Is Christianity Monotheistic or has it become a Polytheistic religion?

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onwingsaseagles

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#181
#181
Mahogony,
I fully expect there to be many trinitarian along with many oneness believers in heaven believe or not I thing that some arians will be there as well. but I do not think you are on the list. You have shown no concern for what is true and have openly denied God's truth on many occasions, An honest mistake is one thing but wilfull blindness is sin.
 
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Slepsog4

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#182
#182
Wings,

I would tend to think that your statements come nearer to describing you. Jesus is clearly and emphatically distinct from both the Father and the Holy Spirit. You persist in the silly idea that Jesus is all three persons, deny plain scripture and confusing the very nature of grammar.
 
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onwingsaseagles

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#183
#183
Slepsog4 said:
Wings,

I would tend to think that your statements come nearer to describing you. Jesus is clearly and emphatically distinct from both the Father and the Holy Spirit. You persist in the silly idea that Jesus is all three persons, deny plain scripture and confusing the very nature of grammar.
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1st John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

What does this say and what does it mean to you?
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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#184
Jan 8, 2009
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#184
I do not think you are on the list.
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Think what you like , just as well God is judging me not you, Pharisee. Or are you God and know a person's heart? hmmm perhaps you think you are God, or your own little god because you feel you can make up your own doctrines independent of what is already established doctrine in the church.

You have shown no concern for what is true and have openly denied God's truth on many occasions,
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When you say "God's truth", you are referring to that truth which you believe God has revealed to you, and few others. But I have always backed up my views with scripture, which aren't actually different from most christian denominations, and the funny thing is I often use bible commentaries from people who have studied the bible and know it a lot better than myself.
 
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onwingsaseagles

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#185
#185
1st John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

What does this say and what does it mean to you?
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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#186
Jan 8, 2009
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#186
You are carnal who should I expect you to understand spiritual things?
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How dare you say such things onwings. If you are the pillar of the truth then why don't most christians believe as you do? Or are you the only one with God's Spirit? You might claim to have the truth, but you certainly don't have much of God's love that I can see.
 
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onwingsaseagles

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#187
#187
MahogonySnail said:
How dare you say such things onwings. If you are the pillar of the truth then why don't most christians believe as you do? Or are you the only one with God's Spirit? You might claim to have the truth, but you certainly don't have much of God's love that I can see.
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No matter who believe in the trinity or not to deny that John 14:18 is not referring to the Holy Spirit is to deny God's word to hold on to your doctrine. You are carnal, you have no discernment, you know not the truth.
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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#188
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#188
I know not the truth which you have defined via your own personal revelations. hmm something fishy about that. Somehow, based on my denial that John 14:18 is referring to the Spirit , you are able to conclude that :
a) I am carnal
b) have no discernment
c) know not the truth

Actually I was using sound English comprehension, and it proves or disproves none of the above.


They are very wild accusations made by someone who a) has only been saved 6 years (according to your profile) , b) is too quick to pronounce judgement , even to say I am not on the list of people saved ( a clear sign of the Pharisee spirit ), c) not accounting for the fact that the truth is something we are all learning about by God's grace.

Despite your previous claims that it doesn't matter if you believe in the Trinity or not, according to you it does matter when a person doesn't interpret John 14:18 according to your views or how you would like them to interpret it. And that's some contradiction right there. And then you are able to somehow conclude they are a), b), c) above.. sorry..if that's how you speak to fellow christians with your judgemental attitude, I wouldn't want you speaking to non-believers.
Sorry but with important doctrines such as the nature of God, it's going to take a lot more than a 6-year old christian to tell me what's right and wrong based on his own fasting experiences and private interpretation of God's Word.
 
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onwingsaseagles

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#189
#189
Man!!!, I thought you were gone.... Instead of mindless meaningless post answer this.

1st John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

What does this say and what does it mean to you?
 
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Slepsog4

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#190
#190
As you very well know it does not say that they are "one and the same". This is not saying that these three are the same person. A husband and wife are also one, but not one and the same or one person.

Stop trying to manipulate the language and forcing your theology into it.

Besides have you investigated the textual evidence for this verse.
 
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onwingsaseagles

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#191
#191
onwingsaseagles said:
1st John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

What does this say and what does it mean to you?
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Slepsog4 said:
As you very well know it does not say that they are "one and the same". This is not saying that these three are the same person. A husband and wife are also one, but not one and the same or one person.

Stop trying to manipulate the language and forcing your theology into it.

Besides have you investigated the textual evidence for this verse.
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Hahahaha, if this scripture offends your faith in your doctrine so badly it might be time to rethink your belief.
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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#192
Jan 8, 2009
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#192
1st John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

What does this say and what does it mean to you?
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What does it say? (and I believe it means to me what it says..)

In heaven there are three that bear record. Note, there are three, not one. The three are one - that they all agree in complete harmony with each other, and that these three are the one God.

What do they bear record of? That Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God ( this is the context of the chapter, 1 John 5:1-4)

and when we look to verse 8, contrasting the three witnesses on the earth, there is the Spirit, the water, and the blood.

So there are three witnesses in heaven, and three witnesses on the earth. There needs to be three witnesses, because it is by two or three witnesses that every word is established (2 Cor 13:1).


 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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#193
By the way onwings, it is debatable whether we can use these verses at all to establish anything about God's nature. Their authenticity is questionable.
But as they are clearly Trinitarian in nature, Oneness people would probably want to take them out of the bible. Yes, the KJV is really a Trinitarian bible if I can put it that way.
 
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onwingsaseagles

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#194
#194
MahogonySnail said:
What does it say? (and I believe it means to me what it says..)

In heaven there are three that bear record. Note, there are three, not one.
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You should have stopped your post right there. The rest of your post just exposed yourself again. You do not believe what it says instead you try and rationalize it away to fiit your belief. You know what i think it says. God witnesess to us through Himself ''creation'' through His word ''the prophets,Jesus, and the Bible'', and through His Spirit ''The Holy Spirit'' (The Spirit bares witness to out Spirit that we are the Sons of God Romans 8:16, and these 3 are 1. That is exactly what I believe.

Terms to expalin the Trinity not used in scripture...
3 in 1
3 separate but all one.
3 separate persons etrnally existing as 1 God
The 1 God is actually 3

What scripture does say and I believe yet you reject....The 3 are 1, not 3 in 1, not separate , not individual persons, the bible nevers says any of that. I believe exactly what scriptures says how it says it. You on the other hand have to change and twiast it into your belief.
 
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onwingsaseagles

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#195
#195
MahogonySnail said:
By the way onwings, it is debatable whether we can use these verses at all to establish anything about God's nature. Their authenticity is questionable.
But as they are clearly Trinitarian in nature, Oneness people would probably want to take them out of the bible. Yes, the KJV is really a Trinitarian bible if I can put it that way.
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No you can't and this verse clearly shows the oneness of God not the ''Tri-unity'' of God. You have blinded yourself to the truth.
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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#196
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Oneness people would probably want to take them out of the bible
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Not saying that to have a go at Oneness people, but the fact is they are taken out of the NIV versions, and that's a whole other debate in itself, can the KJV be trusted ? or can the NIV be trusted? etc etc. So we shouldn't use a doubtful verse to prove a doctrine either way.

Here's a read from the point of view of someone who believes the NIV corrected the KJV:

http://www.allaboutworldview.org/trinitarian-formula-faq.htm

And here's one from the point of view of the KJV which I think is closer to the truth than the "KJV being wrong" argument, at least it explains it better

http://www.chick.com/ask/articles/1john57.asp
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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#197
You should have stopped your post right there. The rest of your post just exposed yourself again. You do not believe what it says instead you try and rationalize it away to fiit your belief. You know what i think it says. God witnesess to us through Himself ''creation'' through His word ''the prophets,Jesus, and the Bible'', and through His Spirit ''The Holy Spirit'' (The Spirit bares witness to out Spirit that we are the Sons of God Romans 8:16, and these 3 are 1. That is exactly what I believe.
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I don't care what you think it says which you've tried to explain by your drivel ... I want to know what it really does say and mean. What it does say when you read it in context, is all three testify Jesus is the Christ the Son of God. Three witnesses, not one. There is clear comparison between the three in heaven and the three on earth. I suppose you believe the Spirit, water and blood are all one as well hey, and not three separate elements?.. The whole chapter, the whole book is meant to be read in context. And if you don't believe me if you like I can throw in a bunch of references from bible commentaries from theologians who can explain it a whole lot better and correctly than your amateurish interpretations and thoughts.

It is well understood that the verses are Trinitarian in nature, as they came from the Catholic church, believed to be inserted in the 1500's, and retained in our KJV bibles. So you are using a Catholic church/Trinitarian - inserted scripture, to prove Oneness. Now that's funny ;).
 
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onwingsaseagles

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#198
#198
MahogonySnail said:
Not saying that to have a go at Oneness people, but the fact is they are taken out of the NIV versions, and that's a whole other debate in itself, can the KJV be trusted ? or can the NIV be trusted? etc etc. So we shouldn't use a doubtful verse to prove a doctrine either way.

Here's a read from the point of view of someone who believes the NIV corrected the KJV:

http://www.allaboutworldview.org/trinitarian-formula-faq.htm

And here's one from the point of view of the KJV which I think is closer to the truth than the "KJV being wrong" argument, at least it explains it better

http://www.chick.com/ask/articles/1john57.asp
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It make no difference to me your claims of the NIV, I wouldn't let my dog read that translation, I am purely kjv, or nkjv, and I am fully convinved by scripture including 1st John 5:7 in the truth of Onenes. So you argument is mute.
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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The KJV is a Trinitarian bible, the people who wrote it were Trinitarians, now note this verse that you hold so dearly in the MKJV is italicised..it's italicised for a reason:
1Jn 5:7 For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one.
1Jn 5:8 And there are three that bear witness on the earth: the Spirit, and the water, and the blood; and the three are into the one.


So you are using a disputed doubtful scripture to prove your Oneness..when in fact it was inserted by Trinitarians because rather than contradicts, it supports their view. So what will you do now? Change bible versions? Because you really should be using the NIV unless you want these Trinitarian writings in there.
 
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onwingsaseagles

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#200
#200
MahogonySnail said:
The KJV is a Trinitarian bible, the people who wrote it were Trinitarians, now note this verse that you hold so dearly in the MKJV is italicised..it's italicised for a reason:
1Jn 5:7 For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one.
1Jn 5:8 And there are three that bear witness on the earth: the Spirit, and the water, and the blood; and the three are into the one.


So you are using a disputed doubtful scripture to prove your Oneness..when in fact it was inserted by Trinitarians because rather than contradicts, it supports their view. So what will you do now? Change bible versions? Because you really should be using the NIV unless you want these Trinitarian writings in there.
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So you are saying trinitarians added this to scripture to try and force the Bible to prove a doctrine it didn't actually teach? you are saying trinitarian falsified these documents and perverted the truth because the rest of the Bible does not really teach the Trinity? Is that what you are saying? This is scandalous do you believe that? and if so do you still adhere to this falsified doctrine?
 
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