Past sins forgiven

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Dec 30, 2020
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#61
Would you be kind enough to answer a couple of questions?
Why do you believe the number of those saved will be so few? And...
Do you believe we can live sinless this side of glory?
A few in each generation, but many in the lifetime of all humanity. When every thought and action is motivated by love, you will not sin.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
15,058
5,416
113
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#62
Thanks
A few in each generation, but many in the lifetime of all humanity. When every thought and action is motivated by love, you will not sin.[/QU
Thanks for taking the time to respond.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
24,781
13,413
113
#63
There is no real evidence in the Bible Jesus died for our sins - Only Paul implies these things well after Jesus
Christians believe that Paul's words are God's words, per 2 Timothy 3:16. Do you believe Paul was a deceiver and a heretic?
 

Komentaja

Active member
Jul 29, 2022
428
225
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#64
There is no real evidence in the Bible Jesus died for our sins - Only Paul implies these things well after Jesus
Ah you are one of those who reject Paul? You do so at your own peril. I had my doubts about Paul when I found a website about a decade ago that pitted "Jesus vs Paul" but once you rightly divide the word of truth, you will see there is no conflict.

I am not hyper dispensational, I don't reject water baptism or spiritual gifts. However I am "dispie leaning" in the sense that I see a difference in POST-resurrection and PRE-resurrection. For example: Jesus tells His disciples to "do everything the pharisees tell them" and tells someone to give ANIMAL SACRIFICES "But go, show yourself to the priest and offer the sacrifices that Moses commanded for your cleansing, as a testimony to them."

Are you supposed to give animal sacrifices today? Are we supposed to do what the pharisees (judaizers) tell us? No! If you reject Paul, I can give you the testimony of James and Peter as well in Acts 15 who said as much, that gentiles need NOT be circumcised.
If you reject Paul I can also give you a verse from PETER that says Jesus died for our sins, here it is (One from JOHN for good measure):


1 Peter 3:18
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit,

1 Peter 2:24
He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness. By his wounds you have been healed.

1 John 2:2
He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.

None of these are from Paul!
 
Feb 11, 2023
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#65
Ah you are one of those who reject Paul? You do so at your own peril. I had my doubts about Paul when I found a website about a decade ago that pitted "Jesus vs Paul" but once you rightly divide the word of truth, you will see there is no conflict.

I am not hyper dispensational, I don't reject water baptism or spiritual gifts. However I am "dispie leaning" in the sense that I see a difference in POST-resurrection and PRE-resurrection. For example: Jesus tells His disciples to "do everything the pharisees tell them" and tells someone to give ANIMAL SACRIFICES "But go, show yourself to the priest and offer the sacrifices that Moses commanded for your cleansing, as a testimony to them."

Are you supposed to give animal sacrifices today? Are we supposed to do what the pharisees (judaizers) tell us? No! If you reject Paul, I can give you the testimony of James and Peter as well in Acts 15 who said as much, that gentiles need NOT be circumcised.
If you reject Paul I can also give you a verse from PETER that says Jesus died for our sins, here it is (One from JOHN for good measure):


1 Peter 3:18
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit,

1 Peter 2:24
He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness. By his wounds you have been healed.

1 John 2:2
He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.

None of these are from Paul!
I was on a dispensationslist based website for a while, its good to see in my view you are not ''hyper dispensational'' as you put it. In regards to Jesus teaching and what came after it, we have to remember the old covenant was in operation when Christ walked this earth, and of course, he had to be faithful to it whilst also looking forward to the covenant to come
 

Underwhosewings

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2023
1,318
671
113
Australia
#66
Hebrews 6:1-2 KJV
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, [2] Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

Hebrews 6:4-6 KJV
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
[5] And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
[6] If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Salvation deals with “sins that are past”

“If they shall fall away”
“If” = conditional
They cannot be “born again,” “sealed with the Holy Spirit,” “Saved,” a second time.
Foundation principles are only laid once.

If we fall away, lose faith, lose hope, get discouraged,
We are to turn around and come back to where we left off.
And to our mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
“We have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ …”

Leviticus 17:1 KJV
And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,…

Leviticus 17:11 KJV
For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.
 
Feb 8, 2023
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Still on earth !
#68
Hebrews 6:1-2 KJV
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, [2] Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

Hebrews 6:4-6 KJV
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
[5] And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
[6] If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Salvation deals with “sins that are past”

“If they shall fall away”
“If” = conditional
They cannot be “born again,” “sealed with the Holy Spirit,” “Saved,” a second time.
Foundation principles are only laid once.

If we fall away, lose faith, lose hope, get discouraged,
We are to turn around and come back to where we left off.
And to our mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
“We have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ …”

Leviticus 17:1 KJV
And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,…

Leviticus 17:11 KJV
For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.



Amen and a PRAISE THE LORD!

A thank you @Underwhosewings for your insight!
 

Deuteronomy

Well-known member
Jun 11, 2018
3,243
3,576
113
67
#69
Point 1- Isaiah 53:5 - it says Jesus was wounded (pierced very arguable) point being Jesus was not killed. Point 2 unlikely that this relates to Jesus. Very briefly - Isaiah 53:7 states that "he did not open his mouth" - Jesus "Eloi Eloi lama sabachtani!" & Isaiah 53:9 9 He had done no wrong and had never deceived anyone. But he was buried like a criminal; he was put in a rich man’s grave. A) Jesus was not buried B) we was placed in a empty tomb by himself. 53:10 ....He will see His offspring, He will prolong His days, and the good pleasure of the LORD will prosper in His hand. The other quotes are Paul - contradictory to Jesus & God
Hello AnotherTheory, I apologize for the slow reply, but timely is (unfortunately) not always possible for me.

Before I reply to what you just said, I have a question for you, are you considering embracing the Christian faith as your own, or are you here for a different reason :unsure: If it is the former (and I hope that it is :)), I have one last question for you, why do you want to become a Christian :unsure:

Thanks!

May God bless you as you seek to find Him and know Him!!

~Deuteronomy
.
 
Jan 30, 2023
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#74
Paul wrote his letters and preached his doctrine in real time. During the time of the twelve apostles.

Galatians 2:2
It was because of a revelation that I went up; and I submitted to them the gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but I did so in private to those who were of reputation. (Those of reputation were James, Peter, and John)

Paul was a contemporary apostle but an apostle to the Gentiles, not the Jews.

Paul's gospel which you claim was a long time after, was in fact, at the same time.

2 Peter 3:15
And regard the patience of our Lord as salvation; just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you.

Peter confirms that Paul has a divine wisdom regarding the gospel.

2 Peter 3:16
As also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which there are some things that are hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.

Peter says, 'As also in all his letters', obviously Peter has read all of Paul's letters.

At Antioch, Paul rebukes Peter to his face.

Galatians 2:11
But when Cephas came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned.

The idea, that Paul arrived on the scene much later on, is without support in the scripture.

Paul taught Christ crucified, if you think Paul was preaching something else, then you are dead wrong.

* I didn't say he arrived later - he changed things after Jesus

Paul says he Rebuked Peter - but doesn't sound like that in Acts, he done what he was told without objects;

Acts 21:21-24 21 They have been informed that you teach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs. 22 What shall we do? They will certainly hear that you have come, 23 so do what we tell you. There are four men with us who have made a vow. 24 Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay their expenses, so that they can have their heads shaved. ***Then everyone will know there is no truth in these reports about you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law.


Why Peter is not in the bible is because of below.

Apocalypse of Peter confirms that - The Savior said to me, "He whom you saw on the tree, glad and laughing, this is the living Jesus. But this one into whose hands and feet they drive the nails is his fleshly part, which is the substitute being put to shame, the one who came into being in his likeness. But look at him and me."
 
Jan 30, 2023
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#75
Christians believe that Paul's words are God's words, per 2 Timothy 3:16. Do you believe Paul was a deceiver and a heretic?
Yes I do - Timothy is Paul writing about himself -

“Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according
to my gospel
:” 2 Timothy 2:8

Romans 15:20 20 In this way I have aspired to preach the gospel where Christ was not known, so that I would not be building on someone else’s foundation.

could quote so many more
 
Jan 30, 2023
48
2
8
#76
Hello AnotherTheory, I apologize for the slow reply, but timely is (unfortunately) not always possible for me.

Before I reply to what you just said, I have a question for you, are you considering embracing the Christian faith as your own, or are you here for a different reason :unsure: If it is the former (and I hope that it is :)), I have one last question for you, why do you want to become a Christian :unsure:

Thanks!

May God bless you as you seek to find Him and know Him!!

~Deuteronomy
.
Different Christian opinions
 

Underwhosewings

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2023
1,318
671
113
Australia
#77
Salvation is the first thing, so past sins are forgiven, now comes the daily walk.

John 7:38 KJV
He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

Ephesians 5:26 KJV
That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

John 13:14 KJV
If I then, your Lord and Master, have washed your feet; ye also ought to wash one another's feet.

In our daily walk,
our feet get dirty,
so the water of the word is there,
to read, or hear.
And has a cleansing effect on us.
Hebrews 6:1 KJV
… let us go on unto perfection;…

Hebrews 12:22,24 KJV
But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem,….
[24] And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

After salvation the blood of sprinkling is there for when we have sinned.

But we must not sin wilfully.

Hebrews 10:26 KJV
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
 
Jan 30, 2023
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2
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#78
That is certainly ANOTHER THEORY. A very fanciful and inaccurate theory. The real issue is whether you want the truth or not. Many people hate the truth.
Yes many people do hate the truth and can not accept - I go by overall evidence of the text
 
Jan 30, 2023
48
2
8
#79
Salvation is the first thing, so past sins are forgiven, now comes the daily walk.

John 7:38 KJV
He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

Ephesians 5:26 KJV
That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

John 13:14 KJV
If I then, your Lord and Master, have washed your feet; ye also ought to wash one another's feet.

In our daily walk,
our feet get dirty,
so the water of the word is there,
to read, or hear.
And has a cleansing effect on us.
Hebrews 6:1 KJV
… let us go on unto perfection;…

Hebrews 12:22,24 KJV
But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem,….
[24] And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

After salvation the blood of sprinkling is there for when we have sinned.

But we must not sin wilfully.

Hebrews 10:26 KJV
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

See #44 God does not accept scarifies & Why do we need to repent is all done.

REV 3:19 "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

Acts 3:19 - Repent therefore, and turn back, that your sins may be blotted out,

Matthew 3:8 - Bear fruit in keeping with repentance.

I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish. Luke 13:3
 

Underwhosewings

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2023
1,318
671
113
Australia
#80
See #44 God does not accept scarifies & Why do we need to repent is all done.

REV 3:19 "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

Acts 3:19 - Repent therefore, and turn back, that your sins may be blotted out,

Matthew 3:8 - Bear fruit in keeping with repentance.

I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish. Luke 13:3
John 3:3,7 KJV
Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
[7] Marvel not that I said unto thee,
Ye must be born again.