Often misunderstood part of the Bible (1 John 1:8-19)

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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#61
Dec 12, 2013
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#61
Jason0047 said:
It's not a reality for false believers who think they can get away with sin. A true believer who loves God will want to do what pleases the Lord. The chastisement is a reminder to them so as to please God. It is a wake up call and it is not so much in what they love in this world. Christians offer their bodies as a willing sacrifice unto God. They are bought and paid for with a price. So what is their life anyways if it is not God's? What is truly chastisement? Did not Job suffer and lose all things? Did Job have some kind of sin in his life? No. The point is that chastisement is not a key factor for a believer who wants to love their sin more than those believers who love God more.
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Job was not chastised of God....Job was tried by Satan......Jason....your logic fails every test and yet you cannot see the truth, nor will you acknowledge it.........I am sorry that do not have the ability to just simply acknowledge the truth....

Chastisement is directed at the people of God who are in SIN...sometimes it involves physical death, the loss of reward, sickness, disease, the loss of financial gain, the loss of Children (David) etc...it has no bearing on the LOST and is directed at the saved with the end result meant to lead to the peaceable fruits of righteousness...To say that it has no ability to move a sinning child of God and is not a deterrent to God's people contradicts the bible and God.......if you refuse to acknowledge it then go for it....the main reason you cannot accept the truth is because it contradicts your belief and the salvation lite/lose your salvation message....!
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#62
Jul 22, 2014
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dcontroversal said:
I have a hard time understanding how you can base your beliefs upon such logic........serious.......!
The bolded above shows a lack of understanding and contradicts what the bible teaches Jason.....!
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So you believe a saved Christian can walk away from the faith and then become unsaved?
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#63
Jul 22, 2014
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#63
dcontroversal said:
Job was not chastised of God....Job was tried by Satan......Jason....your logic fails every test and yet you cannot see the truth, nor will you acknowledge it.........I am sorry that do not have the ability to just simply acknowledge the truth....

Chastisement is directed at the people of God who are in SIN...sometimes it involves physical death, the loss of reward, sickness, disease, the loss of financial gain, the loss of Children (David) etc...it has no bearing on the LOST and is directed at the saved with the end result meant to lead to the peaceable fruits of righteousness...To say that it has no ability to move a sinning child of God and is not a deterrent to God's people contradicts the bible and God.......if you refuse to acknowledge it then go for it....the main reason you cannot accept the truth is because it contradicts your belief and the salvation lite/lose your salvation message....!
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Folks here have got to really read what I am writing. Slow down and read. I did not say Job was chastised.
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

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#64
Jul 22, 2014
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#64
Again, I will ask the question:

How are you forgiven of all sin (Including future sin), if you are forgiven of sin by confessing it according to 1 John 1:9?

You are either forgiven of all sin or you are not forgiven of all sin.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#65
Dec 12, 2013
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#65
Jason0047 said:
Folks here have got to really read what I am writing. Slow down and read. I did not say Job was chastised.
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Why use Job then as an example of anything.........other than the righteous can be put through the fire by Satan....that has no bearing on the use of chastisement as applied unto a believer........The bolded below contradicts why God uses chastisement.....

What is truly chastisement? Did not Job suffer and lose all things? Did Job have some kind of sin in his life? No. The point is that chastisement is not a key factor for a believer who wants to love their sin more than those believers who love God more.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#66
Dec 12, 2013
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#66
Jason0047 said:
So you believe a saved Christian can walk away from the faith and then become unsaved?
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The bible teaches clearly that a saved child of God can backslide and forget that they HAVE BEEN PURGED......one who has works of wood, hay and stubble..........yet saved yet so as by fire.........!
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

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#67
Jul 22, 2014
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#67
dcontroversal said:
Why use Job then as an example of anything.........other than the righteous can be put through the fire by Satan....that has no bearing on the use of chastisement as applied unto a believer........The bolded below contradicts why God uses chastisement.....

What is truly chastisement? Did not Job suffer and lose all things? Did Job have some kind of sin in his life? No. The point is that chastisement is not a key factor for a believer who wants to love their sin more than those believers who love God more.
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I used Job as an example that even when Job did no wrong, he was still faithful. The man of God who truly loves God will be corrected not because of the physical things. The physical things do not matter to the man of God. The chastisement is only to wake the true believer up. The false believer who loves their sin more than they do God (By the fact that they teach a sin and still be saved doctrine) is not going to care about any chastisement (sufferings in this life) because even Job went thru suffering and he did no wrong. The sinner who likes their sin more than God is not going to change by some physical threat in this life. Only the person who truly loves God will change by any type of chastisement (And it is not because they love physical things).
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#68
Jul 22, 2014
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#68
dcontroversal said:
The bible teaches clearly that a saved child of God can backslide and forget that they HAVE BEEN PURGED......one who has works of wood, hay and stubble..........yet saved yet so as by fire.........!
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No, 2 Peter 1 is not saying what you think it does. It is saying they have forgotten their life as a believer is what it is saying. They forgot that they were once saved and now they are not. It is why Peter says in verse 10 that they need to make sure that their election is sure. For why do they need to be sure if they have an OSAS type belief? That would be too easy and uneccesary so as to warn them to make their election is sure. Besides, in 2 Peter 2, we learn that the false prophets are those who have eyes full of adultery and who cannot cease from sin.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#69
Dec 12, 2013
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#69
Jason0047 said:
I used Job as an example that even when Job did no wrong, he was still faithful. The man of God who truly loves God will be corrected not because of the physical things. The physical things do not matter to the man of God. The chastisement is only to wake the true believer up. The false believer who loves their sin more than they do God (By the fact that they teach a sin and still be saved doctrine) is not going to care about any chastisement (sufferings in this life) because even Job went thru suffering and he did no wrong. The sinner who likes their sin more than God is not going to change by some physical threat in this life. Only the person who truly loves God will change by any type of chastisement (And it is not because they love physical things).
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You can slice it and dice it anyway you want....does not change why and how God uses chastisement as directed at a SAVED CHILD OF GOD.......SO...According to you wilful sin cause one to lose salvation....which totally contradicts your use of chastisement in the following statement made by you......

The chastisement is only to wake the true believer up<---if they are in sin, according to you they are lost and not in a state of belief......so how can it wake up a true believer if they are LOST in UNBELIEF....cannot you see your logic is flawed......like totally flawed......!
 
4enlightment

4enlightment

Banned
#70
May 15, 2013
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#70
Jason0047 said:
Uh, confessing your sins to Jesus is going to the physician. In other words, if a believer is not confessing their sins, it is like they are letting a serious illness go untreated, which will eventually cause them pain and then death.
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No, they have to admit to themselves that they are sinners, and then treatment can begin. God already knows what we are, even before we are; and so He doesn't need us to confess to Him.
 
S

Sophia

Guest
#71
#71
Jason0047 said:
No. Most who believe in Eternal Security do not believe CONTINUED confession of sin is necessary for salvation. They believe once you are saved, there is nothing you can do to remove yourself from Christ. This I believe is a dark and evil teaching.
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Who preaches against continued confession? Yes, we continue in confession.
Never seen such things come from eternal security.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#72
Dec 12, 2013
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#72
Sophia said:
Who preaches against continued confession? Yes, we continue in confession.
Never seen such things come from eternal security.
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Don't worry...people who teach you can lose it constantly attribute (truths) to people who believe in eternal security that we do not embrace, teach or imply.....they have to attribute those things to us to try and disprove us and change what we actually teach and believe...happens ALL of the time for sure..........
 
C

cmarieh

Guest
#73
#73
4enlightment said:
No, they have to admit to themselves that they are sinners, and then treatment can begin. God already knows what we are, even before we are; and so He doesn't need us to confess to Him.
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You can't just admit that you sinned you have to confess it with your mouth, which involves speaking.

1 John 1:7-9[SUP]
7 [/SUP]But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. [SUP]8 [/SUP]If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. [SUP]9 [/SUP]If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
 
P

purpose

Guest
#74
#74
what about the Lord's Prayer? I Was taught that in the prayer orginally says forgive us for our sins as we forgive those who sinned against us? is this not correct? would this count as confessing sin? Was it Jesus whom taught this prayer? Please correct me if im wrong or misleading in any way.
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#75
Jul 22, 2014
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#75
4enlightment said:
No, they have to admit to themselves that they are sinners, and then treatment can begin. God already knows what we are, even before we are; and so He doesn't need us to confess to Him.
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No. 1 John 1:9 is written to the believer. For the entire epistle is written to believers. 1 John 2 says we are not to sin. But if we do, we have an advocate that we can go to. Chapter breaks are not inspired. Chapter 2 is not changing subjects.
 
4enlightment

4enlightment

Banned
#76
May 15, 2013
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#76
cmarieh said:
You can't just admit that you sinned you have to confess it with your mouth, which involves speaking.

1 John 1:7-9[SUP]
7 [/SUP]But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. [SUP]8 [/SUP]If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. [SUP]9 [/SUP]If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
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So the next time I comes down with a flu, I'll tell the other sick person that I'm sick. But I doesn't know what good that will do, all they is going do is to start judging me, telling me how sick I am. Confess is to admit.
 
4enlightment

4enlightment

Banned
#77
May 15, 2013
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#77
Jason0047 said:
No. 1 John 1:9 is written to the believer. For the entire epistle is written to believers. 1 John 2 says we are not to sin. But if we do, we have an advocate that we can go to. Chapter breaks are not inspired. Chapter 2 is not changing subjects.
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God has already known that we are sinners, but it is up to Him to cover our nakedness; but if you want to go around flashing your nakedness to others, then so be it. But have you noticed that in the scriptures, that God doesn't say exactly what they actually had done; i guess it is a sin to expose yours and someone else nakedness to others.
 
J

Jeff_56

Banned
#78
Dec 26, 2014
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#78
MikkoAinasoja said:
8.If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth isnot in us. 9. Ifwe confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us oursins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.10. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and hisword is not in us. (1 John 1:8-10)

Soif confess our sins, and not fight for them, like people's do today,then our Lord will clean us for our sins, like the Scriptures alsotell us, if we read the whole subject, because I think it is very common, that people's use only a part of this subject, when they try to convince, that man can't live without sinning.

But man can, and man should live without sinning.

Donot deceive your selves, but be truthful so you may com clean fromsinning.
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having read only the op,

you know already, probably , that you have to actually READ EPHESIANS, and COLOSSIANS, and ACTS,
and REVELATION, and EZEKIEL, and GENESIS, and DEUTERONOMY, and LEVITICUS, and EXODUS,

and JOSHUA, and JUDGES, and so on,

to see people, men of God, called and chosen by God, who had time when they did not sin and God said so.


on this forum, you know, you will see a LOT OF INPUT not from scripture, that pulls only a few verses out
as
if
that's
it and the other scripture doesn't matter .... to try to show that the sinners can keep on sinning because everybody does and God knows it and (they think) God says it is okay to keep on sinning.....


so, they will and can and no one not even God will stop them from sinning. free will, ya know.....


but as for me and my house, we will serve yahweh adonai according to his word and do as he says.

if we slip up, if we sin, he has given us directions/ instructions / on what to do then...... when something

can be done.... still...... (there is some sin that will not be or cannot ever be forgiven... that's for another thread, not here).....


meanwhile, those who God does not hold their sin against them, are blessed.

and as God's children, who will we obey TODAY ? God or hasatan? that's the only 2 choices.

everyone else only gets one choice, and may never know it.
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#79
Jul 22, 2014
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#79
4enlightment said:
So the next time I comes down with a flu, I'll tell the other sick person that I'm sick. But I doesn't know what good that will do, all they is going do is to start judging me, telling me how sick I am. Confess is to admit.
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No, read Luke 18:9-14. Does the OSAS Proponent fit the description of the Pharisee or the Tax Collector?
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#80
Jul 22, 2014
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#80
4enlightment said:
God has already known that we are sinners, but it is up to Him to cover our nakedness; but if you want to go around flashing your nakedness to others, then so be it. But have you noticed that in the scriptures, that God doesn't say exactly what they actually had done; i guess it is a sin to expose yours and someone else nakedness to others.
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You're issue is not with me, but it is with what God's Word says. 1 John 1:9 is not complicated to understand. Howe er, trying to explain 1 John 1:9 from an OSAS perspective is complicated and confusing. Hence, why nobody has tried to answer all my questions regarding it. How can you be forgiven if you are told to confess sin so as to be forgiven?
 
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