The Babe In The Manger

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Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#21
Some specifically say that Mary contributed nothing, not even her ovum. That view seems quite off, to me
Since the conception of Jesus was totally supernatural, no one should have the temerity to speculate about this matter.
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
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#22
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Continued From Post No.17

Matt 2:3-4 . . And when Herod the king heard it, he was troubled, and all
Jerusalem with him. And gathering together all the chief priests and scribes
of the people, he began to inquire of them where the Christ was to be born.

Right about here I got a bit curious. Why would Herod think that the king
the wise men sought was predicted in the Bible? It seems to me that in
order for Herod to be thinking that way, he'd have to be aware of Daniel's
famous seventy-week prophecy. (Dan 9:24-27)

Well, after a bit of checking, I discovered that Herod took an interest in the
Jews' religion and was somewhat learned in it. In point of fact, Herod at this
time was upgrading the Temple.

The chief priests and scribes, being Old Testament experts, were for sure
aware of Daniel's prophecy and I'll just bet that they and their forbearers
had been keeping track of Daniel's timeline all along and thus probably not
all that surprised when rumors of a Christ started cropping up in their day.

Well; anyway, Herod asked the wrong question. According to Matt 2:2, baby
Jesus was already born; in fact, born even before the wise men left their
country. So then, knowing where Israel's new king was to be born was a
long shot that he'd still be there. The question Herod should have asked is:
Where might the boy be now?

NOTE: Jesus' hometown Nazareth was predicted by the prophets (Matt 2:23)
but not recorded by the prophets; which alerts us to the fact that the
prophets didn't put everything they knew down in writing. That was
fortunate because sure enough Herod's death squads would've swept that
area too had he known.

After an audience with Herod, the wise men departed; still guided by their
star.

Matt 2:9 . . After they had heard the king, they went on their way, and the
star they had seen in the east went ahead of them.

And then it stood right over the very address where Jesus was lodged.

Matt 2:9 . . It stopped over the place where the child was.

The place was a house rather than a stable.

Matt 2:11a . . On coming to the house

It's difficult to calculate the boy's age when the wise men arrived; however
one thing we know for sure it was their understanding that the king they
sought was already born even before they left home to seek him. We know
that because their inquiry contains some past tense grammar in Matt 2:2.

There's no telling how long after Jesus' birth that the men departed their
country to search for him. Plus, there were no motorized conveyances back
then; and people normally didn't travel at night because their artificial
lighting was pretty much limited to torches, candles, and oil-fired lanterns.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
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#23
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Matt 2:11b . . They saw the child with his mother

When Jesus was lodged in the stable, the Greek word for his age is given as
brephos (bref'-os): an infant. In the house, the word for his age is given as
paidion (pahee-dee'-on) which refers to any underage kid from infancy to
adolescence but usually always refers to young children rather than infants.

I won't hazard a guess as to Jesus' age by the time the men arrived to see
him, but I'm thinking he was at the very least no longer in a bassinet.

Matt 2:11c . . and fell down, and worshipped him:

The koiné Greek word for "worship" is proskuneo (pros-koo-neh'-o). It's kind
of a funny word because it basically pictures a dog licking its master's hand;
i.e. homage, reverence, and/or adoration; viz: definitely subordination.

Now if these guys knew their stuff-- I think we can safely assume so --then
they didn't come all the way from the east seeking another run-of-the-mill
king of the Davidic dynasty, rather; a very special potentate that would one
day rule not just the land of Israel; but the entire planet, viz: everybody.

Dan 7:13-14 . . In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was
one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the
Ancient of Days and was escorted into His presence.

. . . He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all peoples, nations
and men of every language worshipped him. His dominion is an everlasting
dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is the one that will never
be destroyed.

Well; let the record show that the wise men were the very first to begin
fulfilling that scene; viz: "all peoples, nations and men of every language
worshipped him".
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,201
976
113
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#24
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Matt 2:11-12 . .Then they opened their treasures and presented him with
gifts of gold and of incense and of myrrh.

Those were not only appropriate tributes in that day, but also valuable
commodities that Joseph could put to use in financing his family's pending
sojourn in Egypt. (Matt 2:13-14)

It would've been fun if Matthew had told us the weight of the gold so we
could put a dollar figure on it according to today's precious metals.

Matt 2:11-12 . . And having been warned in a dream not to go back to
Herod, they returned to their country by another route.

That was a safety measure to prevent Herod from knowing where to find the
lad because rulers in that day were typically Machiavellian-- they didn't just
crush potential threats to their power; they utterly annihilated it; and as
subsequent events demonstrate, ol' Herod had neither conscience nor
concern for child welfare.

Matt 2:16a . .Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked of the wise
men, was exceeding wroth

There's really nothing in the story to even remotely suggest that the wise
men had made a fool out of Herod. It was all in his own mind, i.e. his own
perception of the events. In other words; Herod was under the impression
that they had mocked him; thus his reaction was stimulated by a false
premise.

Matt 2:16b . . He sent forth, and slew all the children that were in
Bethlehem, and in all the coasts thereof, from two years old and under,
according to the time which he had diligently inquired of the wise men.

The Greek word for "coasts" is a mite ambiguous. It technically indicates
borders, but can also indicate regions.

That verse is commonly appropriated to calculate Jesus' age relative to when
the wise men visited him and his mother. But the verse merely indicates the
passage of time since Herod interviewed the men; which is quite useless for
calculating Jesus' age seeing as how he was already born before the men
even left their country-- how long before they left their country, nobody
knows for sure.

Matt 2:17-18 . .Then what was said through the prophet Jeremiah was
fulfilled: "A voice is heard in Ramah, weeping and great mourning, Rachel
weeping for her children and refusing to be comforted, because they are no
more." (Jer 31:15)

Ramah was roughly six miles north of Jerusalem, while Bethlehem is roughly
the same distance south in the opposite direction.

Ramah was settled by the people of Rachel's biological son Benjamin, so that
any weeping done by the mothers in that area would be reckoned, by heritage,
to be Rachel's weeping.

What this suggests to me is that the slaughter of the innocents extended
beyond the community of Bethlehem. Were we to set a draftsman's compass
to a radius equal to the distance between Bethlehem and Ramah, and scribe
a circle with Bethlehem at the center, it would yield a pretty good idea of the
area covered by Herod's death squads.

But Herod's efforts were futile. Jesus wasn't even in the country; Joseph had
moved the child and his mother down into Egypt before all the killing
began. (Matt 2:13)
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,201
976
113
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#25
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Happy Holidays everyone! and don't be ashamed to be known as a Christian.
We sure don't want the Lord giving us the same look that he gave Peter on
the night Jesus was arrested.

"The Lord turned and looked straight at Peter. Then Peter remembered the
word the Lord had spoken to him: Before the rooster crows today, you will
disown me three times. And he went outside and wept bitterly."
(Luke 22:61-62)
_