The offensive teachings of Jesus (in John 6)

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tribesman

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2011
4,612
274
83
#1
Luke 11

[27] And it came to pass, as he spake these things, a certain woman of the company lifted up her voice, and said unto him, Blessed is the womb that bare thee, and the paps which thou hast sucked.
[28] But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it.
John 14

[22] Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?
[23] Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
[24] He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.
Jesus was very popular with many when He performed His miracles, healed and delivered lots of people, gave justice to the victimized, translated water into wine, performed the multiplication of loaves miracle etc. It was certainly a great time being a disciple in those days. Many people's lives were changed by all this and so were their lifestyle. Much was achieved in various fields that could have been used for the betterment and reform of society. Hadn't that been good enough?

But when Jesus in John 6 started talking about that it is a work of God that someone believes in Him, that all that the Father gives Him comes to Him, that no one can come to Him unless the Father draws him and that we must eat His flesh and drink His blood to have eternal life and that our flesh profits nothing etc - then many backed out. Even many disciples. They said it was a "hard saying" that they could not endure. They did not feel too well about it. They were smarter than Jesus, they believed, and then they pulled away and walked no more with Him. Only a few faithful remained. There is a difference between Jesus' deeds and the teachings of Jesus.


What happened to those who withdrew? Surely they ended not with their businesses, most likely they had their own gatherings, appointed their own leaders, etc. Or so they withdrew to an undemanding private religious life, or re-adjusted to the synagogue. But they did not teach what Jesus taught in John 6. They did not keep the words of Jesus and thus did not possess the life that comes by faith. Not because they lacked experiences of miracles or charitable work, but because they refused to accept further teaching of the word of God! Also Paul was heavily opposed in his days, even from people inside the church, for his doctrine on justification.


It is essential for our well being that we feel well, it should not be denied, but my malaise here or there is never a word of truth. Truth is truth regardless of how I feel for or against it. If my reply is: I do not feel good when I hear the word of God, then my reply is the same as the rebellious disciples who left Jesus because of his "hard talk". Too many people make the same mutiny. They would like to dwell on Jesus' miracles and works of mercy, which are overemphasized at the expense of everything else in God's word. But then it stops, with various pretexts and excuses. Why? Because they hate Jesus' and the apostles' teachings. How many in our day does not degrade their self accustomed way or worship to only contain social activities, subjective experiences, "miracle revival", health and fortune-hunting or incense-scented mascot-mystery? Think about it.


It is how we receive and apply the word of God that shows who we are. That shows if we have been given the righteousness of God, which has been revealed in the gospel, or not. This is where it becomes apparent who knows God and who is born of God. Not in our own so-called testimonies about various experiences, feelings, healings, commitment and good works. Not even our desire for missions. Such may as well the heretics and devil worshipers come up with. It does not tell much enough. What says something is if we know what the gospel is or not. There is no middle ground here. One must be clear that there are those who have been in "christian activity" throughout much, or all, of their lives and have lots of experiences and live lives that many perceive as moral. Usually these people are very sincere, ardent and zealous for their cause, and yet they are completely ignorant of the gospel and walk as enemies of the cross of Christ. Not least because of what they believe and teach. This is a reality.


To profess the gospel here or there means, therefore, nothing by itself unless it embodies itself in that it has been understood by the same means by which it came to us. Because the gospel brings with it, among other things, the immediate knowledge of God's reconciliation contingent in Christ. A saved person knows that his salvation does not depend on his own will or deed to any degree or in any part. He also knows that Christ's sacrifice only includes His own body - the church. As much as he knows that Christ is the Son of God, and thus one with God. If you have not even this knowledge, it is clear that you are yet ignorant of the righteousness of God that is revealed in the Gospel. If one is ignorant of the righteousness of God, which is revealed in the gospel, then one is still looking to establish one's own righteousness, even if it is done with the greatest zeal for God and in Jesus' name. According to Paul the one who does this is not saved.


In our evil age it's accepted by a majority of the ecumenical community that one can be saved on one's own path. It is rarely said in straight talk, but that is the inevitable consequence of its ideology. Thus, other (i.e. false) gospels can save some, as long as those who profess them "have it good with God" or "a personal relationship with Jesus". Sounds sweet, doesn't it? We should not be so picky and pesky with doctrine, they say, so nicely. The thought is that we have to get as much people on board as possible, so we need to downplay or shut up everything that can cause offense or "division". It all becomes an autobahn with free speed, tainted with the false notion that this way more people are to come on board. Yet, in fact, it just broadens the road to destruction and demonstrate unbelief, not faith; apostasy, not revival.


A whole world is talking about Jesus and the gospel, but what is meant by what they say? We have to discern it and make righteous judgment. Paul warns of other gospels and other christs. And it's not dodgy cults in the world's outskirts he speaks of. He speaks of those who show up among christians and in the christian communities. Such as are making great signs and wonders in Jesus' name, such as uses the word of God and falsifies it to live out their own soulish passions and to get their own mucus gain, such who worship their own thoughts as god. He confirms God's curse, not blessing, on those who comes with another gospel, which is no gospel at all. Why should we have a lower standard? Because it does not feel good?


Should we give up the fight for the gospel for the lentil soup of politics and ecumenism? So that the flesh shall have peace? In order for us to have a comfortable life and not have to take beatings from detractors. To make us feel at home in the corporate world. Never! We should, rather more powerful than ever, abide in the "offensive" word of God and proclaim the gospel to the end. And when we see the apostasy and evil in the name of Jesus to rise even more we should not be discouraged but lift up our heads, because our redemption is drawing near and God will judge the harlot.


May the enemy be destroyed. Amen.
 
E

enochson

Guest
#2
Jesus was very popular with many when He performed His miracles, healed and delivered lots of people, gave justice to the victimized, translated water into wine, performed the multiplication of loaves miracle etc. It was certainly a great time being a disciple in those days. Many people's lives were changed by all this and so were their lifestyle. Much was achieved in various fields that could have been used for the betterment and reform of society. Hadn't that been good enough?

But when Jesus in John 6 started talking about that it is a work of God that someone believes in Him, that all that the Father gives Him comes to Him, that no one can come to Him unless the Father draws him and that we must eat His flesh and drink His blood to have eternal life and that our flesh profits nothing etc - then many backed out. Even many disciples. They said it was a "hard saying" that they could not endure. They did not feel too well about it. They were smarter than Jesus, they believed, and then they pulled away and walked no more with Him. Only a few faithful remained. There is a difference between Jesus' deeds and the teachings of Jesus.

What happened to those who withdrew? Surely they ended not with their businesses, most likely they had their own gatherings, appointed their own leaders, etc. Or so they withdrew to an undemanding private religious life, or re-adjusted to the synagogue. But they did not teach what Jesus taught in John 6. They did not keep the words of Jesus and thus did not possess the life that comes by faith. Not because they lacked experiences of miracles or charitable work, but because they refused to accept further teaching of the word of God! Also Paul was heavily opposed in his days, even from people inside the church, for his doctrine on justification.

It is essential for our well being that we feel well, it should not be denied, but my malaise here or there is never a word of truth. Truth is truth regardless of how I feel for or against it. If my reply is: I do not feel good when I hear the word of God, then my reply is the same as the rebellious disciples who left Jesus because of his "hard talk". Too many people make the same mutiny. They would like to dwell on Jesus' miracles and works of mercy, which are overemphasized at the expense of everything else in God's word. But then it stops, with various pretexts and excuses. Why? Because they hate Jesus' and the apostles' teachings. How many in our day does not degrade their self accustomed way or worship to only contain social activities, subjective experiences, "miracle revival", health and fortune-hunting or incense-scented mascot-mystery? Think about it.

It is how we receive and apply the word of God that shows who we are. That shows if we have been given the righteousness of God, which has been revealed in the gospel, or not. This is where it becomes apparent who knows God and who is born of God. Not in our own so-called testimonies about various experiences, feelings, healings, commitment and good works. Not even our desire for missions. Such may as well the heretics and devil worshipers come up with. It does not tell much enough. What says something is if we know what the gospel is or not. There is no middle ground here. One must be clear that there are those who have been in "christian activity" throughout much, or all, of their lives and have lots of experiences and live lives that many perceive as moral. Usually these people are very sincere, ardent and zealous for their cause, and yet they are completely ignorant of the gospel and walk as enemies of the cross of Christ. Not least because of what they believe and teach. This is a reality.

To profess the gospel here or there means, therefore, nothing by itself unless it embodies itself in that it has been understood by the same means by which it came to us. Because the gospel brings with it, among other things, the immediate knowledge of God's reconciliation contingent in Christ. A saved person knows that his salvation does not depend on his own will or deed to any degree or in any part. He also knows that Christ's sacrifice only includes His own body - the church. As much as he knows that Christ is the Son of God, and thus one with God. If you have not even this knowledge, it is clear that you are yet ignorant of the righteousness of God that is revealed in the Gospel. If one is ignorant of the righteousness of God, which is revealed in the gospel, then one is still looking to establish one's own righteousness, even if it is done with the greatest zeal for God and in Jesus' name. According to Paul the one who does this is not saved.

In our evil age it's accepted by a majority of the ecumenical community that one can be saved on one's own path. It is rarely said in straight talk, but that is the inevitable consequence of its ideology. Thus, other (i.e. false) gospels can save some, as long as those who profess them "have it good with God" or "a personal relationship with Jesus". Sounds sweet, doesn't it? We should not be so picky and pesky with doctrine, they say, so nicely. The thought is that we have to get as much people on board as possible, so we need to downplay or shut up everything that can cause offense or "division". It all becomes an autobahn with free speed, tainted with the false notion that this way more people are to come on board. Yet, in fact, it just broadens the road to destruction and demonstrate unbelief, not faith; apostasy, not revival.

A whole world is talking about Jesus and the gospel, but what is meant by what they say? We have to discern it and make righteous judgment. Paul warns of other gospels and other christs. And it's not dodgy cults in the world's outskirts he speaks of. He speaks of those who show up among christians and in the christian communities. Such as are making great signs and wonders in Jesus' name, such as uses the word of God and falsifies it to live out their own soulish passions and to get their own mucus gain, such who worship their own thoughts as god. He confirms God's curse, not blessing, on those who comes with another gospel, which is no gospel at all. Why should we have a lower standard? Because it does not feel good?

Should we give up the fight for the gospel for the lentil soup of politics and ecumenism? So that the flesh shall have peace? In order for us to have a comfortable life and not have to take beatings from detractors. To make us feel at home in the corporate world. Never! We should, rather more powerful than ever, abide in the "offensive" word of God and proclaim the gospel to the end. And when we see the apostasy and evil in the name of Jesus to rise even more we should not be discouraged but lift up our heads, because our redemption is drawing near and God will judge the harlot.

May the enemy be destroyed. Amen.
Or the He and Him are Christ and has nothing to do with man apart from Christ.