Proof?

[machew]

I remember when people used to ask me to do that. There was a stage of life where I would have some good arguments for how God existed, even scientific evidence. Being really into science, I was able to come up with substantial arguments that many people couldn't explain away. I thought I was being a good Christian by convincing them of God in this fashion. But I had an enlightening experience with a friend from a church used to go to during college.

We both took a secular Christianity course in college for our religious studies elective. By the middle of the class he had started to doubt some major parts of his faith. At the time I didn't consider him to be someone new to the faith, he had been a Christian for many years. I too struggled with the evidence presented in the class. But I had something that he didn't that helped me reconcile the evidence without doubting my faith. At this point I had already experienced multiple encounters with God, where He showed Himself to me and spoke to me. These are the kind of encounters that simply couldn't be explained away. I knew that God was real without a doubt. But my friend had not experienced encounters like this before. So he struggled with it more.

Because I remembered things God had spoke to me before, I was able to make sense of what I learned in class and what the Bible said. As I sought God about the apparent contradictions in the Bible, He said something to me that forever changed the way I looked at the book:

"Some of the Bible seems contradictory because both verses that seem to oppose each other are both true."

I responded: "What???"

"Read 1 Corinthians 2:14"
(Emphasis is what God highlighted to me)
14But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.


God told me another day:
"The Bible isn't meant to be understood through human intellect alone, but through intimate relationship with me. Knowledge puffs up, but knowing Me in relationship gives you spiritual understanding"

I then realized that it was pointless to try to argue someone to Christ, because and intellectual argument whether you use the Bible or not will not secure someone in Christ. In order for a person to truly accept Christ it had to be at the heart level, and even if they found accepting Jesus to be logical and were convinced into it, if they didn't accept Him in their heart it meant nothing.

After moving to another church, there is something my pastor said that I really like:
"A person brought into an encounter with God is not at the mercy of someone with a good argument"

I realized then that my friend had been convinced out of following Christ because he had only been convinced to follow Christ along with many other people in my church.

So I sought out to ask God how I could partner with Him when I went out to reach people, so that they would encounter His Love, rather than me just telling them about it. As I went after this, He started giving me more hunger to seek Him and to seek the spiritual gifts. After a few years I started noticing things that came to my mind and heart as I was witnessing to people. I noticed that they pertained to the person I was talking to. I began receiving accurate Words of Knowledge, Prophesy for the people I ran into. Evangelism because a lot easier as people started realizing that God was real and really Loved them. People started getting healed of sicknesses and injuries more and more. The good news was not just preached but displayed right in front of them.

I started realizing that these manifestations of the Holy Spirit were intended for people to see that God Loves them. Many people were getting healed even before they were accepting Christ. I realized that the most important thing I could do for people I am reaching is to show them that God Loves them. Everything else falls into place after they realize this. The good news is preached without resistance when they truly realize how God feels about them. Every person deep down wants to know that there is a God that Loves them, but most have experienced things in life that seem to contradict this. So they become bitter towards God, and try to find other ways to cope with the hurt and wounds in their heart (ie: atheism, agnosticism, occult, homosexuality, other religions)

Here is my recent testimony regarding this:
I got back from Tijuana Mexico 2 weeks ago. We went to the worst part of town at Revolucion Street in the middle of the Red Light District, and God met hundreds of people, with around 70 or so being saved. There were more displays of God's Love(miracles) than I have ever seen my life. Prostitutes were getting save, club bosses were getting saved, and people in the streets who were searching for lust to medicate their hurting hearts found the real remedy to their pain, Jesus. I weep just describing it because It was truly amazing, humbling, and an honor to be there, in the middle of what God wanted to do.

 

[lil-rush]

That is a great post, Machew, and so true.

 

[Matthew]

I was asked today (here at work) to prove that God existed, and that Christianity is not jus another made up religion. Ive been asked before a few times at work. how would you handle a question like that?

There is only one answer to that in my opinion, I always say - 'I can't prove it, that's what faith is'

You cannot open someone up to faith of any sort with a clever answer, the best you can do is give them something to think about and so I choose to make them think about the truth of it, and that answer is the truth and probably the only thing believers in all religions would agree with.

 

[1still_waters]

I know many try to act like faith is somehow this blind belief THAT something happened. Asserting that if you were somehow able o prove it, it wouldn't be faith.

But I believe faith is this act in something that DID happen. If that thing DIDN'T happen, then we would have nothing to have faith in.

We're not supposed to have faith because we 'think' something happened. We have faith because we KNOW it happened.

Look at 1st John...1

1That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked at and our hands have touched—this we proclaim concerning the Word of life. 2The life appeared; we have seen it and testify to it, and we proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and has appeared to us. 3We proclaim to you what we have seen and heard, so that you also may have fellowship with us. And our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son, Jesus Christ. 4We write this to make our[a] joy complete.

Look at those words..

HEARD SEEN TOUCHED.........

They had faith in a concrete event in history they KNEW happened. They didn't simply have some unfounded blind hope that it may have happened.

Yet so many will say that since you're sure of some concrete reality actually existing, then it's not faith. To that I say RUBBISH!

Faith always rests in something certain. Whether that's God saying something or some actual historical event.

To many faith has become this thing where deep down they don't know if it's a fairytale or an actual thing that happened, so since they can't prove it, they decide to basically hope that it's real. To me that's not faith.

 

[miktre]

There is alot of evidence out there but it isn't popular to take an honest look at it. Jabel al Lawz(Mt. Sinia) has all kinds of proof surrounding it.

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkfxMKWphsY[/video]

 

[James_Steven]

Maybe a good quick retort could be "Can you prove that God doesn't exist."
Then they say "But I don't have to." You say "Then there is your answer."

 

[Rogue]

I was asked today (here at work) to prove that God existed, and that Christianity is not jus another made up religion. Ive been asked before a few times at work. how would you handle a question like that?

I would answer it honestly. Can I prove that God exists? Absolutely not. None of us can, but neither can we prove He does not exist.

 

[pickles]

Ive given different answers over the years depending on the person.
Ussually I respond with a question, why are you really asking? If you ask there has to be something real to question.
Faith is the evidence of things unseen.
If there was proof, then we would be slaves rather than having free will to believe.
The true evidence is in you and before you. I believe with all of my being, and know that all is true. I can say that if you choose to believe, you will not be dissapointed.
These are a few, that I have witnessed with.
Another is if God did not exist, there would be no question asked about him existing.
God bless, pickles

 

[Pete_Martinez]

And adding to this, sometimes the greatest proof of God is a changed life.
2Co 3:2 Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:
2Co 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

 

[jfritzyb]

I was asked today (here at work) to prove that God existed, and that Christianity is not jus another made up religion. Ive been asked before a few times at work. how would you handle a question like that?

For me personally, I feel that it takes a great measure of humility to attempt an answer to this question--whenever it merits one, that is. The kind of answer you give (even if it be an answer of silence) all depends on the kind of person you're addressing. One kind of approach will NEVER "fit" all kinds of people! Now, assuming that the person asking the question is just inquisitive and wants to know how you know God exists, I would answer thusly; "Can I put human love in a test tube and analyze it in a lab in order to prove it exists? If I cannot do such a thing with human love, then how could I do it with God's love? His love pervades the universe and gives it life like the wind gives air to the creatures on earth and the ones that fly in the sky and live in the sea."

"I can only believe that God's love exists because it just...does."

"Now, you want me to prove that Christianity isn't just like the other religions out there; but I ask you this...do YOU believe that Christianity is just like the other religions out there? If so, what is your CHIEF REASON for believing that way?"

Hear him out...and then go from there. If he insists that you answer first, explain to him that your answer is based on how he believes and that if you did answer him first, then you'd be assuming what he believed.

If he keeps insisting that you answer first, walk away; for it is never a good thing to assume things about people that aren't true--and you would jeoprodize the truth in the process which is the very thing you want to uphold in all your conversation.

Peace,

~ JD

 

[mpaper345]

A good way to reach out to them is with prophesy for how can the Bible be one third prophesy with a lot of it coming to pass unless it were given by God.

21Produce your cause, saith the LORD; bring forth your strong reasons, saith the King of Jacob.

22Let them bring them forth, and shew us what shall happen: let them shew the former things, what they be, that we may consider them, and know the latter end of them; or declare us things for to come.
23Shew the things that are to come hereafter, that we may know that ye are gods: yea, do good, or do evil, that we may be dismayed, and behold it together.
24Behold, ye are of nothing, and your work of nought: an abomination is he that chooseth you.
25I have raised up one from the north, and he shall come: from the rising of the sun shall he call upon my name: and he shall come upon princes as upon morter, and as the potter treadeth clay.
26Who hath declared from the beginning, that we may know? and beforetime, that we may say, He is righteous? yea, there is none that sheweth, yea, there is none that declareth, yea, there is none that heareth your words.
27The first shall say to Zion, Behold, behold them: and I will give to Jerusalem one that bringeth good tidings.
28For I beheld, and there was no man; even among them, and there was no counsellor, that, when I asked of them, could answer a word. 29Behold, they are all vanity; their works are nothing: their molten images are wind and confusion(Isaiah 41:21-29).

Matt

 

[resurrection33]

I was asked today (here at work) to prove that God existed, and that Christianity is not jus another made up religion. Ive been asked before a few times at work. how would you handle a question like that?

I don’t know if you need to prove anything. If people want to pass up the opportunity to know the Lord, that’s THEIR problem, perhaps.

 

[VW]

I don’t know if you need to prove anything. If people want to pass up the opportunity to know the Lord, that’s THEIR problem, perhaps.

According to Paul, the proof is self evident to all, because God has made it evident to them.

 

[Kay_Kay]

Proving God exists and Christianity being the "right" religion are two different arguments. It's very simple to prove God exists because the fact we have life shows there is a higher power- and to deny that is not only unscientific but stupid. You can't say life began "logically" or matter just "created itself"- something HAD to be there to create it. Ergo, proof of God.

Christianity as a religion is more difficult to explain. You can't convince someone truth, especially since there is so many different options. Just tell someone, "it's what I believe, it rings true to my heart. I don't believe it because I want to, but because it is truth." Most people pick their religion because they like the lifestyle, sometimes it leaves a better impression that you don't believe in Christianity because it's oh-so-fun or oh-so-easy, but because truth isn't always fun or easy but simply truth. It's personal, so what sort of answer would they be expecting anyway?

 

[jfritzyb]

Proving God exists and Christianity being the "right" religion are two different arguments. It's very simple to prove God exists because the fact we have life shows there is a higher power- and to deny that is not only unscientific but stupid. You can't say life began "logically" or matter just "created itself"- something HAD to be there to create it. Ergo, proof of God.

Ditto; but what about someone who points to the same evidence you did (life) and says that it proves that God doesn't exist? What about people like Darwin who proclaim that natural selection IS deity?

...truth isn't always fun or easy but simply truth. It's personal, so what sort of answer would they be expecting anyway?

Ditto; but what if someone says their way of life isn't always easy to follow either and that it IS personal too? Does something being difficult to follow denote that path to be Truth? Even Buddhist monks suffer persecution from people who dislike their beliefs and nationality as well.

 

[MahogonySnail]

I don't think creation is proof of a single creator God, as there are many different other theories about how we came to be such as space aliens, and random chance,

I think Christians should avoid arguments about or trying to prove or disprove that God exists or not. It cannot be done, if it could be then christians would be making converts left right and centre. So focus on something more important like what happens after they die.

 

[jfritzyb]

I don't think creation is proof of a single creator God, as there are many different other theories about how we came to be such as space aliens, and random chance,

Got a question for ya; would you agree with the idea that we create our own purpose in life?

 

[MahogonySnail]

I might if you convinced me enough

 

[loveschild]

The proof is in how you act and live your life. How God is blesing you. How when things are not ok for the moment your not all upset. All you do is pray. You don't have to prove. This is not a game.

 

[jfritzyb]

I might if you convinced me enough

I'm just wondering if you think that one defines their own purpose in life