2 Thes 1 (KJV)
4 So that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure:
5 Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:
"in all your persecutions and tribulations
that ye endure"... taking place in their present experience (
and in an ongoing way) was what made it REASONABLE for them to be wrongly convinced that "
the Day of the Lord IS PRESENT [PERFECT indicative]"... since
they already "KNOW PERFECTLY that it *ARRIVES*... like the INITIAL birth PANG [SINGULAR]" of a woman in labor (and Jesus had already spoken
about those, in His Olivet Discourse [Matt24:4/Mk13:5] as what "kicks off" those [seven] years, parallel to
what we now read about
as "the SEALS" of Rev6, which Rev1:1/1:19c[/4:1] says are a part of the "
IN QUCKNESS [NOUN]" time period [in the "
future" aspects of that Book]; See also "
avenge IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]" Lk18:8, and "
crush Satan UNDER *YOUR FEET*
IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]" Rom16:20.)
6 Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;
I suppose you mean this ^ will take place in a time-slot of 7
SECONDS or 3.5
SECONDS??
(No, I think not.)
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
Again, this verse literally reads, "ye who are troubled
rest/repose with us IN THE REVELATION OF the Lord Jesus from heaven with His mighty angels
in flaming fire INFLICTING VENGEANCE ON them that know not God [...]"
Do you think this means, during a time-slot of 7
SECONDS or 3.5
SECONDS??
So, to you, "
to recompense trouble [3.5
SECONDS'-worth] to them that trouble you [ONGOINGLY and not MOMENTARILY]"??
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
So, for us, "the FIERY TRIAL that is to TRY you" is of a somewhat lengthy duration, but "in flaming fire
TAKING VENGEANCE ON [those others]" cannot possibly be of a duration more than 3.5 SECONDS, in your view??
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
"Who SHALL be" doesn't mean precisely at that moment (of the time-period being presently addressed), but identifying their end/outcome. (namely "
eternal destruction...")
10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.
"...
when He shall come TO BE glorified IN HIS saints,
AND to be admired
in all those having believed because '
the testimony of us to you' was believed IN
THAT DAY [this second part of the sentence not speaking of the Thess "
in THIS day," but those [future 'saints'] in and experiencing the Trib yrs "IN
THAT DAY"--
they are who it is who are the ones "having believed '
the testimony of us to you,'"
as opposed to OTHERS who will
INSTEAD "believe 'THE LIE/the FALSE/the
PSEUDEI"
in that SAME TIME-PERIOD: "IN
THAT DAY"/"the
DAY OF THE LORD" time-period, when the "man of sin" will exist on the earth and DO ALL he is slated TO DO
during it [or, during the 7-yr "IN THE NIGHT" ASPECT OF it])
We see here that our persecutions & troubles are ended when Our Lord Jesus is revealed with his angels in flaming fire to take vengeance.
...which is not 3.5 SECONDS'-worth...
This is speaking of his return.
Granted, the part about the "who
SHALL suffer
ETERNAL DESTRUCTION AWAY FROM the Lord..." part, YES.
But prior to that, the 7-YRS-worth of it during the "IN THE NIGHT" ASPECT, which is the 7-yr TRIB yrs... the yrs "they shall not ESCAPE" out of (in contrast to those who WILL obey the instruction of Lk21:36 and thus be enabled to FLEE OUT OF [same Grk word as "ESCAPE" ^ ] each and every thing taking place IN/DURING the trib (i.e. the TRIB 'saints'--those who will have come to faith FOLLOWING "our Rapture")
This isn't addressing people 'left behind'
In part it is, and in part he's speaking of us... He's not just covering "one point," here, but several (and of MORE THAN merely a spans of "3.5 SECONDS'-worth" of time)
It's addressing the church.
This is the order he gives. Not me but the apostle who wrote this by the inspiration of God The Holy Spirit.
1 Tribulation experience in the church.
2 His return in glory which stops it. The 2nd coming.
3 Everlasting destruction of his enemies. (This is the wrath we are not appointed to.)
The "salvation" Paul is mostly covering in his Thess epistles is an "
eschatological salvation" ("the
One delivering us out-from THE WRATH COMING" 1Th1:10, for one example)... where "the wrath coming" is what will take place ON THE EARTH (in the "IN THE NIGHT" time-period [commencing with the INTIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR; 1Th5:2-3 / Matt24:4/Mk13:5]" of many MORE that will ALSO unfold upon the earth following that *FIRST* SEAL that Jesus Himself will open, when He will "STAND to JUDGE" Isa3:13, Rev5:6 [Lam2:3-4 parallel the wording in 2Th2:7b-8
a at the
START of the [7-]trib yrs [Dan9:27
a(26b)], not its MIDDLE (v.1:
4/Dan9:27b) nor its ENDING (v.8
b/Dan9:27c)])
It's not right to take a wrecking-ball to scripture & reassemble it with an extra return plus heavenly wine & dine inserted.
That is man-made doctrine only.
Again... biblically, the word
"RETURN" is applicable ONLY to [the time-slot of] His "RETURN"
TO THE EARTH ("when he will
RETURN FROM the wedding"...
THEN the meal Lk12:36-37,38,40,42-44 [and its parallel in Matt24]... and His dealing out of responsibilities: "have thou authority
over 10 CITIES... [and]
over 5 CITIES" Lk19:12,15,17,19
"RETURN"), that is,
in Rev19 (at the END of the "IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]" time-period)... but WAY BACK in Rev4-5
(b/f the FIRST SEAL is OPENED) we see ppl IN Heaven SAYING "and hast redeemed
US to God by thy blood
out-of EVERY kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation"... and Paul had said he would receive a crown/
stephanos "IN
THAT DAY" (
not the day of his death), and not to him
ONLY.
What you are doing it simply
lumping a bunch of stuff together into "3.5 SECONDS" at the moment of His "RETURN"
to the earth Rev19, instead of recognizing where these things fit into
a spans of time of much more duration than you are seeing.[/QUOTE]