Proof That Catholics Worship Mary

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Jul 23, 2024
71
56
18
What precisely do you not understand by the phrase, "If you forgive ('ἀφίημι') anyone his sins, they are forgiven; if you withhold forgiveness from anyone, it is withheld” (Jn. 20:23)?

What is more, I understood what you said perfectly and even addressed what you said. Let me reiterate, this was BEFORE the Ascension and descent of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost. How can this passage be summarizing things that haven't even happened up to that point yet? If you want to say that His breathing of the Spirit upon them is some sort of foreshadowing of what would transpire in the upper room, then fine but it isn't strictly addressing that issue really at all, so I once again call into question your interpretation and challenge you to provide evidence because you keep using the word "synthesizes," but there's nothing in the context to support that perspective. There is nothing to even suggest that a synthesis of the Resurrection, and then the subsequent Ascension and Descent of the Spirit at Pentecost is even in view here. All He is doing is commissioning His Disciples and handing authority over to them.
Yeap, keep believing in what ever you want. Keep confessing your sin to an old man. That’s is your own business.
 
Jul 23, 2024
71
56
18
You try to spiritualize this text by saying that through the preaching of the Gospel, those who believe will have their sins forgiven. Where does it say that anywhere in that passage? What is more, simply believing in Christ is not sufficient, one must repent, which is why St. Paul has a two-pronged explanation of conversion in Romans 4:3-8. In that passage he cites Abraham's belief, as well as David's repentance from his sins of murder and adultery (Ps. 32).

Lastly, James 5:16 speaks about confessing our sins to one another, and in that very context are mentioned the Presbyters of the Church who also anoint with oil those who are ill (Anointing of the Sick). There is absolutely nothing distorted whatever in these passages. I find that in order for you to avoid the inevitable conclusion of certain people being given the authority to take away sins on Jesus' behalf, you have to spiritualize the passages to a ridiculous level, instead of allowing the Scriptures to speak for themselves.
The passage does not indicate a specific date, so it is not possible to know if it was before, after or it is a summary of the events as I am indicating. But if you read, with understanding, Acts chapters. 1 and 2 you will realize that they did nothing at all until 40 days after the ascension in which they received the holy spirit. It was then that they began to preach and forgive the sins of those who received the message of salvation. It's that simple.

The one who is misinterpreting is you. James 5 clearly implies that we confess our offenses committed against each other, but nothing says that by doing so our sins will be forgiven and nothing about the anointing with oil indicates that it forgives our sins. All it indicates is that through prayer our health can be restored and that through prayer our sins will be forgiven. You are looking for verses that do not support your theory at all and misinterpreting or distorting them to say that you are right.

James 5:13-17 NIV
The Prayer of Faith
13 Is anyone among you in trouble? Let them pray. Is anyone happy? Let them sing songs of praise. 14 Is anyone among you sick? Let them call the elders of the church to pray over them and anoint them with oil in the name of the Lord. 15 And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise them up. If they have sinned, they will be forgiven. 16 Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective.

17 Elijah was a human being, even as we are. I have prayed earnestly that it would not rain, and it did not rain on the land for three and a half years. 18 Again I prayed, and the heavens gave rain, and the earth produced its crops.

But like I told you a moment ago. If you want to continue believing that an old man locked in a cabin has the authority to forgive your sins, that is your business. It is not me you are offending but God and the sacrifice that Jesus made on the cross.
 
May 13, 2024
15
11
3
Are you upset that there is a passage that explicitly says those who believe in Jesus receive forgiveness of sins in His name?
Not at all, but that passage doesn't detail how those sins will be forgiven. The passages I quoted and referenced to give that detail, but it seems your perfectly happy with ignoring them. That's fine; you'll just have to answer when you stand before the Judgement Seat of Christ why you pick and choose certain verses and reject others.
 
May 13, 2024
15
11
3
The passage does not indicate a specific date, so it is not possible to know if it was before, after or it is a summary of the events as I am indicating. But if you read, with understanding, Acts chapters. 1 and 2 you will realize that they did nothing at all until 40 days after the ascension in which they received the holy spirit. It was then that they began to preach and forgive the sins of those who received the message of salvation. It's that simple.

The one who is misinterpreting is you. James 5 clearly implies that we confess our offenses committed against each other, but nothing says that by doing so our sins will be forgiven and nothing about the anointing with oil indicates that it forgives our sins. All it indicates is that through prayer our health can be restored and that through prayer our sins will be forgiven. You are looking for verses that do not support your theory at all and misinterpreting or distorting them to say that you are right.

James 5:13-17 NIV
The Prayer of Faith
13 Is anyone among you in trouble? Let them pray. Is anyone happy? Let them sing songs of praise. 14 Is anyone among you sick? Let them call the elders of the church to pray over them and anoint them with oil in the name of the Lord. 15 And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise them up. If they have sinned, they will be forgiven. 16 Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective.

17 Elijah was a human being, even as we are. I have prayed earnestly that it would not rain, and it did not rain on the land for three and a half years. 18 Again I prayed, and the heavens gave rain, and the earth produced its crops.

But like I told you a moment ago. If you want to continue believing that an old man locked in a cabin has the authority to forgive your sins, that is your business. It is not me you are offending but God and the sacrifice that Jesus made on the cross.

No, it's not possible, and it's quite clear that they are in Jerusalem and that this event takes place prior to His Ascension. There is nothing in the context to support your view that this is a summary of those aforementioned events.

Really, then why does it say in James 5:15b, "If they have sinned, THEY WILL BE FORGIVEN"? Are you even reading the text? And what is more, it says in Verse 14 that the priests will pray over them and anoint them with oil. Do you see how the anointing with oil is part of the prayer of healing and forgiveness? What I would like to know is if your church does this? If not, then I'd like to know why because this is a command from James.

Lastly, I think it's pretty clear who is distorting and twisting these passages to their own destruction (2 Pet. 3:16), and it's not me, the guy who is simply reading the passages for what they say.

Anyhow, I'll leave the matter there. The final word is yours.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
61,101
30,227
113
Not at all, but that passage doesn't detail how those sins will be forgiven. The passages I quoted and referenced to give that detail, but it seems your perfectly happy with ignoring them. That's fine; you'll just have to answer when you stand before the Judgement Seat of Christ why you pick and choose certain verses and reject others.
I see you are content to assume things about me you have no way of knowing. You will
have to answer for your erroneous assumptions and false accusations. Good luck with that.
 
Jul 23, 2024
71
56
18
No, it's not possible, and it's quite clear that they are in Jerusalem and that this event takes place prior to His Ascension. There is nothing in the context to support your view that this is a summary of those aforementioned events.

Really, then why does it say in James 5:15b, "If they have sinned, THEY WILL BE FORGIVEN"? Are you even reading the text? And what is more, it says in Verse 14 that the priests will pray over them and anoint them with oil. Do you see how the anointing with oil is part of the prayer of healing and forgiveness? What I would like to know is if your church does this? If not, then I'd like to know why because this is a command from James.

Lastly, I think it's pretty clear who is distorting and twisting these passages to their own destruction (2 Pet. 3:16), and it's not me, the guy who is simply reading the passages for what they say.

Anyhow, I'll leave the matter there. The final word is yours.
As I said before, keep believing what ever you want. I don’t going to let the forgiveness of my sins in another hands that wasn’t the God’s hands. You can go every time that you want to confessing your sin to an old man and believe that he have the authority to forgive your sins. That is your own business.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
13,111
4,374
113
"I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images." —Isaiah 42:8

There is not a more damnable doctrine in Roman Catholicism than the teachings ofOur Lady of Fatima. Roman Catholic officials claim that a supernatural event occurred in 1917 in which theBlessed Virgin Maryappeared repeatedly to 3 little children in Fatima, Portugal. Supposedly, theVirgin Marygave a message to the 3 children—Lucia, Jacinta and Francisco—consisting of anallegednumber of precise predictions, requests, warnings andpromisesconcerning the Catholic faith. An "apparition" means "the unexpected or unusual appearance of a ghostly figure."

The 5th of the15 promisesmade byOur Lady of Fatimaconcerning the Rosary is so blasphemous that it is unmistakable, clear, proof, that Catholics do indeed worship Mary (which is sinful idolatry). Here's the 5th promise...

The soul which recommends itself to Me by the recitation of the Rosary, shall not perish. —SOURCE

Blasphemy!!! You cannot show me even one Scripture from the Word of God where we are told to trust in Mary, by reciting theRosaryto be saved. In fact, the word "Rosary" is NOT a Bible term. TheRosary is straight out of the pits of Hell. Jesus condemnedvain repetitionin Matthew 6:7. According toOur Lady of Fatima(whose teachings are officially sanctioned by the Vatican), a person can obtain eternal life through Mary by reciting the Rosary. In sharp contrast, Jesus Christ proclaimed in John 14:6... "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father,but by me." How could Catholics be so arrogant, so blind, and so apostate as to believe that salvation is found in Mary? I tell you, Catholicism is of the Devil.

The Gospel of Jesus Christ has absolutely nothing to do with Mary. None of the Apostles ever mentioned Mary in their Epistles. Jesus never directed us to recognize Mary. In fact, the Bible clearly states in Matthew 11:11 that there has never been a child born amongst women greater thanJohn the Baptist. And no wonder, becauseJohn the Baptistprepared the people for the coming of the Savior—Jesus Christ,the Lamb of God which taketh away the sins of the world(John 1:29). Yet, Catholics sinfully worship Mary, bowing to her statue as if she's a god.Unbelievably, during one rosary recital (a chaplet), a Catholic will recite 53 hail Marys! Each "Hail Mary" recital is 42 words long. 42 x 53 = 2,226 words just praising Mary! The devout Catholic who prays the rosary every day will praise Mary with 812,490 words in a year's time. That is idolatry! Again,Our Lady of Fatimasaid...

The soul which recommends itself to Me by the recitation of the Rosary, shall not perish. —SOURCE

That's a BIG LIE!!! The Vatican has a lot of explaining to do, because something smells very rotten. One of the most unholy groups in this world is the Holy See, i.e., Catholic leadership. They wrote the book on self-righteousness. No devout Catholic dare deny the promises ofOur Lady of Fatima, i.e., theirBlessed Virgin Mary. The Catholic Mary (which is nowhere even close to the Biblical Mary) claims to have the power to save those who recite the Rosary. No wonder Catholicism's Mary is often referred to asThe Great Whore. Catholics have mutated Jesus' earthly mother into a two-headed, fire-breathing, demonic, monster.

The Biblical Mary was a horrible sinner (James 2:10), who needed a Savior (Luke 1:47), and told others to do what Jesus commanded (John 2:5). The Biblical Mary was not aPerpetual Virgin(Matthew 13:55-56), was notImmaculately Conceived(Romans 3:23), wasn'tBodily Assumedinto Heaven (Hebrews 9:27), and she doesn't intercede on our behalf (1st Timothy 2:5... "For there is one God, andone mediatorbetween God and men, the man Christ Jesus"). TheBlessed Virgin Maryof the Catholic religion is straight from Hell.

Oh! Listen my friend, the Catholic Church is aprisonhouseof religion! Catholics have churchianity without Christianity, and religion without truth. From the cradle to the casket, the Catholic Church offers people a package deal; but it's a guaranteed road straight into the depths of Hellfire and damnation. In Luke 17:21, Jesus stated that theKingdom of Godis within you; not within a religious organization. Many people want an organized religion that allows them to touch, taste, see, and feel what they're trusting in for eternal life. However, true salvation, which is obtained onlyby faithin Christ Jesus, isof the heart(Romans 10:10).

we known this for sometime now LOL
 
May 13, 2024
15
11
3
Hello KephaAlHabayith,

A man asked St Paul and Barnabas,
Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved...
Acts 16:30...
>Salvation in a nutshell<
And yet Mark 16:16 says that one needs to believe AND be baptized in order to be saved. 1 Peter 3:20-21 and John 3:5 say the same thing. I don't take issue with faith saving us but nowhere do the Scriptures teach Faith Alone. In fact, the only time we find the phrase "faith alone" is when the notion is repudiated in James 2:24 where it says, "You see that a man is justified by works, and not by faith alone."
 

HealthAndHappiness

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2022
10,567
4,490
113
Almost Heaven West Virginia
And yet Mark 16:16 says that one needs to believe AND be baptized in order to be saved. 1 Peter 3:20-21 and John 3:5 say the same thing. I don't take issue with faith saving us but nowhere do the Scriptures teach Faith Alone. In fact, the only time we find the phrase "faith alone" is when the notion is repudiated in James 2:24 where it says, "You see that a man is justified by works, and not by faith alone."


In the KJB the answer is given exactly 100 times even! 🙂📖 That's in the one book designated to be THE Book that clearly was written for the lost to be saved....John.

20:31But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
 
May 13, 2024
15
11
3
In the KJB the answer is given exactly 100 times even! 🙂📖 That's in the one book designated to be THE Book that clearly was written for the lost to be saved....John.

20:31But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
Where does it say you ONLY need to believe or have FAITH ALONE?