That thou are Peter

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Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
#1
Upon what 'rock' did Jesus say he will build his church in Matthew 16:18 and how was it revealed unto you?



"And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter,
and upon this rock I will build my
church[SUP]*[/SUP];
and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."











 

FlSnookman7

Senior Member
Jun 27, 2015
1,125
135
63
#2
[TABLE="class: bibleTable, width: 614"]
[TR]
[TD]Mat 16:15[/TD]
[TD]He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
Mat 16:16[/TD]
[TD]And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
Mat 16:17[/TD]
[TD]And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
Mat 16:18[/TD]
[TD]And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.


[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


As always context is key, it was peter's faith that Jesus was indeed God that Jesus said He would build His church upon, not peter himself.
 
Jan 15, 2011
736
28
28
#3
The Rock was the revelation that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God.
Upon this rock of revelation, Jesus builds His church. The Rock is always Jesus :)
 

wattie

Senior Member
Feb 24, 2009
3,052
1,032
113
New Zealand
#4
Yeah.. the words for rock are two different ones for Peter and rock. This rock-- the larger rock.. Peter.. the little rock. So they are seperate. This means Jesus is building His church. He is building it Himself.

He isn't building it on Peter.

His church is also the local and visible assembly of saved baptised believers. The singular 'church' representing all churches plural that Jesus calls His own.
 
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Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
#5
[TABLE="class: bibleTable, width: 614"]
[TR]
[TD]Mat 16:15[/TD]
[TD]He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
Mat 16:16[/TD]
[TD]And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
Mat 16:17[/TD]
[TD]And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
Mat 16:18[/TD]
[TD]And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.


[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


As always context is key, it was peter's faith that Jesus was indeed God that Jesus said He would build His church upon, not peter himself.
Right, context is key.

13 When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?
14 And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.
15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
Matt 16:13-15

Then charged he his disciples that they should tell no man that he was Jesus the Christ. John 6:70

Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
2 Cor 3:3
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#6
His name stone (Peter) was given to typify all the believers that make up the bride of Christ, the spiritul house of God, the church.

1Peter 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.


It was used in the same as one of the the "think not" verses. I will offer below. The Jews were replacing the work of our Father in heaven and attributing the authority to believe God to the flesh of Abraham, rather than walking by faith. In doing so they committed blasphemy.

Matthew 3:9 And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,426
3,479
113
#7
[TABLE="class: bibleTable, width: 614"]
[TR]
[TD]Mat 16:15[/TD]
[TD]He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
Mat 16:16[/TD]
[TD]And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
Mat 16:17[/TD]
[TD]And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
Mat 16:18[/TD]
[TD]And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.


[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


As always context is key, it was peter's faith that Jesus was indeed God that Jesus said He would build His church upon, not peter himself.
Yes having Faith on Jesus is the Rock which will save anyone who stands on that faith..
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,213
6,548
113
#8
Let Peter himself tell us.......


Acts 4:8) Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel,
9 .) If we this day be examined of the good deed done to the impotent man, by what means he is made whole;
10 .) Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
11 .) This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
12 .) Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

And, waaaaaaaaayyyyy back when the Psalms were written.....

Psalms 118:21)
I will praise thee: for thou hast heard me, and art become my salvation.
22 .) The stone which the builders refused is become the head stone of the corne
 

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
#9
Let Peter himself tell us.......
69 Now Peter sat without in the palace: and a damsel came unto him, saying, Thou also wast with Jesus of Galilee.
70 But he denied before them all, saying, I know not what thou sayest.
71 And when he was gone out into the porch, another maid saw him, and said unto them that were there, This fellow was also with Jesus of Nazareth.
72 And again he denied with an oath, I do not know the man.
Matthew 26:69-72
And, waaaaaaaaayyyyy back when the Psalms were written.....

Psalms 118:21) I will praise thee: for thou hast heard me, and art become my salvation.
22 .) The stone which the builders refused is become the head stone of the corne
118:22 The stone which the builders refused is become the head stone of the corner.
118:23 This is the LORD's doing; it is marvellous in our eyes.

42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
44 And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken:[Luke 8:6] but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder. [Luke 8:13]
 
Aug 19, 2016
721
3
0
#10
Upon what 'rock' did Jesus say he will build his church in Matthew 16:18 and how was it revealed unto you?



"And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter,
and upon this rock I will build my
church[SUP]*[/SUP];
and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."



The Rock Peter would build Jesus Church, is Jesus.


Quasar92













[/QUOTE]
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#11
That Peter sure was a "chip off the ole block".
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#12
-
The Greek word for Peter in Matt 16:18 is petros, which is a masculine noun.
The word for the rock in Matt 16:18 is petra, which is the feminine version of
the same noun.

It seems strange to me that Jesus would change Peter's gender if he was
still talking about the apostle when he said "upon this rock". Wouldn't it
make more sense to say upon this petros I will build my church instead of
saying upon this petra?

Grammatically, it would make even better sense to say "upon you I will build
my church".

FYI: Jesus also said that the gates of the netherworld wouldn't prevail
against his church.

At some time during Jonah's nautical adventure, he went to a place called
sheol (Jonah 2:3) which is the Hebrew equivalent of the Greek word haides;
translated netherworld in in Matt 16:18.

Jonah sited the netherworld at the roots of the mountains. (Jonah 2:7).

Well, needless to say, mountains aren't rooted in the tummies of fish,
rather, they're rooted deep in the earth; which is the very same place to
which the Lord retired during his demise. (Ps 16:8-10, Matt 12:40, Acts
2:25-31)

The gates that Jesus spoke of are called bars in Jonah's adventure. (Jonah
2:7)

In other words: though Jonah was alive in the fish at some time during his
adventure (Jonah 2:2) he wasn't alive the whole time because people don't
enter the netherworld as whole men, rather, they enter it as dead men. In
point of fact, Jonah 2:7 speaks of his resurrection.

The point is: Though a percentage of Jesus' sheep will have to pass away
and part company with their body at some point in their lives, none of them
will stay disembodied forever.

John 6:40 . . For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who sees the
Son and believes in him may have eternal life, and I shall raise him [on] the
last day.

John 6:44 . . No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draw
him, and I will raise him on the last day.

John 11:25 . . I am the resurrection and the life; whoever believes in me,
even if he dies, will live.

1Cor 15:51 . . Behold, I tell you a mystery. We shall not all fall asleep, but
we will all be changed, in an instant, in the blink of an eye, at the last
trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised incorruptible,
and we shall be changed. For that which is corruptible must clothe itself with
incorruptibility, and that which is mortal must clothe itself with immortality.

Neither Matt 16:18, nor any of the other passages I quoted allow for losses.
In other words; were the Roman Catholic Church the church that Jesus
spoke of, no Catholics, not even one, would ever be in danger of the second
and final death spoken of at Rev 20:10-15.

But of course that is not the case because when Catholics pass away with
un-absolved mortal sins on the books, they go straight to hell with no
stopover in a purgatory.

CCC 1035 . .The teaching of the Church affirms the existence of hell and its
eternity. Immediately after death the souls of those who die in a state of
mortal sin descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell,
eternal fire.” The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in

/
 
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F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#13
Strongs: pétra (a feminine noun) – "a mass of connected rock," which is distinct from (pétros) which is "a detached stone or boulder"
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#14
The Greek word for Peter in Matt 16:18 is petros, which is a masculine noun.The word for the rock in Matt 16:18 is petra, which is the feminine version ofthe same noun.

It seems strange to me that Jesus would change Peter's gender if he wasstill talking about the apostle when he said "upon this rock". Wouldn't it make more sense to say upon this petros I will build my church instead ofsaying upon this petra?

Grammatically, it would make even better sense to say "upon you I will build
my church".
Thanks for sharing that good point.

My two cents.

In a spiritual sense, I would offer that Peter as a new creature represents the whole new creation, the bride of Christ as one of the lively stones that make up his bride, the spiritual house of God. It could be reason to why the feminine gender. Petra the male gender represents Christ our husband .His incorruptible seed work in a heart gives birth the many little lively stones.

1Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
5,977
400
83
63
#15
It is claimed that Christ turned headship of the Church
over to Peter and his successors. that men rule in place
of Christ, as head of the Church.

Now, since it is claimed that the rock on which the Church
was founded refers to Peter—and not Christ—notice the true
meaning, as originally written by Matthew. Matthew wrote in
the Greek language

Then Jesus added: “And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter”
(Greek inspired original word, Petros, meaning a stone),

“and upon this rock” (Greek inspired original word, petra, meaning a
ledge or shelf of rock or a crag) “I will build my church …” (Matthew 16:18).

-
Peter was also called Cephas (Greek Képhas, from the Aramaic Kêpha).
In John 1:40-42 is related how Andrew, Simon Peter’s brother, found Peter,
and brought him to Jesus. “And when Jesus beheld him, he said,

Thou art Simon the son of Jona: thou shalt be called Cephas,
which is by interpretation, a stone”

The English word stone is translated from the Greek word petros,
meaning a single stone or loose stone. Also the Greek word Kephas
means such a stone, referring definitely to a human man.

when Jesus said “upon this rock I will build my church” (Matthew 16:18),
the Greek word, as written originally by Matthew, was not either Kephas
or petros, but petra, which means a large massive rock.

a few other passages where this same Greek word petra is used.
In Matthew 7:24, Jesus spoke of the man who built his house on a rock.
The Greek word is petra

In Matthew 27:60, it is stated that the tomb in which Jesus
was buried, after the crucifixion, was hewn out in the rock —
in the petra! This is a mass of rock, not a single stone.

The Greek petra cannot mean the human Peter, but the,glorified Christ!
Speaking of the Israelites under Moses, in the wilderness, Paul writes:
“… for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them:
and that Rock was Christ” (1 Corinthians 10:4).

In plain language, then, that petra was Christ—but the
smaller stone, petros, or Kephas, was Simon Peter.

Behold, I lay in Sion [the Church] a chief corner stone, elect, precious:
and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded. Unto you therefore
which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone
which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,

And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offense, even to them which stumble
at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed”
(1 Peter 2:6-8).

In the above passage Peter is speaking to the Church.
He quoted from Isaiah 28:16: “Therefore thus saith the Lord
God, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation, a stone, a tried
stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation”!

This pictures Christ as that foundation of the Church, on which it
is built. God’s Church was built on the ROCK (its foundation),
Christ—not on the stone, Peter

The Church is described in Ephesians 2:20 as being “built upon the
foundation of the apostles and prophets [including Old Testament prophets],

Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone.”

“For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid,
which is Jesus Christ” (1 Corinthians 3:11)

“I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee” (Hebrews 13:5)He is shown
in Revelation 1:13, 18 to be the living Head, spiritually in the midst of the Church.

“Christ is the head of the church”! (Ephesians 5:23). Read it
also in Ephesians 4:15; 1:22; Colossians 1:18; 2:19.

He has been the living Head and High
Priest of the true Church, which He built.

It was on the day of Pentecost, a.d. 31. On that day, Christ, as He had
promised (John 16:7),sent the Holy Spirit to enter into His disciples,
thus baptizing—or plunging them into, the Church.

The word church comes from the Greek ekklesia, which means congregation
of people. The Church of God consists of people—thebegotten children of God.
It consists of—and only of—those who have been begotten of God by having received His Holy Spirit.

So it was Jesus Christ, who went to heaven, and sent God’s
Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost, who founded the Church.

-

For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ.
14 No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.
15 Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves
as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,213
6,548
113
#16
69 Now Peter sat without in the palace: and a damsel came unto him, saying, Thou also wast with Jesus of Galilee.
70 But he denied before them all, saying, I know not what thou sayest.
71 And when he was gone out into the porch, another maid saw him, and said unto them that were there, This fellow was also with Jesus of Nazareth.
72 And again he denied with an oath, I do not know the man.
Matthew 26:69-72

118:22 The stone which the builders refused is become the head stone of the corner.
118:23 This is the LORD's doing; it is marvellous in our eyes.

42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
44 And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken:[Luke 8:6] but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder. [Luke 8:13]

Yes..........???

?????????

(scratching my head)
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#17
His words are life. That's how the church is built
 
Jan 27, 2013
4,769
18
0
#18
Upon what 'rock' did Jesus say he will build his church in Matthew 16:18 and how was it revealed unto yo

"And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter,
and upon this rock I will build my
church[SUP]*[/SUP];
and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."











acts 10
.28 And he said to them, "You yourselves know how unlawful it is for a Jew to associate with or to visit anyone of another nation, but God has shown me that I should not call any person common or unclean.

acts 15

Acts 15: The Jerusalem Council
1 But some men came down from Judea and were teaching the brothers, "Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved

5 But some believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees rose up and said, "It is necessary to circumcise them and to order them to keep the law of Moses."


10 Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?11 But we believe that we will be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they will."Acts 15




70 ad.

42 And he commanded us to preach to the people and to testify that he is the one appointed by God to be judge of the living and the dead.43 To him all the prophets bear witness that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name."


6 he says:
"It is too light a thing that you should be my servant
to raise up the tribes of Jacob
and to bring back the preserved of Israel;
I will make you as a light for the nations,
that my salvation may reach to the end of the earth."Isaiah 49: The Servant of the LORD


a god through jesus. etc

For God So Loved the World
16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.John 3