TALK The tree of the knowledge of good and evil, the flesh and the life of the spirit

[StEpHman]

27 So God created human beings in his own image. In the image of God he created them; male and female he created them. Gen 1:27 (NLT)





Now the man and his wife were both naked, but they felt no shame. Gen 2:25

15 The Lord God placed the man in the Garden of Eden to tend and watch over it.16 But the Lord God warned him, “You may freely eat the fruit of every tree in the garden—17 except the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. If you eat its fruit, you are sure to die.” Gen 2:15-17 (NLT)

Then she gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it, too.7 At that moment their eyes were opened, and they suddenly felt shame at their nakedness. So they sewed fig leaves together to cover themselves. Gen 3:6-7 (NLT)




22 Then the Lord God said, “Look, the human beings have become like us, knowing both good and evil. What if they reach out, take fruit from the tree of life, and eat it? Then they will live forever!”23 So the Lord God banished them from the Garden of Eden, Gen 3:22-23 (NLT)

Do you think that God made man to know both good and evil when he created them in the beginning, male and female before they partook of the tree and sinned?

Why do you think the man and woman felt no shame being naked?

Why did God say that "you will surely die" after saying not to eat of the tree?

Do you think the tree was a literal tree or not if yes please your answer if not explain your answer?

After the and the woman ate the fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil the 'eyes' of the man and the woman were opened and they felt shame what do you think this means?

If God made man and woman in his image why does it appear as though the man and the woman attained something more from the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil?

After the man and the woman eat the fruit why is the man and the woman stopped from eating from the tree of life after eating the tree of the knowledge of good and evil?

NOTE: YOU DONT HAVE TO ANSWER ALL THE QUESTIONS AT ONCE OR IN ORDER. THIS THREAD IS JUST FOR SIMPLE ASSERTION ON MY PART SO THAT I CAN GET MY THOUGHTS OUT THERE TO SOMEBODY ELSE AND BLESS SOMEBODY WITH WHAT GOD HAS GIVEN ME. Feel free to discuss and chat and have fun!

Stef

 

[oldhermit]

The tree of life is at the forefront of a developind discontinuity between man and his association with forbidden things. When man is unconstrained by revelation, he quite naturally draws conclusions based upon how he relates to the world around him. Man allows what he experiences to influence how he defines what is relevant. Once man learns to link the natural to the eternal, he learns to represent human events in quite a different way. One cannot build a triadic picture of reality based upon experiential logic. Human rationalization operating on its own cannot properly context the relationship of man to the natural world. Building a triadic picture of reality is only possible when one learns to represent human experience in the light of revelation. To do this, one must allow revelation to transcend experiential logic.

There is an example of triadic structure that demonstrates how the natural world and the supernatural world relate to one another in the eternal continuum. At the beginning of man’s history in the garden, the tree of life and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil were mentioned in the context of man’s relationship both to God and to the natural world. The text never seems to indicate that in the beginning there was any prohibition to the tree of life but that man was only denied access to the tree of knowledge. It was not until after the fall of man that God placed an angel with a flaming sword at the east of the garden to prohibit man’s access to the tree of life. The way in which Adam chose to represent these trees would reflect his understanding of his association with both God and the natural world. As the narrative unfolds, it becomes clear that access to the tree of life was predicated upon man’s observance of the divine prohibition of the other. Man was to have absolutely no contact with the tree of knowledge. God had provided every tree of the garden for man’s use and pleasure, but this tree was to be left strictly alone. These two trees stand as symbols of a world beyond man’s sensory existence. The tree of forbidden knowledge represents the holiness, the superiority, and the sovereignty of God. It suggests that God always reserves unto Himself the things that belong exclusively to him. It is not merely the tree that has exclusivity, but what that tree represents. As a whole, man is never content to abide by prohibitions. Here, he desires the one thing he is denied. How characteristic this has proven to be of human nature!

Although man was given the highest place of honor as the crowning creation of God and dominion over all creation, this tree was a reminder that even man is not God. Man must stand in the index position of this triad and link the tree of knowledge that he can see to the will of God whom he cannot see. He must also link this tree to revealed consequences that he cannot see and has never before experienced. For man to properly relate to both worlds he must learn to link the eternal world to his world by bringing God’s warning to bear upon his relationship to this tree. He must learn how to define the nature of his relationship to this tree based on what God had told him about it. Now, this epistemology did not just apply to this tree but extended to everything in man’s dominion. He must understand his relationship to all of his domain based upon this triadic epistemology. God had already defined his function in creation and man must relate to his world according to the words of the Lord.


From the beginning, man was confronted with a decision in his association with this icon of good and evil. This tree was a symbol of an unseen reality. There is a particular type of knowledge man was not equipped to handle and should not seek to obtain. The accessibility of the tree shows that man was given the ability to obtain this knowledge. The prohibition laid down by God says that this knowledge is destructive to man. This reinforces man’s position as a subordinate creature to what is unseen. God had said, “From this tree of the knowledge of good and evil, you shalt not eat of it; for in the day that you eat from it, you shall surely die.” Here is a divine standard given to instruct man on how to think when he considers this tree. Since God has decreed that punishment will follow disobedience, the validity of God’s word is upheld. Divine judgment preserves divine justice because it is through the exercise of justice that God protects his holiness. Observance of this revelation becomes a matter of life and death. The ethics were simple; God said, “Don’t touch it.” This did not require a human analysis of ethics to decide what might be the right thing to do. Contact with the tree was evil both because God said it was evil, and because of what man would suffer as a result.

We know, because of how this tree is interpreted by the physical senses in the text that man, left on his own, could not arrive at this conclusion. Adam could not see what the tree represented. He could only see the physical dynamics of the tree. For the rest, he must rely upon what God had told him about the tree. Man requires instruction from God to protect him from that which he has no point of reference to understand. As the Creator, God understood things about the nature of man and his relationship to his environment that man did not know and was not created to know. Man was not endowed with the capacity to distinguish between good knowledge and evil knowledge. This truth has not changed. The knowledge provided by this tree was not a necessary component for man to fulfill his role within his assigned environment.

The environment of the garden supplied every conceivable human need. He was even given access to the tree of life. The garden was a secure environment where man had no experience with fear, shame, and disgrace. These were yet unknown elements. It was an aesthetic environment where God controlled access to knowledge. There were certain things that man knew by design, but the prohibition of the tree says that there were those things which man should never want to know or seek to know.

In the garden, man enjoyed the presence of God and the full awareness of God. God knew that through disobedience man would be exiled from this controlled and protected environment and from his fellowship with God. By violating God’s prohibition, man challenged the sovereignty of God. Man does not have the authority to mandate a standard of moral conduct. The text of Genesis shows us that this level of knowledge belongs exclusively to God. Because man chose to behave sinfully, he is now confronted with a new reality. Adam is now aware of a particular type of knowledge that will forever change the way mankind represents the relationship he has with the natural world and with his God. It also laid a foundation by which humanity would forever be forced to choose between these two epistemologies. Should we represent reality based on revelation from God or should we rely on those things learned from pragmatic experiences? Which one will we depend upon to tell us the truth about what is relevant?

Now, man has access to the knowledge of good and evil. This presents two problems: First, man does not know the difference between good and evil and secondly, history shows us that when man is left to his own, he will more often than not choose the evil to his own destruction, even when revelation is present. In Genesis 6:5, we see that by the time Noah comes on the scene, “every imagination of the thoughts of the heart is only evil continually,” (RSV). The fact that revelation was available to that generation is evident in the character of Noah. God regarded Noah as “righteous in his generation.” Righteousness is the result of submitting one’s self to revealed constraints. This deterioration of a divinely established ethic shows a complete reversal of a revealed epistemology. This is what happens when the mind of man becomes isolated from the revelation of God. This isolation was willful, deliberate, and fatal. When man is left to himself without a desire for revealed knowledge, he is characteristically self-destructive. If man is to survive spiritually in a cursed environment, it will require a standard that will enable him to represent properly his assigned place within creation.

When Satan approached Eve in the garden, he confronts her about the tree of knowledge. Eve rehearsed the commandment that God had given to them about this tree saying, “from the fruit of the trees of the garden we may eat, but of the tree that is in the midst of the garden you may not eat from it or touch it lest you die.” This represents a revealed language structure about certain truths concerning this tree that she could not know any other way. Satan then introduced a new way of thinking about what is true. He portrays this revealed grammar as unreliable and not to be trusted. “You shall not surely die for God knows that in the day you eat from it your eyes will be opened and you will be like God knowing good and evil.” The idea obviously appealed to Eve but the force of the temptation was more than just a desire to be like God. This new way of representing truth offered a means by which control could be shifted from God to man.

She relies upon an unrevealed method for making decisions. Rather than consulting God and relying upon revelation which, by her own admission she understood, she relies instead upon her five senses operating in this natural world to formulate her epistemological base. She “rationalizes” why it would be acceptable to eat that which had been forbidden. This reveals a distorted ethic in the misappropriation of things thatbelong to God. She contemplated stealing that which belongs to God and then attempted to justify the rightness of it in her own mind.

Satan’s temptation was two-fold based upon the decision matrix of the woman. This would imply that Satan understood something of the psychology of the woman and he capitalizes on her naiveté. Experientially, Eve knows nothing of Satan, temptation, evil, craftiness, the pain of disobedience, or death. The serpent creates doubt in her mind about the motives, character, and purpose of God. He accused God of lying and planted the seed of evil ambition. “God knows that in the day you eat of it you will become like God.” The reality was that she was already like God. He creates suspicion in the mind of the woman by implying that God is deliberately withholding something from her that is both desirable and beneficial. It implies that, 1) man is just as good as God is, 2) God is unjust in this prohibition, and 3) man has the right to be God. This is a challenge of God’s sovereignty. At the heart of this, is the question of who has the right to be in control? Who has the right to decide what is best for man? A worldly epistemology says that man has the wisdom to decide what is best for him. A revealed epistemology says that God not only knows what is best he is also able to supply it.

Satan then makes an appeal to the empirical and aesthetic observation. Eve saw that the fruit was good for food and was pleasing to the eye. He also appeals to the subjective impulse; it was desirable to make one wise, which the text defines as knowing good from evil. Where then was the sin? The sin was allowing human logic and rationalization to overrule the revelation of God. This is a propensity of humanly derived standards of ethics. The decision was made by appealing to an uninspired epistemology rather than to the words of the Lord. Human logic and rationalization are not valid determinants for deciding what is right or wrong. God said, “Don’t touch it.” This alone determines what is right or wrong.

 

[StEpHman]

Hello oldhermit

Your reply is quite detailed and in length, not what i was expecting, however i appreciate the response nonetheless.

Second paragraph, closer to the end you said that 'man was never content to abide by prohibitions.' In the garden man was given the prohibition of not touching the tree go knowledge, there is no sign of man not wanting to do what God said not to do until the devil in the form of a serpent came and interrupted Gods work by tempting Eve and ultimately this led to Adams demise as well. Man was perfectly fine until the devil came to play.

 

[StEpHman]

You said 'Man was not endowed with the capacity to distinguish between good knowledge and evil knowledge. This truth has not changed. The knowledge provided by this tree was not a necessary component for man to fulfill his role within his assigned environment.' - Man didn't have a 'knowledge of good and evil' until he partook of the tree yes.

You also said, 'There were certain things that man knew by design, but the prohibition of the tree says that there were those things which man should never want to know or seek to know.' - Might i add that man didn't know 'good and evil' until th entree was eaten and then he attained knowledge of what only God held. The difference between God and man is that God holds the ability to restrain and not do evil because he in nature is holy and righteous but man with this knowledge was not able to restrain from doing evil or good and infact in these times man choose constantly to do what was evil all the time and God was grieved in his heart because of such things.

 

[twofeet]

I will try keep my answer simple...as I am lol

God told Adam not to eat of the tree before He made Eve, it was a direct command to him. Thats why it was easier to deceive Eve as she hadnt heard it first hand by asking the all important question "did God really say?" ...putting doubt in her head. You can see how God deals with Adam differently to Eve AND Satan...after all, he never told Satan not to eat of it but God dealt with his part in it too as he did with Eve.Adam DELIBERATELY went against something God told him not to do. Eve was just stupid and was deceived in her stupidity which is different to deliberate sin. sin is passed on through the male and as we all have a mum and dad we all have original sin...except Jesus of course.

God gave Adam 99% of the garden to eat from cos He is a loving God but didnt want robots so gave a choice. Love, which is gods nature, is always a choice. Wouldn't be nice to have a partner love you cos they had no choice, always feel SO much better if they did it cos they wanted to.

The reason why they didnt "see" each other or notice they were naked was because they were filled with the Holy spirit and his glory as God originally designed. Imagine Jesus on Mt Transfiguration where every pore of his skin was radiating the light from within. I guess its hard to notice anything else. When they sinned they lost that so they could see with their natural eyes and nothing else as they had just killed their spiritual awareness. In that, the felt guilt, shame, an understanding of seperation from God. Not a nice feeling.

Was it a literal tree? I guess so, cant see why not as God gave them fruit to eat. It was only after Noah did God give them animals to eat, I guess cos all the trees weren't in such good shape after the flood so food was scarce for a while.

God out of His love drove them out the garden to contain sin for THIS lifetime only. Man has been appointed ONCE to die and then the judgement. If they had ate of the tree of life after they had sin we would have a big problem on our hands. They didnt need to keep eating of the tree of knowledge...they had killed the spirit and was now living from the mind, their own sense of right and wrong, in essence they became their own god. This is why Jesus died at Golgotha, the place of the SKULL to signify their needs to be a switch back to the spirit. Stop being your own God, die to SELF and put God back in His rightful place. If you loose your life for his sake you will find it.

 

[StEpHman]

God did tell Adam thats true and Eve didn't receive a direct command not eat of the tree thats right but Eve did know somehow not to eat of the tree, "God did say that we must not eat of the tree..."
Both Adam and Eve are punished differently and if we look a little closer the Lord didn't actually punish satan, the serpent was punished and remember it was eve that said, "it was the serpent who deceived me" The judgements God hands down to all three are very interesting when looked at in detail.
Eve wasn't stupid, Eve was tempted and taken advantage of and if it were not for satan using a serpent to deceive and trick Eve i think things would have turned out differently. Which leads me to my next question.

After all that occurs up until the fall why did God actually allow these events to take place? Why is satan around anyway and why is he interrupting Gods creation and tempting Eve to do what God said not to do?

God did give everything to them to eat that was good for food. Theres not much of a choice here but mind you there was not much to say no to either! They had it pretty good and walked in a real living paradise of pleasure. I don't think that the man and woman was given a choice, i believe they were given a command which they broke in the end after being tempted. They had no choice and were to do only what God commanded them not to do, they had a free choice to eat any and everything else except that one and only tree. There was free will but God is sovereign.

The way i think about them being cast out of paradise is because God had pronounced his judgement on the man and the woman, the man was to now get food for himself by himself and by the 'sweat of his brow' and even when he did this the ground was 'cursed' to produce thorns and thistles! God had provided everything the man and woman ever needed for food and now God takes it away from them both and denies them access to his bounty and to the tree of life. Gods judgement is in effect the moment they stepped out of line here and now they're both on their own.

Thanks for your answer twofeet. Its great to hear what other people have to say and have a discussion.

 

[MidniteWelder]

God did tell Adam thats true and Eve didn't receive a direct command not eat of the tree thats right but Eve did know somehow not to eat of the tree, "God did say that we must not eat of the tree..."
Both Adam and Eve are punished differently and if we look a little closer the Lord didn't actually punish satan, the serpent was punished and remember it was eve that said, "it was the serpent who deceived me" The judgements God hands down to all three are very interesting when looked at in detail.
Eve wasn't stupid, Eve was tempted and taken advantage of and if it were not for satan using a serpent to deceive and trick Eve i think things would have turned out differently. Which leads me to my next question.

After all that occurs up until the fall why did God actually allow these events to take place? Why is satan around anyway and why is he interrupting Gods creation and tempting Eve to do what God said not to do?

God did give everything to them to eat that was good for food. Theres not much of a choice here but mind you there was not much to say no to either! They had it pretty good and walked in a real living paradise of pleasure. I don't think that the man and woman was given a choice, i believe they were given a command which they broke in the end after being tempted. They had no choice and were to do only what God commanded them not to do, they had a free choice to eat any and everything else except that one and only tree. There was free will but God is sovereign.

The way i think about them being cast out of paradise is because God had pronounced his judgement on the man and the woman, the man was to now get food for himself by himself and by the 'sweat of his brow' and even when he did this the ground was 'cursed' to produce thorns and thistles! God had provided everything the man and woman ever needed for food and now God takes it away from them both and denies them access to his bounty and to the tree of life. Gods judgement is in effect the moment they stepped out of line here and now they're both on their own.

Thanks for your answer twofeet. Its great to hear what other people have to say and have a discussion.

In order to gain a full understanding start at the beginning.
God teaches us precept upon precept.

Isaiah 28

9Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. 10For precept must be on precept, precept on precept; line on line, line on line; here a little, and there a little:

This is how he created us in his design us to learn. We wouldnt be able to handle everything all at once because it would be too much to process in the flesh since we are not fully spirit yet.
For instance one cannot jump straight to comprehending calculus before first learning the fundamentals of mathematics.

Ask yourself...Who was the first to Mock God? Then the answers may start coming little by little and tying everything together once you ask God to offer knowledge and wisdom as much as he will allow.
Then theres some things I dont believe God wants people talking about because he still has a few things up his sleeve in preparation for Satan which should not be revealed. (dont want your enemy knowing your plan, dont wanna show all your cards if you know what I mean.)

 

[nathan3]

Do you think that God made man to know both good and evil when he created them in the beginning, male and female before they partook of the tree and sinned?

These are not my complete thoughts on it, but maybe; you can see clear.


One thing for sure. It wasn't time yet. The serpent that forced that situation .


Why do you think the man and woman felt no shame being naked?

Simply they didn't know they were naked. It was after, that they had took of the forbidden fruit ,that they realized this.



Why did God say that "you will surely die" after saying not to eat of the tree?

It was a warning that they would die. He says what He means. And means what He says.
But keep in mind what Christ taught .How its nothing that enters a man that defiles him. But what comes from the heart out, from withing a man's heart and thoughts: Mark 7: 21



Do you think the tree was a literal tree or not if yes please your answer if not explain your answer?



The Hebrew is very specific . Also, the other teachings of God and Christ, show that there is more to the story . When taken in all together, then it becomes clear. But that takes a Christian that has maturity .

There are literal trees in the Garden. There are symbolic trees too.

Mark 8:24

King James Version (KJV)

24 And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking.

Christ was able to open the eyes of the blind man. But, though he was physically blind, his spiritual eyes where open. To the truth.He could see, men as trees.

The Assyrian here is likened to a tree. Ezek 31:7 The Assyrian is likely another type, or name, for Satan taking in all that is written there . If you have eyes to see you an see.

None was like satan in beauty, such that it caused envy. What kind of trees envy? Ezek 31:7 ...


Trees are used also as the symbol or a type of man; Christ is saying more than He is saying in words.


Rom 11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

You may be a tree grafted into the kingdom -

Rom 11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?

Or you may be a branch of the natural tree re-grafted to God’s family -

Jude 1:12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;

These trees are supposed to bear fruit!

James 3:12 Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh.

There will be imitation trees. Be careful! Look at what Matthew has to say about trees

Matt 3:10 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Matt 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Matt 12:33 Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.

This fruit comes from having Gods word in your heart better said, mind.

Rev 7:1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.

Here begins the sequence for deception of the last days

And the sealing of those with the truth who are His children. In the first seal of Revelation .


Isa 61:1-3 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound; 2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn; 3 To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they might be called treesof righteousness, the planting of the LORD, that he might be glorified.

Look also at the trees of the wood; forest; field in Isa 7:2; 10:19; 44:14 and 55:12
But don't touch the tree in Genesis , of Good and Evil .


After the and the woman ate the fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil the 'eyes' of the man and the woman were opened and they felt shame what do you think this means?

Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.

Your knowledge in part is within the Hebrew this was translated from. Use your Strong's Concordance to research the word touch as used here in Gen 3:3 ( Index - King James Bible with Strongs Dictionary - SpeedBible by johnhurt.com ) Following the subject


If God made man and woman in his image why does it appear as though the man and the woman attained something more from the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil?
Because they did. they attained knowledge of evil . Or at least, their eyes'' were open to it. Form the Hebrew.

After the man and the woman eat the fruit why is the man and the woman stopped from eating from the tree of life after eating the tree of the knowledge of good and evil?

You'll have to show the scripture for this verse that your talking about.

This is not complete. but some of these scriptures and Hebrew words might help you.

 

[StEpHman]

Im inclined to not believe that God made man in his image 'with' a knowledge of good and evil because 'At that moment their eyes were opened, and they suddenly felt shame Gen 3:7 (NLT)' And “Who told you that you were naked?” the Lord God asked. “Have you eaten from the tree whose fruit I commanded you not to eat?” Gen 3:11 (NLT) And Then the Lord God said, “Look, the human beings have become like us, knowing both good and evil. What if they reach out, take fruit from the tree of life, and eat it? Then they will live forever!”23 So the Lord God banished them from the Garden of Eden Gen 3:22-23 (NLT)
This is my argument in a nut shell.

Its wasnt time yet. As in wast time to eat the fruit? The serpent did force the incident to arise and he took advantage of eve the woman with deception and actually caused the fall of man.


There was no shame because they had no knowledge of good or evil. The knowledge of good or evil either caused them to hide something that was 'evil' namely being naked or hide something that was 'good' namely being naked but this was something that they didnt want to show and be exposed, their nakedness for some reason was not worth showing and so they hid and sowed fig leaves to hide their nakedness. Before this incident they had no recognition that being naked was either right or wrong, we cant tell what they thought about being naked but the fruit most definitely 'opened' their eyes and they hid as a result.


God said death would be the consequence of eating the fruit perhaps because God knew that although man with an attained knowledge of good and evil he did not have the capacity within himself to maintain righteousness and do good but instead would do evil always and all the time and we find this to be true in the coming chapters from chapter 3 before the flood God is appalled at the sight and extent of mans wickedness because they are thinking and doing evil always and all the time. Then the Lord said, “My Spirit will not put up with humans for such a long time Gen 6:3 (NLT) And The Lord observed the extent of human wickedness on the earth, and he saw that everything they thought or imagined was consistently and totally evil.6 So the Lord was sorry he had ever made them and put them on the earth. It broke his heart.7 And the Lord said, “I will wipe this human race I have created from the face of the earth. Yes, and I will destroy every living thing—all the people, the large animals, the small animals that scurry along the ground, and even the birds of the sky. I am sorry I ever made them.”8 But Noah found favor with the Lord. Gen 6: Man was made in Gods image but this image did not include the extra kit and caboodle of 'knowing' evil and good like God himself knew and this is why we see a massive shift and changes take place once they eat the fruit from the tree. Once attaining the 'knowledge' the fall of man was imminent for although the 'knowledge' or shall we say 'knowhow' of good and evil was in the mind there was no ability or discernment that came with that knowledge to 'know' what not to do which was evil which man did until God was grieved at the sight of the creaion of man that god had made and so started again with Noah.


The word touch in the hebrew can find the implication of ones hand being stretched forth and the fingers being placed onto an object of desired acquirement for the taking, holding, smelling, eating, having holding and own for on self or taking for oneself.


Although God made the man and woman in his own image this image did not contain the 'knowledge of good and evil' but was added through the tree. Therefore man did not know good and evil and this has many implications.


Here the man and woman take the fruit and eat it. The woman was convinced. She saw that the tree was beautiful and its fruit looked delicious, and she wanted the wisdom it would give her. So she took some of the fruit and ate it. Then she gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it, too.7 At that moment their eyes were opened, and they suddenly felt shame at their nakedness Gen 3:6-7 (NLT)
Here God banishes the man and woman from the tree of life and refuses the man and woman the right to live forever. Then the Lord God said, “Look, the human beings have become like us, knowing both good and evil. What if they reach out, take fruit from the tree of life, and eat it? Then they will live forever!”23 So the Lord God banished them from the Garden of Eden Gen 3:22-23 (NLT)

The implication of this case is that God made man in his own image 'male and female' God created them and they were good in every way. When they partook of the fruit they now condemned themselves because they now possessed something they had no restraint on which a knowledge of good and evil, doing evil all the time or just in one instance like cain when he killed his brother this same knowledge is a good example of what happens when the man has this knowledge, the man was doomed to commit evil unlike God who is unable to do evil and yet held a knowledge of good and evil. The distinction between God and man at this time was that God was able to hold this knowledge and not do evil and but man was able to hold this knowledge and "not" do evil but do evil and sin and this fall from the glory of God just like Satan fell. God cut off the mans opportunity to not only be made in his own image with a knowledge of good and evil but also to have that knowledge and do evil and good and also live forever. God cut off forever a man who would do evil and live forever, infact that person would not live but die and return to the dust but God would remain forever. There are very stark parallels here with satan if one looks into these things. The scenario maybe compared with satans fall and existence.

Nathan3


Thanks for the input. What do you think?

 

[nathan3]

Im inclined to not believe that God made man in his image 'with' a knowledge of good and evil because 'At that moment their eyes were opened, and they suddenly felt shame Gen 3:7 (NLT)' And “Who told you that you were naked?” the Lord God asked. “Have you eaten from the tree whose fruit I commanded you not to eat?” Gen 3:11 (NLT) And Then the Lord God said, “Look, the human beings have become like us, knowing both good and evil. What if they reach out, take fruit from the tree of life, and eat it? Then they will live forever!”23 So the Lord God banished them from the Garden of Eden Gen 3:22-23 (NLT)
This is my argument in a nut shell.


[/B][/I]The implication of this case is that God made man in his own image 'male and female' God created them and they were good in every way. When they partook of the fruit they now condemned themselves because they now possessed something they had no restraint on which a knowledge of good and evil, doing evil all the time or just in one instance like cain when he killed his brother this same knowledge is a good example of what happens when the man has this knowledge, the man was doomed to commit evil unlike God who is unable to do evil and yet held a knowledge of good and evil. The distinction between God and man at this time was that God was able to hold this knowledge and not do evil and but man was able to hold this knowledge and "not" do evil but do evil and sin and this fall from the glory of God just like Satan fell. God cut off the mans opportunity to not only be made in his own image with a knowledge of good and evil but also to have that knowledge and do evil and good and also live forever. God cut off forever a man who would do evil and live forever, infact that person would not live but die and return to the dust but God would remain forever. There are very stark parallels here with satan if one looks into these things. The scenario maybe compared with satans fall and existence.

Nathan3


Thanks for the input. What do you think?

I think your avoiding something ( because your not calling to memory , key, events within those passages. And I don't know why.) I don't see how anyone can understand them when anything is omitted. but I really can't help much more then. because I'm not Bible teacher.