The 4 accounts at the tomb

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Mar 13, 2010
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#1
I have come across some scripture that I am having a bit of a problem understanding, thought i would try and start a discussion on it to make it a bit clearer.

In each Gospel there are 4 y different accounts of Mary at the tomb,. In John Mary travels alone and speaks to Jesus whom she thinks is a gardener at first, while in Matthew both Mary's visit the tomb and see an Earthquake and an angel spoke to them. the accounts also differ in Luke and Mark quite drastically

As many believe that the bible is the literal truth,That what is written is physical truth.Then how can we deem this so when there are 4 conflicting accounts of the one event. And what consequences does that bring to our view of Jesus, If the authors of the Gospels interpreted this event differently how can we say with certainty that everything else Jesus did actually happened as written and not just the authors interpretation of an event which is quite different to that which physically happened ?
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#2
John centers on Mary Magdalene, but does not rule out others being present. Matthew Mark and Luke all agree on Mary Magdalene's presence.There is a difference between different witnesses accounting different details and having conflicting stories.
 
Mar 13, 2010
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#3
John centers on Mary Magdalene, but does not rule out others being present. Matthew Mark and Luke all agree on Mary Magdalene's presence.There is a difference between different witnesses accounting different details and having conflicting stories.
The stories are conflicting,John 20:12 Mary does not enter the tomb, but there are two angels sitting inside while Mark writes in Mark 16:5 that the women enter the tomb and meet one young man in there

Mark 16:8 the women remain silent,and tell no-one what happened Luke 24:9 and Matthew 28:8 they go and tell the disciples what happened and in John 20:10-11 Mary stays and cries while the others leave.

They time in which they arrive at the tomb vary greatly, They events surrounding the stone, Matthews account explains that they saw an Earthquake which rolled the stone away and in the rest the stone is already gone.

So the accounts are clearly conflicting. and not just different details of the one event
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#4
The stories are conflicting,John 20:12 Mary does not enter the tomb, but there are two angels sitting inside while Mark writes in Mark 16:5 that the women enter the tomb and meet one young man in there

Mark 16:8 the women remain silent,and tell no-one what happened Luke 24:9 and Matthew 28:8 they go and tell the disciples what happened and in John 20:10-11 Mary stays and cries while the others leave.

They time in which they arrive at the tomb vary greatly, They events surrounding the stone, Matthews account explains that they saw an Earthquake which rolled the stone away and in the rest the stone is already gone.

So the accounts are clearly conflicting. and not just different details of the one event
Not really. John doesn't report the detail of them entering, but does not discount them. The initial silence of the women does not discount the telling of it later that morning. No problem with Mary returning to the area or Christ coming to her. All four of them begin the narrative early in the morning. The seeing of the one angel and then the seeing of the two are two different events. No real discrepencies, just different details.
 
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AgeofKnowledge

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#5
I really like Dr. William Lane Craig's published work on this topic. He addresses this in layman's language in 'The Case for Christ' by Lee Strobel on pages 214-223.
 
Mar 13, 2010
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#6
here is a comparison of all texts from the NLT


Matthews account.

1 Early on Sunday morning,[a] as the new day was dawning, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary[went out to visit the tomb.

2 Suddenly there was a great earthquake! For an angel of the Lord came down from heaven, rolled aside the stone, and sat on it. 3 His face shone like lightning, and his clothing was as white as snow. 4 The guards shook with fear when they saw him, and they fell into a dead faint.

5 Then the angel spoke to the women. “Don’t be afraid!” he said. “I know you are looking for Jesus, who was crucified. 6 He isn’ t here! He is risen from the dead, just as he said would happen. Come, see where his body was lying. 7 And now, go quickly and tell his disciples that he has risen from the dead, and he is going ahead of you to Galilee. You will see him there. Remember what I have told you.”

8 The women ran quickly from the tomb. They were very frightened but also filled with great joy, and they rushed to give the disciples the angel’s message. 9 And as they went, Jesus met them and greeted them. And they ran to him, grasped his feet, and worshiped him. 10 Then Jesus said to them, “Don’t be afraid! Go tell my brothers to leave for Galilee, and they will see me there.”

[UJohn,s account[/U]

Early on Sunday morning,[a] while it was still dark, Mary Magdalene came to the tomb and found that the stone had been rolled away from the entrance. 2 She ran and found Simon Peter and the other disciple, the one whom Jesus loved. She said, “They have taken the Lord’s body out of the tomb, and we don’t know where they have put him!”

3 Peter and the other disciple started out for the tomb. 4 They were both running, but the other disciple outran Peter and reached the tomb first. 5 He stooped and looked in and saw the linen wrappings lying there, but he didn’t go in. 6 Then Simon Peter arrived and went inside. He also noticed the linen wrappings lying there, 7 while the cloth that had covered Jesus’ head was folded up and lying apart from the other wrappings. 8 Then the disciple who had reached the tomb first also went in, and he saw and believed—9 for until then they still hadn’t understood the Scriptures that said Jesus must rise from the dead. 10 Then they went home.
11Mary was standing outside the tomb crying, and as she wept, she stooped and looked in]. 12 She saw two white-robed angels, one sitting at the head and the other at the foot of the place where the body of Jesus had been lying[/B]. 13 “Dear woman, why are you crying?” the angels asked her.

“Because they have taken away my Lord,” she replied, “and I don’t know where they have put him.”

14 She turned to leave and saw someone standing there. It was Jesus, but she didn’t recognize him. 15 “Dear woman, why are you crying?” Jesus asked her. “Who are you looking for?”

She thought he was the gardener. “Sir,” she said, “if you have taken him away, tell me where you have put him, and I will go and get him.”

16 “Mary!” Jesus said.

She turned to him and cried out, “Rabboni!” (which is Hebrew for “Teacher”).

17 “Don’t cling to me,” Jesus said, “for I haven’t yet ascended to the Father. But go find my brothers and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

18 Mary Magdalene found the disciples and told them, “I have seen the Lord!” Then she gave them his message.

Luke's account

1 But very early on Sunday morning[a] the women went to the tomb, taking the spices they had prepared. 2 They found that the stone had been rolled away from the entrance. 3 So they went in, but they didn’t find the body of the Lord Jesus. 4 As they stood there puzzled, two men suddenly appeared to them, clothed in dazzling robes.

5 The women were terrified and bowed with their faces to the ground. Then the men asked, “Why are you looking among the dead for someone who is alive? 6 He isn’t here! He is risen from the dead! Remember what he told you back in Galilee, 7 that the Son of Man must be betrayed into the hands of sinful men and be crucified, and that he would rise again on the third day.”

8 Then they remembered that he had said this. 9 So they rushed back from the tomb to tell his eleven disciples—and everyone else—what had happened. 10 It was Mary Magdalene, Joanna, Mary the mother of James, and several other women who told the apostles what had happened. 11 But the story sounded like nonsense to the men, so they didn’t believe it. 12 However, Peter jumped up and ran to the tomb to look. Stooping, he peered in and saw the empty linen wrappings; then he went home again, wondering what had happened.

Marks account

Saturday evening, when the Sabbath ended, Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James, and Salome went out and purchased burial spices so they could anoint Jesus’ body. 2 Very early on Sunday morning,[a] just at sunrise, they went to the tomb. 3 On the way they were asking each other, “Who will roll away the stone for us from the entrance to the tomb?” 4 But as they arrived, they looked up and saw that the stone, which was very large, had already been rolled aside.

5 When they entered the tomb, they saw a young man clothed in a white robe sitting on the right side. The women were shocked, 6 but the angel said, “Don’t be alarmed. You are looking for Jesus of Nazareth, who was crucified. He isn’t here! He is risen from the dead! Look, this is where they laid his body. 7 Now go and tell his disciples, including Peter, that Jesus is going ahead of you to Galilee. You will see him there, just as he told you before he died.”

8 The women fled from the tomb, trembling and bewildered, and they said nothing to anyone because they were too frightened.[c]

As you can see the stories conflict on numerous counts,
 
Mar 13, 2010
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#7
I really like Dr. William Lane Craig's published work on this topic. He addresses this in layman's language in 'The Case for Christ' by Lee Strobel on pages 214-223.
Thanks for information. I will try and find the book and have a look :)
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#8
I have the texts laid out side by side. Again, what I see is seperate accounts with separate details, but no conflict.

I looked at what you have posted and at your profile. I see you have missionary as a special interest. It didn't seem to gel with your posts. If it isn't to personal, may I ask what precepated this post. You have only posted a few times over a long period.
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#10
Try this:
1. Matthew 28:1 and Mark 16:1
2. Matt. 28:2-4
3. Matt. 28:5-8, Mark 16:2-8, Luke 24:1-8, and John 20:1
4. Luke 24:9-11, John 20:2-10
5. Mark 16:9-11, John 20:11-18
6. Matt. 28:9-10
7. Matt. 28:11-15
8. Mark 16:12-13, Luke 24:13-32
9. Luke 24:33-35
10. Mark 16:14, Luke 24:36-43, John 20:19-25
11. John 20:26-21:25
12. Matt 28:16-20, Mark 16:15-18
13. Luke 24:44-46
 
Mar 13, 2010
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#11
I have the texts laid out side by side. Again, what I see is seperate accounts with separate details, but no conflict.

I looked at what you have posted and at your profile. I see you have missionary as a special interest. It didn't seem to gel with your posts. If it isn't to personal, may I ask what precepated this post. You have only posted a few times over a long period.
The details aren't separate, In one Account Jesus himself spoke to Mary and in the rest it was angels. that is a different event. Mary see's an earthquake first hand in Matthew and on the rest the stone is already rolled back. these are different events and not details missed.

I don't think these events are wrong or the fact that they conflict each other disproves the bible in anyway, I strongly believe that the bible is God inspired and the accounts are meant to be there. I have been having a particular problem between a literal view of the bible and an interpretative view of the bible.

I don't post often because most topics are covered on the site I do read the forums regularly. Its only when i have a particular problem or feel i have a good answer that i post my view or ask my questions.

And yeah i have a particular interest in missionary as well as ministry.
 
Mar 13, 2010
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#12
Try this:
1. Matthew 28:1 and Mark 16:1
2. Matt. 28:2-4
3. Matt. 28:5-8, Mark 16:2-8, Luke 24:1-8, and John 20:1
4. Luke 24:9-11, John 20:2-10
5. Mark 16:9-11, John 20:11-18
6. Matt. 28:9-10
7. Matt. 28:11-15
8. Mark 16:12-13, Luke 24:13-32
9. Luke 24:33-35
10. Mark 16:14, Luke 24:36-43, John 20:19-25
11. John 20:26-21:25
12. Matt 28:16-20, Mark 16:15-18
13. Luke 24:44-46
I will have a look. Thanks
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#13
The details aren't separate, In one Account Jesus himself spoke to Mary and in the rest it was angels. that is a different event. Mary see's an earthquake first hand in Matthew and on the rest the stone is already rolled back. these are different events and not details missed.

I don't think these events are wrong or the fact that they conflict each other disproves the bible in anyway, I strongly believe that the bible is God inspired and the accounts are meant to be there. I have been having a particular problem between a literal view of the bible and an interpretative view of the bible.

I don't post often because most topics are covered on the site I do read the forums regularly. Its only when i have a particular problem or feel i have a good answer that i post my view or ask my questions.

And yeah i have a particular interest in missionary as well as ministry.
In John, Mary sees the two angels and then turns around to see Jesus.
The literal interpretation is simply two steps: What did the original human author intend to say to the original audience. Then, what is God saying to us.
One of the issue is that we have a different view of history. I am not sure that they were as worried about aligning the details as we are. Interestingly enough, if they did report exactly the same details, the scoffers would accuse them of collaberation.
 
Mar 13, 2010
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#14
In John, Mary sees the two angels and then turns around to see Jesus.
The literal interpretation is simply two steps: What did the original human author intend to say to the original audience. Then, what is God saying to us.
One of the issue is that we have a different view of history. I am not sure that they were as worried about aligning the details as we are. Interestingly enough, if they did report exactly the same details, the scoffers would accuse them of collaberation.
Lol, it does seem likely. Thanks for your views on the subject. I will check out the book that was recommended see if that can shed any more light on the subject:)
 
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Shwagga

Guest
#15
In John, Mary sees the two angels and then turns around to see Jesus.
The literal interpretation is simply two steps: What did the original human author intend to say to the original audience. Then, what is God saying to us.
One of the issue is that we have a different view of history. I am not sure that they were as worried about aligning the details as we are. Interestingly enough, if they did report exactly the same details, the scoffers would accuse them of collaberation.
Good answers, thank you.
 

VW

Banned
Dec 22, 2009
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#16
What we often overlook in examining these accounts is that they were all written after the event, and not just a few years. But even when realizing this, it should also be remembered that what we are reading is the Holy Spirit's recalling of the event, as He is the One who inspired each writer in his retelling. What is so wonderful about how there are differences is that it shows just how individual God is in dealing with us, because as He brings to remembrance the event to each writer, we see the personal touch in each one. The accounts do not disagree as much as they are seen by four different men filled with the Holy Spirit.

Blessings,
vic
 

VW

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Dec 22, 2009
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#17
I believe that it is also important to remember that John's account was the last to be written. John was an incredible man of God, and the Holy Spirit chose to reveal many things through him that are not in the other gospel accounts. To be realistic about the event of His resurrection, there were only a few people there, Mary, Jesus, and some angels. Not Matthew, not Luke, nor Mark, nor even John were there for the actual time when Mary went to check on the grave.

I think that it is important to also realize that the bible does not have to agree according to our human understanding. If one would scoff at the bible because of a supposed contradiction, they would scoff even if there were no contradictions. And in fact, they do scoff at the bible, saying how can a book be written by God? But we know the truth, because as we read, the Spirit witnesses to us in our hearts with God's voice, and we know.