Is The Lent Period Necessary?

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Didymous

Senior Member
Feb 22, 2018
4,417
1,639
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#41
Citing Mardi Gras as an excuse to disrespect Lent is a truly cheap shot.
Have you read in the Bible that you need to close your eyes when you pray? No, but it still helps to shut out distractions from focusing on God.
Have you read in the Bible that churches should give altar calls after worship? No, but altar calls still help in bringing people to Christ.
Have you read in the Bible that the New Testament is divinely inspired? No, but Catholic tradition proved trustworthy to select the right books for the NT canon.
I never said anything about mardi gras.
I don't close my eyes when I pray.
Most of the churches I attend don't do altar calls.
2 Timothy 3:16 seems to suggest otherwise. Apparently they felt the same about the apocrypha, but I didn't see those books in most bibles I've read.
 

Didymous

Senior Member
Feb 22, 2018
4,417
1,639
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#42
salvation chil: "Yes I agree. Its sad how many of these things are created by men and forced onto believers as a requirement."

How unkind and judgmental! Liturgical traditions offer the discipline of structures to encourage the church to fast, pray, reflect on whether they have unconfessed sin, recognize spiritual testing, and depend their appreciation of Christ's atoning sacrifice and this Fundamentalist Ghetto thinks this is "sad!" Lent is only a requirement in the sense that these spiritual disciplines are recommended. I mean, you don't need a healthy prayer life to qualify as a Christian, but it is a requirement in the sense that you won't grow spiritually without it. But churches don't check up on you to see that meet that requirement.
Most people don't need 'traditions' to fast, pray, or any of the other things you mentioned.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
5,117
2,002
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#43
Most people don't need 'traditions' to fast, pray, or any of the other things you mentioned.
Yes sorry but we just dont have those traditions. The 40 day fast is biblical but the ash bit goes against what Jesus said when you fast, wash your face and do it in secret. Matthew 6:16-18

Another thing is Jesus didnt command his disciples to fast with him. Its good to do though, but Jesus actually went into the wilderness to do it. He didnt make a big show of it in public. And he didnt ask the whole church to do it.

One thing we do observe, cos Jesus tells us to, is passover. Do you obeserve it? Thats what God had insituted as a perpetual memorial and reminder of freedom from bondage. If we are believers, we have been freed.
 

Didymous

Senior Member
Feb 22, 2018
4,417
1,639
113
#44
Citing Mardi Gras as an excuse to disrespect Lent is a truly cheap shot.
Have you read in the Bible that you need to close your eyes when you pray? No, but it still helps to shut out distractions from focusing on God.
Have you read in the Bible that churches should give altar calls after worship? No, but altar calls still help in bringing people to Christ.
Have you read in the Bible that the New Testament is divinely inspired? No, but Catholic tradition proved trustworthy to select the right books for the NT canon.
Also, since the catholic church has a long history of hiding pedophiles in its midst-should we encourage pastors of other denominations to molest children, and then try to hide these atrocities from the rest of the world? The large amount of child predators in this group is the main reason why many, many Native Americans are so anti-Christian. My mother and her cousins were abused by 'fathers' AND nuns.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
10,827
1,919
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#45
it's all connected to Mardi-Gras, = mardi is from marduk the babylonian sun-god -
it's a celebration and declaration of 'war' against The Only True God -
the fruits of this pagan-decadent-festival bear witness to very real
demonic-darkness and witch-craft -
it also has many fingers that reach into other so called religious festivals that
the many christians' partake of...

we must NEVER partake at the table of devils - in any way-shape-form' -
1COR. 10:21.
You cannot drink the cup of The Lord, and the cup of devils:
you cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils.

Where do you get this nonsense from?

French:
Mardi- Tuesday.
Gras- fat.

That is "Fat Tuesday" in English. It was the day to get rid of rich fat and eggs, so they were traditionally used to make Pancakes. Hence, Fat Tuesday is also Pancake or Shrove Tuesday!

Nothing Babylonian about it! Regardless of where you read it in the internet.

(I am fluent in French, and used to teach French immersion but you don't have to be a professional in French to figure this out!)
 

JohnRH

Junior Member
Mar 5, 2018
268
99
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#46
So I have read that ..

''The rules for fasting and abstinence in the United States are: Every person 14 years or older must abstain from meat (and items made with meat) on Ash Wednesday, Good Friday, and all the Fridays of Lent. Every person between theage of 18 and 59 (beginning of 60th year) must fast on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday. ''

I practice not to eat meat on Good Friday weekend, and on Ask Wednesday. However, I cannot understand the purpose of the Lent period nor its importance. Is it from man or from God? How is it necessary for Christians?

Please help.
1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; 3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
 

garee

Senior Member
Mar 28, 2016
12,746
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#47
So the Catholics are the ones who came up with this? I never knew the origins. It would make sense though
With Catholisicim everything is a mystical sign gift to those who walk by sight in respect to a kingdom that comes by observation.

Lent has to do with mystical things that can cause a wonder as "false source of faith" .

Its part of their way of creating illusions as a private source of counterfeit faith. That kind of work is recognized in scripture as the, "law of the fathers" same pattern as the unbelieving Jew. . Mystify people put them in a trance under the spell of Rome.

Their claim again focusing on the mystical ...They call themselves that to help emphasize . The Holy Church the "mystical body of Christ .

Catholicism. The mystic sect, creators of lying wonders. . Ash Wednesday is another work the pew Catholics can perform as a sign gift as a way of beefing false pride..

Just as many doctrines they get seem to be turned upside down by the counterfeiter, the father of lies. This is as it seems is in order to mystify the non venerable pew Catholic. They are fed many mystical experiences like lent. They have a whole army of mystics and mystic interpreters . Together with all of the supposed new private revelations as illusions there is a over flow of visions that must be tried by these mystic interpreters.

The lent tradition as a law of the Catholic fathers .It can be seen in the portion of scripture below.

The Catholic mystifying tradition from my experience of goes something like...

"The mystifying lent"...... Don't eat meat on Friday...... do the will of the Holy Father, the Holy See in Rome as it works in you to both will and do the Popes good pleasure...

Not eating meat creates a illusion someone is doing the will of another . Another gospel, another Christ.

The catch phrase of catholisicim , I have meat to eat that ye know not of

Then they went out of the city, and came unto him. In the mean while his disciples prayed him, saying, Master, eat. But he said unto them, I have meat to eat that ye know not of. Therefore said the disciples one to another, Hath any man brought him ought to eat? Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.John 4:30-34

The meat of lent the earting and drinking damantion to one self as a sign gift.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
5,117
2,002
113
#51
Where do you get this nonsense from?

French:
Mardi- Tuesday.
Gras- fat.

That is "Fat Tuesday" in English. It was the day to get rid of rich fat and eggs, so they were traditionally used to make Pancakes. Hence, Fat Tuesday is also Pancake or Shrove Tuesday!

Nothing Babylonian about it! Regardless of where you read it in the internet.

(I am fluent in French, and used to teach French immersion but you don't have to be a professional in French to figure this out!)
Yes it means fat tuesday, yet it isnt biblical cos in the Bible God specifiies, written in exodus, all leaven (yeast) to be removed, not fat and eggs. The feast of unleavened bread. For seven days until passover. And on the passover day, every household is to prepare a roast lamb. Which is meat! Then on that day everyone is to eat it together. Ever celebrated this? Jesus did, every year, and always went to Jeruslame to do so.

So this lent observance isnt biblical. The only thing about it that is vaguely biblical is the 40 days yet as the OP shows its not even true fasting for the entire 40 days.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
25,985
7,171
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#52
The only thing about it that is vaguely biblical is the 40 days yet as the OP shows its not even true fasting for the entire 40 days.
vaguely Biblical sounds like a good assessment.
whats Biblical is that Christ fasted for 40 days once and He never commanded any of His apostles to do so even once, much less yearly.

not to disparage anyone who wants to do something to devote themselves to God. but just to be realistic; this isn't something required in scripture it's just a ritual meant to sort-of imitate a one-time event.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
10,827
1,919
113
#53
Yes it means fat tuesday, yet it isnt biblical cos in the Bible God specifiies, written in exodus, all leaven (yeast) to be removed, not fat and eggs. The feast of unleavened bread. For seven days until passover. And on the passover day, every household is to prepare a roast lamb. Which is meat! Then on that day everyone is to eat it together. Ever celebrated this? Jesus did, every year, and always went to Jeruslame to do so.

So this lent observance isnt biblical. The only thing about it that is vaguely biblical is the 40 days yet as the OP shows its not even true fasting for the entire 40 days.
Did I say it was Biblical? Was I addressing you? I was addressing Blik, who said it was from the feast of Marduk, in the depths of Babylonian history, which it was definitely not.

Next time, please read both the post I am quoting, and my post. My church is trying to do Lent, a Baptist Church. I am boycotting it, because it is treading much too close to the traditions of the RCC and other churches.

If someone benefits, that is fine. Not that I approve, I'm just not condemning others. But, not for me. Although, I did use Shrove Tuesday as an excuse to go out for pancakes. Nothing about clearing my kitchen out of anything!
 
Feb 8, 2019
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#54
For a good but simple summary of the origin and purpose of Lent, read:

https://stmatthewsnewport.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/LENT-Meaning-of.wpd-revised.pdf

In the church of my youth (my first 21 years), Lent was not observed. Later, when I became a United Methodist pastor, I came to view this oversight as a spiritual tragedy. It is one thing not to observe Lent; it is quite another to disparage those who do. That indeed is a sign of judgmental spiritual immaturity. My congregation learned to appreciate how sensitivity to the church calendar helped them identify and upgrade their spiritual journey.

The disrespect posters display towards Lenten observance mirrors their indifference to the life of the Christian as spiritual journey. It is far too easy to forget about Jesus' teaching on the need for continual confession of sin, repentance, and the need for self-denial for the prospective disciple. Lent begins with Ash Wednesday, a service devoted to renewed self-assessment and meditation on areas of hidden sin that need recognition, confession, and repentance. In many churches, these unconfessed sins are written down on a piece of paper to ensure that the penitent seeker is more serious about the cost of discipleship than the mockers on this site. Then this paper is publicly burnt to signify the marvelous truth that God buries their sins in the sea of His forgetfulness and then puts up a sign that says, "No fishing!" So when we continue to wallow in guilt feelings, after repentance, we are fishing in a No Fishing zone! Towards the end of the service, congregants come forward to allow the pastors to apply ash to their foreheads in the shape of a cross. In the OT, penitents combined fasting with an application of ashes to demonstrate the seriousness with which they take authentic repentance. When the congregation disperses to shop for food, etc,, this cross-shaped ash bears eloquent testimony to the basic requirements of true discipleship.

The 40 days of Lent extend from Ash Wednesday to Easter Sunday, but Sundays don't count in the calculation. The 40 day duration recalls Moses' 40 day fast in Mount Sinai, Elijah's 40 day fast on his journey to Mount Sinai (= Mount Horeb), and Jesus' 40 day fast during His time of testing in the wilderness at the beginning of His public ministry. So Lenten fasting is a way of imitating these spiritual giants and making self-denial real and not just a pious part of our spiritual self-image.

Besdies the themes of confession, repentance, and self-denial, Lent begins with an emphasis on spiritual testing during our spiritual journey. Lenten observers find this helpful because believers often lose sight of how regularly we are tested in our daily walk. Failure to notice these tests often means test failure! Lent also stresses the process of spiritual rebirth and transformation. On Palm/ Passion Sunday and even on preceding Sundays, Lenten services focus on Holy Week in Jesus' final days, so that the events leading up to His crucifixion are understood as a coherent whole. The service on Holy Thursday often includes either a Passover meal or a foot washing ceremony for meditation on the messianic symbolism of the Passover meal and the true meaning of Jesus' foot washing episode in John 13. On Good Friday, of course, the church altar is stripped to draw attention to the horror of Jesus' suffering on the cross in anticipation of the redecoration of the altar during the triumphant processional hymn (usually "Christ the Lord is Risen Today") on Easter Sunday. Lenten disciplines thus enhance the anticipation and joyful celebration on Easter Sunday.
What I see from Mainline Protestant denominations is that they are still followers of the Catholic Church. Period.
I would strongly discourage believers from taking part in the practice of putting Ashes on your Forehead or Right hand!

Why submit to practices that are pseudo-Old Testament such similar to fasting and covering yourself in sackcloth and ashes, when we now have a new convenant, a better covenent in Christ. [Hebrews 8:6] Doing so is a statement that Christ's atoning sacrifice is not sufficient.

Christ Alone atones for Sin. Covering yourself in ashes and fasting does NOT pay for your sins. It is a reputiation of Christ's work on the cross.

If one wishes to fast as a gesture to Christ, if one wishes to deny themselves in an effort to be like Christ than that is Great! But this does not buy you any Grace. These "good deeds" are merely gestures of your believe.

Lent and Ash Wednesday are entirely Man-Made. If you do them they are gestures to what Man has created.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
25,985
7,171
113
#55
I would strongly discourage believers from taking part in the practice of putting Ashes on your Forehead or Right hand!
i've never done this - raised in a church that never did - but when i first heard about it, having a childhood friend who was Episcopalian - i thought, didn't Christ say when we fast not to go around looking like we're fasting, but to do it in secret so that the Father who sees in secret will reward us -- and isn't it kind of contrary to this for me to put a big sign on my forehead saying hey y'all look at me i'm fasting?
 

oldethennew

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2016
9,685
1,942
113
#56
Where do you get this nonsense from?

French:
Mardi- Tuesday.
Gras- fat.

That is "Fat Tuesday" in English. It was the day to get rid of rich fat and eggs, so they were traditionally used to make Pancakes. Hence, Fat Tuesday is also Pancake or Shrove Tuesday!

Nothing Babylonian about it! Regardless of where you read it in the internet.

(I am fluent in French, and used to teach French immersion but you don't have to be a professional in French to figure this out!)
=========================================
look at the dictionary = - plus, I've been there, done that, and there was absolutely nothing 'christian' about any of it,
plus, I could never get away with posting what I saw and experienced there -
so, Sis, take us at our 'word', if you can... what ever, we Love you!...
 

Locoponydirtman

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2018
2,295
1,376
113
Texas
#57
So I have read that ..

''The rules for fasting and abstinence in the United States are: Every person 14 years or older must abstain from meat (and items made with meat) on Ash Wednesday, Good Friday, and all the Fridays of Lent. Every person between theage of 18 and 59 (beginning of 60th year) must fast on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday. ''

I practice not to eat meat on Good Friday weekend, and on Ask Wednesday. However, I cannot understand the purpose of the Lent period nor its importance. Is it from man or from God? How is it necessary for Christians?

Please help.
But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons, by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron, men who forbid marriage and advocate abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth.
1 TIMOTHY 4:1‭-‬3 NASB
https://bible.com/bible/100/1ti.4.1-3.NASB
 

garee

Senior Member
Mar 28, 2016
12,746
1,170
113
#58
What I see from Mainline Protestant denominations is that they are still followers of the Catholic Church. Period.
I would strongly discourage believers from taking part in the practice of putting Ashes on your Forehead or Right hand!

Why submit to practices that are pseudo-Old Testament such similar to fasting and covering yourself in sackcloth and ashes, when we now have a new convenant, a better covenent in Christ. [Hebrews 8:6] Doing so is a statement that Christ's atoning sacrifice is not sufficient.

Christ Alone atones for Sin. Covering yourself in ashes and fasting does NOT pay for your sins. It is a reputiation of Christ's work on the cross.

If one wishes to fast as a gesture to Christ, if one wishes to deny themselves in an effort to be like Christ than that is Great! But this does not buy you any Grace. These "good deeds" are merely gestures of your believe.

Lent and Ash Wednesday are entirely Man-Made. If you do them they are gestures to what Man has created.
I would compare the Catholic "mystical tradition" of lent more to the understanding of the kind food that the disciples knew not of .
.Which was to do the will of another not seen or walk by faith. Jesus declared His meat was to do the will of the father and finish the work of faith as the labor of His promised love..

Catholisicim as a oral mystical tradition of the fathers have created lent so show they identify as the people of the flesh, and not people of the born again Spirit of Christ, the Holy Spirit of God. But people who must believe the kingdom of God must come by observation as the very foundation of their belief system. They say a man seen must teach them as to the manner of their spirit.

Ash Wednesday in the same way.. a false source of faith, giving the illusion something is there, but it is not or something not there and it is . The Commandment to apply ashes to one forehead is as a sign to themselves whose approval they are seeking after.(the Pope their Holy Father). There is no written tradition , the new oral traditions of the fathers simply makes the word of God's tradition without effect.

It would seem that those who do hold to a form of mysticism forget signs work in two ways. Either to point back; there it goes. Or point ahead; here it comes. Learn the difference between the things of men seen and that of God not seen .Mysticism the old age, new age doctrine of men is on the rise, or still rising.. picking up speed.
 

Mii

Well-known member
Mar 23, 2019
899
615
93
#59
The concept of corporate fasting is a personal choice...it shouldn't EVER be compulsory.


Thanks, its true, it is not from God. I remember when I was in high school, a preacher came to us and stated that we dont have to give up meat but anything that you enjoy in life whether it be music, chocolate, etc. I was confused then and felt guilty since I gave up nothing. Ive always felt the guilt. Now I understand that its man-made and not necessarily instructed by God. :)
I do actually agree that fasting can be anything, so something can be gleaned from that experience at least :)

Obviously the decision is your personal choice and leading by the spirit but that's between you and the Lord.



I would encourage you not to let experiences like this turn you completely off to fasting as there are definite spiritual benefits. Jesus did do it for a reason. It's a VERY private thing though in my experience.
 

Mii

Well-known member
Mar 23, 2019
899
615
93
#60
I think there are certain instances where group fasting for a particular prayer need is pivotal when dealing with extreme issues (consider Daniel's 21 day fast). Fasting for someone else though should be prayerfully considered and not entered into lightly. It should still be kept privately/secretly the Lord sees.