The New King James Version (NKJV): Another counterfeit and bogus bible

[AtonedFor]

I admit that I only took a quick glance at your post.

IMHO, you are assuming that the 1611 KJV is the standard of truth to go by.
But, I can promise you that some of the KJV words don't mean what they do today.
And this can cause great confusion.

To be sure of what today's translator should come up with,
you need to look at the original Greek and keep the context of the passage in mind.
.

 

[Crosby]

I got as far as the first bash and had to check it out for myself:

(Strong's Dictionary)
G2585
καπηλεύω
kapēleuō
kap-ale-yoo'-o
From κάπηλος kapēlos (a huckster); to retail, that is, (by implication) to adulterate (figuratively): - corrupt.



(Thayer's Greek Definitions Dictionary)
G2585
καπηλεύω
kapēleuō
Thayer Definition:
1) to be a retailer, to peddle
2) to make money by selling anything
2a) to get sordid gain by dealing in anything, to do a thing for base gain
2b) to trade in the word of God
2b1) to try to get base gain by teaching divine truth
2c) to corrupt, to adulterate
2c1) peddlers were in the habit of adulterating their commodities for the sake of gain
Part of Speech: verb
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from kapelos (a huckster)
Citing in TDNT: 3:603, 415


(The Complete Wordstudy Dictionary)
G2585
καπηλεύω
kapēleúō; fut. kapēleúsō, from kápēlos (n.f.), a retailer, huckster. To treat as if for personal profit, a profiteer. Used only in 2Co 2:17 translated "corrupt," i.e., corrupting God's Word for personal gain. See Rom 16:17-18; 2Pe 2:3. It means to profiteer from God's Word, to preach for money or to profess faith for personal gain.
The kápēlos may also be derived from kápē (n.f.), food, nutriment, from káptō (n.f.), to eat; a huckster or petty retail trader, contrasted with émporos (G1713), merchant (Mat 13:45; Rev 18:3, Rev 18:11, Rev 18:15, Rev 18:23), who sells his wares wholesale. Kápēlos refers especially to the retailer of wine who is exposed to the strong temptation to tamper with it or sell it in short measure in order to make additional profit. Kapēleúō includes dolóō (G1389), falsify (2Co 4:2), to adulterate wine with water to make an unworthy personal gain.
Syn.: phtheírō (G5351), to corrupt; kataphtheírō (G2704), to corrupt unto destruction; diaphtheírō (G1311), to corrupt utterly.

____________________________

just for note; most words rendered "judgment" in the KJV Old Testament should be translated as "justice" (check it out for yourself). Anyway, even though i do use it still, the KJV really is not the best translation for the original Greek and Hebrew.

 

[Albino_Nun]

Hi Crosby,
Wonderfully thorough post. You've certainly given us a wealth of
info to peruse. I do have a few questions:

1. Re your statement:
Anyway, even though i do use it still, the KJV really is not the best translation for the original Greek and Hebrew.
What, in your opinion, is the best translation for the original Greek and Hebrew?
2. Please clarify what you mean by: "Citing in TDNT: 3:603, 415"
3. What edition of Thayers would you recommend? (Publication year and ISBN# if possible.)

Thanks again for the great post.
- Albina

 

[Crosby]

Hay Nun my sister, The NASB is the most closely rendered word for word translation. And the NKJV is a great adjustment of the KJV and true to the original scriptures. they are both word for word translations. but don't leave out the other paraphrased translations like the NLT that can bring light to your understanding. just stay away from the "New World Translation" which is terribly twisted and produced by the Jehovah's Witnesses cult.

TDNT: Thayer's Dictionary New Testament

can't really recommend Thayer's dictionary other than the newest (if possible updated version). Vine's is good to, along with the others.

 

[TomB_2012]

As a minister that teaches from both the KJV and the NKJV it is your post that is bogus. You need to do a little more research on the KJV...Cheers

I agree with every word in your post Moe. The OP hasn't shown any knowledge about how the KJV came around.

Well interesting read, cant say it changed my mind though, guess ill stick with esv or niv. They worrk for me.

Indeed you should Nautilus. Both the ESV and the NIV are good versions to use.

The KJV bible is not the appropriate translation for people of today because of its archaic language and mistranslations... In fact, it does not even use the proper OT, it uses the Hebrew OT when it really should be using the Greek SEPTUAGINT OT.

I can see why you believe that the KJV is not the appropriate translation for people of today. But I wouldn't say it is completely inappropriate. I prefer the KJV. It might have its archaic language and a few mistranslations, but it is still a good translation to use.

Sadly though, the vast majority of Protestants believe in the Hebrew OT rather than in the Greek Septuagint which is the only true OT translation.

Judging by your post, I'm getting the idea that you are a Catholic. The OT was originally written in Hebrew and Aramaic while the NT was written in the Koine Greek. I'm not saying that the Hebrew OT is the only true translation, but that doesn't mean that the Greek Septuagint is the only true translation of the OT either.

 

[AlexandertheLeast]

I love the King James and it's the only book I use, one reason is it's not copyrighted. Why would anyone want to copyright God's Word when He gave, and gives, them freely? Like I posted earlier, NKJV (as well as NASB, ESV, and NIV), has 2 Corinthians 2:17 as Peddling instead of Corrupting, "We are not as many peddling the word of God." This word means to make a profit, like a trade. Don't they do that, though? Copyright allows the publishers and translators to have control over what is copyrighted, and they gain a profit if someone wants to quote it or buy it.

King James isn't the best translation, I know that. But it is the Holiest translation we have. It was translated by Martyrs who didn't get paid for it, it is the closest work to Tyndale's translation, the man who literally gave his life so that we would have the Word of God in our tongue, it has nothing lacking nor conflicting, it doesn't make Jesus into a sinner or a liar like the other translations, and if I changed just one word it would be my translation free of charge and I wouldn't get fined for it. Just quoting the other translations without permission directly from them who cause me to get fined. I also did my own research and found what is called TR to be the most valid manuscripts, as well as the most numerous, much more than the Critical Text. King James is the only translation that is truly faithful to that series of Manuscripts, not even the NKJV is. The very fact that it's called Critical Text is concerning indeed, an edited text to what they believe should be in there instead of taking it as it is.

I'm not a KJVO either, I love using the World English Bible too. It has God's name as Yah and Yahweh instead of LORD and GOD, it's the best modern translation I have read so far, and it's not copyrighted. Again, I can change one word and it would be my translation free of charge, no fine.

If the Bible is to be revered, and His Word is to be trembled before, then should we even conceive making a profit off it? Should it remain in the controls of men, like it was for at least a thousand years under Roman Catholic rule? It's a question we gotta ask.

 

[Nautilus]

I know that. But it is the Holiest translation we have. It was translated by Martyrs who didn't get paid for it,

It was not translated by martyrs in any way, James gave the translators instructions intended to guarantee that the new version would conform to the ecclesiology and reflect the episcopal structure of the Church of England and its belief in an ordained clergy. The translation was done by 47 scholars, all of whom were members of the Church of England.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I love the King James and it's the only book I use, one reason is it's not copyrighted. Why would anyone want to copyright God's Word when He gave, and gives, them freely? Like I posted earlier, NKJV (as well as NASB, ESV, and NIV), has 2 Corinthians 2:17 as Peddling instead of Corrupting, "We are not as many peddling the word of God." This word means to make a profit, like a trade. Don't they do that, though? Copyright allows the publishers and translators to have control over what is copyrighted, and they gain a profit if someone wants to quote it or buy it.

1. Copyright? Not sure why this would matter. Everyone does it, just because one is or is not copyrighted does nt mean much. Not sure they even had that in the 1600's or the KJV might have been copyrighted also.

2. Peddling. The greek word used is kapelouontes: which means to "peddle", To be a retailer by selling, To trade etc.

King James isn't the best translation, I know that. But it is the Holiest translation we have. It was translated by Martyrs who didn't get paid for it, it is the closest work to Tyndale's translation, the man who literally gave his life so that we would have the Word of God in our tongue, it has nothing lacking nor conflicting, it doesn't make Jesus into a sinner or a liar like the other translations, and if I changed just one word it would be my translation free of charge and I wouldn't get fined for it. Just quoting the other translations without permission directly from them who cause me to get fined. I also did my own research and found what is called TR to be the most valid manuscripts, as well as the most numerous, much more than the Critical Text. King James is the only translation that is truly faithful to that series of Manuscripts, not even the NKJV is. The very fact that it's called Critical Text is concerning indeed, an edited text to what they believe should be in there instead of taking it as it is.

I'm not a KJVO either, I love using the World English Bible too. It has God's name as Yah and Yahweh instead of LORD and GOD, it's the best modern translation I have read so far, and it's not copyrighted. Again, I can change one word and it would be my translation free of charge, no fine.

If the Bible is to be revered, and His Word is to be trembled before, then should we even conceive making a profit off it? Should it remain in the controls of men, like it was for at least a thousand years under Roman Catholic rule? It's a question we gotta ask.

I think God can use many things, even some of these other versions. One has to realise, we do not have scribes today who can copy a bunch of bibles. it takes money to make bibles so they can be distributed.

As for KJV, I grew up with KJV, and thus the language did not really affect me, It was learned. However, as a teen My Father bought me a NKJV. This was over 30 years ago, When my mother passed away, I wanted her bible, It is KJV, I read it a few times, and even though I grew up learning it, It had been so long I struggled trying to figure out what it was saying in many places, as I had lost the use of that language.

As far as bibles go. If I found a new believer who was a young adult or older, I would in no way let them or recommend the KJV because of its language, or the NLT because it is so horribly translated. Even though it is in modern language.

 

[AlexandertheLeast]

Should it be done on the Bible just because it's done on everything else?

 

[RedTent]

Am I the only person on this post who sees translations aiming at taking Judaism out of the bible?

I have been studying the history of the development of the Christian church so I am sensitive to this problem, perhaps. But I am not knowledgeable enough about bible translations to judge them. I would simply like to read God’s words as purely as possible, without men’s input. I have gone into learning the original language only superficially, so I am dependent on people who have more knowledge than I do.

I am not finding the answer, here, to my question of where can I get a translation closest to God’s original pure word? I thought I had that in HCSB, but I don't see any mention of it in this post.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Am I the only person on this post who sees translations aiming at taking Judaism out of the bible?

I do not understand this. Judaism in its core is apposed to God. so what do you mean taking judaism out of scripture?

I have been studying the history of the development of the Christian church so I am sensitive to this problem, perhaps. But I am not knowledgeable enough about bible translations to judge them. I would simply like to read God’s words as purely as possible, without men’s input. I have gone into learning the original language only superficially, so I am dependent on people who have more knowledge than I do.

I am not finding the answer, here, to my question of where can I get a translation closest to God’s original pure word? I thought I had that in HCSB, but I don't see any mention of it in this post.

NASB or NKJV should be perfect;ly fine modern translations. Never heard of HCSB so not sure what that is.

 

[edward99]

Am I the only person on this post who sees translations aiming at taking Judaism out of the bible?

I have been studying the history of the development of the Christian church so I am sensitive to this problem, perhaps. But I am not knowledgeable enough about bible translations to judge them. I would simply like to read God’s words as purely as possible, without men’s input. I have gone into learning the original language only superficially, so I am dependent on people who have more knowledge than I do.

I am not finding the answer, here, to my question of where can I get a translation closest to God’s original pure word? I thought I had that in HCSB, but I don't see any mention of it in this post.

The New Testament inteprets the Old (unless you believe God did not intend His New Testament (Holy Spirit breathed testimony of the New Covenant) to be in Greek - in which case you're in quite a pickle).

Why not learn Greek?

Koiné is also the language of the Christian New Testament, of the Septuagint (the 3rd century BC Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible), and of most early Christian theological writing by the Church Fathers. In this context, Koiné Greek is also known as "Biblical", "New Testament" or "patristic Greek".[4]

Koine Greek - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[RedTent]

Have a heart, you guys! I am 87 years old and I should learn Hebrew and Greek?

Judaism opposed to God? Wow!! That takes in the entire OT, my beloved psalms and all, and all of Christ!! Christ was Jewish. And you think Pentecost wiped out needing written word, too? I don’t go along with this thinking. I love the bible, read it every day. And every morning I sit quietly listening for God as He feeds me through the HS, and I still read His word.

The HCSB is the Holman Christian Standard Bible, published in 2009. The team that translated the NT was mostly Baptists, with scholars from other denominations part of the OT team. It is more literal than the NIV and less than the ASB. It is becoming quite popular.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Have a heart, you guys! I am 87 years old and I should learn Hebrew and Greek?

Judaism opposed to God? Wow!! That takes in the entire OT, my beloved psalms and all, and all of Christ!! Christ was Jewish. And you think Pentecost wiped out needing written word, too? I don’t go along with this thinking. I love the bible, read it every day. And every morning I sit quietly listening for God as He feeds me through the HS, and I still read His word.

1. Judaism KILLED Christ.
2. Judaism says it is our works which saves us. David was no follower of Judaism. He followed God.
3. What bible kills what you call Judaism? I have yet to see one which distorts the OT so I am not sure what your talking about.

The HCSB is the Holman Christian Standard Bible, published in 2009. The team that translated the NT was mostly Baptists, with scholars from other denominations part of the OT team. It is more literal than the NIV and less than the ASB. It is becoming quite popular.

I will have to check it out. How do you think they tuke what you call judaism out of the OT. I still am not sure what you mean here.

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

1. Judaism KILLED Christ.
2. Judaism says it is our works which saves us. David was no follower of Judaism. He followed God.
3. What bible kills what you call Judaism? I have yet to see one which distorts the OT so I am not sure what your talking about.



I will have to check it out. How do you think they tuke what you call judaism out of the OT. I still am not sure what you mean here.

maybe before you continue you should make sure everyone is working from the same definition of 'judaism'

for example i would say judaism is an incomplete christianity...or christianity is the completed judaism...

 

[Nautilus]

Judaism killed Christ...umm I don't know how much into christianity you are, but Him dying was kinda one of the main facets you know? It was part of the plan... ugh I dont even know why I am explaining this

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Judaism killed Christ...umm I don't know how much into christianity you are, but Him dying was kinda one of the main facets you know? It was part of the plan... ugh I dont even know why I am explaining this

Maam, When modern day people think of Judaism they think of the saducees and pharisees, and the works based system which most Jews who practice judaism today practice.

Now if your talking about Isreal and the law, that is something different. Remember, People are saved today the same way Adam and Eve were saved, We do not have a different gospel (although some believe they did)

I am still trying to figure out which bible trys to take OT laws concerning Isreal and their dealings with God out (I would not call this Judaism) and how.

 

[RedTent]

[eternally-gratefull;]1. Judaism KILLED Christ.
2. Judaism says it is our works which saves us. David was no follower of Judaism. He followed God.
3. What bible kills what you call Judaism? I have yet to see one which distorts the OT so I am not sure what your talking about.

I will have to check it out. How do you think they tuke what you call judaism out of the OT. I still am not sure what you mean here.

Nowhere in scripture does it say Judaism killed Christ. That was a saying made up hundreds of years ago by people bent on murder to excuse their murdering Jewish people. A study of the thinking of the mob that wanted Christ killed is very interesting, but it is no reason for our taking on the judgment of every Jew, even those who are blinded to Christ as Savior. That is God's work; it is presumptuous to take it on. Our instructions are to not judge.

Nowhere in scripture does it say that we can make ourselves holy for God through our works, OT or NT. Scripture always talks of faith and grace, when it tells of laws it is to those who have been saved through God’s grace because of their faith. They are precious, holy instructions, but after salvation. God does not dispute God. Christ is God.

I am going to have to back off on pointing to scripture interpretation that uses secular words when the original Greek was the name of a Jewish festival. My memory says that it was done, can't prove it. Sorry.

Thanks so much for checking out this translation.

 

[pickles]

Am I the only person on this post who sees translations aiming at taking Judaism out of the bible?

I have been studying the history of the development of the Christian church so I am sensitive to this problem, perhaps. But I am not knowledgeable enough about bible translations to judge them. I would simply like to read God’s words as purely as possible, without men’s input. I have gone into learning the original language only superficially, so I am dependent on people who have more knowledge than I do.

I am not finding the answer, here, to my question of where can I get a translation closest to God’s original pure word? I thought I had that in HCSB, but I don't see any mention of it in this post.

The only true translation, is given through the Holy Spirit, set upon one by God.
His word is given to us through scritpure, and understanding through His Holy Spirit, God is faithful in this.
For no man or any corruption, can effect this.
When one lives in Jesus Christ is Lord come in the flesh.

God bless
pickles

 

[jkalyna]

DON'T KNOW WELL, GOD LOVED ADAM, AND THERE WAS NO HISTORY NO PARABLES, JUST LOVE, AND FELLOWSHIP BETWEEN THEM. JESUS LOVED THE THIEF ON THE CROSS, AND HE REPENTED BEFORE TAKING HIS LAST BREATH. JESUS LOVED MARY MADALINE, AND SAID TO THE WOMEN CAUGHT IN ADULTERY, YOUR SINS ARE FORGIVEN. WHAT IF THERE WAS NONE OF THIS , NO HISTORY, NO KNOWLEDGE ON THINGS, ONLY JESUS, TO BELIEVE IN HIM, AND HIS WORDS, MAKES THE BIBLE FOR ME. NOT MUCH TO DEBATE ON TOPICS, I GUESS. LOL.