am completely a sexual. I hope that I have not said too much. I glory in God.
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#95

Katia

Active member
Aug 29, 2021
493
219
43
PDX
#96
To all the people who claim America has always been non-Christian:
Amazon.com: The Origins of American Constitutionalism (Bibliographies in the History of): 9780807115060: Lutz, Donald S.: Books

It's a small book. You can read it in an evening.

Also, I think it's important to note Paganism is a specific kind of religion, describing worshiping a pantheon of gods built upon house deity worship. What we're dealing with in the West today has its own important distinctives.
Some/many of the founding fathers were either atheist's or not overtly religious. I'll look the book up.
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#97
The point of the book is that regardless of the founding fathers' religious beliefs, the (small-r) republican tradition they were born into, The tradition of self-governance that served as casus belli in the War for Independence, had a VERY Christian cultural backdrop. That and many of our founding fathers we do not emphasize in popular history telling were observant Christians. Men like John Witherspoon (James Madison's mentor), Roger Sherman, Benjamin Rush, John Randolph of Roanoke, and so forth. Part of the reason we do not remember these men is that we have become more heathen and have chosen not to honor their memories in our popular telling of history.

Additionally, the deism of certain founders is also over-stated.

I don't think the founding of our country is perfect, but it had a better foundation than most out there. To have one man like Roger Sherman loom as large as he did is enough for me to be proud of our country in the period of separation from Britain.

It's a great book. Easily one of my favorites.

Some/many of the founding fathers were either atheist's or not overtly religious. I'll look the book up.
 

SteveEpperson

Junior Member
May 12, 2018
552
222
43
#98
Look back at history among the pagans,Rome is an excellent example.
Homosexuality,all desires of the flesh involving children, eating, drinking,and making slaves of other nations. Denying God and making up mythical gods to adore and sacrifice to.
Agreed. We often talk about the persecution of Nero against the early Christians. And it was heinous, indeed.

However, in my opinion, there was none more licentious than Caligula with his decadent sex parties and his insane pleasure killings. But, of course, all that eventually led to his assassination.

Abortion is legal. R Kelly was just convicted today for sex trafficking teens. We worship Hollywood and it's stars. We have all manner of herectical so called churches ( scientology is one bad thing)
You hit on a lot of topics here. And most of these anomalies have been around for over 100 years.

For example, Joseph Smith started Mormonism in the 1820s. The Watchtower Society had already published the first edition of their apostate New World Translation in 1918. And L. Ron Hubbard finished his book Dianetics in 1950, creating the first spark for the Scientology movement.

We don't celebrate Easter as a Passover and the day of our risen Lord! Christmas is a joke and totally pagan as well.
Within the Edict of Milan in AD 313, Roman emperor Constantine declared all Christians free from persecution. He then changed the Jewish Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday. And he even went as far as to erect Christian monuments, build enormous houses of worship, and offer state funding to various religious activities.

However, all this benevolence toward Christians— and Jews, for that matter— came at an enormous spiritual cost that we're still paying for today. What Constantine did to Christ's church was cloak it in paganism. And it has been tainted ever since.

Of course, the great protestant reformation in the 16th century was an enormous blessing to us even to this day. But some of the remnants of church tradition started by Constantine are still with us in 2021.

We are as all fallen pagan nations...... EAT,DRINK,AND BE MERRY,not acknowledging tomorrow we die but tomorrow we get to do it again as not taking into account our souls!
The term paganism is somewhat vague, where Christians over the centuries have taken it to mean any religion outside of the Gospel. So, by definition, paganism really isn't organized religion. However, what's interesting is that, during the past twenty years, it has gained traction as a movement, if not a full-blown religion, complete with religious symbols and gatherings.

One final thought. I'm not sure that I buy the argument the US is a Christian nation. But I do believe that most of our traditions are steeped in Judeo-Christian values.

And the fact that we seem to be getting away from those traditions is not necessarily because we're in the end times. I believe it's because of the cultural shift from institutional precepts into a smaller, more communal order.

And once we finally settle into this new alignment, I believe we're going to experience a revival of the magnitude we've never seen before.
 

Katia

Active member
Aug 29, 2021
493
219
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PDX
Being American, America IS a pagan nation. I do not know what is holding God's hand against us?