Our new relationship to the law.

[justbyfaith]

https://www.oneforisrael.org/bible-...he-torah-from-a-messianic-jewish-perspective/
Cut from above "not reinventing the wheel" Give credit to above website
UNDERSTANDING THE CONTEXT
The children of Israel were most definitely not an innocent people – rather these commandments were given to a people who had been slaves, a people who went through oppression and physical and mental abuse, a people lacking in education, influenced greatly by pagan, barbaric, and twisted cultures – cultures which were mostly extremely wicked and cruel. That’s why the children of Israel had extremely low morals and principles. You could almost say that they were a bunch of hooligans. Also, their way of thinking and their way of interacting with their surroundings was morally speaking like that of a small and undisciplined child, and their behavior and the way they treated one another was influenced accordingly. People such as these must indeed learn basic things – that murder is not a good thing, that you’re not supposed to have sexual intercourse with your mother, and not with your goat or sheep either, and when your mother and father ask you to do something that you really don’t want to do you don’t beat them up because they’re old and weak – rather you respect them and their request.

On the one hand, when you’re dealing with merciless barbarians, you need to handle them with a strong hand, and that’s why you find a lot of threats about death penalties. On the other hand, for the first time we’re introduced to God’s grace and compassion, for who has the patience to deal with such people? But God, while putting down firm and clear boundaries, also shows grace and compassion. How? By being merciful!

By the way, despite the fact that the standards in the Torah do not represent God’s ultimate standards, not one of us is able to uphold them perfectly, which shows us that we are incapable to save ourselves. We need someone to come and deliver us, a divine Messiah. There’s a direct correlation between “knowledge” and “morality”. When we “know” God, in other words when we know the character and the will of God, our moral principles and ethical standards go up accordingly. The Torah and its laws were only a first step, a first step out of a moral slough and towards godly morals....

...
JESUS CAME TO FULFIL THE MESSIANIC HOPE OF THE TORAH AND THE PROPHETS
In other words, the entire Old Testament, from the very beginning of the Torah to the very end of the Prophets, points to our need of the Messiah. Jesus did not come to abolish the Torah. In other words, Jesus didn’t come to make up a new story, but to fulfill the original story because, after all, the Torah’s prophecies are about him:

...
In conclusion, while the Torah is God’s word in every sense, we need to remember that we are no longer under the authority of the commandments of the Sinai Covenant. In the Sinai Covenant, we served God through the priesthood and through sacrifices in the temple.

The priests were the mediators between God and the people and the commandments of the Sinai Covenant were the laws that showed us how to serve God in the framework of this covenant. In the New Covenant, on the other hand, we are under the Torah of the Messiah. He is our great High Priest, who brought us a Torah with much higher and much more challenging standards in comparison with those of the Sinai Covenant.

All would be classified as merciless barbarians from my understanding.

So, the law declares what is sin to all people; and through the law all the world will become guilty before God (1 John 3:4, Romans 3:20).

 

[rayzor]

We fulfill the righteousness of the law because the love of the Lord has been shed abroad in our hearts (Romans 5:5, Romans 13:8-10, Romans 8:4).

going to challenge you a little bit, expression a scripture dose not make it so! It was once said how forceful r right words.If you where in love with god,, you are not now.I might say ,, and the dragon might ask you think chapter and verses is greater then truth of the spirit?,,,blessed is he that does not get offended in me.

 

[justbyfaith]

I know that I have the love of the Lord in my heart, you are not going to be able to convince me otherwise.

The love that God has placed in me causes me to desire that everyone be saved; even those who have hurt me the most in life.

 

[rayzor]

I know that I have the love of the Lord in my heart, you are not going to be able to convince me otherwise.

The love that God has placed in me causes me to desire that everyone be saved; even those who have hurt me the most in life.

k

 

[peldom10]

I have had the 1611 it's not the same as yours.But close in meaning.But you would have trouble reading it at first, maybe like the first 3 months

I think I understand what your point is. However, we are reminded that there are only three things we need to know as a map to get us from here to God's granted eternity;
1) Repentance
2)Baptism,
3) A righteous life.

Yes it may be challenging to understand the creature coming from the ocean in Revelation...so what? It has nothing to do with my eternal salvation.
My concentration under God's guidance is to present His word in a manner of sequential priority. The above three has many challenges for a newbie to understand and God's people are charged with that objective. Not to spend time on what day Christ was born...a symbolic date is fine. Or a sabbath since God new we would need medical, emergency, police help 24 /7 and they would not be available on the normal sabbath so their sabbath...7th day would be different.
There are many examples ...just common sense...which the Bible refers to at least 14 times.

I know that I have the love of the Lord in my heart, you are not going to be able to convince me otherwise.

The love that God has placed in me causes me to desire that everyone be saved; even those who have hurt me the most in life.

Respectfully, Those two comments have nothing to do with the point at hand.

 

[peldom10]

There is no such thing as ....a new relationship to the law.....

God's commandments are the same in the NT as in the OT.

For example...that is not the case with divorce. A standard was presented in the NT which did not exist in words in the OT, etc.

 

[Grandpa]

No; that is not what I am trying to do.

I have said on a few occasions that I am not bound by the oldness of the letter but am free to obey according go the newness of the spirit of what is written (Romans 7:6).

You just bound yourself to the oldness of the letter by this statement.

You need to read scripture much more critically and precisely.

There is no "spirit of what is written". That is a construct that you have made up because you don't understand scripture.


2 Corinthians 3:3-6
3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

4 And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:

5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;

6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

There is no "spirit of what is written" here. There is "what is written" and there is "spirit". You follow one or the other. You can't follow both. Its foolish to think you can ( Galatians 3:3)

 

[justbyfaith]

Respectfully, Those two comments have nothing to do with the point at hand.

No kidding. But somoene questioned my love for God, and that is why I answered what I did. Maybe you have them on Ignore.

 

[justbyfaith]

There is no such thing as ....a new relationship to the law.....

God's commandments are the same in the NT as in the OT.

For example...that is not the case with divorce. A standard was presented in the NT which did not exist in words in the OT, etc.

In the Old Testament, there was condemnation for violating the law.

In the New, there is no condemnation...and also the love of the Lord shed abroad in our hearts means that we will be obedient to it.

 

[justbyfaith]

You just bound yourself to the oldness of the letter by this statement.

You need to read scripture much more critically and precisely.

There is no "spirit of what is written". That is a construct that you have made up because you don't understand scripture.

No, I told you by that statement that I am not bound to the oldness of the letter.

And, the newness of the spirit is spoken of in Romans 7:6.

I understand scripture just fine.

But you appear to be willing to omit scripture.

 

[justbyfaith]

There is no "spirit of what is written"

Exo 34:27, And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel.

 

[rayzor]

No kidding. But somoene questioned my love for God, and that is why I answered what I did. Maybe you have them on Ignore.

no justbyfaith everyones love for god including my own i know what love is and it is greater then just liking someone.i said to another we have not receive the new heart yet because theres a diffence between a penny and a septillion dollors

 

[peldom10]

In the Old Testament, there was condemnation for violating the law.

In the New, there is no condemnation...and also the love of the Lord shed abroad in our hearts means that we will be obedient to it.

Totally disagree.
That is a pure ....unsullied.... new age religion falsehood concerning the NT.

 

[justbyfaith]

Totally disagree.
That is a pure ....unsullied.... new age religion falsehood concerning the NT.

No...see Romans 5:5 and Romans 13:8-10.

 

[peldom10]

No...see Romans 5:5 and Romans 13:8-10.

Please Post what supports your reasoning from references.

 

[justbyfaith]

Please Post what supports your reasoning from references.

That the love of the Lord is shed abroad in the believer's heart and that this love is the fulfilling of the righteousness of the law within him.

 

[justbyfaith]

Also, Romans 8:1 tells us plainly that there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus; of whom it is characteristic that they walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit.

 

[BroTan]

Right on...keep up the good works.

Praise the Lord in Jesus mighty name my friend.

 

[peldom10]

That the love of the Lord is shed abroad in the believer's heart and that this love is the fulfilling of the righteousness of the law within him.

I am looking for specific wording in the references you posted, please. I believe I know your point, just verifying.

 

[Gideon300]

Praise the Lord in Jesus name is you where baptize like Peter says...Thats awesome! There's two different laws Paul talks about in this chapter. Let's take a look at Roman 8: 1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. This is true, because Jesus says in John 4: 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. Jesus also say in John 6: 63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. So walking in the spirit is the word of God.

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Now, what law is this Paul talking about. This law is animal sacrificial law, not the royal law (Ten Commandments, statutes and Judgement). Paul explained this law in; (Heb.10:1, 9-10,18,26-27) (v.1) For the law (what law, the law of animal sacrifice?) having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. (v.9) Then said he, (Jesus) Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first that he may establish the second. (v.10) By which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

When Jesus died on the cross that was the end of the first covenant, which consisted of the blood of animals and the keeping of God’s commandments. And his death also brought in the second covenant, which consist of the blood of Jesus and the keeping of God’s commandments. (v.18) Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin. In other words, no more animals are going to die for your sins. (v.26) For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins.

Now, Let's get back to Romans 8: 4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

So what is the righteousness of the law? Let allow Paul to tell us in Paul said in (Rom. 7:7,12) (v.7) What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, THOU SHALT NOT COVET. Paul asked a question, is the law sin? He said God forbid, he said the only way that he knew what sin was, was by the law. (v.12) Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.


The Sabbath day on the seventh day of the week, it is consider walking in the spirit because its part of the law (commandments), to be carnally minded is walk contrary to the law of righteousness.

You put grace under the law. That is a recipe for confusion. Your righteousness is based on your behaviour. Mine is superior because it has nothing to do with me. Christ is my righteousness now. He leads me and guides me. He empowers me to live in a way that pleases God. I live by the Law of the Spirit of Life in Him, which sets me free from the law of sin and death.