No 'But '

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lenna

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2020
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I've seen some people who claim to be Christian whose behavior and language makes them appear as if they'd dedicated to winning top prize in the ahole of the year contest. Hateful, condescending, mocking, vulgar behavior and language.
And not surprisingly when engaging them in a discussion they say the same thing many we've encountered here do. Works has nothing to do with salvation. Good deeds has nothing to do whatever with our salvation.
if there were no mods here, you just described how many would behave, as though cursing and name calling were virtues

and yeah some here can barely hold off doing what they no doubt do in their neighborhoods

most of these so called rappers do wear crosses. mockery whether they know it or not
 
Apr 2, 2020
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right

the pendulum swung too far in one direction then swung the other way with the same results

sounds like hyper grace being presented here IMO
Maybe, though I don't think that's fair to a true hyper grace message.

The exclusion and hostility towards holy living isn't necessarily a part of hyper grace, though it may be one of the results.

A true view of grace will be hyper, but apprehension of that grace is transformative and leads to holy living.

This is just being culturally Christian, all of the trappings with none of the salvation.
 
Jul 3, 2020
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David did a lot of bad deeds and the Church of Corinth was far from a stellar example of the righteous life.... having said that there is only one Gospel and one correct response that brings the gift of eternal life...and the gift has no strings attached...but there is chastisement and many "shoulds" but love is not compulsive.

For it is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of God
And yet fear and fearful do not translate as what we understand today being a reference to having awe and reverence for God.
I would also submit that doing good deeds as God sets them before the Christian is not a string attached to our salvation but is, again, linked with our salvation.
This is a faithful saying, and these things I want you to affirm constantly, that those who have believed in God should be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable to men. Titus 3:8

As has been said, if faith,belief, was all that is necessary for our salvation we'd be walking the streets of heaven with demons and the like. James 2:19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.
 
Aug 4, 2020
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Hello throughfaith, why do you continue to move the goalposts in our discussions :unsure: TULIP was ~not~ part of the topic in your OP, rather, the second half of the Luther/Calvin/Protestant statement, "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" was. Here is an excerpt from your OP again.


Here again you have singled out "Calvinism" as the lone confessor of what you believe to be a false doctrine, but the doctrine that you are complaining about, that "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone", is taught clearly 1. in the Bible, and therefore 2. by us all (IOW, by all of the churches and denominations that are found within the pale of orthodox Christendom).

As I said to you in another one of your threads, I believe that your fight is ~rarely~ against the "boogeyman" that you call Calvinism. RATHER, your fight is against the Bible (and thereby against what is taught by our churches, IOW, what is taught by Christianity, in general, NOT by Calvinism, in particular).

The ENTIRE Christian church/Christianity in general (Protestants/Catholics/Orthodox, etc.) teaches the 2nd half of that quote (that "the faith that justifies is never alone"), NOT Calvinism only.

This is the point that I have been attempting (and clearly failing) to make to you, not that there are no doctrines that are peculiar to Calvinism, but that many of the doctrines that ~you~ have argued against here at CChat, doctrines which you have also claimed to be the ~peculiar~ to Calvinism, are instead the ~common~ belief of Christianity (in general).

Finally, I'm not sure why you believe the word "practicing" causes a problem, so let's take a look. Here is the ESV, which chooses to use the word "practicing" (in 1 John 3), and KJV which does not. As best as I can tell, this comes down to nothing more than "take your pick", because both translations speak against the principle argument that you've had in most of your threads here since the get-go (concerning those who are justified by faith alone never being sanctified).

1 John 3 ESV
10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

1 John 3 KJV
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

~Deut
p.s. - while it may be true that there is no "BUT" concerning God's "justification" of us (e.g. John 5:24), there is most definitely an "ALSO", because He "sanctifies" EVERYONE He justifies/saves .. Philippians 1:6, 2:12-13. In fact, He could not have made this fact clearer in the Bible when He told us (through the pen of the Apostle Paul), "This is the will of God, your sanctification......" ~1 Thessalonians 4:3.
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My Op includes Calvinism into the saved 'but ' groups . Yes there are many that add at best 'Lordship salvation ' . At worst ,blatant works salvation . With everything in between . Within the 'pale of christianity. And as I already said Calvinism has permeated into most traditions and denominations. Not Just 'Lordship salvation ,but on Election and Predestination.
 
Aug 4, 2020
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Hello throughfaith, why do you continue to move the goalposts in our discussions :unsure: TULIP was ~not~ part of the topic in your OP, rather, the second half of the Luther/Calvin/Protestant statement, "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" was. Here is an excerpt from your OP again.


Here again you have singled out "Calvinism" as the lone confessor of what you believe to be a false doctrine, but the doctrine that you are complaining about, that "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone", is taught clearly 1. in the Bible, and therefore 2. by us all (IOW, by all of the churches and denominations that are found within the pale of orthodox Christendom).

As I said to you in another one of your threads, I believe that your fight is ~rarely~ against the "boogeyman" that you call Calvinism. RATHER, your fight is against the Bible (and thereby against what is taught by our churches, IOW, what is taught by Christianity, in general, NOT by Calvinism, in particular).

The ENTIRE Christian church/Christianity in general (Protestants/Catholics/Orthodox, etc.) teaches the 2nd half of that quote (that "the faith that justifies is never alone"), NOT Calvinism only.

This is the point that I have been attempting (and clearly failing) to make to you, not that there are no doctrines that are peculiar to Calvinism, but that many of the doctrines that ~you~ have argued against here at CChat, doctrines which you have also claimed to be the ~peculiar~ to Calvinism, are instead the ~common~ belief of Christianity (in general).

Finally, I'm not sure why you believe the word "practicing" causes a problem, so let's take a look. Here is the ESV, which chooses to use the word "practicing" (in 1 John 3), and KJV which does not. As best as I can tell, this comes down to nothing more than "take your pick", because both translations speak against the principle argument that you've had in most of your threads here since the get-go (concerning those who are justified by faith alone never being sanctified).

1 John 3 ESV
10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

1 John 3 KJV
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

~Deut
p.s. - while it may be true that there is no "BUT" concerning God's "justification" of us (e.g. John 5:24), there is most definitely an "ALSO", because He "sanctifies" EVERYONE He justifies/saves .. Philippians 1:6, 2:12-13. In fact, He could not have made this fact clearer in the Bible when He told us (through the pen of the Apostle Paul), "This is the will of God, your sanctification......" ~1 Thessalonians 4:3.
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We are set apart as believers already.
When a Calvinist says " But that Faith is never alone ' To one degree or another most people would agree . Until they understood what Calvinists mean by it. And that's when we understand the rest of the 5 points , why they say this .
 
Aug 4, 2020
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Hello throughfaith, why do you continue to move the goalposts in our discussions :unsure: TULIP was ~not~ part of the topic in your OP, rather, the second half of the Luther/Calvin/Protestant statement, "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" was. Here is an excerpt from your OP again.


Here again you have singled out "Calvinism" as the lone confessor of what you believe to be a false doctrine, but the doctrine that you are complaining about, that "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone", is taught clearly 1. in the Bible, and therefore 2. by us all (IOW, by all of the churches and denominations that are found within the pale of orthodox Christendom).

As I said to you in another one of your threads, I believe that your fight is ~rarely~ against the "boogeyman" that you call Calvinism. RATHER, your fight is against the Bible (and thereby against what is taught by our churches, IOW, what is taught by Christianity, in general, NOT by Calvinism, in particular).

The ENTIRE Christian church/Christianity in general (Protestants/Catholics/Orthodox, etc.) teaches the 2nd half of that quote (that "the faith that justifies is never alone"), NOT Calvinism only.

This is the point that I have been attempting (and clearly failing) to make to you, not that there are no doctrines that are peculiar to Calvinism, but that many of the doctrines that ~you~ have argued against here at CChat, doctrines which you have also claimed to be the ~peculiar~ to Calvinism, are instead the ~common~ belief of Christianity (in general).

Finally, I'm not sure why you believe the word "practicing" causes a problem, so let's take a look. Here is the ESV, which chooses to use the word "practicing" (in 1 John 3), and KJV which does not. As best as I can tell, this comes down to nothing more than "take your pick", because both translations speak against the principle argument that you've had in most of your threads here since the get-go (concerning those who are justified by faith alone never being sanctified).

1 John 3 ESV
10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

1 John 3 KJV
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

~Deut
p.s. - while it may be true that there is no "BUT" concerning God's "justification" of us (e.g. John 5:24), there is most definitely an "ALSO", because He "sanctifies" EVERYONE He justifies/saves .. Philippians 1:6, 2:12-13. In fact, He could not have made this fact clearer in the Bible when He told us (through the pen of the Apostle Paul), "This is the will of God, your sanctification......" ~1 Thessalonians 4:3.
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Philippians is about the work of the furtherance of the Gospel . Thats the point of those verses you quoted.
12¶But I would ye should understand, brethren, that the things which happened unto me have fallen out rather unto the furtherance of the gospel;

Paul wants these believers in spite of the persections and sufferings to 'work out their salvation 'in the sense and objective as the above verse says . Paul wants them to press on .
 
Aug 4, 2020
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Hello throughfaith, why do you continue to move the goalposts in our discussions :unsure: TULIP was ~not~ part of the topic in your OP, rather, the second half of the Luther/Calvin/Protestant statement, "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" was. Here is an excerpt from your OP again.


Here again you have singled out "Calvinism" as the lone confessor of what you believe to be a false doctrine, but the doctrine that you are complaining about, that "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone", is taught clearly 1. in the Bible, and therefore 2. by us all (IOW, by all of the churches and denominations that are found within the pale of orthodox Christendom).

As I said to you in another one of your threads, I believe that your fight is ~rarely~ against the "boogeyman" that you call Calvinism. RATHER, your fight is against the Bible (and thereby against what is taught by our churches, IOW, what is taught by Christianity, in general, NOT by Calvinism, in particular).

The ENTIRE Christian church/Christianity in general (Protestants/Catholics/Orthodox, etc.) teaches the 2nd half of that quote (that "the faith that justifies is never alone"), NOT Calvinism only.

This is the point that I have been attempting (and clearly failing) to make to you, not that there are no doctrines that are peculiar to Calvinism, but that many of the doctrines that ~you~ have argued against here at CChat, doctrines which you have also claimed to be the ~peculiar~ to Calvinism, are instead the ~common~ belief of Christianity (in general).

Finally, I'm not sure why you believe the word "practicing" causes a problem, so let's take a look. Here is the ESV, which chooses to use the word "practicing" (in 1 John 3), and KJV which does not. As best as I can tell, this comes down to nothing more than "take your pick", because both translations speak against the principle argument that you've had in most of your threads here since the get-go (concerning those who are justified by faith alone never being sanctified).

1 John 3 ESV
10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

1 John 3 KJV
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

~Deut
p.s. - while it may be true that there is no "BUT" concerning God's "justification" of us (e.g. John 5:24), there is most definitely an "ALSO", because He "sanctifies" EVERYONE He justifies/saves .. Philippians 1:6, 2:12-13. In fact, He could not have made this fact clearer in the Bible when He told us (through the pen of the Apostle Paul), "This is the will of God, your sanctification......" ~1 Thessalonians 4:3.
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The ' practicing 'translations are nonsense . which feeds into Lordship salvation nicely . Quoted as someone can stumble a little , but not to Practice sinning , if were truly an elect we don't habitually ,practice, have a hobby and make a sport out of sin . Nonsense . How much is practicing and who's counting? There's lots to be said about 1 John which would take up more space and time here .
 
Aug 4, 2020
1,997
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Hello throughfaith, why do you continue to move the goalposts in our discussions :unsure: TULIP was ~not~ part of the topic in your OP, rather, the second half of the Luther/Calvin/Protestant statement, "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" was. Here is an excerpt from your OP again.


Here again you have singled out "Calvinism" as the lone confessor of what you believe to be a false doctrine, but the doctrine that you are complaining about, that "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone", is taught clearly 1. in the Bible, and therefore 2. by us all (IOW, by all of the churches and denominations that are found within the pale of orthodox Christendom).

As I said to you in another one of your threads, I believe that your fight is ~rarely~ against the "boogeyman" that you call Calvinism. RATHER, your fight is against the Bible (and thereby against what is taught by our churches, IOW, what is taught by Christianity, in general, NOT by Calvinism, in particular).

The ENTIRE Christian church/Christianity in general (Protestants/Catholics/Orthodox, etc.) teaches the 2nd half of that quote (that "the faith that justifies is never alone"), NOT Calvinism only.

This is the point that I have been attempting (and clearly failing) to make to you, not that there are no doctrines that are peculiar to Calvinism, but that many of the doctrines that ~you~ have argued against here at CChat, doctrines which you have also claimed to be the ~peculiar~ to Calvinism, are instead the ~common~ belief of Christianity (in general).

Finally, I'm not sure why you believe the word "practicing" causes a problem, so let's take a look. Here is the ESV, which chooses to use the word "practicing" (in 1 John 3), and KJV which does not. As best as I can tell, this comes down to nothing more than "take your pick", because both translations speak against the principle argument that you've had in most of your threads here since the get-go (concerning those who are justified by faith alone never being sanctified).

1 John 3 ESV
10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

1 John 3 KJV
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

~Deut
p.s. - while it may be true that there is no "BUT" concerning God's "justification" of us (e.g. John 5:24), there is most definitely an "ALSO", because He "sanctifies" EVERYONE He justifies/saves .. Philippians 1:6, 2:12-13. In fact, He could not have made this fact clearer in the Bible when He told us (through the pen of the Apostle Paul), "This is the will of God, your sanctification......" ~1 Thessalonians 4:3.
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If all Calvinism meant by " but the Faith that justifies is never alone " was that a believer will be indwelt by the Holy Spirit , be sealed until the day of redemption . That The Holy Spirit would testify with our spirit ,that the love of God would be shed abroard and the peace that passes.....then fine . But no we gotta have the works .
 
Aug 4, 2020
1,997
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Hello throughfaith, why do you continue to move the goalposts in our discussions :unsure: TULIP was ~not~ part of the topic in your OP, rather, the second half of the Luther/Calvin/Protestant statement, "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" was. Here is an excerpt from your OP again.


Here again you have singled out "Calvinism" as the lone confessor of what you believe to be a false doctrine, but the doctrine that you are complaining about, that "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone", is taught clearly 1. in the Bible, and therefore 2. by us all (IOW, by all of the churches and denominations that are found within the pale of orthodox Christendom).

As I said to you in another one of your threads, I believe that your fight is ~rarely~ against the "boogeyman" that you call Calvinism. RATHER, your fight is against the Bible (and thereby against what is taught by our churches, IOW, what is taught by Christianity, in general, NOT by Calvinism, in particular).

The ENTIRE Christian church/Christianity in general (Protestants/Catholics/Orthodox, etc.) teaches the 2nd half of that quote (that "the faith that justifies is never alone"), NOT Calvinism only.

This is the point that I have been attempting (and clearly failing) to make to you, not that there are no doctrines that are peculiar to Calvinism, but that many of the doctrines that ~you~ have argued against here at CChat, doctrines which you have also claimed to be the ~peculiar~ to Calvinism, are instead the ~common~ belief of Christianity (in general).

Finally, I'm not sure why you believe the word "practicing" causes a problem, so let's take a look. Here is the ESV, which chooses to use the word "practicing" (in 1 John 3), and KJV which does not. As best as I can tell, this comes down to nothing more than "take your pick", because both translations speak against the principle argument that you've had in most of your threads here since the get-go (concerning those who are justified by faith alone never being sanctified).

1 John 3 ESV
10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

1 John 3 KJV
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

~Deut
p.s. - while it may be true that there is no "BUT" concerning God's "justification" of us (e.g. John 5:24), there is most definitely an "ALSO", because He "sanctifies" EVERYONE He justifies/saves .. Philippians 1:6, 2:12-13. In fact, He could not have made this fact clearer in the Bible when He told us (through the pen of the Apostle Paul), "This is the will of God, your sanctification......" ~1 Thessalonians 4:3.
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A lot of the verses like Eph 2 .10 say we ' should ' not that we all do . This is evident when we hear all the virtue signalling from the legalists who barely evangelise or preach the Gospel. Yes we read what the ' will of God ' is ' but its clear that all do not execute God's will as they ' should ' .
 
Aug 4, 2020
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Hello throughfaith, why do you continue to move the goalposts in our discussions :unsure: TULIP was ~not~ part of the topic in your OP, rather, the second half of the Luther/Calvin/Protestant statement, "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" was. Here is an excerpt from your OP again.


Here again you have singled out "Calvinism" as the lone confessor of what you believe to be a false doctrine, but the doctrine that you are complaining about, that "we are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone", is taught clearly 1. in the Bible, and therefore 2. by us all (IOW, by all of the churches and denominations that are found within the pale of orthodox Christendom).

As I said to you in another one of your threads, I believe that your fight is ~rarely~ against the "boogeyman" that you call Calvinism. RATHER, your fight is against the Bible (and thereby against what is taught by our churches, IOW, what is taught by Christianity, in general, NOT by Calvinism, in particular).

The ENTIRE Christian church/Christianity in general (Protestants/Catholics/Orthodox, etc.) teaches the 2nd half of that quote (that "the faith that justifies is never alone"), NOT Calvinism only.

This is the point that I have been attempting (and clearly failing) to make to you, not that there are no doctrines that are peculiar to Calvinism, but that many of the doctrines that ~you~ have argued against here at CChat, doctrines which you have also claimed to be the ~peculiar~ to Calvinism, are instead the ~common~ belief of Christianity (in general).

Finally, I'm not sure why you believe the word "practicing" causes a problem, so let's take a look. Here is the ESV, which chooses to use the word "practicing" (in 1 John 3), and KJV which does not. As best as I can tell, this comes down to nothing more than "take your pick", because both translations speak against the principle argument that you've had in most of your threads here since the get-go (concerning those who are justified by faith alone never being sanctified).

1 John 3 ESV
10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

1 John 3 KJV
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

~Deut
p.s. - while it may be true that there is no "BUT" concerning God's "justification" of us (e.g. John 5:24), there is most definitely an "ALSO", because He "sanctifies" EVERYONE He justifies/saves .. Philippians 1:6, 2:12-13. In fact, He could not have made this fact clearer in the Bible when He told us (through the pen of the Apostle Paul), "This is the will of God, your sanctification......" ~1 Thessalonians 4:3.
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Titus 3.8
8¶This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.

We can see here ' good works ' are not automatic . Paul says that there should be a constant reminder to affirm and maintain good works . For they are good and profitable.

with this in mind . Titus 2
11¶For the GRACE of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to ALL MEN,
12TEACHING us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
13Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

1 John 3.3King James Version
And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
 
Dec 20, 2017
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It serves a major disservice to misinterpret a single word by adding to its meaning. As it causes a misapplication of the word. which can lead to false theology

sorrow would be a result of repentance (The word means to change ones thinking, to do an “about face or to the rear march” as we call it in the Military). I do not need to feel sorrow to make this change, I just need to agree with God, and TRUST (have faith) in him

I disagree entirely with this utter absurdity. I'm not adding anything to it's meaning or speaking of false theology.
You repent. You get saved. In that order. You can't get saved BEFORE you get saved.

Feeling SORROW is not what I was suggesting.

BEING SORRY. SAYING SORRY, ADMITTING WRONG. TURNING FROM YOUR POINT OF VIEW.
It couldn't be more obvious, more simple, more rudimentary or more Biblically sound.


2 Pet 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
 
Dec 20, 2017
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Godly sorrow leads you to repent,not wordly sorrow,that brings death.
I agree but I think Eternally Grateful is hung up on my using the word "sorry". I have never argued that everyone must feel emotionally sorry. One can make a conscience choice to accept the Lord's gift of salvation without FEELING emotion. It must be rare but I wasn't trying to make an issue out of intense weeping sorrow. Just that repentance which is a turning round, a change of heart or mind toward God is exactly the same thing as saying "sorry God".

I don't understand why anyone should be make a big deal over the simple biblical truth & start accusing of "false theology". I told him it served no useful purpose to dissect a word to that degree. But he would have none of it.

A sinner repents. A sinner is saved. In that order. Repentance is not a work.

Math 9:13
But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Luke 15:7
I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance

Luke 24:47
And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

Act 11:18
When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
 
May 19, 2020
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I agree but I think Eternally Grateful is hung up on my using the word "sorry". I have never argued that everyone must feel emotionally sorry. One can make a conscience choice to accept the Lord's gift of salvation without FEELING emotion. It must be rare but I wasn't trying to make an issue out of intense weeping sorrow. Just that repentance which is a turning round, a change of heart or mind toward God is exactly the same thing as saying "sorry God".

I don't understand why anyone should be make a big deal over the simple biblical truth & start accusing of "false theology". I told him it served no useful purpose to dissect a word to that degree. But he would have none of it.

A sinner repents. A sinner is saved. In that order. Repentance is not a work.

Math 9:13
But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Luke 15:7
I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance

Luke 24:47
And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

Act 11:18
When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

Sis,try not to get hung up on what others say..haha,says me who does it often.

You get hung on the word of God.....Look and stay focused on God..as you do..don’t let the devil steal if from you.

He is a sower of discord and loves to see us..get personal with each other.

Not saying you are....just be alert of his scheming ways.
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
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I agree but I think Eternally Grateful is hung up on my using the word "sorry". I have never argued that everyone must feel emotionally sorry. One can make a conscience choice to accept the Lord's gift of salvation without FEELING emotion. It must be rare but I wasn't trying to make an issue out of intense weeping sorrow. Just that repentance which is a turning round, a change of heart or mind toward God is exactly the same thing as saying "sorry God".

I don't understand why anyone should be make a big deal over the simple biblical truth & start accusing of "false theology". I told him it served no useful purpose to dissect a word to that degree. But he would have none of it.

A sinner repents. A sinner is saved. In that order. Repentance is not a work.

Math 9:13
But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Luke 15:7
I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance

Luke 24:47
And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

Act 11:18
When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
Try to get your salvation doctrine from Romans to Philemon instead. Remember God sent his Son to die for you, while you were still his enemy. (Romans 5:8).

All that is required on your part is to believe that he died for your sins and he rose again on the 3rd day, and you are saved.

Is repentance necessary? In a sense, you need to change your mind and believe that Jesus died for your sins and rose again on the 3rd day. Once you believed that, your sins are automatically forgiven, without you having to repent from them.
 
Dec 20, 2017
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Try to get your salvation doctrine from Romans to Philemon instead. Remember God sent his Son to die for you, while you were still his enemy. (Romans 5:8).

All that is required on your part is to believe that he died for your sins and he rose again on the 3rd day, and you are saved.

Is repentance necessary? In a sense, you need to change your mind and believe that Jesus died for your sins and rose again on the 3rd day. Once you believed that, your sins are automatically forgiven, without you having to repent from them.
"once you've believed that" You've repented.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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I disagree entirely with this utter absurdity. I'm not adding anything to it's meaning or speaking of false theology.
You repent. You get saved. In that order. You can't get saved BEFORE you get saved.

Feeling SORROW is not what I was suggesting.

BEING SORRY. SAYING SORRY, ADMITTING WRONG. TURNING FROM YOUR POINT OF VIEW.
It couldn't be more obvious, more simple, more rudimentary or more Biblically sound.


2 Pet 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
To repent does not mean to feel sorry for your sins,

being sorry, saying sorry, admitting you are wrong, is not repenting. it is the result of repenting at the most,

so yes you are adding to the word and interpretation, whether You believe it or not is not my problem. The false theology you are presenting is dangerous, because you are adding to the meaning of a word

no one will come to faith apart from repentance, not sure why you posted 2 peter 3: 9. I have never stated repentance is not necessary, if you would learn to read yu May figure that out, instead of calling what I said absurd you may look and understand what you think I am saying and what I am saying do not quite line up.

true repentance leads to true faith, leads to true salvation, which leads to a change of life,

that’s the gospel
 
Mar 14, 2011
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I agree but I think Eternally Grateful is hung up on my using the word "sorry". I have never argued that everyone must feel emotionally sorry. One can make a conscience choice to accept the Lord's gift of salvation without FEELING emotion. It must be rare but I wasn't trying to make an issue out of intense weeping sorrow. Just that repentance which is a turning round, a change of heart or mind toward God is exactly the same thing as saying "sorry God".

I don't understand why anyone should be make a big deal over the simple biblical truth & start accusing of "false theology". I told him it served no useful purpose to dissect a word to that degree. But he would have none of it.

A sinner repents. A sinner is saved. In that order. Repentance is not a work.

Math 9:13
But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Luke 15:7
I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance

Luke 24:47
And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

Act 11:18
When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
While this is true, saying repentance means feeling sorry for your sins is wrong

if it’s wrong it’s wrong, half truths have always led to problems and we should not stand for the,
 
Mar 14, 2011
69,812
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Try to get your salvation doctrine from Romans to Philemon instead. Remember God sent his Son to die for you, while you were still his enemy. (Romans 5:8).

All that is required on your part is to believe that he died for your sins and he rose again on the 3rd day, and you are saved.

Is repentance necessary? In a sense, you need to change your mind and believe that Jesus died for your sins and rose again on the 3rd day. Once you believed that, your sins are automatically forgiven, without you having to repent from them.
It takes more than mere belief,

jesusnsaid we must gnaw on his flesh and drink his blood, (John 6). Just tasting is not enough, it takes true living faith,
so many people think that you just have to feel sorrow (Repent) and say some sinners prayer and magically you are saved, And you go live your life, sadly I believe many who have done that will get a rude awakening one day,
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
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It takes more than mere belief,

jesusnsaid we must gnaw on his flesh and drink his blood, (John 6). Just tasting is not enough, it takes true living faith,
so many people think that you just have to feel sorrow (Repent) and say some sinners prayer and magically you are saved, And you go live your life, sadly I believe many who have done that will get a rude awakening one day,
It is deliberately made very easy for us non-Jews, unlike the Jews during the 4 Gospels, because God wanted to provoke Israel to jealousy for rejecting him for the final time after they stoned Stephen, as Romans 11:11 states

11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.