Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked
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If you read through this thread you will see strong views and arguments from both sides OSAS & NOSAS. For what it's worth I think many of us have missed then main point in this discussion "OS". The reality is that you can find verses that support both views and I have heard fine preachers support them. What we should be focusing on is Once Saved and not worry or dispute over something we really cannot answer.
I have read many of the pro & con arguments and the reality is that if someone is going to abuse their salvation based on how they understand OSAS/NOSAS then I would be more inclined to question the reality of their faith or the object of their faith.
I am sure we have all seen or heard of people that have used OSAS as a license for liberalism, to live as they wish and on the other hand have used NOSAS as a reason for legalism, rule keeping will gain you salvation. For me both these views have errors as they have run to either end of the logic pool.
We are saved because of the faithfulness of Christ Jesus as long as we have faith in Christ Jesus. If either of those fail then we are lost.
I have read many of the pro & con arguments and the reality is that if someone is going to abuse their salvation based on how they understand OSAS/NOSAS then I would be more inclined to question the reality of their faith or the object of their faith.
I am sure we have all seen or heard of people that have used OSAS as a license for liberalism, to live as they wish and on the other hand have used NOSAS as a reason for legalism, rule keeping will gain you salvation. For me both these views have errors as they have run to either end of the logic pool.
We are saved because of the faithfulness of Christ Jesus as long as we have faith in Christ Jesus. If either of those fail then we are lost.
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And you know all about those books and even their price.
People save their money mostly. All they have to do is take the Gospel, argue contrary to what is written, insist it is true and those who don't see that are deluded. It works the same way for anyone on either side of the equation.
However, the telling portion as to whom is actually able to stand on the scriptures and be right in such cases where people are trying to discern which is which, is easy enough.
Jesus said, “Therefore by their fruits you will know them. Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of Heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in Heaven” (Matthew 7:20–21).
When readers encounter those who insist God's law, now for the New Covenant known as the Law of Christ (who was/is God), does not apply and was done away at the cross, that is not one of the redeemed in Christ.
If you encounter those who insist man's (and woman's of course) will is able to override all those scriptures, truths, wherein God tells us, we plan our way, that is, make choices for our life, but GOD sets our steps. (Puts us where his will wants us to be), that's a nominal (name only) person.
If you read someone that tells you Jesus saved everyone no matter what, that's Universalism and is never and will never be substantiated by scripture. If that were the case? There would be not a single active Christian Missionary on earth. Nor would Christians proselytize, nor would tracts with information to lead people to the truth in Christ exist. Nor would Bibles exist or churches.
If the whole wide world forever is saved, that's it. That means there's no damnation, no sin, no sinners, and no transgression against people or God's law exists.
If you encounter those that work to strip God of his power and authority, that's a Devil. That which denies God's Sovereignty, Omniscience, Omnipresence, Omnipotence, Omnigenesis. Because, as they imply or even insist, we are able to choose and God has no say in the matter at all. That's a Devil.
There are many of those. As the Bible tells us, even Satan can quote scripture and appear as an angel of light. And why not? He was first known as Lucifer, Light Bringer.
Basically the best and easiest way to know you're on the right track, is to read the Bible. People who try to rewrite it don't respect it. Those, who will excerpt a scripture out of context, while arguing the context is contrary to what is actually there, aren't in the word.
God predestined whom he would save before the foundation (creation) of the world. He knows their name, just like he knows the number of hairs on your head, or when a sparrow falls from the sky, that's in scripture too.
Jesus himself tells you he didn't come to save the whole wide world of people for all time and for as long as earth exists!
If God intended that he could just do it. In fact, we would be saved from day one of our creation until now because we would have never been let to fall. But the Book of Eternal life was already written with the names of those whom God would save. Before there was created anything at all. Including earth, the garden, the tree of knowledge, Adam, Eve, the serpent, the curse that let that book become relevant.
When God predetermined whom he would save, he planned the fall. As he tells us. Because you can't write the name of people you'll save from their sins when there is not yet an earth, a people, needing to be saved.
Sin entered the world through one man. Sin pre-existed one man. The first and only man.Adam.
No thing exists that is not of or from God. The Beginning
(Genesis 1:1–2; Hebrews 11:1–3)
John 1:1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning. 3Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made. 4In Him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
Anyone who denies God's Sovereignty is not of God. You'll know them by their LOL at the truth of God's word in Christ.
People save their money mostly. All they have to do is take the Gospel, argue contrary to what is written, insist it is true and those who don't see that are deluded. It works the same way for anyone on either side of the equation.
However, the telling portion as to whom is actually able to stand on the scriptures and be right in such cases where people are trying to discern which is which, is easy enough.
Jesus said, “Therefore by their fruits you will know them. Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of Heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in Heaven” (Matthew 7:20–21).
When readers encounter those who insist God's law, now for the New Covenant known as the Law of Christ (who was/is God), does not apply and was done away at the cross, that is not one of the redeemed in Christ.
If you encounter those who insist man's (and woman's of course) will is able to override all those scriptures, truths, wherein God tells us, we plan our way, that is, make choices for our life, but GOD sets our steps. (Puts us where his will wants us to be), that's a nominal (name only) person.
If you read someone that tells you Jesus saved everyone no matter what, that's Universalism and is never and will never be substantiated by scripture. If that were the case? There would be not a single active Christian Missionary on earth. Nor would Christians proselytize, nor would tracts with information to lead people to the truth in Christ exist. Nor would Bibles exist or churches.
If the whole wide world forever is saved, that's it. That means there's no damnation, no sin, no sinners, and no transgression against people or God's law exists.
If you encounter those that work to strip God of his power and authority, that's a Devil. That which denies God's Sovereignty, Omniscience, Omnipresence, Omnipotence, Omnigenesis. Because, as they imply or even insist, we are able to choose and God has no say in the matter at all. That's a Devil.
There are many of those. As the Bible tells us, even Satan can quote scripture and appear as an angel of light. And why not? He was first known as Lucifer, Light Bringer.
Basically the best and easiest way to know you're on the right track, is to read the Bible. People who try to rewrite it don't respect it. Those, who will excerpt a scripture out of context, while arguing the context is contrary to what is actually there, aren't in the word.
God predestined whom he would save before the foundation (creation) of the world. He knows their name, just like he knows the number of hairs on your head, or when a sparrow falls from the sky, that's in scripture too.
Jesus himself tells you he didn't come to save the whole wide world of people for all time and for as long as earth exists!
If God intended that he could just do it. In fact, we would be saved from day one of our creation until now because we would have never been let to fall. But the Book of Eternal life was already written with the names of those whom God would save. Before there was created anything at all. Including earth, the garden, the tree of knowledge, Adam, Eve, the serpent, the curse that let that book become relevant.
When God predetermined whom he would save, he planned the fall. As he tells us. Because you can't write the name of people you'll save from their sins when there is not yet an earth, a people, needing to be saved.
Sin entered the world through one man. Sin pre-existed one man. The first and only man.Adam.
No thing exists that is not of or from God. The Beginning
(Genesis 1:1–2; Hebrews 11:1–3)
John 1:1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning. 3Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made. 4In Him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
Anyone who denies God's Sovereignty is not of God. You'll know them by their LOL at the truth of God's word in Christ.
I have not seen anyone say the law of Christ doesn't exist.
The law of Christ is the law of love and by this shall we be known as his disciples!
People take apart whatever they want of God's word and obey it as such.
I say unto all of us we must let the Spirit lead us in wisdom on what God is or isn't saying .
The FEAR of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. Fear = respect ,awe, and being afraid for Jesus himself told us NOT to fear he that can only kill the body but TO FEAR him that hath power over the whole.( body,soul,spirit)
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Awe and respect. Yes. Being afraid of God? Hell no!
I'll let you in on a little secret.
If your god wants you to be terrified of it, that god is not Omni-Benevolent. Because God is beyond our comprehension. We, being created in God's image and likeness, and are following the steps "he" has planned for us, can only be afraid of, terrified of, God if we don't trust God.
If you worship God because you're terrified not to, you're not fooling God.
I'll let you in on a little secret.
If your god wants you to be terrified of it, that god is not Omni-Benevolent. Because God is beyond our comprehension. We, being created in God's image and likeness, and are following the steps "he" has planned for us, can only be afraid of, terrified of, God if we don't trust God.
If you worship God because you're terrified not to, you're not fooling God.
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Oh how quickly some deflect from what they asked and hone in on something said they think they can dispute.😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
You do you with God and I'll do me!
My God is the creator of all,the judge of men,the keeper of his word,the mighty one who repented that he had made man,and the one who sent his only son to become a saviour to whosoever will believe on him!
That is MY GOD,MY KING,MY LORD AND MY MASTER!
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Really? Then you shouldn't laugh at people who share their opinions when you posit yours in that regard.
You're deeply confused. My post that you quoted wherein I responded to your statements about fearing God said not one thing about God's law or the Law of Christ.
When you're deeply fond of laughing at people's posts, and can't keep track of what they've said even when you've quoted them, you'll understand when I say, I don't believe you when you share how old you claim yourself to be.
You're deeply confused. My post that you quoted wherein I responded to your statements about fearing God said not one thing about God's law or the Law of Christ.
When you're deeply fond of laughing at people's posts, and can't keep track of what they've said even when you've quoted them, you'll understand when I say, I don't believe you when you share how old you claim yourself to be.
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Since you can't actually post and quote correctly let me just say, that first line that you quoted of yourself:
Gardenias said:
I have not seen anyone say the law of Christ doesn't exist.
The law of Christ is the law of love and by this shall we be known as his disciples!
People take apart whatever they want of God's word and obey it as such.
I say unto all of us we must let the Spirit lead us in wisdom on what God is or isn't saying .
The FEAR of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. Fear = respect ,awe, and being afraid for Jesus himself told us NOT to fear he that can only kill the body but TO FEAR him that hath power over the whole.( body,soul,spirit) [END OF YOUR POST]
WAS NOT addressed in my post 606 that you claimed did address your remarks.
You're so intent on posting childish slights you can't even spell correctly.
THANK YOU!
You are indeed very very young. If you are 64 years of age, you have my deepest sympathy.
Because in truth your behavior is as one who would add those two numbers together to arrive at the age of 10.
There is nothing spiritually fulfilling in continuing to go back and forth with a fallen child such as yourself. Grow up.
Gardenias said:
I have not seen anyone say the law of Christ doesn't exist.
The law of Christ is the law of love and by this shall we be known as his disciples!
People take apart whatever they want of God's word and obey it as such.
I say unto all of us we must let the Spirit lead us in wisdom on what God is or isn't saying .
The FEAR of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. Fear = respect ,awe, and being afraid for Jesus himself told us NOT to fear he that can only kill the body but TO FEAR him that hath power over the whole.( body,soul,spirit) [END OF YOUR POST]
WAS NOT addressed in my post 606 that you claimed did address your remarks.
You're so intent on posting childish slights you can't even spell correctly.
THANK YOU!
You are indeed very very young. If you are 64 years of age, you have my deepest sympathy.
Because in truth your behavior is as one who would add those two numbers together to arrive at the age of 10.
There is nothing spiritually fulfilling in continuing to go back and forth with a fallen child such as yourself. Grow up.
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