Research: Majority of Americans Believe Works Are the Key to Salvation

[Jackson123]

To me bible say the fruit of Holy Spirit is love
sheep in Matt 25 doing love by helping poor
so no fruit in John 15 = goat in Matt 25

 

[Jackson123]

only need faith to be save

Noah save from float because faith not work

is that mean Noah don’t need to work to build an arch?
because he is good in swimming ?
though he is good in swimming he need work, swimming is work

sheep in Matt 25 save by faith, not work
it doesn’t mean they aren’t doing anything
they do love the poor,
it mean that work to help the poor is to small compare the wage it trillion dollar house in heaven,
we call it grace because we pay small get big

every body that willing to come to my house I will give them 100 thousand dollar car
free, grace

its that mean they don’t need to work, travel to my house spend gas money?
they do need drive to my house
but I call it free because their expend is to small compare the grace of 100 thousand dollar car

 

[Inquisitor]

Okay I’ll do it, but you’ll probably disagree.


False


Truth:
John 6:29
29Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.




False


Truth:
Mark 16:16
16He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

John 3:5
5Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.



False

Truth:
Matthew 25:41-43
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 42For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: 43I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

1 John 5:2,3
2By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.





Works of the Law and energy you expend to do work in process of going the extra mile, being a Good Samaritan, walking the strait and narrow path, obeying God, loving your neighbor, loving God, believing in Jesus, and water baptism are not the same things.

There are works that save and I just proved it. Stop fighting the Bible.



The Bible refutes you.

Works save do they?

Ephesians 2:8
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

Well done, you contradicted what Paul said.

We are only ever saved by grace through faith!

We are saved by the blood of our savior, Jesus Christ.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Can give me a verse that say to go to heaven don’t need love

Can you give me a verse that plainly says salvation can be lost?

 

[Inquisitor]

Galatians 5
6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

Hmm
Interesting comversation

Faith wich work by love

So it is need to have love, to make faith work

No love faith not wor, mean nothing

1 cor 13
13.And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

Charity ( love in action) is greater then faith?

You cannot possibly love others without the Holy Spirit. And you cannot receive the Holy Spirit without believing in Jesus. So the word of faith comes first. We are only saved at the primary level by the blood of the Christ.

1 Corinthians 15:14
Now I make known to you, brothers and sisters, the gospel which I preached to you, which you also received, in which you also stand, by which you also are saved, if you hold firmly to the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain. For I handed down to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures.

Why would anyone boast about their works, as if, their works were somehow generated by an act of their will?

Jesus Christ is the only source of salvation not you.

 

[Inquisitor]

Can you give me a verse that plainly says salvation can be lost?

Luke 12:10
And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but the one who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
Can you give me a verse that plainly says salvation can be lost?

Luke 12:10
And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but the one who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him.

The context for these words of Jesus was Jews who had seen with their own eyes Jesus performing miracles, and then attributing those miracles to the devil. Calling Jesus' miracles, which were by the power of the Holy Spirit, miracles of the devil, blasphemes the Holy Spirit.

Such people were so negative toward Jesus as Deity, they would never believe He was the Messiah. And all of those people weren't forgiven.

The so-called "sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit" isn't even possible after that generation of Jews. One would have to physically see Jesus performing miracles, and then saying He was performing miracles by the power of the devil. Not possible.

If this is your only verse, it doesn't plainly say salvation can be lost.

 

[Jackson123]

Can you give me a verse that plainly says salvation can be lost?

Hebrew 6

4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

impossible ,,,,,……..to renew

if you once enlightened and fall away

lose salvation

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
Can you give me a verse that plainly says salvation can be lost?

Hebrew 6

4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

impossible ,,,,,……..to renew

renew what, exactly? Read the text. It's real clear. It's NOT salvation. It's about changing their minde (that's what repentance means) about what they are doing.

if you once enlightened and fall away

lose salvation

This is a very poor assumption. There is no mention of salvation in this text.

You have not given any verse that plainly teaches that salvation can be lost.

ALL of the verses YOU think plainly teach loss of salvation requires much presumption and assumption.

And you KEEP avoiding the clear words of Jesus about those He gives eternal life WHEN they believe.

Why is that?

 

[Runningman]

Works save do they?

Ephesians 2:8
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

Well done, you contradicted what Paul said.

We are only ever saved by grace through faith!

We are saved by the blood of our savior, Jesus Christ.

No I didn’t contradict Paul. Did you actually read my post before responding? The works Paul mentioned in Ephesians 2:8 are works of the law, which I said don’t save.

 

[Jackson123]

You cannot possibly love others without the Holy Spirit. And you cannot receive the Holy Spirit without believing in Jesus. So the word of faith comes first. We are only saved at the primary level by the blood of the Christ.

1 Corinthians 15:14
Now I make known to you, brothers and sisters, the gospel which I preached to you, which you also received, in which you also stand, by which you also are saved, if you hold firmly to the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain. For I handed down to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures.

Why would anyone boast about their works, as if, their works were somehow generated by an act of their will?

Jesus Christ is the only source of salvation not you.

Yep no agape love without Holy spirit

jesus say apart from me you can do nothing

 

[Jackson123]

FreeGrace2 said:
Can you give me a verse that plainly says salvation can be lost?

renew what, exactly? Read the text. It's real clear. It's NOT salvation. It's about changing their minde (that's what repentance means) about what they are doing.


This is a very poor assumption. There is no mention of salvation in this text.

You have not given any verse that plainly teaches that salvation can be lost.

ALL of the verses YOU think plainly teach loss of salvation requires much presumption and assumption.

And you KEEP avoiding the clear words of Jesus about those He gives eternal life WHEN they believe.

Why is that?

How you know renew mean repent
and how about salvation without love

 

[Jackson123]

Let read Hebrew the same chapter next verse

7For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:
8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

no good fruit >rejected> cursing> burned
to me burned is hell
i don’t think we are burned in heaven

 

[Jackson123]

Salvation by faith alone not by work, but we have to know what is faith
Noah save from float use faith
in his case work to build an arch is part of his faith

the reason why he work is faith

christian bear fruit of loving work because their faith
that is why we save by faith not work
but It doesn’t mean faith not bear fruit
In Matt 25 Jesus detail the fruit of faith and it is agape love,helping poor

 

[Inquisitor]

No I didn’t contradict Paul. Did you actually read my post before responding? The works Paul mentioned in Ephesians 2:8 are works of the law, which I said don’t save.

I read your post and you are dead wrong.

I see no mention of the phrase, 'works of the law', in the text. The church in Ephesus was a Gentile church and they had no concept of any work of the law.

How about you read more of the context surrounding Ephesians 2:8, see below.

Ephesians 2:2-10
And you were dead in your offenses and sins, in which you previously walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. Among them we too all previously lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the rest. But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our wrongdoings, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the boundless riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

The text definitely does not say 'works of the law', your interpretation is faulty.

Salvation is a gift that is freely given to you in Christ Jesus. You cannot earn salvation through a legal work or any work for that matter.

For some strange reason everyone thinks their works will save them?

 

[Bluesproverb]

Really, God calls people to his saving faith by his grace.
If there are people out there doing good for people , animals, the environment, thinking they can work their way into heaven, so be it.

Think of all the good that will be accomplished in that effort.

And then maybe we can ask ourselves, we who know we don't work our way into salvation, what good have we done for people, animals, the environment? When we are certain we are saved by grace through faith.

 

[Jackson123]

Really, God calls people to his saving faith by his grace.
If there are people out there doing good for people , animals, the environment, thinking they can work their way into heaven, so be it.

Think of all the good that will be accomplished in that effort.

And then maybe we can ask ourselves, we who know we don't work our way into salvation, what good have we done for people, animals, the environment? When we are certain we are saved by grace through faith.

Grace through faith

faith + grace

faith mean believe Jesus teaching
jesus teaching is to love God and other
so grace + faith mean

grace + do Jesus teaching to love Gods and other

mark 12
30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

 

[Jackson123]

If you have faith in Jesus you do like He teach you

this His main teaching

30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

if you say you have faith and hate God + your neighbour you are lie your faith is fake

 

[Runningman]

I read your post and you are dead wrong.

I see no mention of the phrase, 'works of the law', in the text. The church in Ephesus was a Gentile church and they had no concept of any work of the law.

How about you read more of the context surrounding Ephesians 2:8, see below.

Ephesians 2:2-10
And you were dead in your offenses and sins, in which you previously walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. Among them we too all previously lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the rest. But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our wrongdoings, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the boundless riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

The text definitely does not say 'works of the law', your interpretation is faulty.

Salvation is a gift that is freely given to you in Christ Jesus. You cannot earn salvation through a legal work or any work for that matter.

For some strange reason everyone thinks their works will save them?

No you’re dead wrong. Apparently you still didn’t read Ephesians 2. I am finding it difficult to understand why, when you just quoted Ephesians 2, you deliberately left out the context about the “works” being works of the law. That really looks like you have an agenda.

Ephesians 2:11-19 says that those of the circumcision (law keepers) were in the household of God, citizens of Israel, because of their covenant and law of commandments. However, now these uncircumcised gentiles (who don't keep the law) can have access to the household of God by their faith in thew Gospel of Christ. Unlike Israel, they are saved by faith, not works of the law (circumcision).

Ephesians 2:11-19
11 Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh, the so-called uncircumcision by the so-called circumcision in the flesh, made by hands,

12 that you were at that time apart from Christ, alienated from the citizenship of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, not having hope, and without God in the world.

13 But now in Christ Jesus you, the ones who once were far away, have become near by the blood of Christ.

14 For he himself is our peace, who made both one and broke down the dividing wall of the partition, the enmity, in his flesh,

15 invalidating the law of commandments in ordinances, in order that he might create the two in himself into one new man, thus making peace,

16 and might reconcile both in one body to God through the cross, killing the enmity in himself.

17 And coming, he proclaimed the good news of peace to you who were far away and peace to the ones who were near,

18 because through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.

19 Consequently, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but you are fellow citizens of the saints and members of the household of God

I strongly encourage you to know the difference between good works and works of the law.

 

[Inquisitor]

No you’re dead wrong. Apparently you still didn’t read Ephesians 2. I am finding it difficult to understand why, when you just quoted Ephesians 2, you deliberately left out the context about the “works” being works of the law. That really looks like you have an agenda.

Ephesians 2:11-19 says that those of the circumcision (law keepers) were in the household of God, citizens of Israel, because of their covenant and law of commandments. However, now these uncircumcised gentiles (who don't keep the law) can have access to the household of God by their faith in thew Gospel of Christ. Unlike Israel, they are saved by faith, not works of the law (circumcision).

Ephesians 2:11-19
11 Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh, the so-called uncircumcision by the so-called circumcision in the flesh, made by hands,

12 that you were at that time apart from Christ, alienated from the citizenship of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, not having hope, and without God in the world.

13 But now in Christ Jesus you, the ones who once were far away, have become near by the blood of Christ.

14 For he himself is our peace, who made both one and broke down the dividing wall of the partition, the enmity, in his flesh,

15 invalidating the law of commandments in ordinances, in order that he might create the two in himself into one new man, thus making peace,

16 and might reconcile both in one body to God through the cross, killing the enmity in himself.

17 And coming, he proclaimed the good news of peace to you who were far away and peace to the ones who were near,

18 because through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.

19 Consequently, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but you are fellow citizens of the saints and members of the household of God

I strongly encourage you to know the difference between good works and works of the law.

How about you provide just a one line comment on each verse from Ephesians 2:11-19.

That way, I can see how you convert works into the works of the law.

I am not seeing what your seeing, that's for sure.