The Error of KJV-Onlyism
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Many find fault and error in Jesus, but it does not mean they are right.
Those who follow Jesus and say He is perfect does not mean they are dishonest.
The same is true for the Communicated Word of God, like Scripture.
As for your so-called errors in the KJV:
First, even if they were errors in the KJV, we are not talking about gross intentional errors like in Modern Bibles. The supposed errors in the KJV do not affect any doctrine (unlike the Modern Bibles). Either your mind is closed to looking at the changed doctrines in Modern Bibles, or you simply are not aware of them. Second, any supposed errors in the KJV are very minor. In other words, I see folks swallow gnats (minor things) in the KJV and yet they swallow a camel (i.e., they accept certain false doctrines in Modern Bibles). Three, there are many great KJV apologetics and supposed contradictions I discovered early on in my faith in the KJV that were resolved later. I prayed and waited upon the LORD and He gave me understanding later in His timing. But you and others are quick to see error in God's Holy Word because that is what you desire to see. You don't want there to be a perfect Word of God and so you desire to see error to fit your preconceived belief. Many in your camp mock us and say there is no verse in the Bible that refers directly to the KJV. Well, there is not one that refers to the Vaticanus and Sinaiticus directly, either. Neither is there a verse that refers to Textual Criticism or Only the Originals are inspired. You will not find such statements in Scripture.
Those who follow Jesus and say He is perfect does not mean they are dishonest.
The same is true for the Communicated Word of God, like Scripture.
As for your so-called errors in the KJV:
First, even if they were errors in the KJV, we are not talking about gross intentional errors like in Modern Bibles. The supposed errors in the KJV do not affect any doctrine (unlike the Modern Bibles). Either your mind is closed to looking at the changed doctrines in Modern Bibles, or you simply are not aware of them. Second, any supposed errors in the KJV are very minor. In other words, I see folks swallow gnats (minor things) in the KJV and yet they swallow a camel (i.e., they accept certain false doctrines in Modern Bibles). Three, there are many great KJV apologetics and supposed contradictions I discovered early on in my faith in the KJV that were resolved later. I prayed and waited upon the LORD and He gave me understanding later in His timing. But you and others are quick to see error in God's Holy Word because that is what you desire to see. You don't want there to be a perfect Word of God and so you desire to see error to fit your preconceived belief. Many in your camp mock us and say there is no verse in the Bible that refers directly to the KJV. Well, there is not one that refers to the Vaticanus and Sinaiticus directly, either. Neither is there a verse that refers to Textual Criticism or Only the Originals are inspired. You will not find such statements in Scripture.
Actually, it does. If you have any basic understanding about how statistical probabilities work, you would know that such Mathematical miracles in the Bible are not random chance or meaningless discoveries.
Not true.
Uh, I was referring to the English word "LORD." This word is the 1611th mention of LORD and it just so happens to take place in Deuteronomy 16:11.
There is so much more to this discovery than you realize. I would recommend checking out Brandon Peterson's video below.
Watch the video, and then tell me it is a lie.
Do you believe the apostles had a completed Bible?
When do you believe the Bible came into existence?
Also, nowhere did I claim that verse numbers are a part of the original text.
That does not mean God has not moved with the times and helped His people to have them.
Yes, I know. The verse numbers were added by a man, but I believe God was involved because we see too many unexplanable patterns involving such things. Take for example chapter numbers. I know that Exodus 33 is the chapter God shows His back parts to Moses because there are 33 bones in our spine. Revelation 13:18 talks about counting as a part of wisdom and the mark of the beast (666). Is it just another coincidence that the 666th chapter also talks about counting as a part of wisdom? (See: Ecclesiastes 7). And it doesn't stop. You could keep going on this stuff for a very long time. No other book has such Mathematical miracles on the level that the KJV has.
The Bible as it exists today (the KJV) has chapter and verse numbers in it. Most Bibles do. In fact, I do have biblical grounds to count because that is what Revelation 13:18 tells you to do.
Revelation 13:18 (KJV)
"Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six."
It says to him who has the understanding to count. Understanding of counting. You are supposed to know that the number of a man is already 6 and that is what makes up the number 666. Read Revelation 13:18 in the KJV several times in prayer, and get back to me. You will not see it unless your mind is open to what the text says.
First, you spelled it wrong. It's Mount Fengari and not Mount Fenagri.
Second, according to various websites on Greece, it says it is 1,611 meters high.
https://www.mountainsgreece.com/feggari-2/?t
https://youingreece.com/samothraki/saos?t
Acts 16:11, points ahead to the 1611 translation and the island he stopped by had a mountain on it that was 1, 611 meters high.
That's three 1611s.
My bad, I should have said, “Neapolis” as the end destination and the geodesic line continues beyond that to England.
I am not claiming verse numbers are inspired. However, we can see the hand of God upon them because of the many Mathematical miracles attached to them. Facts are facts. You can ignore them if you like.
Rudolf is a German anti-Semitic scholar who created a Revised Hebrew text based on unorthodox Hebrew manuscripts (i.e., The Hebrew Ben Asher manuscripts). Rudolf’s work is called the Biblia Hebraica (BHK), a critical edition of the Hebrew, which was published in 1906, subsequently revised and renamed as the Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia (1977), and now the Biblia Hebraica Quinta (2004). Rudolf was not a Christian, but he was a German rationalist. Rudolf did not believe in the inerrancy of Scripture. He used the Ben Asher Text instead of the Ben Chayyim Text to create his Hebrew text. This Hebrew text is the basis of the Old Testament Modern English bible translations we have today (Note: Kittel’s work is updated, but it was not radically changed - See this article here). Compared to Rudolf’s work vs. the traditional received text that King James Bible uses, there are thousands of changes in the Old Testament. Now, Gerard Kittel (who is the younger brother of Rudolf Kittel) edited the 10-volume standard reference work used in the N.T. Greek word studies entitled "Theological Dictionary of the New Testament.” Almost without exception, all translations, including the NIV translators, relied on and referred to Kittel for his judgment when selecting words in their translation.
Gerhard Kittel joined the Nazi party in 1933 and, the same year, began working on his 10-volume Greek Word Theological Dictionary until completed in 1944. At this time, he was taking a leadership role in the Nazi organization and became a key contributor to their propaganda journal. He wrote six of the eight volumes before publication was cut short by the end of the war. He was Hitler's hired man. He recommended in his writings that all German Jews be dismissed from their jobs, stripped of their German citizenship, and their property confiscated. Kittel was tried, convicted, and imprisoned for his key part in the extermination of two-thirds of Europe's Jewish population. It is amazing that this was hidden from those who were seeking Greek definitions from a 10-volume set of books penned during the time of a Jewish-hating Nazi. Unfortunately, this 10-volume set appears in the majority of the pastors’ libraries today. [6.]
Nope. I copy and pasted the words of the KJV from BIblehub.com into a word counter. This KJV is the Pure Cambridge Edition many Christians believe is the final purified KJV.
Not true.
Uh, I was referring to the English word "LORD." This word is the 1611th mention of LORD and it just so happens to take place in Deuteronomy 16:11.
There is so much more to this discovery than you realize. I would recommend checking out Brandon Peterson's video below.
Watch the video, and then tell me it is a lie.
Do you believe the apostles had a completed Bible?
When do you believe the Bible came into existence?
Also, nowhere did I claim that verse numbers are a part of the original text.
That does not mean God has not moved with the times and helped His people to have them.
Yes, I know. The verse numbers were added by a man, but I believe God was involved because we see too many unexplanable patterns involving such things. Take for example chapter numbers. I know that Exodus 33 is the chapter God shows His back parts to Moses because there are 33 bones in our spine. Revelation 13:18 talks about counting as a part of wisdom and the mark of the beast (666). Is it just another coincidence that the 666th chapter also talks about counting as a part of wisdom? (See: Ecclesiastes 7). And it doesn't stop. You could keep going on this stuff for a very long time. No other book has such Mathematical miracles on the level that the KJV has.
The Bible as it exists today (the KJV) has chapter and verse numbers in it. Most Bibles do. In fact, I do have biblical grounds to count because that is what Revelation 13:18 tells you to do.
Revelation 13:18 (KJV)
"Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six."
It says to him who has the understanding to count. Understanding of counting. You are supposed to know that the number of a man is already 6 and that is what makes up the number 666. Read Revelation 13:18 in the KJV several times in prayer, and get back to me. You will not see it unless your mind is open to what the text says.
First, you spelled it wrong. It's Mount Fengari and not Mount Fenagri.
Second, according to various websites on Greece, it says it is 1,611 meters high.
https://www.mountainsgreece.com/feggari-2/?t
https://youingreece.com/samothraki/saos?t
Acts 16:11, points ahead to the 1611 translation and the island he stopped by had a mountain on it that was 1, 611 meters high.
That's three 1611s.
- a straight line from Traos to Samothrace doesn't go anywhere near England! it goes close to Copenhagen!
View attachment 261350 [/QUOTE]
My bad, I should have said, “Neapolis” as the end destination and the geodesic line continues beyond that to England.
I am not claiming verse numbers are inspired. However, we can see the hand of God upon them because of the many Mathematical miracles attached to them. Facts are facts. You can ignore them if you like.
Rudolf is a German anti-Semitic scholar who created a Revised Hebrew text based on unorthodox Hebrew manuscripts (i.e., The Hebrew Ben Asher manuscripts). Rudolf’s work is called the Biblia Hebraica (BHK), a critical edition of the Hebrew, which was published in 1906, subsequently revised and renamed as the Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia (1977), and now the Biblia Hebraica Quinta (2004). Rudolf was not a Christian, but he was a German rationalist. Rudolf did not believe in the inerrancy of Scripture. He used the Ben Asher Text instead of the Ben Chayyim Text to create his Hebrew text. This Hebrew text is the basis of the Old Testament Modern English bible translations we have today (Note: Kittel’s work is updated, but it was not radically changed - See this article here). Compared to Rudolf’s work vs. the traditional received text that King James Bible uses, there are thousands of changes in the Old Testament. Now, Gerard Kittel (who is the younger brother of Rudolf Kittel) edited the 10-volume standard reference work used in the N.T. Greek word studies entitled "Theological Dictionary of the New Testament.” Almost without exception, all translations, including the NIV translators, relied on and referred to Kittel for his judgment when selecting words in their translation.
Gerhard Kittel joined the Nazi party in 1933 and, the same year, began working on his 10-volume Greek Word Theological Dictionary until completed in 1944. At this time, he was taking a leadership role in the Nazi organization and became a key contributor to their propaganda journal. He wrote six of the eight volumes before publication was cut short by the end of the war. He was Hitler's hired man. He recommended in his writings that all German Jews be dismissed from their jobs, stripped of their German citizenship, and their property confiscated. Kittel was tried, convicted, and imprisoned for his key part in the extermination of two-thirds of Europe's Jewish population. It is amazing that this was hidden from those who were seeking Greek definitions from a 10-volume set of books penned during the time of a Jewish-hating Nazi. Unfortunately, this 10-volume set appears in the majority of the pastors’ libraries today. [6.]
Nope. I copy and pasted the words of the KJV from BIblehub.com into a word counter. This KJV is the Pure Cambridge Edition many Christians believe is the final purified KJV.
This is old news. Get the book, “Don’t Passover Easter“ by Bryan C. Ross.
https://www.amazon.com/Dont-Passover-Easter-Defense-Acts/
It makes a great case for how William Tyndale invented the word “Passover.” Before that time, Easter was the word that was used in English.
https://www.amazon.com/Dont-Passover-Easter-Defense-Acts/
It makes a great case for how William Tyndale invented the word “Passover.” Before that time, Easter was the word that was used in English.
@posthuman
I apologize for not mentioning Neapolis. But I did not mentiion the actual end destination. You assumed the end destination was Samothracia when that is not the case. They merely stopped at Samothracia along the way. Samothracia is the island which has Mount Fengari on it (Which is 1,611 meters high).
I apologize for not mentioning Neapolis. But I did not mentiion the actual end destination. You assumed the end destination was Samothracia when that is not the case. They merely stopped at Samothracia along the way. Samothracia is the island which has Mount Fengari on it (Which is 1,611 meters high).
And you are correct. Kavala is the current city that used to be the ancient city of Neopolis.
https://www.perplexity.ai/search/Is-Kavala-Greece-ySPkNQgKTTKBix7dQCH6yQ
https://www.perplexity.ai/search/Is-Kavala-Greece-ySPkNQgKTTKBix7dQCH6yQ
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@posthuman
Three people gave positive reps to your post that supposedly corrected what I said on my one post defending the KJV. However, I have shown your facts are wrong. In other words, they did not do their own homework in fact-checking what you said. This is why when I present evidence to defend the KJV, it rarely ever is considered or looked at. Sometimes folks are desperate to accept anything, even if it is false because they don't like the idea of a perfect Word of God.
Now, granted, my side has been guilty of not fact-checking things. But this is not always the case. For example: Incorrect statements made by Gail Riplinger have been corrected by David Cloud (Another KJV believer). However, what disturbs me is that your side does not really have any good biblical evidence to defend your statements, and then you attack us as if we do not have any Bible verses to defend our position (When in fact we do and have given them multiple times). Also, to be fair: A weakness by my fellow KJV-only brethren is that they say the KJV is easy to understand and they put the number of archaic words at a lower amount. They say even children can read the KJV. Yes, i am sure to a degree they can, but there are 4, 144 uncommon (archaic) words in the KJV listed by Dr. D. A. Waite (Which is available in book form). But lke all fields of study, they have their own terms. If you are an airline mechanic, you will learn many words that is geared towards that field. If you learned 12 archaic words in the KJV a day, it would help you to know them before a year. But your side makes it more difficult because many have told me that you have to learn the Biblical Hebrew and Greek in order to get the true meaning on God's words (Which are dead languages). Granted, I am not saying there is no advantage in looking to the original languages on rare occasion; It just should not be done to explain away what the word says in the English in our Bibles (Which is what I have seen often from your side). They act like the KJV translators were stupid when they did not even fact-check their credentials. One person today who does not even know these languages acts like they know more than certain KJV translators who did know these languages. So again, they are not looking at all the facts. They want to slice and dice God's Word to fit their belief and understanding.
Side Note:
I am Core KJV and not KJV-only. The KJV is my core foundational text, and it is the perfect and inerrant words of God. But I am not against using Modern Bibles at times to draw meaning out of the 1600s English in the KJV. But Modern Bibles teach false doctrines and so they cannot always be trusted. I look at Modern Bibles like I would a dictionary. Sometimes the wording fits, and sometimes it doesn’t. One has to read the context, look at cross references, and pray about it.
Three people gave positive reps to your post that supposedly corrected what I said on my one post defending the KJV. However, I have shown your facts are wrong. In other words, they did not do their own homework in fact-checking what you said. This is why when I present evidence to defend the KJV, it rarely ever is considered or looked at. Sometimes folks are desperate to accept anything, even if it is false because they don't like the idea of a perfect Word of God.
Now, granted, my side has been guilty of not fact-checking things. But this is not always the case. For example: Incorrect statements made by Gail Riplinger have been corrected by David Cloud (Another KJV believer). However, what disturbs me is that your side does not really have any good biblical evidence to defend your statements, and then you attack us as if we do not have any Bible verses to defend our position (When in fact we do and have given them multiple times). Also, to be fair: A weakness by my fellow KJV-only brethren is that they say the KJV is easy to understand and they put the number of archaic words at a lower amount. They say even children can read the KJV. Yes, i am sure to a degree they can, but there are 4, 144 uncommon (archaic) words in the KJV listed by Dr. D. A. Waite (Which is available in book form). But lke all fields of study, they have their own terms. If you are an airline mechanic, you will learn many words that is geared towards that field. If you learned 12 archaic words in the KJV a day, it would help you to know them before a year. But your side makes it more difficult because many have told me that you have to learn the Biblical Hebrew and Greek in order to get the true meaning on God's words (Which are dead languages). Granted, I am not saying there is no advantage in looking to the original languages on rare occasion; It just should not be done to explain away what the word says in the English in our Bibles (Which is what I have seen often from your side). They act like the KJV translators were stupid when they did not even fact-check their credentials. One person today who does not even know these languages acts like they know more than certain KJV translators who did know these languages. So again, they are not looking at all the facts. They want to slice and dice God's Word to fit their belief and understanding.
Side Note:
I am Core KJV and not KJV-only. The KJV is my core foundational text, and it is the perfect and inerrant words of God. But I am not against using Modern Bibles at times to draw meaning out of the 1600s English in the KJV. But Modern Bibles teach false doctrines and so they cannot always be trusted. I look at Modern Bibles like I would a dictionary. Sometimes the wording fits, and sometimes it doesn’t. One has to read the context, look at cross references, and pray about it.
i got three different heights from three different sources - 1585, 1611, 1614m
but three things to point out -
but three things to point out -
- none of these are going ro be exact. there's centimeters and millimeters involved
- why meters? Biblically cubits should be the measure
- it's all hooey anyway - give me literally any number and i can find some way to relate it arbitrarily to something. this is NOT PROOF of the innerancy of a pagan language translation.
You know what? This comment just opened my eyes to a HUGE difference that you and I have in opinion and perspective when it comes to God, and I think you just really showed your hand and the flaw in your KJV only stance.
I don't "build my life" on and specific book. While His word is my authority, the bibles we have are only tools in that. It's nothing to bow down to, the way you and your crew do. (rhyme way a happy accident) You make the KJV a false idol in this way. I was saved before I ever cared about reading ANY bible. It was Him who saved me and Jesus the Christ is the cornerstone I build my life on, NOT the KJV. It's His Spirit that I'm reconciled to that guides me to ALL truth, not the KJV. Although to be fair to you, the KJV may be the very tool He uses to lead me to that truth, but you don't just have the cart before the hoarse, you have the hoarse upside down and backwards shoved in the cart and are bowing and praying to the twisted mess.
I'm being a little hyperbolic at the end there, but seriously you are lifting this version up WAY higher than it should be to the point you are giving it glory that belongs to God and His Spirit that it could never "live up to" under honest and rational criticism. Imo anyway.
I don't "build my life" on and specific book. While His word is my authority, the bibles we have are only tools in that. It's nothing to bow down to, the way you and your crew do. (rhyme way a happy accident) You make the KJV a false idol in this way. I was saved before I ever cared about reading ANY bible. It was Him who saved me and Jesus the Christ is the cornerstone I build my life on, NOT the KJV. It's His Spirit that I'm reconciled to that guides me to ALL truth, not the KJV. Although to be fair to you, the KJV may be the very tool He uses to lead me to that truth, but you don't just have the cart before the hoarse, you have the hoarse upside down and backwards shoved in the cart and are bowing and praying to the twisted mess.
I'm being a little hyperbolic at the end there, but seriously you are lifting this version up WAY higher than it should be to the point you are giving it glory that belongs to God and His Spirit that it could never "live up to" under honest and rational criticism. Imo anyway.
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@posthuman
For clarification: The 666th chapter of the Bible is Ecclesiastes 7.
This chapter also talks about wisdom and counting just like Revelation 13:18 does.
Revelatoin 13:18 talks about the mark of the beast (666). Things like this are only the tip of the iceberg, and yet it does not mean anything to you. Why would God tell his people to march around Jericho 7 times? Imagine if Joshua asked God, "Lord, why are we doing this 7 times? Does it have any meaning?" According to you, the Lord's reply would be something like, "There is no meaning. I just wanted you to do it that many times."
For clarification: The 666th chapter of the Bible is Ecclesiastes 7.
This chapter also talks about wisdom and counting just like Revelation 13:18 does.
Revelatoin 13:18 talks about the mark of the beast (666). Things like this are only the tip of the iceberg, and yet it does not mean anything to you. Why would God tell his people to march around Jericho 7 times? Imagine if Joshua asked God, "Lord, why are we doing this 7 times? Does it have any meaning?" According to you, the Lord's reply would be something like, "There is no meaning. I just wanted you to do it that many times."
The Bible warns us against false Christs. How would a person know they accepted a false Christ? By looking to contradictory Bibles or your own thinking that you were saved without reading any Bible? This is deeply troubling. All believers need to hear the words from Scripture to be saved. The very gospel itself listed in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 is a part of the Scriptures. We believe Jesus died for our sins, He was buried, and risen the third day according to the Scriptures. According to you, this would not be true. You believe you really don't need the Scriptures but you were saved without them. So then the Bible is regulated to a self help guide that you can take it or leave it. But Jesus said His words are spirit, and they are life. Jesus' words now are immortalized in Scripture. Peter talks about how we are born again by the Word. You say anything in regards to the faith today, and you have to check it with the Bible. If a person goes outside the Bible, then they fall into the error of the Charismatics in shaking down on the ground, screaming, making animals noises, and throwing people back by the wave of a hand.
A general search at Google brings up 1,611 Meters.
The first 8 results have this number. It appears to be the major answer and general consensus.
Even a search a Perplexity.ai (an AI search that provides sources) has this number.
But we are talking meters here. That's what matters.
Don't limit God. The Lord our God is not the God of the dead but of the living.
Actually, you are speaking with zero knowledge of the Bible Numerics topic. You have no clue, my friend. You did not examine any of the findings to make any kind of proper judgment.
I would start with Brandon Peterson's Number 7 video.
If after you watch that, and you say, "Oh yeah, that's ALL random chance."
I would either label you as either insane or incredibly unintelligent.
So I challenge you to watch his video.
The first 8 results have this number. It appears to be the major answer and general consensus.
Even a search a Perplexity.ai (an AI search that provides sources) has this number.
But we are talking meters here. That's what matters.
Don't limit God. The Lord our God is not the God of the dead but of the living.
Actually, you are speaking with zero knowledge of the Bible Numerics topic. You have no clue, my friend. You did not examine any of the findings to make any kind of proper judgment.
I would start with Brandon Peterson's Number 7 video.
If after you watch that, and you say, "Oh yeah, that's ALL random chance."
I would either label you as either insane or incredibly unintelligent.
So I challenge you to watch his video.
@posthuman
Do you believe God is not capable of using English to preserve His word because it is a pagan language?
What about the Koine Greek? It's not a pure language. It's a Gentile or dog language. So your attack on this point is simply not taking into account all of the facts here. You would be condemning the Textual Critic position by your point against the KJV here. In short, you’re not thinking logically here, my friend.
Do you believe God is not capable of using English to preserve His word because it is a pagan language?
What about the Koine Greek? It's not a pure language. It's a Gentile or dog language. So your attack on this point is simply not taking into account all of the facts here. You would be condemning the Textual Critic position by your point against the KJV here. In short, you’re not thinking logically here, my friend.
Again, try reading 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. The gospel is according to the Scriptures. The gospel is how we are saved. The gospel comes from the Scriptures. You cannot be saved without the Scriptures. Even Peter states in 1st Peter chapter one that the Word (Which is incorruptible) is how we are born again and it is how the gospel is preached unto you. But you both can join Benny Hinn or Joel Olsteen if you like. With no Bible or real authority, that is what can happen to a person.
This is why we are living in the last days. More people do not think they really need the Bible.
They kick the Bible like a football today. Really, I am serious. A church actually kicked the Bible like a football not too long ago.
Would you join a church like that? Would your future generation of children join such a church? By your current statements, I wouldn’t be surprised.
This is why we are living in the last days. More people do not think they really need the Bible.
They kick the Bible like a football today. Really, I am serious. A church actually kicked the Bible like a football not too long ago.
Would you join a church like that? Would your future generation of children join such a church? By your current statements, I wouldn’t be surprised.
No, I'm not reading any books about this which is a complete waste of time.
I go by God's Word, not be what others thought they heard the bible says in some fake seminary or bible school.
Passover was used in the old testament long, LONG time before Tyndale was ever born so Passover is the correct word to use as easter is a pagan holiday that has nothing to do with the Lord.
I don't have anything to do with easter since it's not of God, but feel free to get your easter bunny on every year if this is something that gives you goose bumps and warm fuzzy feelings and such.
I go by God's Word, not be what others thought they heard the bible says in some fake seminary or bible school.
Passover was used in the old testament long, LONG time before Tyndale was ever born so Passover is the correct word to use as easter is a pagan holiday that has nothing to do with the Lord.
I don't have anything to do with easter since it's not of God, but feel free to get your easter bunny on every year if this is something that gives you goose bumps and warm fuzzy feelings and such.