So what about the fourth commandment?

[abcdef]

if you will study out the context, circumcision is a "sign" given to Abraham.
The "sign" of the Holy Spirit was given later to represent the same thing. It is a "sign" that says this person is a representative of God. It is also called "circumcision of the heart".
Again, if you study out the context, even that commandment is kept, but in a new way.

Lev 12:3, "And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised."

This is in the law of Moses and it is a commandment given to Abraham.

It is a commandment after the flesh.

Is the commandment, after the flesh, necessary to please God, when we are in the body of Jesus?

When you become a Christian do you need to follow this command, after the flesh?
----
No, we do not have to obey this command, after the flesh, given by God to Moses and Abraham, I think we agree on that.


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Gal 5:3, "......every man who is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law."

If you convert to the body of Christ, you don't follow the commandment given to Moses and Abraham (flesh circumcision),

But if you do, you are a debtor to the whole law, Moses and Abraham, circumcision is both covenants.

If you are seeking to please God by keeping the old covenantS, then you must obey the whole covenant that you have placed yourself under,(the yoke).

According to Gal.,

You cannot keep only "part" of a covenant, you must keep the "whole" covenant of the one that you have chosen to be under.

You cannot keep part of the law of Moses/Abraham, and not keep it all.

If you keep the 10 commandments, you must be circumcised after the flesh, when you become a Christian, to keep the Whole law.



=======================



But then you have already said, and understood, that circumcision after the flesh, is a law that is "passed away".

It is a shadow of a greater circumcision that we have in Jesus.

It is the same with the Sabbath and the 10 commandments,

The Sabbath is just a shadow, of the rest, that we have in Jesus.

If you keep the Sabbath ritual of not working, you must keep the whole law, (circumcision), they cannot be separated.



========================



If you try to please God by keeping the Laws of Moses,

You are not keeping the right covenant,

You have taken yourself out of the Grace covenant of Jesus,

And put yourself under a covenant without the blood of Jesus,

You have fallen from grace.

 

[Dan_473]

This is very true !!!
sadly too many ASSUME they follow the right 'Spirit because they call themselves 'Christian. UNLESS they have a 'burning desire to live and do like Jesus they are using His name 'in vain.

say beta,

what's up with the apostrophes before words?

like, "a 'burning desire" Are you using them to add emphasis?

 

[beta]

I'm just quoting Paul,

He says that the law is bondage.

Paul is talking about the physical rituals/ordinances/works which were abolished on the cross....these laws the people were in bondage to....NOT the spiritual 10 Commandments, holy, just and good.

Some of Paul's writings were/are hard to understand because he was not 'clear on which laws he was talking about. There were many laws in the OT and not all finished with Christ.

 

[beta]

In the context of the Gal passage, he is talking about circumcision, a law given by God. Not the ones given by men.

circumcision was one of the physical works among many others given through Moses.
But the 10 Commandments were given by GOD personally Deut 5v22 and were a separate law apart from any other...that is what makes them different.

 

[beta]

I don't understand what you wrote...

I thought you wanted verses about Christians having the Spirit inside of them?

calling yourself a Christian does 'not automatically impregate us with Holy Spirit....God looks for more than just 'lipservice.

 

[beta]

Quoting from the law is great! It's all part of God's word.

In this case, I quoted Paul quoting the law.

I believe you'd asked how we love ourselves. I think the answer is in this passage, we don't harm ourselves (unless we're insane).


Jesus showed his love for his neighbor by healing her on the sabbath. Healing is a work. The letter of the law says no work may be done on the Sabbath.

Dan, God healing us is no ordinary work ! and in the NT we can do 'good works of God on the Sabbath.

 

[beta]

Yes! that's why we have the idea of the spirit of the law and the letter of the law.





If you try to mix being led by the Spirit and following your own understanding of the law, then you will be confused.


"Having begun in the Spirit, are you now completed in the flesh?"

The HS will tell us to keep the law/commandments 'different in the NT - it will not tell you to reject the law. Jesus kept His Fathers Commandments, but different from the OT.
A heart of stone could not absorb them but a heart of flesh can ! God did not abolish the law - He changes US so we can do it with the love and grace of Christ.

 

[disciplemike]

If you are seeking to please God by keeping the old covenantS, then you must obey the whole covenant that you have placed yourself under,(the yoke).

you have been taught well by the lying preachers of prosperity.
a little mixed up in the head. why do you teach people to not obey God?

 

[Dan_473]

calling yourself a Christian does 'not automatically impregate us with Holy Spirit....God looks for more than just 'lipservice.

How does a person know if they are born of God?

Romans 8:14 Those who are led by the Spirit of God are children of God. 15 The Spirit you received doesn’t make you slaves. Otherwise you would live in fear again. Instead, the Holy Spirit you received made you God’s adopted child. By the Spirit’s power we call God Abba. Abba means Father. 16 The Spirit himself joins with our spirits. Together they tell us that we are God’s children.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=rom+8&version=nirv


Do you believe that a person is first born-again, then at a later time receives the Holy Spirit?

 

[beta]

wait, you believe that the new convenant changes how at least some laws are kept?

Of course we do. We are now created in Christ Jesus unto 'good works. In the OT they could not do any work. We now have a heart of flesh, not of stone. We no longer serve the 'letter but the Spirit.
There are changes all round but the same basic law....
just doing things different thanks to Jesus Christ !

 

[Dan_473]

Dan, God healing us is no ordinary work !

Right! I think the letter of the law says, "do no work".

and in the NT we can do 'good works of God on the Sabbath.

Yes! we do the works of God on the Sabbath.

We do the works of God everyday.

We work for ourselves no days of the week.

 

[beta]

You must understand ... those of1 disciplemike's pursuasion reject many of Paul's writings .

I wouldn't know about that. I don't reject what Paul says but he is 'hard to understand on some things and misunderstood, giving rise to erronious beliefs.

 

[disciplemike]

I wouldn't know about that. I don't reject what Paul says but he is 'hard to understand on some things and misunderstood, giving rise to erronious beliefs.

right, and by lawless men, according to Peter.

 

[disciplemike]

You must understand ... those of1 disciplemike's pursuasion reject many of Paul's writings .

Nope, I reject the misunderstanding of Paul's writings.
Paul kept the Sabbath and the dietary laws and the Feast Days of God!

 

[Dan_473]

The HS will tell us to keep the law/commandments 'different in the NT - it will not tell you to reject the law. Jesus kept His Fathers Commandments, but different from the OT.
A heart of stone could not absorb them but a heart of flesh can ! God did not abolish the law - He changes US so we can do it with the love and grace of Christ.

right, we don't reject the law, we fulfill it.


how do you believe "The HS will tell us to keep the law/commandments 'different in the NT"? how will it be different, in your view?

 

[beta]

say beta,

what's up with the apostrophes before words?

like, "a 'burning desire" Are you using them to add emphasis?

YES.....does it annoy you ? I will try and refrain from doing so in posts to you.

 

[beta]

right, we don't reject the law, we fulfill it.


how do you believe "The HS will tell us to keep the law/commandments 'different in the NT"? how will it be different, in your view?

Just follow Jesus' example ! (does that explain ?)

 

[Dan_473]

Of course we do. We are now created in Christ Jesus unto 'good works. In the OT they could not do any work. We now have a heart of flesh, not of stone. We no longer serve the 'letter but the Spirit.
There are changes all round but the same basic law....
just doing things different thanks to Jesus Christ !

"We no longer serve the 'letter but the Spirit."

yes, that's it... and we fulfill the spirit of the law by loving our neighbor.

 

[beta]

Right! I think the letter of the law says, "do no work".
Yes! we do the works of God on the Sabbath.

We do the works of God everyday.

We work for ourselves no days of the week.

Why do you have to spoil what God says by adding your own opinion ?
Of course you have to earn a living, money for your own use.
You are not asked to assemble before God every day of the week.

Let's just stick to the Sabbath being holy....for a start....then we can move on.

 

[abcdef]

circumcision was one of the physical works among many others given through Moses.
But the 10 Commandments were given by GOD personally Deut 5v22 and were a separate law apart from any other...that is what makes them different.

Did Moses make up the laws?

ALL the laws are God's word, there is no difference.

Didn't God personally give to Moses the laws for the priesthood and the sacrifices?

Laws for the tabernacle? Laws for circumcision?

The 10 commandments are shadows of Jesus,

The 7th day Sabbath rest, the circumcision of the flesh, the tabernacle/temple laws, diet laws, rituals, holy days,

All are shadows of Jesus.

They are all part of the old covenant, of the blood of sheep and goats,

If you want to keep part of it,

You must keep all of it.

Gal 5:4, "Christ is become of no effect unto you,

whosoever of you are justified by the law;

ye are fallen from grace."
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